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that honestly don't come up next to crosstalk discusses donald trump's foreign policy moves towards north korea and syria. hello and welcome to cross talk we're all things considered i'm peter lavelle from north korea to syria's president donald trump's foreign policy is literally all over the map north korea says it is open to direct talks with washington only to be met with preconditions in syria where the u.s. has no legal right to be in the first place peace is within view but this is not what the trumpet ministration want.

cross-cutting missing diplomacy i'm joined by my guest musin in washington he is the executive vice president of the eurasia center in new york we have daniel is our he is an author and freelance journalist who writes frequently about the middle east eastern europe and the us constitution and in fort lauderdale we have ivan eland he's a senior fellow and director of the center of peace and liberty at the independent institute are you gentlemen crossed the rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciated daniel let me go to you first you were calling this program missing diplomacy and let's look at two areas where a lot of diplomacy is necessary north korea and syria in both cases there there have been or still present some kind of diplomatic opening considering the very fierce rhetoric we've heard about a second phase when we look at it from the trauma administration for north korea and then the u.s. sensually obstructing a number of peace processes and designs in syria where is the diplomacy

daniel go ahead. the so mostly is absent we have a very erratic individual at the top donald trump who has little idea what he's doing but it's very important to emphasize that the u.s. empire is vastly overextended it's gotten self in deep trouble another part of the world including korea and syria and so there really is no easy way out so trumps confusion is a reflection of the larger confusion of the us system ok i've been one i'm good with that's a point you know and we can put it on the person of donald trump and i would put it on the people he surrounded him in self with my impression and i'm very far away is that he's basically disinterested in these topics and he's delegated it to others and unfortunately a lot of them are neo cons go ahead i've been yeah well i think you're right i hear his campaign pledges were different than his than what he's doing now he is pledges

was was let's stay out of a lot of stuff america first let's do what we need to do here at home et cetera and get in don't do nation building overseas etc but i do agree that the u.s. has been overextended for a long period of time and he's exacerbating the problem and it's very it is very confusing to him because he had no one ever and his advisers do not. given the option of saying well you know we we deterred a radical mouse a tongue when he got nuclear weapons in china so he can probably deter kim jong. un in north korea because dictators they just want to survive that's their main goal is to reviving in power and so you know why threaten a paranoid guy right but you know that's not what they're doing in syria of course his name objective was to what you said was to get isis well isis is at least you

know shrunk that's the shrunk in size. as of territory now whether they'll come back elsewhere i don't know but certainly if you're done with the job get out but of course the united states is not doing that because it wants or has forces on the ground it wants to keep control of territories there or that it has a role in the syrian negotiations that's a much different mission then we started with only you know that's exactly right and you could apply that you know syria staying there to determine political outcomes staying in south korea to do to determine political outcomes that is exactly it and it's a zero sum game that we get what we want to win or there's going to be trouble there could be potentially even war i mean that's not how you run a foreign policy all of that is foreign policy it's an extension of military policy and it precludes or excludes the possibility of peacemaking you can think whatever you want of the north korean regime but if the north korean regime and south korea

are talking and both want to talk more and the south wants the u.s. to talk to north korea i don't think there's anything wrong with that because the alternative is far far worse go ahead. and i think peter you're. it's unfortunate but i don't necessarily think people want to direct conflict however we're getting dangerously close to it one could accidentally happening specially when we've got a radically some place that want their survival or the looking for the political perspective and they back in their own selves in their corner and sometimes things happen that you don't expect but i think when we look at syria. you know the. the u.s. is concerned about the rising role of iran in russia in the middle east and i think i think there's pressure from both from the u.s. side from one of their close allies in the area as well as some of the gulf states and they do not want to see iran raising up so you see these accusations or

violating the nuclear accord you see them try and even though they're they're welcome in syria trying to force them to get out of the region. it. it's a dangerous situation there in the u.s. really right now appears they just want to stay present there and present in korea as well to really i don't know if that stuff sort of counter north korea more than just as much as perhaps to counter the rising influence of china no remorse well of course that's the whole point ok that's why they want to stay there they want to determine well first of all they want to make sure that if there's a unification of of the peninsula they determine what that unification is because that is going right up to china's border would be what the president white house would very much want intense in the in the chinese don't want that happen no surprise danny let me go to you you know earl is mentioning about u.s. presence in syria and iran well i mean it's the activities of the united states in

