excellent point it would be a safeguard it would be a signpost it would be an indication that quantum computer had hacked into the big client protocol in a significant way what about all those quantum computers that here are we in danger is it all happening is unraveling it's tweet i saw from stacy herbert and oh that's very. crypto is already quantum whoever looks at it observes whatever they want to see and this is in response to all of these regulators in the u.s. you know we have more regulators in united states that we have intelligence agencies and they all want in on coin and crypto currency and they're determining what it is so here's a succinct tweet from mines fiction and he says crypto is considered property by the i.r.s. money by the treasury department commodities by the c f.t.c. and securities by the f.c.c. in before c.d.c.

declares crypto a pandemic. isn't this fascinating they can't really decide what it is you know all these regulatory agencies are looking at it and they see it as a reflection of themselves in some way there is a case to be made that it does resemble to some degree a commodity i've said since two thousand and eleven it is a but it is an emerging asset class that is none of the above somebody made the comment that it's like a duck billed platypus right it's got features from all these things in and one thing and you would think it would work but it does work so it's not really any of those things it is a unique asset class we haven't seen anything new in the world of finance master classes and hundreds of years really this is the first thing we've seen new in such a long time and so that's why it's so interesting to see how regulators approach this because they don't really have the tools you. to regulate it in the way that

they've become accustomed to there needs to be a new agency spawned you sound exactly like brian quinn tens who is a commissioner of the c f t c and some of your quotes they're almost exactly as he recites looking at cryptocurrency but before then i just want to point out that what has happened in the past week we can have is that we've seen a federal judge judge a us federal judge determined that the c.f. t.c. can basically go after coin as a commodity we've also seen the f.c.c. obviously say that all of the tokens that they look at they see them as securities and then we saw fin san in the united states determine that exchanges are basically money transfer so that bitcoin encroacher currencies are money so mark marquess centaury who is a crypto lawyer he pointed out that that's technically and legally impossible for

an asset to be both money and a security it can only be one or the other it's going to be regulatory mayhem and as they cancel each other out potentially they won't work together of course will probably just create a mishmash of isolation for a moment that it was considered to be a trans a merger heard you say which was interesting because it would be killing the old world and assuring in the new world of crypto which is transforming the global financial big way i think it's going to have the biggest impact in countries and regions of the world that have no formal banking in place now so across africa and other places is where the crypto revolution is really going to take hold it won't be in london or new york well we'll see time will tell and of course part of the problem has been that while queen itself is an amazing innovation that nobody could figure out why. it is but it is that it works is that many of the people who have

made it big in the big points base lack the imagination to come up with their own words and phrases so they use words like i.c.a.o. which taunts the f.c.c. saying who they are the regulator for i.p.o.'s so calling year is not an initial public offering but an initial coin offering only taunts them and says. you know me the model for the skype you know the creators of skype and they totally destroyed the long distance market in the love funny business they purposely never refer to as telephones are these none of those no more like overjoyed at protocol they just did stuff to tolu avoid that and they snuck in ubiquity before the regulators could shut them down in the coin space because space to use the word coin itself was problematic i see it was problematic they should have just gone with tokens should have been

a bit token or something token originally they should've avoided all the words a normal place you're referring to money from the day one they would have avoided a lot of these issues now i mentioned brian quinn tends from the commissioner as they see f.t.c. the commodities futures trading commission and here's a headline from coyne desk where he says crypto industry should self regulate c f t c commissioner regulations can take years to develop so why wait when you can self regulate that's the message us commodity futures trading commission commissioner brian quinn tends to liberate to the audience at the d.c. blah change summit last week i believe that a private cryptocurrency oversight body could bridge the gap between the status quo and future government regulatory action he told the audience in his keynote address contents also suggested that a cryptocurrency self regulatory organization or an s r o could have an impact beyond the u.s. market and could potentially take on global significance it goes into all this that that crypto currency is actually many things and that's why so. many regulators one

in on it but this notion that how about self regulating why not come up with your own regulations and part of this is that the ecosystem of cryptocurrency well there's no one voice to speak for bitcoin there's no set toshi nakamoto we don't know who he or she or they were there are also many libertarians and anarchists who want nothing to do with government so nobody wants to have any sort of regulations but there are obvious scams out there are many of the i c o o's were obvious cams and who within the community is going to step forward and say we need to end this look nobody buys it going the escape. that's what gives a value is the crumbling world because fiat it doesn't work. emerged and there have been attempts to bring some kind of oversight or regulatory body or

