hello and welcome to crossfire where all things are considered peter lavelle with the advent of the trump presidency much has been said about america's culture wars even the new civil war the country is clearly divided but trump didn't do this on his own there are two americas now and both co-exist. talking america divided i'm joined by my guest steve malzberg in new york he's a conservative political commentator in alexandria we have gregory copely he is author of sovereignty in the twenty first century and crisis for identity cultures

nation states and civilizations and in williamsburg across two and langar he is president of the institute of liberty as well as host of the andrew langer show on . in baltimore right gentlemen cross-talk rules in effect that means he can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciated gregory let me go to you first in alexandria your books at least the title sound very enticing and it gives me the sense that you have kind of a broad view of history here is what we experience say now the cultural divisions and and wars in america is this something new is an extension of something something uniquely new and whatever your answer is why. is that. well it's not new this is a cyclical phenomenon throughout human history we've seen the movements of societies are going on eternally but what we do say is when there's a massive shift in the global strategic architecture or

a regional strategy got the texture people tend to panic they circle the wagons and they gather around their special interest groups and the special interest groups who three seem generally emerging throughout civilised history are open groups and rural roads and that's what's happening again now we saw with the end of the cold war and we sat in a see some changes in the global strategic architecture. the question of urban urbanization and globalization became critical with the well which we saw growing after world war two we saw massive freedom to move freedom to buy. no need to regard national interest sovereignty or the protection of trade routes the protection of one's own national enterprises whether their industrial record cultural. as things start to get a little more tense and uncertain economically and politically people say start to

to rally around and they been globalist utopian is if you like want to keep the old girl days going where we saw seventy years or so growth and that's now that's now over so we're inevitably going back to an age of nationalism where people circle the wagons of the say and look at their own people ok let's see but i'm all i that's got very broad answer to a very broad phenomenon there but with the advent of donald trump there's been a rejection of much of what gregory just said and the current to lead to the control the media academia hollywood i go on and. they are rejecting this pushback and i think that's where you get the sparks that you see with these cultural tensions in the united states unfortunately and that's why i asked gregory i mean is this something new well is this something new because i haven't in my lifetime at least seen this kind of tension before go ahead steve well i think what

what's new is that you now have one side not only committing the violence in these in this culture war if you will but also condoning the violence that's being committed you have the media giving the ok and you have elected officials almost calling for and condoning when it happens the violence we have people with trump hats and trump shirts and trump paraphernalia being attacked at a broadway play the other day someone held up a trump that are in the front row during the curtain call the actor reached down took a crumpled it up threw it away stealing the man's property he got applause for it he tweeted out afterward i'm not apologizing we have a congressional candidate in california the other day a republican who is almost stat is really really dangerous that means you can't disagree shut up not that's

a dangerous place to beat go ahead gregory well absolutely and if you look at the the first u.n. general assembly speech by president trump he mentioned the word sovereignty nineteen times yet exactly a year before president obama has devoted his entire speech in contradistinction to absolutely campaigning against sovereignty now nothing could have showed the difference between these two eras more dramatically than that and yet this was not this discrepancy with this difference was not noted by the u.s. media or the global media at all but what we were seeing was the world moving to the new era and the new era. it is nationalism that's not to say they're going to lose and will not return again but what we're seeing globally look at the issue with the hungry issue we are going to move in these days this is all about people returning to identity and identity around things which they know they value

there in the united states constitution the flag is a symbol the bill of rights and so on because it appears these are all critical elements to modern u.s. identity which overlay the smaller if you like of countries of origin interests in the country but we see that in australia canada throughout europe we're seeing it now in the horn of africa and this really this rush back to nationalism and in ninety nine ninety ninety one when the cold war collapsed i said that the countries which go back to their national core first will be the ones which move fastest toward strategic dominance and the russians did that when they finally were able to overthrow the soviet union and the chinese themselves reinvented themselves or been actually so we're looking at this incredible movement and this the pace of

this movement scares people it scares or people in cities particularly in another state it's certainly scares the elites ok i steve you know i you in a number of these a gay trumps a race is to hear that all the time in liberal media but. you know he's a dog whistle but it seems to me that you know liberal media is the dog whistle the everything is raises rates of rates of phrases i mean it i am i'm dumbfounded by that is that because they have nothing else to say go ahead steve. racists not see or thora tarion you name it that's what donald trump is and i do want to go back to condoning and you brought up morality you know and i hate to harp on this book risk cuomo in primetime on c.n.n. said that it's not violence is viewed the same under the in the eyes of the law of violence if you attack someone it's bad in the eyes of the law but if you have the

moral high ground if you're attacking nazis if you're attacking the bad guy it's viewed differently it's not so bad now i would like to ask chris cuomo this he's a stout. staunch liberal i'd like to say hey what if the pro-life movement were to view abortion doctors even manhattan collision as baby killers and they attack them what would you say you'd say ok well that's up ok let me run but that's your opinion and let me when you start to see if i've got to go to a break i got to jump in here we're going to go to a break and out of the break we'll continue our discussion on america's divided state which. i'm trying to say this is real the tea before we take action for sure through the action like energy efficiency renewable energy. actually generate to bore money and

the board drafts and even higher because it grows so i want to change the story line that claim with extra is not a bad for economy or your own money but claim they actually do the beneficial good positive making money for you. was already on the table which they referred to that's discrimination and emerge in the ways they should be. the ukrainian orthodox church once. if except it will presuppose that the ukrainian or so the church should change its leader and that it should be a name to the russian church in the ukraine it is something like put things the. halo. on the georgians in this.