the region since two thousand and three that is only advance the interests of iran i mean i how many more do we have to go through how many more failed regimes we have to go through in that region to to show that the more you push for regime change you more you push to determine political outcomes the more you lose i mean it's a losing streak ok for over a decade and a half but nobody realizes that go ahead dan you're absolutely correct i mean the u.s. policy in the that part of the world has been just amazingly wrong headed the invasion of iraq provided a huge opening to a rare america's allegedly number one enemy in the region you said before they got there america wants things you know in korea and syria but it's not really clear that america even knows what it wants exotic limiting russian iranian or chinese. influence but otherwise it has no idea it has no positive program you know and so therefore the u.s. is trying you know is acting at the behest of saudi arabia and israel saudi arabia

is maybe forming a part very rapidly israel be facing regime change also. who struggles to maintain. scrip so things are crumbling really fast the us has no idea how to stay on top of these things and of course as you say everything had seems to make things worse yes i mean you know it's pushing these pushing for political outcomes there's an impatience going on right here i mean the united states my opinion is scared to death that peace could break out on the korean peninsula they're terrified of that they're terrified that peace could break out in syria because the very fact that they stay there were nobody wants them to be there it makes it a political outcome a peaceful outcome impossible i mean why they so afraid of peace go ahead. well i think you're absolutely correct they seem to want to maintain overseas president

presence in south korea and japan that's where our major forces are right now and that gives us. you know an anchor in east asia and i think they do feel that china is rising and you know just like when saddam invaded kuwait that was a way to stay in saudi arabia for a long time and so i think these types of conflicts are useful in a certain sense for the has your mind to stay and whatever region they want to stay in you know earl if we if we look at the south korean peninsula look at that let's look at the region we've got japan we've got south korea we've got north korea we've got china we've got russia those countries can solve this tension on the peninsula all by themselves but the us will not let that happen the us will not allow south korea full sovereignty over its defense planning and this is the real

problem and i think it could be solved with regional players go ahead. i would agree in fact i just made a made a comment blog recently they were talking about there was some type of conference in vancouver. canada was hosting of course the u.s. was there and and other players but two players to discuss the resolution what direction to go forward on korea and of course the two players that probably should most importantly be there russia and china were not invited and so i think it's. it is ito i agree that i think and i also think the new president south korea is open to dialogue with north korea i think you saw that during the olympics a potential you know mel maybe a slight melting of some ice there but. i do not think the u.s. sees it is in their interests to actually have a dialogue unless it's under their terms and unfortunate i think personally i agree

the regional i think the regional powers here could come to a very good settlement could be general for everyone. but the u.s. wants to the u.s. wants to play the role as far as determining what the conditions are and i don't think that's very healthy for the future of korea and for the region and it very dangerous and in the current environment let me go to daniel before we go to the break here one of the things i find very problematic troubling is that diplomacy is equated with a peace meant these days that is that is terrifying go ahead daniel. yes it is that the u.s. is in a very militant mood it's not interested in diplomacy or talking. look the america wants to prolong its you know the you know polar moment which broke out in ninety nine but now it's faced with challenges by china iran and russia trying to hold them off trying very hard i don't see how that strategy will be successful but

that's what the u.s. is trying to do ok i'm going to jump in here chance i got to jump in here we're going to go to a large break and after that heart break we'll continue our discussion on missing diplomacy stay with r.t. . popess institutions to. put themselves on the line they did accept or reject. so you want to be present. some want to listen. to going to be for us this is what the three of them will be that. i'm interested always in the why. do you. think should. hey everybody i'm stephen ball in the past hollywood guy suspects every proud

american first of all i'm just george bush and r.v. to see this is my buddy max famous financial guru where she's a little bit different i'm not. going to tell or not knowing no one knows up with all the drama happening in our country i'm shooting the brood have some fun every day americans come home and hopefully start to bridge the gap this is the great american people which. russia has been reaching out for decades for years down under putin saying look we've got to trade more this more trade and america is like no no you're an existential crisis because we have to give these deadbeats in congress a lot more money if you're going to create a fake enemy called with demand three hundred million dollars meanwhile you go to trade with china and on the east and create a new so crowded because much for join

