israelis. in the tent ok i that's really interesting let me go to michael here because. well you know some some sovereignty is more important than others ok i mean syria should have the legal sovereign right to make whatever friends it wants ok the united states that is that all the time ok and then when he says anything about it and let me go to michael you know you know israel is right on the border there one of the largest military set in the world most powerful it is never lifted one finger to fight terrorism in syria actually just the opposite it's aided and abetted groups ok so i mean worried about israel's concerns that israel is part of the problem here and i think in saudi arabia is part of the problem here two key allies of the united states go ahead michael. you hit up you hit right on at the end there this this is as a result flowing out of a deal that between the saudis and the israelis and again the saudis actually are pouring millions of dollars into the sunni controlled areas as well as into lebanon

because they see it but they see a potential for. iran absolutely capturing them as it is as far as their influence is concerned and the saudis are absolutely against that and you have the israelis who are trying to help that and they see the they see the forward movement of the iranians and as a direct threat to them and and as a consequence i wouldn't doubt that the israelis could and this an attack on lebanon almost any time chair and i know people in lebanon that i talk to are very concerned about that joe weigh in on that there because it is you know is this policy being driven by tell of even riyadh. well certainly riyadh and other gulf states from the very beginning and turkey wanted the overthrow of saud and that brings me to the point that whether you agree or like the assad government or not it's a fact that they were been on the defensive this is an uprising this was an attempt

to overthrow a government so you're on the defensive so to invite iran in and russia to help them defend themselves is a natural act of a government trying to survive this was not iran or russia invading syria the iranians wouldn't come in if there were no attempt to overthrow the government so they they have every right as you pointed out to invite whoever they are any friends they had to help them survive this is not true and any government would do that now the israelis i mean hezbollah by the way i think is defending lebanon even lebanese christians and you know they don't know who would agree with as much as they hate they may hate that well they may not like them but they realize that the libyan army isn't worth joining me so let me jump in here just let me jump in here we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion on syria state with our.

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back to crossfire where all things are considered i'm peter lavelle you were discussing the situation in syria. ok let me go back to richard in new york richard i know you're a career diplomat and diplomacy is sorely lacking these days around the world but richard me what a military strike against the regime. the assad government in damascus what is that's what kind of. what outcome would washington be looking for in striking syria you've said that they have backed away. from a regime change i think there that doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense i think they would want to go all the way i mean what kind of behavior is that hugo trying to enact here i mean this is the problem with military policy because it doesn't really have to work with political outcomes it has certain goals of destruction and threatening and doesn't really talk about the

political part of it go ahead richard in new york we certainly do need a clearer overall policy towards syria the strategy has been wanting to put it mildly now the question though what are we trying to accomplish by staying in why we're two thousand yeah very small number there in northeastern syria. we don't think first of all we don't think that the isis. effort is totally ended and we also know there are other groups ready to come in in its wake if given the least opportunity so what's needed is a strategy which develops the country as a whole as quickly as possible involves the people with their own government as quickly as possible after these years of warfare massive killings and dislocations

it's not going to come easily it's not going to come well but one thing we can contribute up the moment is the continued small military presence in the country with isis very much at the top of our concerns well richard it just the opposite is probably the truth i mean the u.s. maintaining its forces in syria probably gives isis a reason to exist to fight a foreign occupier number two richard the u.s. government has already warned it will sanction third parties and countries that help syria with its reconstruction so getting all the people together and helping developing the country that's already off the table you'll be sanctioned ok michael i can see you wanted to jump in there go ahead. yeah i guess once again gets back to the whole point is as to why u.s. forces are remaining in the sunni controlled area of eastern eastern syria looking for bases actually that the turks have complained about in the kurdish controlled

area the whole idea is i think by the united states if it's trying to resurrect this policy of any kind is that unite the sunni's and of east syria with west western iraq and to maintain that presence there and control that area and basically partition syria ultimately even though you have a little pocket of of isis but but the united states is supporting entities and groups militant groups though such as josh al islam which was in east ghouta and and has the capability by the way of launching chlorine gas and other and other weapons of mass destruction they have actually admitted that in the past up in aleppo earlier this year so the data states is going to continue to support these sunni control groups and i think ultimately it is to divide syria and with the help of the saudis the saudis are paying for this or they've they've offered money and

