dam after it had said we're going underground as we enter the shed you'll final week of tory brick said chaos of the coming on the show we go to the birthplace of jesus as israeli settlements trying to cut off the biblical city from jerusalem to speak to the mayor of bethlehem was a scene you negotiate with the siege of the church of the nativity and as the u.n. security council debates because tin ewing civilian casualties of nature's war in afghanistan we speak to controversial award winning one academy artist michael son both about drawing tony blair naked on the doorstep of ten downing street all this more coming up in today's going underground but first a week before christmas eve we're going to bethlehem in palestine to speak with man . anton thanks so much for joining us us media celebrating best we have is not only israeli but the site of record tourism this christmas give us an idea an idea of what bethlehem is like kind of under siege from eighteen the parent be illegal israeli occupation settlements first is celebrating christmas no matter the

circumstances that we are facing as a palestinian people and people who still live under occupation because we believe that our celebration and our christmas it's our right our duty to. have told meanings one it's our fear and our fees and give us the duty. and second part of the celebration in christmas is focusing on bethlehem and on the palestinian territories and show the. occupation and the palestinian people with all the challenges that they are facing . and said a brit christmas and then you go on living in this country with all the challenges with the hope that the future will bring the p. . in the area as mayor of bethlehem what can you do to help christians whose

land has been stolen by israeli settlers say in the commies and valley look what's going on in palestine is going against the palestinian people. and muslim and. there is no difference in the. israeli occupation policy concerning the palestinians i understand there was a conference backed by netanyahu and it was an israeli hotel in occupied land in bethlehem and american tourists came to look at the wall around bethlehem firs that ireland is not going to come back to bite that land because better them is a palestinian city and under the palestinian national authority under law and they are were coming in not welcome to come back to the city or occupy the city where

for hours something is not going to be and will not be allowed going to struggle against because a bit lame is a palestinian territories and must be to continue as a palestinian territories second i don't know the americans if there were around the city or there and through the city or were around the wall i don't know or we don't. and in general for us we insist that we are part of the palestinian people we are palestinians and our land is a palestinian territories. going to continue like this and to be part of the palestinian state in the future of course netanyahu is saying that that is from the bible and the gospels of course which tell the christmas story that he told the congress u.s. congress that justifies the israeli occupation one r one. on his press

conference in jerusalem two months ago all. of them by a press release i publish. told him not to use the religious issues or been draw. this policy in palestine or in the middle east second for us it's not accepted. and will never be accepted in the future and not on you know home or say that he is the friend of christians because he's not a friend to anybody he's a compiler so and we never accept or not they never let not any or any other. israeli leader to speak about their palestinian people it's time to question and and days i'll draw out of the point that that is core give the palestinian people their rights and having the. set of determination

and state in building their state their future by the by ourselves britain is being recorded to weapons to the israeli government including sniper rifles to get to bethlehem do you have to go through israeli army checkpoints. as you know about the . area is divided in four or five zones. and nineteen sixty seven is it a confiscate the north side of bethlehem. and then continue in two thousand to one . wall surrounding the bethlehem governorate and also confiscated from the land of bethlehem another area the total area of bethlehem is six hundred and eight square kilometers the palestinian authority and the policy there people controlling. six seven point three percent of the total area zone

a according to the last hour or so argument but the torah and the rest area we speak about are around eighty seven percent of their is divided into different areas is on sea which is under the full control of is that on which is sixty seven sixty five percent of the total area and zone. national reserve also twenty two percent under the control of israel it means that the palestinian people in bethlehem area living with thirteen point four percent of the total area around seventy kilometers out of six six hundred and it's working on the terms on the edges seven percent around bethlehem it is there is not just eighteen settlement there is more than the. there is one hundred seventy thousand settlers living in the area and is available planning now to build a new settlement in the south side of bethlehem call in

