was. the new scandal over the two thousand and seventeen state election in alabama democrats are accused of false flag linking their rival to an alcohol campaign. women in paris hold a yellow vests demonstration ending in another weekend of clashes with police. u.k. governments contingency plans for a no deal breakers fuel truck drivers branded stage two traffic jam near the port of dover and. latest on the stories you can head to dot com coming up though a french former security chief is the guest on sophie and co talking about

counterterrorism stay with us. welcome to sophie and callum sophie shevardnadze so called here in paris but terrorism still remains and threat here and friends as a country targeted by terrorists out of all your members. how can the terrorism threat be contained here in. the former head of the french internal security or a. dangerous extremism in france a country targeted by islamists both at home and abroad and it's only just coming to terms with the new reality on through a string of the recent attacks in recent. what is the french know how containing

tara compare is due. to come together in the face of radical extremism. thank you very much for being with us today hello so france's bill eight ticks and border controls with its neighboring countries for another six months to a persistent terrorist threat if this measure is so effective in combating terrorism maybe the border controls to return of the borders should be permanent. distance with this question brings forward two problems first we are in the schengen european zone where there is freedom of movement so when isis was around there was a very strong terrorist threats against europe and notably our country in particular was bloodied by terrorist attacks isis planned to infiltrate via the muss of columbus' time immigration networks which destabilized the functioning of europe dormant networks to attack the states that were sending armed forces to fight in

syria today massive illegal immigration has created a political problem for europe germany is directly affected to the stance of i'm glimmer go into liz well but surprisingly their new minister of the interior has decided to slam their borders shut it is true that we could occasionally close the borders for example for a weekend during those big international protests at the beginning national summits but right now there is insecurity linked to illegal immigration in the public opinion even if it's not justified there's also the terrorism risk of course but there is above all a populist reflex that we can observe in hungary and italy among other countries. and it's been a year since france lifted a state of emergency imposed after they plan attacks but as your interior minister says everything is fine to believe that everything's ok now. that new france is very much threatened like never before actually we participates in the syrian

coalition but we also have a vast operation for establishing security in africa so we have a menace which comes from outside that's one threat some massive number of french citizens are in syria about two thousand with their families they are now in hiding because they know that we are waiting to prosecute them in france with some have been locked away in prison in syria during the military campaign against eyes. yes you know this but isis is not defeated yet politically or socially it is maybe close to being defeated militarily but they still keep their tools and services they still have followers of these and so we don't know. why their propaganda on the internet through oh why do you think that now that i says is almost defeat ate their internet propaganda is still as dangerous as before. yes yes of course

because when you do something you have to have people know what you did. on the second thread i want to talk about that exists in france is the thread from the inside clip that exists in our territory with people who use this kind of internet communication that we're talking about to fulfill their need for respect for being useful we also have cases unfortunately linked with mental illness troubles and all that kind of stuff which leaves us with low cost terrorism the potential for action it any time so we should not bring our guard down. but to go back to the question to you saying that french surveillance services are doing fine without the state of emergency. yes in the sense that we also have a plan a plea of inside terrorist legislation since. we have new paths of action open for intelligence and we have the possibility to act now on the

administrates of a level for instance arrests which are under legislative control of course are decided by the i misread of authority now we can search we can call outs we can expel we can put under house arrest i mean there are a lot of tools for the prevention of radicalization we'll talk about this and more detail but i want to ask for the people because you said that the terrorist threat was still high in france should people just get used to live like this always watching. living in a state of readiness because this was never a problem friends before. so those who know never i mean we live in a country of freedom and this is why in the past the terrorists from the extreme left came to meet secretly in france france is a country of freedoms and this is due to its history we are a democratic country so today yes given the way in which the last terrorist attacks were programmed structured using european logistics we can see that there is

a certain desire to change the way of life to change the society in france as an answer to that sara threat and this is the risk of destabilization on one hand by the terrorist attacks themselves but also by the rise of rampant salafi is an every day life the issue of wearing head scarves in society in swimming pools join sports etc so today there is a reflection that has to be made regarding the organisation of islam in france which is not in self a problem the minister of the in syria is responsible for the questions of religious practices on national territory so this goes from the training of moms to talking about the muslim world to the concept of preaching. but the muslim world in itself is not a problem there is a minority that is problematic. and i want to talk to you about different types of

terrorism because you will see more and more the terror acts in the europe are increasingly committed by a lone wolf. he. exists of course terror hurts are efficient against bigger guns ations but how do we deal with someone who is not attracted to a bigger organization. right in the so today it is necessary to make the distinction between and i said that at the mohammed merah trial there. in the methods right so before people would go to afghanistan they would stay there for a couple of years for theory and practical exercises and then come back to commit terror attacks in france or now for the first time we have a type of terrorist on our hands someone who for example in fifteen days after having been radicalized within a family a neighborhood and environments prison