and i think taken that may be the only reason why he has decided not to pull out because well i got a good you know you know michael it has been it has really paid for isn't it really wonderful that the u.s. government pimps out the american military for a foreign power what it does scrapes wouldn't real discrete you know where we're coming in over the many women there and we're going to go to anything there is for the people that work in the military to be pimped out by their own president to have you know a somewhat hobby crazy regime in saudi arabia pay you you know you wrap your head around that ok that's pretty that's amazing ok let me go to joe here i think happening it's happening let me go to joe you know what's what is happy. thing to me is that there is such a poor in the united states because of russia russia russia and this disease is transported south across the atlantic and to britain right now over a nother chemical weapons incident which we see no evidence whatsoever disposed to

believe it but joe that they want to give russia a bloody nose they want to give russia a bloody nose in syria the russians have already made it very clear that they will not take those threats lightly ok that's why i'm very very concerned go ahead joe. yes i totally agree with you know we have to understand the it's a fiction that the united states was fighting isis in syria i believe they were fighting them in iraq i think there were two separate wars we know from this intel defense intelligence agency document from twenty twelve that the u.s. and its partners in the region and europe wanted to establish yourself as principality which later became isis it was warned about that then we know from a john kerry leaked audio that he was watching he says he was we were watching isis advance on damascus to try to get assad to leave exactly what that document said that the put pressure on us so there was no there is no effort to defeat ice russia has to feed it with syria and iran and other militants and shia militias have

defeated isis in syria they're not there for that reason and we have to remember also at from the campaign of donald trump he wanted to cooperate with russia in syria and syllis worry about the former government later on whether assad stays or not the real problem was isis why the king had i don't know who told him that weather was bannon or whatever or he just got a brilliant idea one morning but that was the right policy that even obama tried to implement if you recall he had kerry try to work out a cooperation they would ask russia that putin has for the national lottery destroy you know it's you know spoiled the priority you know that the right i gave let me you know the other night you know be evil when there is a illegitimate to require as the legitimate diplomatic attempt it is it's destroyed by these hawks in the military. and now peter yeah and now peter you want to do a drawer to troops if you read a piece in the new yorker by robin wright the generals who are the ones who are supposed to be running the show not the president the we have a civilian form of government here not the generals so again trumps instincts are

to say the right thing but he's pulled back by those behind him and this attack coming very for to asli would i was about to withdraw the troops looks like the opposite is going to happen you know richard why why does the why is the united states threatening the demand. because government when damascus has been doing the heavy lifting to fight isis and what the united states there's every times it goes in there militarily has its forces on the ground it just dull ones that attempt to fight terrorism if you know the u.s. policy is an impediment to fighting isis i don't understand the logic here go ahead richard in new york you have flatly disagree with the resumption of at least the consistency of syrian policy to fight isis what is it and is what is the u.s. done in syria for what is wrong with what is what name one thing the united states has done right when it comes to syria one thing well we tried for many many years

to get syria interested in opening up talks with the israelis they were very very reluctant to come anywhere near the wine glass was the last president his last years ok i don't claim to have no idea what you actually mean to after seven years of civil war a proxy international war it's because assad didn't want to talk to the israelis really. no no don't don't misinterpret i'm just saying that. we have tried to do something positive in syria we did work on it to extensively year after year didn't get anywhere ok so that's passed but it didn't leave a very good impression of syria in washington and i can tell you. well i think this is a thank you to know that syrian people and i'm sure you all love the u.s. after the billions of dollars the training the funding the salary of these jihad is from outside the country that's what the u.s.