type of pownal to get a big point foundation for example came and went and it didn't really work it doesn't idea of having a centralized force in this way doesn't doesn't work and it's already self-regulated big the protocol regulates itself it doesn't need an outside regulator to regulate it if somebody wants to come along and try to encourage best practices and encourage you to get good wallets and how to protect your individual sovereign say that's a great idea but it does it's not going to the state is going to come forward and say here's how we're going to help you create your individual sovereignty so you're not reliant on the state by promoting best practices in the big points space so the state is not going to do that and all these regulators are functions of the state so they're not going to be helpful in any way a lot of people would say that getting wrecked is self regulation that's the way to get regulate it is like you should have done your due diligence you sort of studied a little bit wary markets used to be like that until nine hundred eighty seven the crash of eighty seven brought about the plunge production team of great. and robert

rubin alan greenspan they started buying and selling stock futures in the open market for the first time american history guiding the price of the dow jones so nobody had to experience a down day and this is the beginning of the collapse of the american economy and anyway so you can apply that to everything in life there needs to it's like because allah says i'm without hell if you need the good and the bad any of capitalism to work both winners and losers you can't bail out every single bank that gets into trouble you can't bail out every single county capitalist i need free money you gotta let the system weed out the losers otherwise you end up with you know a state controlled state maintained price fixing regime by the state that resembles all failed such experiments of the past why not just let the free market be the free market well here's brian quinn tens and of course he is a regulator he's at the c.f. t.c. and when clinton remarked in the interview that big coin is absolutely clearly not a security it is absolutely

a commodity he also said that the aforementioned agencies and others should avoid reducing the broader space to one type of product in reality it's a very broad array of innovative products that have been created some are very simple some are very complex some have utility function some have security like features some have payments associated with them are returns or ownership or sure some could have voting rights you get into a very murky landscape very quickly as you go through the diversity of the landscape here let me help this fella understand what's going on you know here in north america we are faced with an invasion of the tiger fish not just in north america but in florida in particular in florida in particular because they released this fish that's natural to another. part of the world in asia it came in and it is now devastating the ecosystem now of course. time is the

tiger fish a money it entered into an ecosystem dominated by the us dollar fee our currency and it now is eating it it's destroying it is pushing it out of the way and there's nothing you can do about it and because it's it's it has evolved it's a quantum leap we started talking about quantum physics this is a you know electrons are there in there in one orbit or another there's no in between it's they can't land on a fraction ok it's group place is a corrupt broken system where the new better system full stop you can't do anything about it game over you can try and full around in a waste a lot of money but you know as you will of course because that's your nature but again like the to use another analogy of the frog and the scorpion you know the frog taking the scorpion over the river and he says i'll do it but don't sting me and sure enough the scorpions to get the frog and they both drown and the frogs is

why did you do it and he says because it's my nature a k. crypto is going to be here to stay regulators will try to destroy it even though it's stupid to do so because it is their nature they don't have the comprehensive ability intellectually to understand the seismic paradigm shift that they are trying to deal with if my god are already and it's already what well i think you mean lionfish not tiger fish and they have no known predator in the caribbean they do in the pacific ocean but not in the caribbean so that is part of the problem i had overproduced the same thing happened up until. the introduction of bitcoin is the us dollar had no known predator and then they quickly became the thank you for making sense of my analogy ok so then allergies been cleaned up in the following way it's a lion fish and not tiger fish and there's no known. predators which is why they

bring their dominance and fear i had no known predators up until big is that it or say i have clarified i d crypted you're an allergy and at the same time cleaned up your code which had misprinted tiger fish rather than lion fish it's all so wonderful all those more coming your way stay right there. this is. the church secret indeed the priests accused of sexually abusing children can get away with it literally i want to call this the do graphic solution so what the bishop needs to do then he finds out that the priest is is

a perpetrator is simply moves him to a different spot were the previous standards not the highest ranks of the catholic church conceal the accused priests from the police and justice system to that end of themselves and as the i intend. to do this out in the. the most expensive fish in the world each one is selling for tens of thousands of euros it continues to grow its entire life if it was thirty years old you might have a two ton fish out there and yet they don't get that big today because we're way too good at catching. it's only women and it's off

