the worst time to be in charge of the i.f.r. c given both the growing scope of humanitarian needs and the man's challenge of securing the funding to meet them why would you even want these kind of job but let me clarify for us all that this is not a job. and i am a volunteer i'm not paid for my position i've been a volunteer and in my national society for many this is a is a passion fashion for humanity try to improve. the way in which we need to get there and for me this is my goal is my priority having the owner and the responsibility to do the most important most relevant or going to your money toward it's really an honor well mr malcolm because it's a volunteering effort how do you keep your faith in what you're doing a live seeing the misery day violence the suffering proliferated to an extent they

have been. yeah. this is it's like a mission i'm not the only one seventeen million people that i've decided to dedicate your life to to set of humanity a legacy over to you and our legacy of course. to sacrifice both of our work time and i mean really the first. prize and these are our families our friends but this is why we have decided to. every now we're going to dish and there it. is all going to volunteers based for the volunteers out of the corps auction on the local level and i will do my best to bring the volunteers voice. plays of the ward because this is where this will be my my role in the next four years now mr ok i know you rely on volunteers but you also have to work with local actors. including

local governments and i may be cheap disinterested but it's a common view here in moscow that the so-called international community has no problem coming together to create problems like the ones we observe in the middle east or north africa but it is very very rarely joins hands in order to solve the am i being too negative look if i look at the capacity. of the international community and the government to fix the problem that are causing so many suffering of course there is nothing to be optimistic but if we look of the capacity of humanity of each human beings to do. to be party to other human beings. every day so the problem is that we have to speak up we have to do. to the governments to improve the. tomb. of those in need to protect the life of those.

risk especially in the war zone those are leaving the consequences of climate change as an example but mr olcott i assume that this is what you have been doing in your capacity. of working in many positions for the italian red cross at a time when your country was facing the influx of challenges of refugees from multiple wars and demand the region and that it was a challenge that italy by and large had to face on its own didn't die out experience undermined your face in solidarity in. this period that i had in this year of course is that we found a lot of solidarity of the beginning but then because the lack of vision of our of our e.u. policy this created the perfect environment to make the xenophobia and the rushes to increase the big. this wasn't up and they didn't up any immediately and. there

was a lot of solidarity then when the discussion come to better distribute to relocate the people and we found that there was this kind of quarter that the wall where. these us created these. phenomena of arrested for be about. didn't up and. maybe we couldn't work a bit better you know what communities up in it for a very long time but to mr ok and to be fair. hasn't been created out of nowhere i mean if you look at the number of refugees around the world it increased by seventy percent in the last and it take it so if you only focus on response do you really thing you can. see any result coming up here after because it seems that even if you try to how those in need there will always be more and

more significantly more people coming. for how to later on i fully agree with you on the spot about this is not the this is. this is the failure of the lack of vision of the of the international community because of course is not about to take care of the sea it's even about to fix the causes of migration if i think when i started to be a volunteer in ninety eight at that time we were receiving in italy the migrants. coming from the horn of africa thirty years later we are still receiving people coming from this. not being us changed so this is a complete failure of the international community we should put. the fire from from the disposition of the people so the problem for us as human and i'm going to take care of the people but when you are confronting the communities you have to explain the reason why even about. the failure of the politics of the failure of the

policies that has been set up to avoid people free their homes and their houses because no one that is escaping most of europe is to do it or no one is to try to cross the middle with these rubber bullets and i see that many of the people they see themselves not to do to escape from their country they were not migrants before the war saw this is the this is their wages that we have to do us to ourself and our governments and politicians but mr olcott sounds as if he are asking the ordinary people to clear out of the mass of the politicians have created which is fair but only to a certain extent the un high commissioner for refugees philippa grandy an italian like yourself recently spoke before the security council urgently calling for the need and what he called cataclysmic conflicts to be dr mass displacement and it's

interesting because italy was a very active participant in both the iraqi i believe be an intervention is it also played on the side of the west in the syrian conflict i appreciate your call the your appeal to the ordinary people i also appreciate so many italian humanitarians taking on the international leadership roles but do you think dr may change the view of the political elite in eataly on the advise ability of military intervention. yeah look this is something that we did and we tried and the. politics is not so different from the their rest of the war the so the problem is that. our party the british and sometime are looking for today and then. for the future i'm not selling that. the government didn't make any mistake i'm telling you that. responsibility that we don't have to focus when we

when we talk about. these kind of phenomena is something that. involve the international community not only a single county then in this single country we have to advocate for to stop because as of migration the. our government and our communities understand that we have we have to fix because of migration talking about the migration just on his own as an example mr rock i don't want to be too argumentative here but when you talk about the international community it's too general of a time because as you know perhaps russia or china wasn't dot and c.z. asked about the american or the western lot after it's in iraq or he in libya and syria so let's be more specific here do you see the west and i fully understand your point and i would try to answer the best they can. when i talk i