policy has been and now they are illegally present there under illegally under international law the damascus government wants them out and they won't leave i mean who is breaking the law here who's being an animal here ok this is this war could have ended a long time ago if it hadn't been backed by the united states saudi arabia the other gulf countries and israel would have been over a long time ago go ahead michael do you want to jump in it could have been over a long time and. then beaten up those kids down and ok and on their person and richard on their current stand as they were by alliance and they were it was from outsiders it's very well documented you know don't tell me you know this is all peaceniks war you know wandering around you know giving flowers to people goes out to buy lunch started on day one ok michael you want to jump in. the you know our relationship with the cia are with i'm sorry with with syria actually

degraded in two thousand and three when we invaded iraq the syrians saw all that this was going to happen they had they had the back channel with the cia how and when they let this say ok they have helped to a point they did and then that's when they turned to the pentagon just on the eve of the invasion they say don't don't invade we'll while try to work this out we'll leave the state some five thousand troops to go into iraq for you to do look for w m d they saw what would what the outcome will be so everything went to pieces from then that's when assad really turned to iran right after that and that cannot be disputed that is a that is a fact and i think that that's when iran and syria really began to become closer you've got to keep in mind assad is a she is a white so that was normal and this is what upset israel to

a great extent our foreign policy in the united states has been to carry out to help implement israel's foreign policy for years and the pentagon was the instrument for doing that ok joe that forty seconds you had to program go ahead joe . yeah well john bolton began this week his new job to be advisory as a real thing for iran the iranian presence in syria might be what he would ultimately be going after even more than trying to overthrow assad yeah it looks to me that always it's iran always that is at the very very center it has been since the the revolution in one nine hundred seventy nine and trump and he has surrounded him with a group of people that feel exactly the same way people that meant the the defeat in vietnam that's all the time we have gentlemen many thanks to my guests in washington and in new york and thanks to our viewers for watching us here see you next time and remember ross hospitals.

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yet to stamp out disdain the constant activity. and engagement because the trail. when so many find themselves worlds apart when you choose to look for common ground . zia's says harlan kentucky. boy you go three families are you. a co money city with almost no coal mines left. the jobs are gone all the promises i'd. love to see these people the survivors of disappearing before their eyes. i remember thinking when i was younger that if anything ever happened to the coal

mines here that it would become a ghost town but i never thought in a million years i would see that and it's happening it's happened. this is our t. russia says it has solid evidence that the intelligence services of a foreign power helped to stage the alleged chemical attack in the syrian city of duma on saturday. demonstrators in gaza rally along the israeli border demanding freedom and justice it's the latest march in a two week old protest campaign that's been met with deadly force by israeli soldiers. at arsenal football fans receive a warm welcome in russia before their teams match with cisco moscow despite their concerns about russian hooligans. are really good if you know what the world cup so we could see when you come in for yourself and you see that is no problem the russians are lovely i mean to say what happens between governments a lot happens between people are totally different.

i their life worldwide from moscow this is r.t. international news at five pm here on friday with me calling bright first off russia's foreign minister sergei lavrov says moscow has solid evidence that saturday's alleged chemical attack in the syrian city of duma was staged with the help of a foreign intelligence agency. we have undeniable evidence that this was yet another staged attack that involved intelligence agencies of one of the countries that is rushing to spearhead a research for the campaign however those who reported on the alleged attack in duma have some question marks hanging over their credibility as well i guess they have now explained. reports of a chemical attack first appeared strange enough it's almost the precise moment the battle had ended when the syrian government and rebels were negotiating on how to

evacuate the latter reports first appeared on social media twitter facebook and spread like wildfire while my colleague kendall anian and i have learned today that the u.s. now has blood and a year in samples from some of the victims of this attack in syria last weekend and that those samples according to u.s. officials tested positive for chemicals and sources the usuals why the helmet's who service rescue is islamists and syrian rebels also the somewhat less known syrian american medical society sounds together with the white helmets they were cited by the washington post the new york times c.n.n. virtually every western media outlets reporting on this chemical attack on saturday april seventh amidst continuous bombardment of residential neighborhoods in the city of duma more than five hundred cases the majority of whom are women and

children were brought to local medical centers with symptoms indicative of exposure to a chemical agent sams that self is funded by u.s. aid six million in two thousand and fifteen usaid is widely believed to be an arm of the state department and is banned in multiple countries accused of interfering in domestic policies and promoting regime change it even has an office of transition initiatives the management at sams also believe it or not former usaid stuff is. reportedly provided the u.p.c. w with samples of the alleged sarin gas that was used in houla the site of a chemical attack last year after we. donald trump sent fifty seven cruise missiles at the syrian air base o.p.c. w. is on its way to duma to investigate we've contacted various groups including the