a community who was training only thirteen days and we know the person who was giving the classes he was killed in a drone strike by americans much later he thought only operational commanders who went back to europe so fifteen days was something we had never seen before and today the questions of the interior intelligence is posed like this which person out of one hundred people is capable of taking a terrorist action without having executed the act which is obviously a punishable offense without having done any preparations for instance buying nitrogen songs and fertilizer which can be used in preparing explosives which can take off our attention the task is now. to probe the consciousness to find out who has an intention to commit a terrorist act in their head. and this is where we asked after the affair

to legalize special operations which are particularly useful in that the main of counter-espionage like the internet surveillance email surveillance everything with regards to social networks and all that kind of stuff the problem is no longer only that of the police threat analysis must be much more refined and must bring together sociologists academics people from surveillance lawyers psychologists i don't priests how can we prevent extreme radicalization working as a group we should france be operating some kind of advanced warning intelligence network outside the country that enables it to stay had of terror plans i saw actually israeli counterterrorist specialists and they all told me that having a good intelligence network in baghdad among the terrorists abroad is what saves most lives at the end of the day. both internal and external

intelligence services benefits from a multilateral exchange base between the european in. we have national experts. to the season the center. which permits us to make common analysis using the practical experiences of each country. then we have the bilateral exchange service to service by country and finally we have a friendly club of directors of the services where we discuss freely what should be done and what will happen. today. is are we able to spot a terrorist on a european level really the answer is not yet. see what i mean the americans were not able to do that either so today this. and disobey sion because you need to

anticipate thread into submission exists thanks to sharing an exchange of trust between people who are competent and professional who respect each other and who above all protect their human sources because in the intelligence services the key is human sources and operational intelligence as well like surveillance and it cannot cope with a solution to a problem if your human sources are compromised and this is a difficulty and the reason why exchanging information is so important for them. to take a short break right now when we're talking to net lapis questioning the former head of the french internal security.

team wrong all along just all. to get to shape out this day become educated and in. the trail. once on many find themselves worlds apart. she says to look for common ground. so. u.s. veterans who come back from war often tell the same stories. were going after the

people who were killing civilians they were not interested in the wellbeing of their own soldiers either they're already several generations of them so i just got this memo was circulated branches off that says we're going to destroy the government and seven countries in five years americans pay for the wars with them money others with. if we were willing to go into harm's way and willing to risk being killed for a war surely we can risk some discomfort. for.

aware that. a former head of the french internal security bureau. he said that we have yet to establish a profile of a terrorists and this is why americans and everyone who is facing this terrorist problem is trying different techniques and how to side against terrorism for instance for americans it's collecting data is this something that france could or would do because a one hand you control people on the other hand it is a fine line. i perfectly understand your question and i will be very direct x. and one handy collect data you control people somehow but on the other hand it is a fine line. so you collect intelligence. you collect intelligence to do what with it. it is like

a library you use it when you need it so being threatened by terrorism and it is the number one threat for you would collect a lot of metadata like a comment on a global level but let's not kid ourselves you can or make us be and is a dominant part of all services human also besides dealing with terrorism we can collect a large amount of intelligence which will serve our country information economic competition military market. arms supply all that kind of thing among a multitude of others or we can outright bring an advantage to one company over another over its competitor. so this is where we must find the limits of the system for terrorism yes it's allowed when but for other purposes data mining is an attack on the national sovereignty of each country should be. suggesting that collecting

personal data is something that efficient in terms of fight against terrorism separately it can be a threat if we use it in an intelligent way and if we for in the exact piece of the conversation that is necessary for us to prove an offense but really managing meta data implies collection me masses storage and above all software to go find the small needle that is in the haystack. so it is very delicate it is not simple. the technical side that's only one aspect of the fight against terrorism. human side is very important and it is the one that is the most relevant and the one that can have remarkable efficiency but what do you mean by the human side. the human side is recruiting informants from within terrorist

organizations who will explain to you what's going on they have different motives of course but they are the best source because here at the heart of they're going to say sure. if i'm not mistaken pan-european and tara were lobbied by paris anyway called the attacks in france and belgium including a law that allows a broad collection of air passenger data and a wide sharing of age to identify suspicious patterns. so this is an old issue with this program it's called the passenger name record to date while fighting against terrorism it is good it's anticipates them to know it's good to follow certain targets could be taking action so it's good to know where they are going with who etc and how many terrorists have been caught thanks to this law so far. the were not able to do it before because we didn't have the tool

we only found out later that they were going around certain countries and making connections after the fact right so i will explain today given that the pan-european decision about the data collection was not taken even though other countries have this plan in place when you take the blame you present your boarding pass at the council and you put it in the electronic terminal. the plane leaves the flight attendant takes all the stubs in general the should correspond to the number of passengers and then the company will give these elements these this information to the police. and their the best injures are checked. but it is a bit late because the flight is a really in the middle of the atlantic and sometimes with patronymic names that are not very well at densified it can create problems what we wanted was to have personal information at the reserve ation time one month before the flight the

ticket was paid for with whom the person is traveling this data would permit us to react and to say hold on this person is going to this country so we will call our plan. brother service so that they take that into account because he surely has an important meeting in an area that is very important to us so this is what we wanted with the anticipation of the events and the follow up on the potentially problematic people so making this plan work across europe was always difficult because of the opposition from german politicians when spain so could splays as the head of the e.u. country who paid a very high price with regards to terrorism especially military we made major progress in obtaining more tools to fight against terrorism it was the spanish who obtained the european arrest warrant and common investigation teams meaning someone