a place called the national air and that and that is they want to build another one hundred one thousand two hundred settlement units it means that bethlehem is selling from the north by the wall from the south and west and east by the settlements that was built by the israeli occupation israeli embassy in london never gives us any much of a comment to try and get their response to that any irony feel that there are us evangelical christians coming to the city of bet. the ham this christmas they support the move of the u.s. embassy from tel aviv to jerusalem first. is jordan is occupied territories and to transfer there is an american embassy united states and the embassy to jerusalem its illegal procedures took by the americans and that means that is that american and the united states of america must. go back and

dig. the from jerusalem back door to let according to their international. and according to the international law that said that is dualism is part of the occupied territories and it's under. jurisdiction of the fourth geneva convention that is again not allowing the occupier to change the status of that or cool make any changes demographic changes in the area and what happened last week in the general assembly and then i did nation with votes that voted for the palestinian state a very clear opening in the world to fuel their nice sit. ministration procedures concerning the palestinian issues and the palestinian territories and the personal people you must talk to some of the american tourists that are there

for this christmas what did they tell you about their government policies its record tourism apparently in bethlehem this year we spoke to the people there's a lot of visited the city and. about. the united states' policy in the middle east and the people who are hearing us and understand what we are seeking and what we are planning for they. sure that they are against the policy that ignore and continue ignoring the palestinian rights and. in the future you were there at the siege of bethlehem as a negotiator a few years ago you could see britain is now exporting weapons to the israelis because things are better now than under the siege right in two thousand better than was under siege. by the israeli

occupation for of thirty nine days added continued after that of the siege of the nativity but but things are better britain is now sending more weapons than ever to the israelis you can see britain saying things are better now than they were then. i want to say their weapons were never this security forces that i was given the security for israel that is the peace with the palestinian people because. your neighbor is good and in good situation you will be in good so for us as a palestinian we are ready for peace to have equally in the area a very good neighborhood the relation to respect each other principles of independent freedom is jerusalem take up that of the palestinian state in the future when we speak about equality want to speak about the respect for lever or good relation it means that give give us their portrait to implement

security for all people in the region without the continued the conflict will continue and with all the work and they will have from the americans will never feel in peace because the neighbors whom we are the palestinians are not in peace. so at the moment when bethlehem becomes the cultural capital of the arab world in twenty twenty you expect it still to be enclosed by eighteen illegal israeli occupation settlements and still surrounded by israeli checkpoints. look when we speak about our culture and it's back to their history of our city and for us you are going to send a brit. them to keep it off. of their out of the world and we have our programs and our events in the city no matter what.

behavior of the occupation because we believe that separating them as part of the capital it's part of our struggle against occupation and show the world that we are people who are deserve to live deserve a pretty dumb and that independence because we have a culture we are qualified our culture is a bit of music is all or all kind of cultures where our showing and giving that tension on our culture means that we are people and we are not the groups and we are people who deserve to live in peace as other people and other nations in the mayor of bethlehem thank you after the break i have tomorrow as u.n. security council debate on palestine we speak to award winning well academy artist michael sandal about why he sculpted jesus as a british on his radio sixty pilot told us more coming up in part two of going on the ground.

spine mania returns the u.s. weaponized as its laws against adversaries also has the western world in crisis and much much more in this edition of crossfire. council well. it's an. elf. yes well this is how the.

welcome back the u.n. security council sits today to debate the ever growing fallout of nature's longest war afghanistan where unknown numbers of afghans have perished and more than ten thousand british soldiers have been killed or wounded but afghanistan is just one of the countries experiencing the blowback from britain's humanitarian interventions and secret support for militants from libya to syria and yemen one

artist you brushes away the hidden rubble of nature war mainstream media coverage is michael sandel his paintings etchings and sculpture look to criticize the heroic decadence of capitalism in its ever growing involvement in global conflict going underground deputy editor sebastian baca went to speak to the multi award winning royal academy artist. look at television or read these purposes. or just think you. can quote. pics. planted in. so you grew up in plymouth your house was bombed how do you think those bombs of reverberated through your your walk when i was in it we were evacuated to baldwin but i was in one thousand forty one primitive gobo more anywhere else in britain

