these kids are. following welcome to cross talk where all things considered i'm peter lavelle the brags that saga continues this deeply divided british house of commons can only seem to agree on one thing it doesn't want the u.k. to leave the e.u. without a deal the problem is there isn't a parliamentary majority on what to do next maybe this was to resume its plan all along briggs's death through inertia.

bragg's that i'm joined by my guest now in paris he's the chief foreign correspondent of the figaro in london we have george galloway he is a broadcaster a writer and a former member of parliament and also in london we have alan skip he is a professor emeritus of international history at the london school of economics right gentlemen cross-talk rules in fact that means you can jump in anytime you want i always appreciate george let me go to you first here we've had. two very disastrous votes for to resume its plan. there has been a move that there there will be no exit without a deal the deal is supposed to be voted on again like the two first votes it doesn't appear that that's going to move forward and you have the european commission basically saying that's the deal you negotiated with there's a little wiggle room maybe for invoking article fifty but not much more than that they have pretty much put up by a stone wall here where do we go from this because like i said in my introduction one

a cynic and i it certainly am. saying this was planned all along go ahead george. i don't think saw of course the conspiracy theorist would be hard pushed to come up with a conspiracy which had one just as perfectly as this one as it happens because i know the people involved personally i think it's more a cock up a series of blunders and in the courses that have led us to this particular pass but in a way it doesn't matter whether it was intended or whether it's a series of accidents the british parliament has betrayed the british people with grave consequences for british democracy because more people voted for bricks it than have ever voted in britain's history for anything or anybody are not going to get it and they're not going to get it because of the actions of just six hundred fifty people indeed in the recent vote just four people four people made the

decision not to keep no deal on the table and if you don't have no deal on the table you have no possibility of a negotiated settlement as any negotiator in even the simplest house knows if you as you the right the determination to walk away if the price isn't right and if the deal isn't right then you're more or less handing to your interlocutor the power of life and death over your you know yeah but alan e. where where do we go from here because what i said in my introduction there is no majority in the house to go in one direction or another i mean this is the ultimate stalemate but the clock is ticking and as i pointed out the european union is basically saying we're looking at our watch what are you guys going to do go ahead alan. well i agree very much as what george galloway said the elite and paul de mint has betrayed the will of the british people i think what's going to happen is

that mayor will try for a third time to get dreadful agreement pos in the house of commons if it is pos then of course we leave with that agreement and we leave quite a. if it's not passed then confusion reigns i think she would have to have a general election i think the government's a shambles if it looks and let me know and but i want to end it but a general election won't solve the dilemma will it it'll just be a different person there go ahead alan well lionel's hold the dilemma but it will get rid of a lot of people and paul that would the new independent group would probably disappear labor i think would be would suffer enormously i think the be a purge inside the tory party before the election and there would be a different house of commons and. they're off of course we still have the dial emma if if the deal hasn't been agreed then i don't know the new house of commons might

like the new deal but as it stands at present you're right the new obvious way forward but i think a general election like help police to clear things up ok now let me go to you in paris i mean as a on the continent yourself looking at all of this going on here. what does what is the perspective of the you you hear i mean they have a deal they've made it very clear for weeks and weeks and weeks now that a deal is a deal. keeps flying over trying to make you guys budge but you're not so i mean it's is it seems to me that you know she doesn't have much of a learning curve and is to resume a good negotiating partner when it comes to this whole dreadful process go ahead in paris. i mean in the continent in paris it shows three things first thing is that. david cameron made a mistake to go to

a referral for internal affairs for the conservative party because actually you know british democracy is based on the house of commons for the last i don't know eight nine center is there sure a lot could go into this kind of latin instrument which is a riff on a no no it's a real huge mess and hang on hang on now and hang on to me if i lament in this farce the second thing if i can tell you what we think of the continent the. the second thing is that. there was a deal agreed i mean you cannot negotiate between the very difficult to dig between one country and twenty seven country so michelle money was given a mandate by the twenty seven but the twenty seven are not going to change their minds all the time it's too difficult it's a technical question so. and after all it is about britain to

adopt they decided to draw in a european union after refusing to join it join the common market in fifty seven general de gaulle that warned them twice that they should not and could not enter the world of the spirit the interests they still wanted to enter the entered and then they made a lot of problems through the european union so. you know the you have to you have to understand that the european countries from the continent quite upset and quite tired of this false and they want just you know you want to leave or not i mean they want to actually cannot spend on here to. this guy i get your followers i get your point here let me alan you want to jump in here but i don't think there's a lot and so i hang on hang on here ok i knew this was going to happen you know

that could i don't i don't want to be saying so when we heard or sang on we heard a point when we heard today in the british house a lot of problems for the e.u. but the lot of the british voters it was the e.u. that was a problem i just correct you i can i just i know your question of going to want to go out and go can i just say on the question of referendums that. people should not just to ensure. they don't significantly called institutional questions like scottish and welsh to evolution the election of them for london we now have an established edition that parliament the law is the population to decide these issues and referendum and we abide by the results i know the fed should the referendum in two thousand and five on the constitutional treaty they voted it down and then the french government paid no attention to it and the lisbon treaty which was the same thing was run through the fed paul them and i do think we need lessons

and referendums from the french but many cases we have a tradition of abiding by referendums which are not part of our constitution we had a referendum the people voted to get it and the people's you must be respected otherwise will be a popular backlash joe in georgia i mean the elites failed not the people go ahead george we don't want to give you a lesson so we're good on sort of you go listen our problems do you know so this we would just. give this part don't miss your part don't miss your let someone here in london talk we have been a neck if you think that the british democracy with this party. and with you we don't think it works very well for the. secret was really working. google i recognize george galloway george galloway go ahead that. we're a net contributor for forty five years so we've been paying more into the e.u.