world health organization cited cited in the details but for the u.s. there's already enough evidence we definitely have enough proof but now we just have to be thoughtful in our action the national security team is trying to give him as many options as we can and will be thoughtful about it and see what happens what comes next no one can say whether the u.s. will go ahead with a preemptive strike or whether cooler heads will prevail or the u.s. defense secretary of noted on thursday that there's no clear evidence that chemical weapons were actually used in duma last weekend but james mattis did insist that america has the right to carry out a preemptive strike on the syrian government to defend its troops it goes down of looks now at how washington appears to be scrambling for a pretext for intervention. we're looking at very very seriously very closely that whole situation and. we'll see what happens folks will see what happens with the

drum of war is beginning to bang in washington and the beat is for syria the u.s. is again accusing president assad over using chemical weapons on his own people but the basis for this conviction appears to be lacking one crucial aspect we're not engaged on in the ground on the ground there so i cannot tell you that we had evidence well something is better than nothing but right now it's just a feeling behind a possible military attack is it enough to risk ask elating into a war with syria's allies and even a nuclear standoff apparently yes protection of our forces i don't think we have to wait until they're under chemical attack when the weapons are used in the same theater we're operating in the rocky invasion played out along suspiciously similar lines we must take the battle to the enemy we will take every step necessary to make sure our country is secure and we will prevail the iraqi regime has in fact

been very busy in answering its capabilities in the field of chemical and biological agents one difference that jumps out is that with the rug the u.s. had that infamous bottle of anthrax as reason to call on its forces in hindsight it was a completely false pretext and with syria they don't even have that the o.p.c. w the u.n. chemical watchdog the height of judgment when it comes to such cases already vouched two years ago that syria's stockpiles were no more wrong to twenty seeing and their word seems to matter a little for washington there is another similarity with the iraq invasion and one must keep in mind the history of u.n. inspection teams in iraq. even as they were conducting the most. system of arms control and history the inspectors missed a great deal in my last attempt to enlarge the membership of all of the

organisation was convincing iraq and libya for example to join in and that when i am no system member states it was a shock to the americans i believe. because the plans already to take some action military action against iraq the bottom line is that the pentagon is hardly keeping its lack of evidence on whether the attack even happened a big secret never mind the perpetrator behind it all that matters sticking to the tried and trusted path the problem is that the united states believes and that's it would be. of any any law they believe that they have their own rules and it is not the case the threat to use force you know through action the goals against the united nations charter and also we are concerned about the possibility of this coalition that this could go out of control and we might end up with

why there a conflict that done the one that's already been suffer in syria it will not be an attack against syria but also an attack against the whole united nations system are picking up on that let's welcome back to our to british historian and author addle darwish good to see you again why do you think there's this discord between western countries are gung ho ready to go in with their military others are holding back. well i think you can talk about britain here i mean there are five from the prime minister and a few tory m.p.'s and of course the cabinet yesterday i mean they are very strong voices opinion poll was published rather than just that they only twenty two percent of the public with the prime minister threes and. seventy eight percent are against any intervention. again live and

several in the east asking for. parliament parliament supposed to come back to the prime on monday because as a pastor said. the iraq. experience is not quite it was that the front bench of the shadow home secretary diane abbott on review for this morning. said that we do not want to get involved when they were in force become a de facto party to the war and then actually bones on behalf of the islamic terrorist group isis so they are strong voices in britain. to ice to see reason and not push for anything to go further than that and what if things actually interest amaze mind though is it that she's keeping a cool head on this because as well as the iraq mistake that was made in two

thousand and three don't forget her predecessor try to ask parliament about going to war in syria and that got him nowhere you think that's on the mind of the fear of losing in parliament again. well i think it would be very very sort of the balancing for her to lose that nothing definite cameron in fact he probably now and that's sort of less is the circumstances that give him a way to climb down and give but isn't obama a way to climb down and i think that the engine of this time and many people out i'm aware of that yesterday the express we're seeing on the b.b.c. market now we're seeing america since the vietnam war that we actually bombing fear that this third world countries thrive samin and herdsmen that grandstand this time it might actually come against perhaps the best defense system in the modern world and that would actually shoot down and look at their craft and this collision are just of the.