twenty forty you know bloody revolution to the demonstrations going from being relatively peaceful political protests to be creasing the violent revolution is always spontaneous or is it you know here i mean you know i live with to do it through me in the new bill is that i'm pulling you to the former ukrainian president recalls the events of twenty four. those who took part in this today over five billion dollars to assist ukraine in these another that will ensure a secure and prosperous and democratic. welcome back across the uk were all things considered i'm peter remind we're discussing america divided.

ok let me go back to andrew in the wonderful city of el williamsburg. one of my favorite in america. and you will who's pushing this here ok because you know one can make the million they claim it would be true if you read donald trump tweets you know when he's on the stump and he's full of himself and he can deliver some real barnburner i mean he's amazingly talented person in that regard. and then we have these and t. for people we have the liberal media i think steve is absolutely right. the day there's an omission of morality when they discuss about these things here who is driving this most and what can be done is that an antidote to start slowing the stone because i'm worried just like steve said that maniac in california he didn't know how to run or use his own switchblade we could have had a dead candidate very easily go ahead andrew well i mean that and this gets into this this issue of if if the shooting at the congressional softball practice didn't

give the democrats pause and should have had them step back from the abyss i'm not sure what the next step is i think you know we have we have another couple of elections i think some of that depends on whether or not donald trump runs again not that he is the reason for this you know but but the but the idea is he's certainly becomes a to use a phrase in recent memory a loadstone and all of this sort of an environment i want to go back to something that both greg and steve touched on which is this issue though of calling your opponents immoral if you don't believe what you believe this is probably the greatest problem that's here and i think it will take some figure of national stature i don't know who it's going to be someone who's going to be respected. variety of people who's going to come out there and is going to have to make this case a very a very impassioned plea of saying listen you're enemies of your enemies your enemies are not your enemies your opponents are not your enemies and they are not

immoral it's going to take somebody doing that i don't know who that figure is you know because i don't know if we have another martin luther king in our mix we must have to have some on faith in that there's no it's going to be somebody you know one big idea well one thing is for sure in terms of journalism there isn't even edward r. morrow out there not on the left that are damn sure ok great very great really had to address that issue because i think this is what bothers me the most is the demonization of the other side you know this it that's be the problem is that if you demonized. the other side and i'm looking at the left and the right but i'm convinced the left is more guilty of this because they have so much more of the media space but if you do step back and you'd have a conciliatory gesture then that's seen as weakness and seen this compromise appeasement and that this is where the moment we're at right now is that anybody that reaches across the aisle is considered a traitor of

a coward and to be dismissed ok gregory how do we deal with this well you're absolutely right we have to bear in mind that we are not going to stop this with one or two decent leaders coming forward and saying enough of this let's be friends are the reality is that there's a mass movement which has been building up on this for decades we have moved through the last so many years beyond the age of reason beyond the age of science and we're back to an age of beliefs and you're getting a good character and wisdom to see that it's all about opinions and you're going to make the argument but it won't in time to an opinion and i believe but don't confuse that with fact nobody is prepared to go back to a fact based or apparently based argument i am i am i am i'm not i'm not i do that all the time here steve let me go let me let me go to you we had. judge

brett kavanaugh over the last news cycle he was accused of his characterization of these abortion drugs and all of that and it was patently obvious that the left was lying it was proven very quickly or you know senator booker you know in his spartacus moment what the hell is this all about out ok i mean i mean to rational people i look at i shouldn't use rational because everyone is so emotional these days but i mean you could pick these things apart so easily. but there's hardly ever occur rection or it doesn't matter that's what it gets down or it doesn't matter because he trump is a judge is evil ok because they're evil there and that's a that is a having a lend political language is so impoverished go ahead steve well let me point out i think america was greatly divided during the eight years of barack obama and i don't think there was ever a more divisive president in my lifetime than barack obama who divided on every

every avenue that he could get down but we didn't have the violence and the right didn't resort to violence and i'm going to keep harping on this because you know when you bring up a kavanagh susan collins who is a key vote on the republican side for kavanaugh her office was receiving after the hearings was receiving threats staffers got threats that they would be strangled that they would be raped she received death threats that if she voted for kavanaugh she'd be killed i mean this is not typical but it's not that announced by the leftists by the by their fellow senators by the democrat leadership and when you don't denounce it you condone it where head let me tell you something god forbid something happens to donald trump or a senior administration official but if it does you know the media is going to blame the let's get a blame donald trump. you know scary stuff i've been saying it you know the liberals better be careful what they wish for because as i tell my friends here

