politics sports business i'm show business. a welcome to sophie i'm going sophie shevardnadze tensions are running high between india and pakistan over a deadly terrorist attack in kashmir with artillery and mortar fire from both sides and indian jet downed is this a random uptick in violence or a war in the making on this edition of the show will hear both sides out to. the two nuclear powers of south asia one small on the brink of war with pakistani based terrorists attacking indian soldiers and the indian air force and gauging pakistani point is how you can cool heads prevail and prevent escalation manager to safe kind

of election pressure in india and military influence in pakistan push the leaders towards radical decisions and well the cycle of violence in the rest to kashmir continue to threaten peace in the region. and will start with the indian perspective ambassador a shock that a former indian envoy to china and accept which are referred to at the ministry of external affairs he joins us to help shed some light on the conflict and master mr confident the most recent escalation between india and pakistan since there have been contained now with pakistan releasing the captured indian pilot and returning its commissioner to new delhi but the situation is still chance in kashmir is our risk of violence breaking out again. yes the tradition has been there continue as you mentioned our men or what has happened that their pension has been is winding down they are happy to see that under international pressure bucket done has taken some steps against terrorist groups operating from

a fly but would like to be convinced that what pakistan is doing is not merely cosmetic in nature that they are willing to bring along have picked up a sponsor in terrorist activities against india a look not that problem it is not and i'm afraid that this too often all. actions on indian soil leading to escalation and will continue. so the steps to discuss later came quick and worked goodwill gesture from pakistan so as a release of their captives indian palace can that momentum of making sense carry on forward and bring about opportunities to improve the climate between india and pakistan. i don't think it is possible there are two steps without being taken but as i mentioned much more needs to be done the. problem but it comes to india pakistan relations which is the link to. the ship of terrorism.

bloomed that because look with a nuclear weapon get this team and not respond to terrorist activity on its flight from and clear has been sent to pakistan international community has also one big very clear message to pakistan that it's not in its interest it's not an interest of these little and global business security that pakistan should sponsor terrorist activities and allow them to operate with impunity from which so i'm so lucky that there will be some change and some fundamental change in months and years to come so he has claimed it inflicted major damage on the terrorist camp and sad to pakistani territory however pakistani authorities deny this and independent researchers have also cast doubt on indian version of the dance and journalist says that india who doubt the special story are selling the pressure from the government

but at rallies politicians are talking about hundreds of kill terrorists are in an eyesore it is exaggerating to scale up there which allegation. nor as well are buried or in the parties have not given any. number of the is inflicted as a result of the wrist action taken by indian air force in the inner forces and from that it hit against the target dug that were given to it and it was done successfully i think the basic objective has been conveyed that pakistan cannot operate with impunity as i mentioned earlier and that india will retaliate if such actions continue to be mounted by pakistan on indian soil and it was hard to believe that the sides will actually go to all out war over this incident even though it was scary if for a moment what is the point of this short ask. if the situation always.

be a win or clarify that that noise still lingered elise and banal. if i may describe it as such if there was any real risk of outbreak of war written in the end the situation beyond a point are still strong desire on india's spartak list to see that there not peace and there is still it is maintained and that we move toward the nor more amicable relations with pakistan but this will require as i mentioned earlier some more fundamental shift in pakistan attitude on issues relating to terrorism so will this kind of thing just keep on happening between india and pakistan forever well hopefully not in fact as you can see it in though the country it is then or point when his name even when it comes to its pursuit operant development legend. india's

economy is the fastest growing major economy in the world today and if you would like to concentrate on that we do not want to be distracted by pakistan but given the whole incident play. happened there i think while india especially in a democracy. build needs to take the north some action and in this case they have gone to the list very taken by indian air force but to eliminate india is not interested in escalating pakistan you'd like to have more in a given relations pakistan and if i could really absorb the use of terrorism mistreatment of state policy we can move down a more positive part in our relations in relations between india and pakistan so the underlying issue behind the terror attacks is the status of general in kashmir

an issue that seems to be frozen in time with neither side willing to start doing anything about it how much longer will new delhi and islamabad tolerate powder keg like that which can bring them to an all out war that nobody really wants why is the issue of kashmir not moving along for decades now even palestinians and israelis have managed to make some progress since nine hundred forty seven you know surely it is or to do that for pakistanis and indians. you know as well that you're going to school is concerned from india's perspective the only issue that needs immediate result is location by pakistan of illegal occupation of parts of juggling read that's our position but when it comes to anything that india and pakistan there are whole fundamental issues which are causally linked to meter of quality in pakistan they lead them into stablished men dominate while the

in pakistan and then all they have a certain vested interest in promoting ottley d n a most directed against india so this is one you surely are pakistan needs to do some introspection and see how because the pursuit of that policy is it's only gone in we've been affected are the little ovations the fatal which is not at all good for pakistan apart from you know problems but it's done creates for its neighbors whether it's india whether it's pakistan that iran whether it's china i think that problem needs to be addressed by pakistan quite quietly and cynthia only. pakistan has repeatedly denied supporting terrorists such as jaish e mohammad and islamabad sad it's red it's a corporate with india are combat inc extremism is it fair to hold pakistan