than we ever got back second and you would never. suspect it from the other again french but little for sure because we've got or you're running your big friend. got her check back my didn't show you that shows shows what you know that shows what you know you've got it on track to back into the union treaty you lose in your glory years he got this. bag and government the heat the hate the e.u. they hate the austerity they hate the european central bank the reason you can't have referendums on this in most of the european union countries is because they would vote to leave also it is completely absurd this false dichotomy between a lotta nordic democracy democracy is democracy is democracy we were asked and we were told it would be binding do you want to leave we've hurted to leave leave we

must and the more we hear of that kind of our get drivel the more certain i am the more people in britain today would vote to leave than did in twenty second you and i we have a minute before we go to the break let's go back to paris please react. yes it's a pity that too you see britain when they join a club they have to make. every generation because remember that after joining. you know he's government joining and then there is a labor government government coming to london and they said oh maybe we have to do a reset on them they made a referendum and if i recall well but mr galloway will come to my help i guess two thirds of the british population had approved to join this club though they knew very well the rules of the club you know they had plenty. of the rules of the club that was the cause and. twice during the conference. i said well that your

monologue and then and then then. and then they approved because you cannot move you up with all right out. of i have been here gentlemen we're going to go to a short break here then we'll continue our discussion on breaks at stake with arc. breaks at countdown. is not an ideological scarecrow russia is

a real neighbor we'll have to leave always being in nato or wherever. for us to go to russia to talk to russians. and to understand that. the internet is not built for security so we have to take it to a different level and we have to take the new value to this fight change it but you can bet security security is an industry and security has all they need to expose the fears and all they can devise is so that people get a break and they get to make sure that we have to come up with new infrastructure this is very important to start thinking positively about the new tools to build a new system.

welcome back to crossfire where all things are considered i'm peter remind you we're discussing rags it. ok let's go back to allan in london it seems to me that the for the political elites in both political parties in the u.k. the major parties have failed they had a two year deadline to get this done and it has been incompetence after incompetence after incompetence and and that's why i started out i mean you one has to wonder if this was intentional because you have a prime minister that is a remainer negotiating the exit i mean again that's comical on its face all right but you know if if alan if one thing i see from the european position and because i look at what's going on in the populist movements in europe and the collapse of the

center for the most part of this entire european union project here is brussels behavior and disposition to the u.k. during this process actually also a signal to all other members of the european union to stay in line because if you want to get out we're going to give you hell and look watch what we're doing to the u.k. alan go ahead. yeah i think that's true martin selma who's now heading the european euro because he's made it perfectly the brussels that britain has to pay a price he thinks surrendering on london should be the price but it's quite clear the populous discontent in europe is growing and growing mr mack called when he was last in britain was asked on television if the french were given a referendum what the result would be and he said they would vote to leave but then he added of course i'm not going to give them a referendum the french had a referendum on the maastricht treaty which illness and when the people think it was rigged it was close and then they had won in the constitutional treaty which

they voted against me in the french of distribution of having referendums as well because on the great issues of the day when you're voting on your national future and who who makes the laws and who decides that is such a fundamental choice that it has to go back to the people it went back to the people here and the result astonished not only the elites in the british political parties but this stone age the elites in europe who had been assured by david cameron that he would he would win. the people voted that the european union is unpopular among a large large a majority of the british people they want it and they want a clear break and the question is for you if this is a law without a price being paid how many other members of your sailing union pin union would follow because you are because a disaster economically the european currency system isn't working it's led to the

crushing of the greek economy and recessions in southern europe unemployment in the e.u. is twice as high in the rest of the and years and is twice as high as in britain use unemployment in southern europe it's twenty to forty percent you're getting. two to three hundred young europeans coming to britain voting with their feet to get i'd to the eurozone every year to come and get jobs in london or in britain if we had the situation with one hundred to three hundred thousand young brits were having to go to europe to the euro zone to find work because we had high and massive unemployment then i would say there was a case this thing in the e.u. but the e.u. economy is failing the eurozone is probably going to another crisis a new player very quickly and yet these people in britain can understand why on

