time advantage of sending in electromagnetic signals whether they be radio signals or laser pulses as opposed to trying to make contact by a spacecraft so how do you make sure that extra terrestrials will interpret our signals as an invitation to communicate rather than a challenge when the most important thing about sending the message out is simply being clear and any civilization that has been through this process know that there's going to be some ambiguity so we can expect a certain amount of reservation on the part of the extraterrestrial that they will see what patterns we're sending and try to make sense of them and so that's why we start our messages the first messages we've sent by a focus on simple mathematical and scientific principles to make it as unambiguous as possible that we're talking about what we and the extra terrestrials have in common an understanding of our physical universe all right so here you are saying that our radio and two signals are ready in space could there be like ellie is

watching jerry springer reruns out there somewhere right now like light years away i mean if they base their understanding of us on our t.v. man i mean we're in deep trouble. exactly i couldn't agree with you more that in fact we do expect if there is a civilization just a tiny bit more advanced than we are that they can already pick up jerry springer or any other sit coms interview shows the nightly news they see what we're doing to our planet you know it isn't really a very pretty picture and so in addition to sending in this chaotic messages that we use to communicate with one another we want to send a clear signal to the extraterrestrial that there's also some rationality on our world so flaky have sat. this speech with which to signal us are sent out is very slow as so the closest to about eight layer light years away so there's

a reply it will come in what sixteen years so we're looking at decades if any aliens are out there so. is your whole word just sending messages in a bottle i mean hoping that future generations will get any answer because our civilization will be completely different by that time will they even remember your role. excellent point and that i think has been the greatest obstacle within the seti community to send in intentional signals because some of said we're not ready for something that requires that long term perspective our position it may be is that we need to get ready for a long term perspective as a species in fact a lot of the problems that we encounter in our world today is because we're always looking for immediate gratification we want results by the end of the week or if we're really thinking long term the end of the next quarter but some good things take time so you're absolutely right that when we're sending our messages in a bottle we're sending many of them to many stars and it's critical that we keep

track of where we've sent those and what the messages were so that if we do get a reply back we will know what the reply was in response to how do you figure out what the aliens will understand what they won't i mean do you think human culture has something that transcends this boundary mathematical equations i don't know maybe music. you know i wish that when we're communicating with the aliens they would know english or russian or spanish or arabic but there's no reason to think they would have that in common so we have to say what do we and the aliens have in common simply by virtue of being able to make contact well if they receive our radio signals we know that they can build radio antennas that requires a technical sophistication and you've got to be a good engineer you're not going to be a good engineer on any planet if you don't know something as fundamental as two

plus two equals four so that's what we begin with in our message simply explaining to the extraterrestrials here's how we count here's how we do arithmetic the interesting thing is by taking very gradual steps upward soon we can talk about the nature of the radio signal itself and that's what the aliens have in their hands or that they pick up on their machines and so we focus on communicating some very basic concepts very clearly because that's the essential starting point once we have something that they understand that could open the floodgates to tremendous understanding where we can go beyond just math and science to talk about something as you suggest like music the beauty of music is that at its core it can be described in terms of mathematical ratios between no it's it can be described by the same terms physicists use an amplitude frequency duration and so by

starting with basic scientific and mathematical principles we can begin to give extraterrestrial a peek into what it means to be human all right we're going to take a short break right now when we're back we'll continue talking to dr douglas in fact president of massey organization discussing what it's going to be like to hear back from l.a. and civilization state. and

we're back with dr douglas back ajah president of mexico organization discussing

their prospect of finding intelligent lies are other planets so dr black arts when you think about extraterrestrial what do you personally imagine there are like. well the ones that we can contact are going to be scientists because that's the only way we can exchange a radio signal or a laser pulses if they also have an ability to create the instruments that allow us to exchange information but beyond that i don't expect that they're going to look like us you know they're not necessarily even going to have the same way of encountering the world that we do we rely very heavily on our vision vision has evolved forty times independently on earth so it's been very affective here but what happens if you're a civilization on a planet where there is a murky cover over the atmosphere and you need to get around through a sense of hearing or a sense of touch or a sense of smell you could still be a scientist still discovering your universe but your way of encountering that day