a much larger mission was once there and that was much more widely distributed we have politicians that are in office for a few years they have to get reelected everything is very very short term our system is not suited and is not geared for long term survival and that's why we have the catastrophes. welcome back to the kaiser report i'm asked as i'm going to turn to jamison lop of casa hoddle or hodell the penny and i pronounce that james and welcome back great to be here all right first tell us about costs hoddle sure yes so we're just going by costs you know the problem is some squatter has the cost of a twitter account so casa hoddle on twitter for now but in general what we're trying to do is facilitate the ability for people to be their own big bank and you

know we've been given this promise for so many years that with the queen you can be your own bank but to be honest a lot of people don't want to go to the trouble of being their own bank so we've learned a lot over the past few years and i've spent three years working at bit go doing multi-city enterprise hard wallets and now i'm kind of transitioning to focus on the individuals i think there's a gap here where especially with the price run ups over the years we have a lot of extremely wealthy crypto people in the space who are not doing their due diligence to really be their own bank and so what right so a lot of people want to be that on bank but they're not engaging that a bit the it's hard to do right so you're trying to come to market with a product or something that will make that easier so how is it the product is easier how right so we really want to make it as simple as having an app on your mobile phone that you're just following the wizard instructions and we're going to enable the security by having three or five multi-city while it where most of those

keys are going to be on different hardware wallets so you'll then have your hardware wallets that you'll geographically separate and have in different secure locations and we'll be providing full service best practice advice and you know phone and e-mail support if you have any questions ok so this is a start up exact right and roger marriott well we are all over the place we have. people in multiple states around the united states ok so good luck with that will keep close tabs on it let's talk about trip down because the big picture here is the twenty seventeen was the year of a theory m i c e o's the great big coin civil war which resulted in the summer of fork not the summer of love what do you have to look forward to in twenty eighteen a lot more of the forking for sure in fact you know there are some people who have said that we could expect as many as fifty fifty different forks as it becomes easier for people to do that for the uninitiated out there quickly a coin fork is what we're specifically talking about is

a big coin block chain for there have been software forks a big point for many years but the idea being that you say you know at a specific block specific date we're going to create a new divergent history of the big block chain and everyone who had been at that time now has the new tokens on the new chain and you know you can change any of the rules of the protocol that you want to and that is resulted in people doing a lot of very interesting creative things and this of course as we alluded to create a tremendous i would say drama in twenty seventeen this summer twenty seventeen and the seem like the forces of quote unquote good prevailed i guess one camp would say and gave a segue and as a result now we have the stage is set for a lot of development coming. as both a pro simplicity let's talk about these because this is really some people would

argue that the crypt to look at most would be the crypto with the best technology and because it seems to attract the best technologists and let's talk about these things a lightning network is worse a status that wasn't me we have progressed pretty far even just in the past few months where now there's actual usable lightning so. where where you can either run on the test net or if you're feeling particularly adventurous you can actually run it on main that but there are definitely still some bugs in there that are needing to get fleshed out so we're not recommending putting you know actual value behind it yet but you can you can go to lightning dot network and see a lot of the development and apps that people are building all right signatures so that's a little bit further out probably be at least a year or so before we see people actually using it but that's going to be a really under the hood thing where i think like the average user isn't going to directly see much from it we're going to see more efficiency gains basically from

individuals and people who are receiving lots of transactions and then having to spend all of those you so it's really just a consolidation of the signatures to make the transactions more compact use less block space and therefore be cheaper on the feeds so this all of kind of falls under the heading of scaling and this is a benefit ongoing debate and the vacant space is not scaling fast enough it's not scaling the way people like it people trade for x. they don't like the way it scaling of the view that is scaling exactly as it needs to scale there's no faster slow to scaling it scaling as it is it's they the protocol was launched in january of two thousand and nine and it's still in exactly what lincoln expected to do no more alas is that is that a fair statement yeah i mean i spent ten years doing web app development and special ops specific specifically like scaling problems in web apps and in the way