a five twenty six line dollar commie all america shrink. fifty years ago breaking within two cons again as a sleeping pill a dozen pieces would suddenly because not just us would share the scientific sweat terrible but not on the road as shown in dutch one football movie here nor the wall. across europe victims are still waiting legal battles demanding at least some compensation in something in two ways first will the physical damage itself as well that the constant mind that the people who could take this call it has never been the job. this has been a couple. welcome

back across the uk where all things considered i'm peter beltre mind you we're discussing missing diplomacy. ok let's go back to new york with the new idea when you finish up your point the one that you were elaborating on before the break yeah yeah my point simply is the u.s. is trying to fend off a triple threat from iran russia and china. and there is complete unanimity i've seen no dissent whatsoever among any of the mainstream commentators or political politicians liberal conservative or what have you they all agree that they must rebut the russian chinese and the rainy and threat menace. and i can't see how that strategy can possibly prevail well you know ivan i'm i'm

i don't agree that there are threats whatsoever i mean china is a regional power russia is certainly. not a global power its reach is actually quite small and if you look at russian foreign policy and defense policy it's very they're most concerned about their sovereignty more than anything else and the near abroad i know some people don't like that term but it's it's real ok i mean these these threats here in a rant on iran it's surrounded by. nato or nature related countries bases i mean this is all a fiction here but it certainly is very good for the arms industry i mean and donald trump has been such a sugar daddy to them this year and next year first go ahead. yes i think that's absolutely right and we can also add that our south korean japanese and european allies are. very wealthy country absolutely and this is not one nine hundred fifty

anymore and they can start taking over the their own defenses what about a deal and korea that north korea denuclearize if the u.s. withdraws all forces from south korea and south korea defends itself you know we wouldn't have to be immediately over time that's a possibility you have got to do something dramatic but that's of course that's not going to happen that's wishful thinking because there's a military industrial complex in many countries but the one here in the united states we tend to build up threats larger than they are and i think your assessment of the various threats was pretty accurate china may rise but of course all the countries in asia could band together and they have fairly good internal security japan's an island that's very safe you just have to run a porcupine strategy is that are european allies have more combined economy g.d.p. than the united states so and have course in the middle east it's sort of it's sort

of a canard that we need to defend or oil the market is much better of providing oil at the cheapest prices exactly you know one of the things that if you look at the client states in the in the alliances of the united states was created around the globe these client states do like the status quo for the most part south korea in this moment maybe a little bit different because they might see it some kind of diplomatic opening and want to take it and washington say no but like look at japan you know look at saudi arabia look at israel i mean they're all fat and happy i mean the american taxpayer pays for it. they don't even have to be particularly loyal allies thinking there's a wide avenue of maneuver for them in many cases and the united states if you look at like in the pacific here you know they could easily be pulled into a conflict that it was not of it's one thing but because of all of its alliances here i mean this these all these entangling alliances are very dangerous for the united states but for a country that voted for a man that wanted america first go ahead irl. it's interesting it's i mean we have

like seven hundred bases around the world. being sickly ringing around surrounding iran's rounding russia surrounding china. but yeah absolutely i think essentially we're we're we're providing the military side of the foreign policy for a lot of these countries that are quite well off. and the thing is is would piece really and would diplomacy really take hold if if we did draw back you know and diplomacy would not be an interest differently or you would have to kick in it would it would have to automatically kick in a little to saying well washington said well washington's no no you guys have to sit down and work this out here i mean earl isn't it remarkable how many borders around the world the united states protects and doesn't protect its own border go ahead earl finish up. yeah it's. true.