to day could be very different and so that's why we always need to be open to new possibilities for creating messages so that if they are detected they'll be understood jill tarter from seti told me once that we tend to think about aliens ass earthlings on steroids is it likely that we will be similar in appearance and how do you how do we wait thinking about it this way. you know there are some aspects of our bodies that we might find in other species for example we're bilaterally symmetrical the left in the right hand side of us looks pretty much the same but why would we expect the extraterrestrial to have say only two hands you know we see very intelligent creatures on our own planet with very different body types the octopus has more of a radial symmetry there's more of

a circular symmetry to it and there is also the possibility of having multiple appendages so i don't think we can count on the extra terrestrials looking like us i think jill is right that we we tend to think of aliens as humans on steroids because that's frankly what it's cheapest for hollywood to make but instead we may even encounter intelligence that is not biological at all but created by the biological intelligence on another world you know our first contact may not be with carbon based life but silicon based life computers artificial intelligence is we project our own development of artificial intelligence on this world some are saying within the next century will have very intelligent computers so those may be the nature of the extra terrestrials we make first contact with here is the point earlier can we study what other species might be like breaks based where they might

leave for instance what would allianz from venus look like if life was possible there longer and i would say is huge chad's or no no it is seen as is a plant vs they would need anyone living on venus would need to almost have an especially as covering this incredibly hot on venus but one of the basic things that we can think about is how big is the planet the bigger the planet the greater the gravitational force and so that's going to favor as. species that's really going to be sturdy maybe shorter squader very solid in stocky on a planet that is much smaller than our earth it's similar to being on the moon which is much smaller it's a much smaller gravity and so there would be a selection through evolution for creatures that are maybe taller and thinner so that's one of the fundamentals that you can consider but then as you point out maybe it's the dim environment so maybe there is aquatic life that's intelligent we

know that whales and dolphins are highly intelligent on our world but there's one problem i mean there may be extraterrestrial whales creating wonderful symphonies that they send to one another but if they never build a really you know detector if they never send us radio signals we simply won't know about them so in some sense that narrows the kind of intelligence that we will make contact with in intelligence that can create a technology similar to ours so is there a planet that you are specifically concentrating on right now when looking for alan life a planet that you have the most hopes for. yes in october two thousand and seventeen mattie sent its first messages to a nearby star called lojban star this was in cooperation with the sonar music festival a project called sonar calling g.j. two seventy three b. and this is the closest star that has

a known exoplanet within the habitable zone so it's at just the right distance from its star that it could support liquid water now the fact that it is twelve point four light years from earth means that a round trip exchange would take just under twenty five years so those are some of the best timescales that we can hope for so that's why we focus on stars that are in our own galactic backyard rather than much further away stars how do you imagine earth will react to actually making contact will there be panic emergency security council meetings crises i mean what sort of reaction do you expect well if you believe hollywood you're going to see a tremendous upheaval but when we do surveys psychologists ask people how would you respond they say you know i think other people are going to be upset but i'll be fine but if everyone is saying that it it maybe there really won't be a big chaos i think over the last decades people have become more familiar with the

idea that there may well be intelligent life out there and so actually getting confirmation i think for a lot of people would be no big deal they're going to want to know when's the next football game that'll be the next thing in their attention and the world's major religions stress god special concern for the earth and humans what would that mean for religion as a whole once we know we're not alone in the universe. well it could have profound religious implications and for many years people said christians or monotheistic religions would have special trouble because of the idea that there is something special about life on earth but in fact theologians from christianity other religious traditions have said there's really no in compatibility if in fact the universe was created by god then god could have populated it with as many creatures as he or she wants and so i think even those

religions that people have said will have a hard time absorbing it are really pretty comfortable with it and other religious traditions like buddhism or hinduism already have a notion of multiple gods and incarnations throughout the universe so i think there'd be no difficulty at all there let me ask you this what do you think of people like former canadian defense minister paul hellyer he says that ellie is already contacting humans very discreetly and there are other people who think like him what do you make of it have we had contact already without knowing it. i think whenever anyone says the aliens have been very discrete and various or a petition is you've got a question that. many and seti scientists need evidence we need proof we need something that you and i can look at together and say is this really from an extraterrestrial you can have as many conspiracy theories as you want about the aliens having arrived but unless someone can give me

a piece of their spacecraft i'm not going to be impressed so we need to be incredibly skeptical that's built into the way we detect signals in seti and we have to be just as skeptical about any claims that the aliens have come to earth so no i have never seen evidence any evidence to suggest the extra terrestrials have already arrived now there are so many who follow just out there who claim that aliens built the pyramids that alley and still are water are oxygen i mean it seems that people are a bit wacky but only other hand they believe in las just like you believe in aliens and perhaps you guys are in that different. well i would make a distinction because you say i believe in aliens i think it's possible they're out there certainly devoted my life to trying to make contact but as a scientist i also have to be open to the possibility that humankind is the only intelligence in the universe now when people say that the aliens are going to come here to steal our oxygen or our water that just doesn't make economic sense but