americans are really well armed ok andrew let me go to you you know the deplorable i think that was the most the key moment in the two thousand and sixteen election not necessarily not that dot ca not any of it that one word deplorable and those deplorable for everyone that calls a trump supporter a racist those deplorable help make sure that barack obama was elected twice to the u.s. presidency without those deplorable he never would have been president but the left can get their head. around that logic because it's a fact go ahead andrew well it's interesting as i come back to this one of the great tests will be let's assume for a moment that ruth bader ginsburg sometime in the next supreme court term decides to retire let's also assume actually coming upon that is this idea that let's assume for a second that the senate is going to change hands going to shift from republican to democrat ruth bader ginsburg retires you a democrat majority in the senate and donald trump turns around and nominates

merrick garland to the high court now is there any what among us who believes that they will that nomination would not be immediately met with the region and ridicule and would be obstructed by the current by the by the democratic majority i mean that is where we've come to because it gets back to what you were talking about peter and what gregory steamboat talked about there is no sort of not just moral not a common but there's no reasonable compass inside them there's no keel that is keeping their ship righted so they can sort of be fluid and change depending on what is happening in front of them and we all deal in rationality we all deal with the reality in front of us and that is one of the great divides between left and right is that they just don't deal with reality you know gregory the thing that you know when i look at you know when these revelations about peter struck in lisa page in the d.o.j. and. komi clapper brennan you know it's not that you can like or dislike

these people that's fine if you do but i've been looking at what they've been doing and they're destroying institutions and they're destroying trust in the system that the founders and i think you know go look at that the federalist papers it should be required reading it's an amazing book it's amazing what they thought of and i see these people they're trashing it they're shredding it because of hatred and petty politics go ahead gregory it's more than hatred and petty politics it's about protecting rights bowls. people in areas with their in government on no off tend to want to keep the stated current status quo which is about their jobs and what they what it takes to keep their job they don't care about ideology we have moved because of our wealth into it entirely materialistic society and what you see in the rules of society is actually less materialistic less concerned with the latest

i pad and i phone and more about the way of life and we saw this in eight hundred sixty as well in the united states but we're seeing it also around the world but what we have to keep remembering is the global context we're seeing the world going through this in this global civil war if you like yeah so it's phenomenon which peter is not going to. buy a rational moderate approach and it may in fact become extremely violent in a number of countries. i think i need to put you back a little bit here and here i think you are probably on the same wavelength here i do think identity politics is an ideology i think you can make that argument and i push against that all the time andrew in williamsburg what i was just going to say though is it's very interesting to me because the same for instance right in america we're told that if we don't go along with this relaxed immigration policy if we want to take some semblence to protect our national sovereignty that means that we're racist and the media blithely ignore is that all throughout the world

countries are struggling and gregory calls it you know nationalism national identity or sovereignty countries all over europe are struggling with the same issues in terms of end and the great political change again brock's at what's happening in sweden with their elections and all of these are because you have a small group of people who want to foist an unrealistic world view and everybody else has to pick up the pieces and a lot of them are not even elected ok they're permanent iraq steve go ahead state. one of the thing that's driving the left in this country is fear they saw donald trump get a higher percentage of the hispanic vote then did mccain or romney they see that black unemployment is at an all time low they see the economics in this country now booming and zooming for all across all economics. and demographic so they are acting out of fear that everything is slipping away from them they're becoming more and more and more radical left and again j.f.k.

couldn't run as a democrat and i maintain bill clinton could really run as a democrat any grave he had to apologize for all of his a big achievements during his wife's campaign so the whole party is unrecognizable ok steve going to stay with you a few more seconds here is this going to end badly or do we get to get some cooler heads go ahead i don't see cooler heads i see people saying get in their faces if they trumpet ministration officials if you see him in a restaurant you see him in a shopping mall get a group together harass them stay outside their houses this is a recipe for disaster and it's going to end with somebody getting hurt i'm not you know what i say here that's just imagine what the liberal levy would say if conservatives were saying there's just the bajan that ok gentlemen that's all the time we have here many things to make it to new york alexandria and in williamsburg and thanks to our viewers for watching us here in our d.c. you next time and remember.

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we'll discuss reinstating the russian anti doping agency as a member. compliance in twenty fifteen. russia's foreign minister reiterates moscow's willingness to cooperate with the script poisoning case but also on the principle of the seems guilt to some trenchant criticism from

u.k. politicians. do you see that you see what's happening. with these q two characters produced in this. way by putin and it really makes. british m.p.'s the mainstream media explode into a frenzy after the two russians accused of carrying out and they have agents attacking me.