don't want to be naive and i'm not that if i can assure you when we talk about international community of course we are talking about. the count trees that have the power and that many of the causes and this is something that involve a lot of counties so it's up to them to discuss and you money have to take care of people and when i call. and when they could too. all of the people we need this is part of my duty is but then at the same time i had to advocate and to call for action so i will calm any initiative that bring to the dialogue or bring to new policies included the rush owing to the usa this is i don't make anything of these variances on this aspect because when that when the people is suffering any person involved in the international dialogue and is an international actor is responsible for the for the suffering is causing these lack

of dialogue this lack of action in fixing the causes of of migration well some may be more responsible than others to be honest i don't think the people are. suffering always is stuck in the detention center the libya is one that if the thirty percent of the responsibilities of coming from one country to seventy one or the seventy percent is coming from another i think that both parties must see and discuss how to alleviate the suffering of these people and this is this is the point i'm not i'm not pointing anyone please i'm i'm telling that there is a common responsibility when we talk about only one county i mean on the right side of the truck this is these are mistakes started i think that we have to see that we have to discuss how to improve our capacity to alleviate this offer and some of the human being or to avoid the what causes so for instance to do human beings well mr

fully agree with you my point was that as you consider possible ways of dealing with the current crisis you he should also be aware of the same consequences if you apply the same methods in the future that's that's my only point i think there and then there is a pattern of intervention and leaving out the consequences for the people on the ground that this is something that surely has to be remedied and i know that you also have actually a solution for that you are in favor of create. these so-called illegal groups particularly out of libya which you believe would be critical for closing this rainy and human smuggling highway why do you think this idea is so far matched with so little enthusiasm from the countries involved look. even more clear and more tough gauging or as a president of the italian across engaging my government on this just to be very clear because of course i talk about legal rules by they also said that this is

a very important a good location for for the government or for the italian government and for the e.u. to engage the libyan authorities to do sign of the geneva convention and improve the capacity to protect the life of those the needs of those. that are fleeing the violence and war and this could be a good sign because in my experience. with the libyan authorities was to sign an agreement about all this and not about human rights and about the protection of the dignity or to subscribe to the geneva convention of the fifty one about jesus and this is something that. isn't a question that my my government as a president of the italian across as minister and i spoke out very very clearly and of course if there is someone who is fleeing violence of course i speak about. a call for a legal route because they must be protected this is my duty from the day which i

took the office in two days to go through as a president of the international federation everywhere will have the opportunity to speak out on beyond four of those they cannot the most vulnerable it's and this is will be my need and we will meet i hope in the future and you will see that. i don't mean any kind of discount to anyone mr speaking about the legal route given the and control tower of the. in libya and the fact that there are already many thousands if not millions of migrants and refugees from all over africa gathered in doc country many of them without proper documentation. why do you believe that the establishment of several processing centers is going to change anything imaginable way look at it talking. is a country in war so in this moment who have. cannot be.

brought big in the. libya so this is. a point on my point of view you are talking about the militias or the role of the militias this is not my world i'm a war is about the level of human suffering and the convention and talking about the protection of the people who's feeling the county. again i think that everyone in this moment in a country war is keeping or cannot be brought in that count so this was the point that they raised out several times i. honestly i could not argue about to the militias right because. i'm not aware i'll bow to always making the violence we know only that there is a lot of violence in this country but i you know and this is we have because we have to prove and the evidence is the volunteers of the car you have across yesterday i received twenty six body of a women that died during crossing that we need to run and this is not set the ball

on a set of what we've done we don't want to see any more bodies of people of people was fleeing a country war being on the italian coast well mr rocca we have to take a short break now but we will be back in just a few moments stay tuned. sure . to keep it was i live eat good for yourself then. leave.

we have other things in this world and this is it you know for everyone why some peoples once so take our thing all the power just for themselves and. we. are. welcome back to worlds apart with francesca rocca president of the international federation of the rat cross and the red crescent society mr rocca just before the

break we touched upon the issue of how the european countries should process people from africa or the middle east who are knocking on their doors and i'm going to ask you about the situation in myanmar later on in the program but i want to use it as a point of comparison because one of the sticking points in the myanmar situation is the proof of origin the demand by the myanmar government that the refugees. provide some sort of documentation. to prove that they indeed come from the state i wonder how do you think the western governments should deal with the african and middle eastern migration do you think they should allow anybody in even with or without documents and if that's the case how would you down ensure that the ride of asylum is respected but not abused look this is. what you

and she are for these ideas is not something you have to ask from me every person you need i don't ask and i thought oh my god my i'm so ready for jesus we already know that in this moment. there are six hundred thousand desperate people was stranded. in a sea of six hundred thousand people but without electricity without water without proper assistance and this is our this is our role and that we are trying to provide the right aid to you or your question should be. directed to the to the head though you ensure the maybe is more a competent than me on and saying on this question for me you know only that there are disparate people in need then and this is what they what they see in these people are telling us that these freeing violence then it's not me i'm not an investigator or a stop to either read out or it is to verify if you store or not but we have a lot of disparate issue and we see