and you don't forget it i was it was five years old. if you're a child it's a spectacle and you think that's normality but you don't forget it campaspe forget it it's seeing your city in ruins. and also knowing that it was you know it was all now friends doing it i remember is it was yesterday so i just think this is the these so all four it tells you so much of how he is he would beings all europe it's soaked in blood. new thinking about how many wars there were in the twentieth century with just the second world war something about right and very unpleasant horrible walls to one of those wars spawned another one of your scopes is a twentieth century memorial yes can you tell me why you decided to change the name

your second working we're going to why it was i was inspired to do it i was in berkeley compassed with some friends that. nixon had expected the war was pretty mines in the high from delta in the stupid riot it was a middle of a riot was put down with some force by the national guard and those were running away and the rubber bullets and abuse hurling and tear gas i thought oh somebody's got to do a sculpture book. a lot of thought then with a sinking feeling oh god it's going to have to be me. and i did a lot of homework and i thought the americans were the bad guys is that the jerk reaction so i'm going to call it a big key mouse monument for america it was going to have to be he mouse and the shingle i did some homework and i found out to my amazement that the war in that was caused by the british and this is

a sort of fact. in the it was the athlete government. just to be to v.g.a. day the attlee government said the british general who general douglas gracie was small contingent of indian troops and he. was to take the surrender of the japanese forces who had occupied you know a toehold of no account get involved in the politics but he did just that he thought that holcim it was a puppet of the chinese communists they were nowhere near vietnam in fact the north pole was under these the jurisdiction of the chinese nationalists anyway. instead of rounding up the japanese a policeman prison armed them the nine hundred forty five british of the japanese fought alongside each other. and forced even who was

a nationalist into the arms of communism and into the jungle also. he also the dogs grazing with these indian troops also sprung the interned french garson the japanese interned and the french was alongside us and british uniforms we use spit for us against even the knees when i tell people this their mouths full open anyway i thought we cut i can't possibly blame the americans long cold it twenty dream a moral for general perfidy and general stupidity not just americans it is also why did the blair drawing it will at least go clean away with it a bucket exactly of those good i mean you certainly expose him in your i did around tripoli because i find him the so disgusting in his hypocrisy it's a lot of my work is against hypocrisy come barrett so he pretends he's found jesus

on the he knew how he so say when you go to heaven they want you to burn in hell and became a peace and that is the whole point i did i was interviewed over did a peaceful the only magazine. and is it to have tourney as a peace envoy in the middle east is like having king herod as a child by a bit on the left front panel this couple paying who who did prisoners and beat them to it as simply the old hopefully by different selves and entertain his mates and i'm thinking about the war in iraq which exercised me was. it because i'm convinced that tony blair went to war because of vanity. and in need of done. all of us thought in many ways we're a bit like vishy fronts you know the french pretend they had nothing to do with the

persecution of the jews because they did. so we didn't have to go prosecute the iraqis because that was attempted regime change. the regime just as we know it's a kind of. look at look at libya look at something that was isis came because of the power vacuum and then you go. getting rid of saddam hussein would seem to be a terrible mistake the mother being a monster and he was a bulwark against radical islam and this peace in iraq the sound of your silence i mean always he's commenting on the election process he's made by the british army base also talking about the silo vote that when the point is the the war in iraq is . was it could justify. millions of whatever haven't iraq is double deliberate and most of the people say. yes the the this sculpture up

i didn't know how to finish it i thought it would be square took in different cultures but then i thought on the internet they further growth of a woman to carry her baby with others has bled off. and bandages i thought this is where i'm going to go and do a lot of research and usually a lot of the rocky prisoners with bags on their occluding bags put on by the british this is a very long just a short period the sculpture. ended up as a peer to reason these of course because again. against hypocrisy in the scene of the diary a mild of hypocrisy. in the world that had pocker see in foreign policy is examine in the sculpture behind us that yes this is this is it you see. we are told that all i see is. cutting heads off with with knives but we cut