responsible for actions of non-state actors i mean for instance the batter clan attacks in paris were carried out by belgians but we don't expect france to bomb belgium or are turned away. you know i think they're very clear back to long established pattern of the northeast activity that directed against india are in all the most recently we have pulled our law before that we had already we had not only six eleven in two thousand and eight when they were attacked in mumbai they were. attack indian parliament in two cars and one and in all the incidents that absolutely no doubt they did involvement of this group which are operating with impunity from pakistan soil or from totally control or pakistan i think the situation needs to be changed and india's patience and regard is frankly not limitless there is a lot of anger in india that pakistan is unwilling to change have bitten the

guard are going to get lucky and all despite all these. problems the indian economy will continue to progress but this is a situation which is not acceptable india has been a very response to power our response to society and polity and country but our responsibility should not be taken as a sign or manifestation of helplessness as pakistan was in plain to do that's why in this case indian air force had to take certain from action directly against jackson ahmed facility which i look at it in pakistan. and just last question to wrap it up the terror attack in cash where was preceded by a terror attack in iran carried out by the group that is also allegedly aid it or at least tolerate by pakistan i have heard indian afghan politicians accuse

pakistan of directly aiding terror groups many times and islamabad always denies it why doesn't the indian government publicly show irrefutable proof of pakistan's support of terrorism. to put an end to this debate once and for our. rose not a question of india taking second position in fact the international community is police convinced you just ask people in in there in afghanistan are you like people in your life people in your theory in the country that think there is absolutely no doubt that pakistan has their eyesight and cruel proven track record on sponsoring terrorism. it's still believed that the terrorists who can be used as their what does the mystically described as conventional not mean foreign or pressurising india and other neighboring countries there are no little absence

of proof in fact to look at actually they can buy one to think so when they're coming to the un security council they have very little many in or do this groups and there is. it's operating out of pakistan that's not action taken by india that's actually taken by us to talk to cancel a one to six and a look at that committee so it's not a question not in the taking up of this bill and others not accepting i think that's something which is being internationally acknowledged that pakistan is a problem when it comes to its sponsorship of terrorism. all right ambassador thank you very much for this interview best of luck with everything we'll take a short break right now and we're back we'll hear the pakistani view on the current situation in kashmir from chowdhury pakistan's gutteral minister for information and broadcasting stay with us.

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welcome back to the show in the first part of the show. heard the indian point of view on the escalation of tensions between new delhi and islamabad over they deadly terrorist attack in kashmir now far walk half men chaudhry pakistan's federal minister for information and broadcasting is here to present they pakistani perspective mr chaudhry welcome to the show it's really great to have you with us thank you for having me so much under india says its planes struck a terror camp inside pakistan but islamabad denies these and says india hate nothing how is anyone to believe anything about this conflicts accounts of events. well yes you are absolutely right everyone will have their own perspective we will

have our own perspective india will have its own perspective. then what one what one should do one should look at the new pearl account so you can go and see the whole true story on that you can see the international media reports you can order that what the independent news agencies have reporter and the fact is that. the kind of the the fear of indians you force has actually you know i think has damaged prime minister mood there is a negative also the kind of that it was going to build the indian army and the depend forces that us after and actually it has shattered the myth of infants ability of for prime minister modi himself so i think it has one hundred to lord the indian clinics that they are done so much that they are almost close to be a super power so this whole story and myth has actually shattered by this very immature actions by india so the terror attack that started the conflict was

carried out from pakistani controlled territory about the same time another group of terrorists attacked iran also from pakistani controlled territory why is pakistan putting itself at risk of relations from its neighbors by tolerating terrorist organizations within its borders or are the extremist groups too powerful for the pakistani authorities to control. well presently there is no evidence to that so we have historical issues with india so they're trying to blame everything on par because on the fact of the matter is even if you see today as united nations human rights report you will see the atrocities of indian army in kashmir has actually. occurred so much current for india in kashmir that even now there are really all indian writers independent you know the media people there are also reporting that such into incidents are actually indigenous and in the first speech

when the prime minister of pakistan asked india that if you're alleging something so just chill it wouldn't that we have not received any evidence then we are for joining then we are for investigation of any kind we have not heard anything about doubt then we are let's talk and are we have not heard anything of that and actually the prime minister moody has used this incident more for his personal political gains and that is actually problematic when a politician who refuses to care about the lives. of girls and hundreds and millions of people and just focus on its own politics that's actually unfortunate so you're saying there is no proof or evidence does this mean that are you saying indian air force just struck pakistan without any cost. of course of course this is what joe buck a son has demanded from india and on the very first day when. some more than