again the bottom line is that you can claim and believe whatever you want i mean who am i to question someone's belief but then the big question the science asks is what kind of evidence can you give so that someone else can share your belief vats what's lacking from the u.f.o. community you said it yourself there is no hard evidence that elin's exist it is just a possibility and sorry as we know without speculating earth is the sole planet where last exists surrounded by the vast freezing black space of dust and gas so could our obsession with aliens be just a way to cope with enormous costs make loneliness. i do think some people want to reach out they want to make contact because they feel like their lives are empty on this world my advice to them would be get a friend on this planet because an alien is never going to be our friend an extraterrestrial if we ever do make contact will be so different from us that we

cannot expect them to solve all of our problems we can't expect selfish an from the stars i think the best that we can hope for in contacting another civilization is to learn how another species understand this universe in a sense it's holding a mirror up to ourselves because what we know from contacting people on other cultures on our own world gives us a new perspective on ourselves it's not that we want to give up our culture and take on theirs but we have a better appreciation for ourselves. golden words dr back get a friend from this planet don't rely on aliens thanks a lot for this interview when talking to dr douglas exactly the president of the messaging extraterrestrial intelligence organization discussing our chances of finding intelligent and we in life and whether we should be trying to in the first place this holiday season about i wish you and list love and peace let's hope that

what's he made in us will always prevail over evil stay close and kind of each other a peaceful sky about our hads is worth much more than riches of the world happy holidays to you that's it for this edition of so i think oh i'll see you next. palm oil is one of the most controversial products of odds on it's a salted vegetable fat that's very cheap. twenty seventeen production grew to sixty

three million items that rapid growth in international demand for cheap oil has led to the massive expansion of palm oil plantations which is the destruction of rain forests. given to these you alone more than ten million typed in as of unique rain forest has been destroyed and it's a process that just keeps going. the global economy is so tightly wound that these sanctions don't work but that he has to because the supply chains are completely overlapping and the what is the sanction in one country drives economic problems in another country that you're not trying to sanction stuff or get sanctions to spell longer workable in the global economy has to come to integrate it too fragile it's too. interdependent.

russia says it is waiting for other nations to admit that they manufactured to the czech president says his country produced and stored a nerve agent similar to that used in the song brave boys. u.n. chemical weapons watchdog contradicts its own chief who earlier said up to one hundred grams of no chalk was used to poison a former russian spy. i don't think i want to hear about oh i'm going to. have palestinians demonstrate on the israel gaza border for a sixth consecutive friday and are met with live fire and tear gas from i.d.f. soldiers. and two journalists mounted

a legal battle in the us against to their alleged inclusion on the government kill list they say they are wrongly suspected of having links to terror groups. or broadcasting live direct from our studios in moscow this is r.j. international and sean thomas proud to have you with us now russia is urging foreign powers to declare whether they have produced in the nova chuck nerve agent in the past it comes after the czech president admitted to his country manufactured a substance similar to that used in the poisoning of former double agent sergei screwball and his daughter in the u k. there. was produced and tested in the czech republic it was a small quantity though we know when and we know where it was done it would be hypocritical to pretend that such a thing never happened. and want to now expect answers from other countries that as

we said had and still have the potential to develop the chalk. all right russia says the revelation undermines the ukase case but in a statement to r.t. the british foreign office repeated its claims that only russia has the technical means and motive to target the script was separately there has been confusion in the program being conducted by the international chemical weapons watchdog the director general and other o.p.c. w. staff have given conflicting views on how much of the nerve agent was used the o.p.c. w. would not be able to estimate or determine the amount of the nerve agent the booze used in solsbury on the fourth of march twenty eighth in the quantity should probably be characterized in milligrams. for research activities or protection you would need for instance five to ten grams or so but even in solo spree it looks like they may have used more than that without knowing the exact quantity i'm told