from spain can join the french team on a terrorist project or on surveillance or procedure a french judge can use a record of the spanish officer in their procedure this is the progress that was made. in europe not everyone has the same story with terrorism. of certain countries have never been affected and will never be all the better for them but others paid a high price already and so the presidency of the e.u. changes and there are moments when we explain what we need in our tool box which is not taken into account and we wait for the presidency to change in hopes of getting this extra tool. what you have sat before the interview when talking about immigration that estonia will never be as concerned as france but for anti-terrorism it's the same there are countries that are targeted more than others of course i understand that but at the end of the day the european union is

a one hole so you need to fight that all together when called solidarity exactly it doesn't help fight terrorism while you have open borders like this so i'm wondering if it possible to elaborate a common plan of fighting against terrorism. of course yes on the level of the mindset but the fight against terrorism relies on its will that i would qualify as classic surveillance from the intelligence services. intelligence and the lisbon treaty reminded us of us raises the issue of the sovereignty of each state what does this mean that there will never be european intelligence service or it will be empty or else the treaties must be changed in the domain of intelligence it is based on bilateralism today this does not mean that we do not give operational or analytical information

at a european level of course we do. means we come together the club. they steria services they have that's who we try to bring forward all of this and intelligence service cannot give out its family jewels within a european palace so simply. this school you think that since this is such a major issue that it is time to change the treaties and the approach. the buzz rightly joyleen the structural and legal base of course. but you must also have european diplomats it actually when the seek to open because the problem is not only a police problem it is also about security and diplomacy and also the evolution yes you have there must be stability and a common vision look at today's problems regarding illegal immigration there is no

unanimity of visions however illegal immigrations is starting to destabilize political regimes in certain european countries but hungary italy or any other countries will be france's literate of course moles so there is an impulse to changing the approach to the problem and that reflection is also far from unanimous between salvini and emanuel the current does not flow freely anglo-american had the lead on a european level today this problem of illegal immigration has blown a hole in her ship so these are subjects that are of course external common in europe but which have a direct impact on the electoral stability of each country so we will see how things will unfold what will. yeah apart from here of there's also america there is

russia everyone is faced with this problem can all build a wall like mr trump. wants but nevertheless when the washington moscow relationship was already in tatters sanctions were flung around and everything has a russian security intelligence services top brass went to the united states to meet with their american counterparts despite the personal sanctions so it showed that eve need be to conflate the two sides can still benefit from talking to each other and. this is what i'm telling you that it's on one hand it is in this city on the other hand we do not want to show it it is done in a fairly confidential way the intelligence services who are trusting the intelligence services are actually. right after minister of foreign affairs your kind of doing what the minister of foreign affairs couldn't do. but we work

together with the ministry of foreign affairs which transmits all that said bits of information that are brought forth might be of concern to them and even better and it happened to me personally often when i went to see my foreign counterparts i would always go business out a message in that country and i would transmit fresh analysis to the embassy so one diplomacy fails that's her secret service has come into play a very good especially useful when two countries no longer talk to you gary caldwell with the russians to. trust we have a good relationship on that ceteris part. friends as a lot of chechens who have historically requested political asylum here and we also have people who within that community or they can create problems and who we found at something terrorism acts in moscow and we were able to exchange. we were able to

carry out procedures and through film international commissions were able to help the russians saul's this type of problem. square seanie sank you very much for the century and good luck. i am. you know like the e.k.g. for countries is their ten year bond rate look at that he say oh that country southie the country is not healthy well looks like being healthy of the chinese economy based on that their interest rates are better than america.

when they came back from iraq oh marijuana her was cocaine methamphetamine see anything that's altering trying to get us out. that bad mindset using the chemical that would be so. i want to be dream kenyan dream keno new nope just killing myself. drink to get drunk alcoholics drink to feel normal. that's why it's this way drug addicts do what they do not shop while still for the near. star cool under which these guys are going through to it it just means to. reduce need to be hoped and good pushed on by the v.a.'s ours drugs for those in need to be built. and

they've really should be looked at like numbers they should be looked at like people if they go to a veteran center for health issues be considered as someone who really needs attention. politicians to. put themselves on the line they did accept the reject. so when you want to be president or injury. or somehow want to. have to go right to the press that's what before three in the morning can't be good. i'm interested always in the waters of the how. things should.

greetings and salutations while much of the world has been focused on u.s. president donald trump's reason recent decision to remove u.s. military forces from syria we shouldn't in the course of all that debate grandstanding and hoopla forget about the hundred forty nine some odd other countries around the world that currently have u.s. troops operating inside their borders take africa for example where the united states currently has an estimated thirty four bases spread across the continent lily pad style deployment strategy that according to modern middle eastern history ph d. eric shu not only permits the maximum projection of military power with the least commitment it also allows military commanders to publicly depict all such deployments as temporary and to conceal their existence from the public well just last week buried in the.