a solution based in pakistan has claimed responsibility and it is evident through that prime minister non-con went or he on the other that sure that i would and we're looking forward to that and if we prove if you crew provide us evidence we are ready for action and literal and he also offered in the investigation into the into this incident he are not good for the box also but our officers have never met with any you know substantive counter all foot and other in the herd just tried to create a war frenzy in their part and knowledge that consensus even in the india that prime minister modi has actually true is actually trying to use this incident for his own political gains so that distance as it is ready to call parade with india on the anti terror front after this latest flare up how serious can this cooperation get i mean can we really see two countries that were just on a brink of war becoming anti terror allies all of

a sudden. look this is the only option available how can i mean we have three options we are neighbors for seventy years when you know we're for clean force we can fight another war the second option is we can you repeat india actually sponsor terrorism in pakistan from there to the rest of the press would we have enough evidence to prove that indeed our sponsors terrorism in pakistan this once are terrorism in baluchistan and it continues through the crowd to become as an all of course we all know we can always try to weaken them and the third option is the let's become you know let's talk to each other and let's become a partner in fighting terrorism now we're offering this third option to india what else we can do this is what we're trying to push through to indian do to show that the only way forward is that if we proclamation if we go on the issues and push when it is obviously one real issue that pakistan and india need to talk about how

can you how do you know they have it has become the most militarized territory in the word with every word then question is how one installed on them so this is the kind of environment we have created in the schmear so we would like you know to cooperate with us and we can actually. resolve many probably should. promise area around han highest show and calm and restrained by fraying the day in day and captive pilot and he is demand that want to end and mending of the end of pakistani ties can this become the sound ations for an all round psalm and the relationship between the two countries. well we're looking forward to that we want this to become. we want to move forward prime minister noncommittally even before taking what offered in the know that if you take one stair we'll take two steps but are. coming to have the king altered your picking power iran can has not doing its

policy and we opened our border for india we started the. incentives in this region but actually we have not been responded with that. with the same courtesy is actually prime minister moody there was a rather wide perception is that prime minister moody is actually trying to clear this war frenzy environment to grow for a for his own elections and under under us we have the elections over in india chances of moving forward towards peace are very difficult but actually we are waiting for those elections to happen and certainly we can start again. india claims pakistan american bought af sixteen's to engage indian warplanes which goes against a contract signed with the us when it was obtaining they have sixteen's their rule was that the planes shouldn't be used against another country what kind of an

american reaction to this can be expected will pakistan be a further sanction for this were you thinking. well in order ball actually we paid full amount for those f. sixteen s and those photos i think we have more while you could any. in in this incident nor of clicks to have been used in this incident as the bike is on has already made it killer but you know. we actually put want to get into war we don't want these incidents to happen we are standing for peace we want things to be resolved without. resorting to f. sixteen s and f. seventeen and you know the bombs and and moreover we want to introduce it to be resolved peacefully but little void is imposed on us obviously than we know how to fight wars so the united states has long been an ally of pakistan but recent

american presidents are growing cold towards islamabad or they alleged support of terrorism and washington's reaction to this most recent crisis was more supportive and sympathetic of india actually so should pakistan not count on american help anymore is that door closing for islamabad. well frankly we want good relations with the u.s. it we also want good relations with the u.s.s.r. there's a historic you know you can say or die lamar of walking sons aleutian share with us. and. it keeps changing you know when you are saying the perception is there when us and inspire to stand it becomes for indian when we don't need repugnance on they become you know and in music if not on him is there we can stranger so this is a kind of relationship we always have and will bring us here but now we want

a strong relationship based on economy and that is the same kind of relationship we want to have with the militia also there and as you know in the recent past partisan and have come close to each other so maybe there will be there are some i would say some issues because of the do a simple but we're ready to roll i mean there will be other sovereign country we're going to we want a relationship independent relationship with all the countries but certainly. the lucian ships are based on mutual interest and goes interest will be the lead china is becoming closer with pakistan is helping pakistan in the un and investing in the country as part of the silk road project as a slum about expect chinese help in case of a real conflict with india as well. well frankly we we have we have more thinking

in terms of conflict we are thinking more in terms of peaceful resolution of things . but. this conflict is concerned i think pakistan has the serious huge void support after this incident we have received does you know that has offered mediation president trump has asked for this training the european union has actually said that india must not less clear things so but i think. we are not thinking in terms of conflict in the world for this befriends cooperation or we're all in this conflict but even trying obviously pakistan has a really long standing historical relationship and deal relationships are based on economy. the project that china is investing in pakistan is always the is such a huge economic project that we would like when we have offered other countries to

come and invest in pakistan so we would like the relationship with the world with china and with other countries based on our economic you know running for it and we want to achieve peace for the heart and normalization within the r. and stability in afghanistan are two most important i would say last two most important goals of our government are at mr choudary sankyo for the center you were talking to chadri pakistan's federal minister for information and broadcasting discussing the recent escalation between islamabad and new delhi earlier in the program with her at the indian version of these events from a master i shall contact former india and watch china next secretary for a day at the ministry of external affairs that's it for this edition of so i think i'll see you next.

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