it may be fifty one hundred grams of so which goes beyond research activities for protection of the saga that started on march fourth with the poisoning of sergei script and his daughter yulia and the snowball effect it has seen we have certainly seen quite a bit of backtracking and lots of questions in fact about evidence this latest statement from the o.p.c. w. follows statements from their own chief of this organization saying that it was probably from fifty to one hundred grams used in this attack and we've seen tweets from the russian embassy here in london questioning what exactly one hundred grams of such a nerve agent on a door handle would look like of course with a door handle reference being discussed as one of the possible ways this cripples had been poisoned so that's one latest example of how we've gone from some information becoming completely different another example that made headlines here in london of course was when scientists from the porch and down the board tory said they could not identify the source of the nerve agent used in the attack while

previously before that we saw boris johnson the talk about how he has been reassured by the exact same laborde tory that russia was behind the attack we know verify the for so you sort of start you off to see where actually was manufactured so typically you will not tell you to look cool down to say where it is from we haven't yet been able to do that but when i look at the the evidence from the people from important they were absolutely categorical and i asked the guy so i said are you sure and he said as they don't and of course the last but not least we saw russia being identified as the culprit in this massive saga that brought relations between russia and the u.k. to a brand new low and while russia was being called guilty almost immediately we have to remember that any official results of an investigation are still yet to come. well more british army officer charles for a bridge believes the confusion over the numbers may be more than just an

accounting error but one can look at that and say well ok it's very easy poppy to make a mistake an image of an interview and say grams when in fact you meant milligrams but that is actually contradicted by what the i.p.c.c. selves have said because they have said no it probably would have been actually a milligrams but actually in fact we haven't been have to make any estimate at all and so burn in mind that they have actually contradicted what their own chief said it makes you wonder what was the reasoning behind the chief actually saying something that appears to be not just a mistake but at least officially untrue certainly it was grassed upon by headlines in the west that said that this was further proof that such a huge substance huge amount could only come from a state of course to bolster their case that this might be russia for quite some time we've had confirmation that actually that central plank of the u.k. government's claim to only russia could produce this was actually likely to be untrue and this of course admission from the czech president is further

confirmation of that i mean even the chemists themselves who produce this substance of themselves gone on record and said that it's highly likely that for example britain and other countries have themselves in small quantities produce that. the search for undercover kremlin agents in the us is continuing and one analyst has pointed the finger at an unlikely suspect rapper kanye west and his mail and guardian comments remember when being portrayed as a russian spy was funny. bit of a joke. over. what he had done in the dark when. russian spy assaulted. by a casual. who isn't funny now could be anyone in the oval office in the pentagon madison square garden. can years recent

coordinations with trump along with his use of infamous or rhetoric and symbols confederate flag reek of private cats here just join up the dogs can year endorse trump publicly their friends. i'm not saying can you west is involved at all in the trump russia scandal but i am saying he has russian ties and was there right after the twenty sixteen elections scott walk in or perhaps work in a contributor for the us news channel m.s.n. b c and also founder of russia gate agrees there are just too many dogs not to connect them kanya west went to russia he went to russia he literally flew to moscow and walked around the jew see what he got up to i sure didn't get to be doing anything it's now so or vs why didn't we see it before we

see it now and there are more of them clint eastwood openly backed trump and the russian connection is blatant clint eastwood speaks russian. pretend. oh and robert de niro he hates trump or so he says but look at the fact he cool owns a chain of ultra luxurious restaurants in moscow and he's opening a new one soon you know who goes to his restaurants oligarchs we're not blind anymore there could be russian spies in my audience and i wouldn't know everyone is a suspect. are you a russian spy now you know that's what russian spies. ellen de generous knows

what's up we need lists so i've put together a quick one to start things off this is a list of american stars who recently been to russia they held. business it's time to wake up russian agents everywhere the president the republicans hollywood your neighbor your friends maybe probably even you. at least a ten palestinians have been injured in clashes on the israel gaza border. around ten thousand protesters turned out for the rally for a sixth consecutive friday israeli soldiers used live fire and tear gas to push the

crowd back the i.d.f. claims that rioters were trying to break through the border fence with more on the developments heres a local journalist and co dari. the sense the morning there is really snipers have been calling and warning the israeli if the palestinian protesters to stay away the palestinian the protesters started burning the tires to blur the vision of the israeli snipers since the morning the israeli army is stated that they deployed to one that one hundred fifty new snipers israeli snipers targeted a paramedic with. his alone as that make with live ammunition that the damage there is going into the holiday to the medical field going and as you see those are the snipers are targeting that is even protesters and paramedics and journalists they have been using a lot of tear gas since the morning like i am they didn't stop it.