the scaling works is you you become more popular and you hit some bottlenecks that hurts you know it's painful and that's your incentive to then make changes to make it more scalable and this is a cycle that will repeat over and over probably in perpetuity you know that the way encryption works of course is that it's a lot easier to create encrypt and then to decrypt a simic asymmetry involved in this is part of the reason this is really the. of the whole truth of work algorithm but it's also can be said as a lot easier to create an all quiet or a four coin that is to create bitcoin in other words i say this so is this an attack vector and you have you know other words people can come out lots of coins a lot of four x. seven gobs of lots of cash on the sidelines and does it swamp this space as attract regulators does it does it stink in a way that's unhealthy. i mean it has created a branding war it's been a real brain drain for a lot of people in the community arguing about like what is the real bitcoin also

from a technical standpoint you know when i was working at big goo it was causing a lot of developer drain for us having to expend a lot of resources to support various forks and you know it's unclear how the long term viability of those different things is going to end up or let's get back to our list of scaling initiatives that are coming down the road here bullet proof so that is going to give us better privacy which i think a lot of people have been waiting to see. so we've had these various ideas for things like confidential transactions and then cash for example is doing there's your knowledge proofs but in general these these great privacy advancements they have a lot of blue to them they require a lot of data and of course with the block size being restricted you want to use as little data as possible bulletproof they're going to enable us to do these more privacy centric signature schemes without requiring huge transaction back to twenty fourteen or so a lot of these old colleen's came in to being it was in response to

a lot of people believe what the scaling issue in terms of the slowness of scaling etc and so a lot of coins are focused on privacy. narrow even dash are these coins. are these developments going to such a cannibalize those coins to a degree is there anything that can be done. in an altered coin that can't be done on because. well from a long term standpoint technically you know big or any of these protocols can theoretically be changed to do anything of course we've seen the social dynamics to make that a lot more complicated but i can say you know for example marrows already working on implementing bulletproof because it's going to be a huge advantage to their efficiency is it likely to cost brought it in first so you can argue charlie and that did those guys it was a push to the ball forward a lot of ways and it showed it worked and it was so there that was and that i think

a positive thing that was done in the space. good on our list ok is one member wimble i guess this is another harry potter reference it is and the project that's implementing member wimble is actually called the grin project and this is very exciting cutting edge stuff that i can't even claim to fully understand myself but suffice to say that they're really rethinking a block chain such that they're they're targeting extreme privacy and extreme scale ability at the same time which we haven't seen before the easiest way to describe it is that a block in member wimble only really has one transaction in it regardless of how many people are transacting with each other these are all second layer apps member wimble will be its own separate watching ok at the moment it's just a test network so the name of the company is going to be. that the formal name of the company just cost is just cost of a call consomme ok your comment to this from what you perceive to be the number one

issue for adoption i think are a big issue for adoption and talking about adoption now people are starting to get a bit nervous about all the regulatory heat that's coming on and we've said for many years that bitcoin the regulators drop dead that's been our message. it's self-regulating in a sense and we're going to another attack vector that needs to be overcome because the regulators after all were regulating all the banks in two thousand and eight and then the genesis block it there's a note right there chancellor on the brink of a second bailout for banks so big call in the regulators are essentially oil and water in a lot of ways. where do you think we are and this is now the regulators going to burn themselves out trying to regulate because because they don't know if they still don't understand they don't the some call a commodity some

a currency some stick a currency some a security they can't even decide what it is. are they going to burn themselves out and we're going to overcome this hurdle james well they can't i don't know if it's that they can't decide what it is i see it more as you know every regulatory agency is going to define these crypto assets in whatever way but who's them to have the most control over you know deciding how certain entities interact with them so we're going to see a lot of regulation that is going to you know put some pressure on the custodians of these assets so especially like the exchanges or in the case of i.c.'s and tokens whoever is issuing these new possible securities and so we haven't really seen i think any governments try to regulate these protocols themselves that would be interesting to see if they actually go that far but i think the at least understand that you can't regulate you know data or protocol they have to focus on

regulating specific people that are in their jurisdiction right and so should not come out is anonymous and also we've often said on many times that the exchange is a kind of the vulnerability the weak point this whole process and so that they clearly this is where they're starting to to to attack and i think trans like below . which is now been bought out by circle. back backed up by goldman sachs and my portend a trend away the big banks decide to get into this business by dominating those exchanges and then they can go to work picking off coins that they don't like they say for saying well you bet all right well that's going to do it for this edition of the cars or a pair of eyes or as they say eric like to thank our guest jamieson all up he is with casa or cottle the panic if you want to catch us on twitter at kaiser report at the last time.

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