heads off with droves of asteroids many ways it could be argued that ethically or more morally superior to cut somebody fall through the head of the knife i could do it but up there but you will particularly in that if you are in the i.d.f. the israeli defense force you flying over gaza you could be in an armchair your perfect safety dropping bombs killing those five children of the public opinion that actually was the inspiration of the work when i when i when i saw a photograph of the children from seventy four laid out five of them i thought my god out of that monthly suppose it was my daughter who my daughter's in that there's a portrait of her in that and then i thought well i don't want to attack this isn't

really jesus i don't want to this is or a truck all the spent is based on but i think all the lights of the by the light of the world but i thought in many ways it would be a powerful statement of five point zero the fact that we do it to be done throughout history but cutting heads off with. a burning people alive is what we do with missiles and you know it is pretty disgusting for white phosphorous i read about the trial to go with it the doctors were horrified because steam was killing of the trials here in the. white phosphorous it is no hope for the they said they didn't use that course of all depleted uranium pickle so they don't of course they do and they kill first of all the positive i mean is that when you think about it it was astonishing. connection to israel greed cruelty stupidity

there's a huge amount of money made from rush to people alive the work i'm most proud of is the multiple siege memorial. when i go to a mall to go round trip the captain morgan's ship and i look up and i have this sick with pride and the reason i don't this commission is quite interesting because i used to go drinking in the very first job i had it lester in a pub called job wayne book thirty years later i got a letter from the. new veterans association has been set up called the george cross i love association an eye of the president of the maritime brown branch of what's your career. they want a memorial to the convoy that saved most of which of the codename operation at a school pedestal when i actually got the monument finished after four years it was

such a privilege working with these veterans i thought about the money. i thought that's it i mean. i was proud of and i always wanted to be of architect so you saw that destruction of your home when when you when you listen and you wanted to be a crater in a way or you think you've got to go through you know you can't just but it's so incredibly important part of our history and we're heading towards sleepwalking probably into the other war we're living in very very dangerous times of i'm convinced i worry about my children. close are not to be here but they're going to be the this is history just tend to repeat itself. allege of something people who when they just seem to lack imagination. when you think is a misery call the misery of the second world war the misery see what i hate is all

these empty russian propaganda because those that actually won the war the twenty eight million died which is why we don't speak german. there's a conservative published politician was a german then go to that and he's always. mouth bad mouthing russia i think this is a saying this is i thought this is a pity that the letter b. of putin wasn't cold roman and all the stuff either of each piece and why razz putin then he you are vilified even though it. award winning royal academy artist michael sandal speaking to going underground so fast impact of their that's of the show when they will have a review of the top stories of former m.p. leadbetter pick the daily mail's entropy as a look at every steve coppell until then people by social media will be back on wednesday seventeen years to the day that you'll start the uprisings in argentina would rule as the so-called pink and coke all around the world.

if we have a new trade arrangements with china that may build a new foundation for wars they will relations i think broadly the there's of us has a problem in accepting the rise of china no matter what they do. you mentioned six thirty five and you have a career and a career involves using your i phone in your computer and things like that in an office and perhaps you sort of getting to mix a circular t.v. you could have to stop doing all this and this is tell you lou the minutes must be frightened my world became smaller and smaller and smaller until i ended up winning it and appox. very strong magnetic field on my head in my head.

thinking it's like a real heart my skin burned and that wireless access point says continues on saying with our students in the schools. we are just continually our citizens in this microwave radiation it is certainly electro small and it's getting worse. in a world of big part of the lot and conspiracy. it's time to wait to dig deeper to hit the stories that made history media refuses to tell more than ever we need to be smarter we need to stop slamming the door. and shouting past each other it's time for critical thinking it's time to fight for the middle for the truth the time is now for watching closely watching the hawks.

say. yes. let me. try to tell you that you cannot regret having that you know when you're not already voting. and they don't really up with. the end of a. poor job. cause of those move to create his own army sees a session of u.n. security council called amid fears it could escalate tensions with serbia. the russian foreign ministry hits out at the b.b.c. saying its word smacks of cynicism and the messages from one of the reporters says

have added to.