a lot of consequences from violence and we have to protect these people and this is what we are trying to do there all of the money on these not all of the states we take care of the people this is. our role and then there are the government that set up policies and it's up to us to engage them to verify of the policies are not organ. of the people but we protect and we try to give dignity to issue mum because we don't we don't make the difference between the two jews are going to make all migrants alone but mr erakat you are one of the view. if you organizations with the practical experience on the ground because the governments when they make policy is then not very well informed in my if least in my experience about what is actually happening on the ground in libya in syria and in sierra leone you all volunteers with actually no doubt that that's why i think that you know some sort of expertise from your side would be very welcome don't you think so yes of course of when we provide you all the information that we have about the the life condition then

there's this parish on the people that these people are living in but we have not we don't make politics look. because when we talk about our role in this. operation though it's very it's very daily we don't want to be involved in some political issue though we know that there are six hundred thousand people of the three in my and i am are arriving in bangladesh. to try to take care of them it's up to our movement of course to open a dialogue to verify if it's possible that they come back safe in their houses. which they are fleeing but this is this is our all there is when you come to sponsor bit of the international community don't put on our show that they are there is kind of responsibility which there is not let me ask you one more question about this intersection between politics and humanitarianism because the syrian war in particular has dramatically changed the humanitarian field it gave rise to many

organizations which combine humanitarian activities with political or even geo political activism. talents would be one of them but there are many similarities ations originating in turkey even in russia and i want to ask you what do you think about this kind of partisan humanitarian is more humanitarian part of partisanship or whatever you call it does it make your work on the ground easier or harder now. this is becoming hard because a. this is a very she uses sure and i think you that you raise this because this is. the action of the you money that he is putting a risk the life of the. day you money time and money that you're next on the field and your money is an action that we should never politicize look i would we i went down i want to answer you with a very simple towards duty for

a fairly old brother so this is the motto that our founders at least and i did so for you know more than one hundred fifty years ago so after a very very poor bottle because the. war of the independence in italy was a really a terrible war and tens of thousands were lying on the ground with the table suffering and they were. strong that they were enemies but the ladies also for you know the women of seoul for you know that inspires and you know they said. all brothers because when a people is suffering and it's not not belong anymore to a party you. must see as a human being. brothers this is the way in which you neutrality because you are not taken by luck to you care of everyone now this syrian conflict has been now somewhat overtaken in the media by the refugee crisis in myanmar you alluded to it a couple of times already and it's be puzzling to me because the this situation in

myanmar has been deteriorating not just for years but for decades and all of a sudden everybody woke up to it even though it was pretty evident where it was going for quite some time i know you visited the area i think you visited bangladesh last month what impression did it make on you. look it was a maybe there was a situation that the. ever seen in my experience. because. six hundred thousand people in five weeks. i think nor no one is this being the level of this vision though was immense was immense. when i well when. i was really good through friday there was. without a enough wars to explain the level of suffering of the children thousands of

children without parents without their relatives and. this is something that shouldn't up and to anyone i visited syria. i've been in god's eye view that's all you can imagine the level of suffering that i've seen in my experience the ninety after the quake in georgia i've been in many places but what they've seen in that context and of course you said this is aids and i agree with you the problem is that we say that this is not the olympic games of this predation unfortunately this is something that up and every day and this is the crisis but that this doesn't mean that as you money and we are not present everywhere there is a need because we are still in syria because we saw the problem is not about the humanity and the problem is maybe and i maybe i understand even the reason why did the media i'm not following but we always follow we are still in the know what he's talking about we are in the horn of africa and no one is talking anymore about on

an obvious only if you will say all this when three hundred people died while we spend the. day and so why was such a talking about. the one single there was a parka. which another kind of very strange competition so this is something that again that is their responsibility is not of the your money that in your money in silence are doing their part that when their request we are ready to revive you formation to lead. but then it's up to the media to cover the crisis it's not up to us well mr ok let me put one final question and i don't know if it's good or not i don't want to sound too cynical but this situation in myanmar reminds me a little bit of the situation with the refugees in your native country in italy when everybody was agreeing on the fact that the refugees and migrants had to be treated humanely but there were very few countries or actors who were eager to come for very time actually shared the burden do you think that is

a valid comparison maybe maybe maybe. even even war still goes. maybe we have more reporting on it is. bangladesh which every year phase. two of the zoster floods and. then this year. is a low enough to another world disaster. but they see a lot of stories that the migration of course you have for you which you. should be more. sure that it is coming from from either other countries but this is the this is. on the ground and. look i'm very proud about.