we have more concern over other. country's security than we do our own sometimes but. you know there's other political regions in that because there's both lobbying groups on the military side lobbying groups for for other countries that have a significant influence on what's going on and it's not necessarily for america first unfortunately i think would be better handled maybe facilitating regional discussions and actual talking to people would be much more beneficial i think for global peace but i don't necessarily think global peace is is the major objective i think it's almost a disruption you know what is the objective well it's a gemini is the goal ok i mean that's that's the goal in washington you know daniel if i could just go astray just a little bit here you know i'm sure you've been following the ups and downs in the smoky rooms and mirrors of brushy gate in the seventeen hackers in the st

petersburg we took about a week of the news cycles. but there's no real concern in the mainstream to talk about the countries that actually really do influence american foreign policy in washington d.c. they call it lobbying in the united states but you know there is this kind of influence is that saudi arabia has israel has turkey has japan south korea we could go all we could make many many programs about that but that's almost kind of a taboo subject to talk about you can go after macedonia teenagers fine on twitter but you know a real serious discussion i'd like to know how many congressmen and senators meet with foreign lobbyists they don't have to record it they don't have to tell anyone but if you accidentally bump into the russian ambassador well you get a warrant against you go ahead down. well you know you say it like to have some serious discussion i'd like to have some serious discussion about just about anything and this. is so debased. fallen so far

about about everything everything. and so so it's farcical really farcical but yes influencing american politics first of all politics are international laws for all trees number one and number two i mean countries like saudi arabia kuwait the u.a.e. is real maintain huge lobbies the united states that are extremely effective the gulf states for example the lavish money every virtually every major think tank in washington is funded by the gulf states and they use that money to essentially shape or control debate so and so in washington one rarely gets the gets the opposing non saudi non israeli point of view it's completely outrageous and the people who are just served by this are the american people who you who you

know there are very important issues that need to be thrashed out but what you're being you know buried you don't know you know swept under the rug it's just it's the symptomatic of a of a political system in deep crisis i mean that you know there's it long ago there was the it was a long time ago when there was public debate about foreign policy you never hear anything about that if you just as dan you were saying as i tell people here in american media don't say much about israel don't say anything about saudi arabia ok those are just two examples good i've been. yeah i think the other participants or are right on here. our whole policy is on autopilot and what we have is a military that set up the power project overseas so we should call the department of defense department of often through the department of defense of other countries because in the in the few times during our history that the military has been asked

to defend the country it doesn't fit haven't done a very good job in a war of eight hundred twelve we got the capitol burned before they managed to fight the british to a drive to declaring war on the superpower at the time in world war two they didn't think the japanese were capable of attacking pro harbor so the military failed there and of course on nine eleven the fighter jets went out to sea so we need to increase our defenses and quit you know meddling in other country's business you know you know early that through the thing that i find again i think daniel really hit it here because i'm i'm very disappointed to so i have my own program because i can talk about things that i think are interesting because when i look at the literal of corporate media there's almost nothing of interest to me whatsoever it's tragic stories it's sad stories it's political posturing but there's no debate really about policy and foreign policy is never ever debated right now except for china's bad russia is bad in iran's bad ok that's it that's all you hear twenty

four seven and you never hear the other side of the argument well why are they so bad you hardly ever hear it go ahead. now i mean daniels correctly absolutely correct i mean if you look at the funding goes to some of the think tanks that are very influential where they're coming from you really don't have a real dialogue on foreign policy and and it should from the hip sometimes it's autopilot it's unfortunate i think and even look at our diplomats i really some of the verb jews didn't public in public forum so i'm i'm kind of appalled by and it doesn't really set a fine example of where we should be as a country and should be leading into a diplomatic efforts and i really we're kind of lagging in that area for the most part you know daniel you know well i know the person that girl's talking all this talk about nikki haley you know for she got her job at the u.n.

the only foreign experience she had was going to the internet an international house of pancakes that's what we have in the united nations you get the last word daniel. well you know our peter. peter five days if i may correct you on one thing there is a serious debate in this country for example a very lively serious debate has broken out over jennifer lawrence's low cut dress . for her latest movie. and that was a very wide ranging debate very serious a question a lot of important subjects so dad you know what side of the on what side they are to make sure you will discuss daniel what side of the argument you on on that one there are. no head no comment as much as much to fraught it's much too fraught for me i would never i would i don't have the courage a little bit could do you think there would be totally destroyed on facebook and twitter if you meant gave your opinion ok god help us god help us all all right gentlemen that's all the time we have any thanks to my guests in washington new york and in port lot of there and thanks to our viewers for watching us here see

you next time and remember. when else seem wrong. but all wrong just don't. get to see a pallet just to come out to. and in detroit equals betrayal. when something find themselves worlds apart we choose to look for common ground.

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