a rational basis people would want to get out ok all right i mean let me go to georgia and keep going with this here george i over the last few months have been extremely harsh on to resume and her parts of her tory party but i want to be fair here more balanced here how it's labor behaved through all of this have they acquitted themselves with on or indignity because you know they're just recently talking of a second to referendum which to me again is a slap in the face to democracy i mean democracy means democracy doesn't it one a vote outcome should count shouldn't it so so evaluate labor's behavior during all of this. well up until comparatively recently i would have said the labor leader jeremy corbin whom i've known for forty years had played a blind are in terms of parliamentary tactics he had maneuvered the government into a position where it began and is now excel or almost to fall apart but labor put

the mark of cain upon their own head when the announced quite recently in the last few weeks that they would support the so-called people's vote to hear the forcible didn't involve people or as if it was you know donkey's horses and sheep that had voted the first time and when it did the allowed people and when it did the allowed people to the right to brand them as the anti breakfast party as the anti bricks it maneuver us conspiring and i'm unprincipled way and saw we now have basically two labor parties and two conservative yachties trucked inside a single first past the post electoral system and i don't believe it will survive this crisis referendum changes the political part of diamond countries and it will change this one in a very profound with even the losers of referendums never accept the result really

here we've got the win the arse of our foreign. now literally cheated in front of their eyes by a privileged elite group of parliamentarians that can not withstand the kind of blizzard that's coming their way ok we know back to you in paris i mean if there's a quite a bit of animosity there in the british isles and in continental europe on this program so why don't don't you might why don't you have the attitude good riddance and good by ok i mean if britain is such a nuisance to the e.u. then good riddance i mean does it have to be nasty go ahead in paris. no it does not to be nasty i'm in still be. thanks for for britain for its role during the second world war will never forget that great britain churchill welcomed charles de gaulle in london. and we'll

never forget that britain. campaigned for us to get a seat a permanent seat in the security council of un we have a defense agreement with britain which is called lancaster house because the defense. of defense of course will never work so we have this agreement which is very strong and we are very close to the british and when the british had problems with the argentinians in eighty two the americans drop to the british but the french went to help them so we are very close to the british and we want to do is to clothe their very good friends it's very it's for me it's a quite a pity to see a country destroying itself but after all it's up to the people why yes it is doing this because you know for me the whole policy of britain for the last three sent to

raise was two things keep a foot on the continent to remember that it was important for them to be parked and to be important in the congress of eight hundred fifteen to keep always. a foot on the continent and the second. pillar of british policy was keep. british islands united in one nine they have sabotaged they have destroyed all this policy because they will not keep. a foot in the continent good chance with the relationship with america. only and then they they will destroy the unity of the british islands because i think that the scottish people want to remain in europe so it's very pretty because we have a lot of respect for this great country which is great britain but we will always

be friends we just do not understand me ok well i do not win the war and i we're going to lose i don't have my wings of the david cabdriver words british prime minister after lord north well i think the competition for the worst prime minister is you know you could spend a lot of time on because there's a lot of candidates recently ok. could i you know i also i just want to finish off in paris where i mean you do have a nato footprint ok in europe so i wouldn't be so worried about not being in europe you're there and go ahead. could i just say that if you british history is quite flawed the great british injuries are uniform i think if it was a dramatic sort of the great you know now i've got to ask and to alan alan the great british to do should form paul as he was actually to remain independent and to make sure that continental europe was never united either on the the spanish the hapsburgs the poleon the colonies of the hitler and we stayed we didn't have the

food stuff and in britain we were in europe we stayed outside and europe and getting into the european union was quite against the whole british foreign policy tradition and i was going to correct that i hope by getting it. i think the british point of view is that you it works best as a collection of friendly slightly competitive nation states who take from each other the best practice commercially intellectually philosophically with their common market the common market was the goal but what is the golden age of growth after the second world war was the cause. yeah. but did nothing and nothing to do with the u. that's what i do i see my point that's my point exactly my point is when in fact if you look at growth patterns since the unification of the e.u. it's slowed down dramatically and yeah it's a move and it's already martin and its trademark is austerity that's its trademark

yellow the more that you know the more the european union integrates the slower its economy becomes. and now it's the sort of slow it's growing part of that ok i want to give george i want to give george the last word forty five seconds my friend finish and i give you an advice can you can you give. her a way to go and visit poland go and visit in poland just a little advice go and visit poland both of you well i know you know this because i lived there for ten years. love you think george tenet your version of another small thing not often mosco. twenty second short we could tour we could tour but he was of young unemployed right across southern europe we could we could make a trip to the smoking ruin of the greek economy we could go to italy we could two

of the heart is wrong and we will find that the european union has less support inside europe than it has ever had and the reason is that it ceased to be a common market all right on that began i know that orange. county i'm sure held in many thanks to my guests in london and in paris and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at r.t. see you next time and remember rostock rules. thank you. they both they of what they.

thought there and i don't think i want to discuss the one. thing i thought it was a couple that i. just got out he. was physically ok so i'm. watching a football for you i think. you want to go on the phone. at home think nothing nothing. not that in a way that a few of the things. i don't want to pull off of a nightly basis. during the great depression which i'm old enough to remember there was most of my family were unemployed working. there wasn't it was bed you know much worse objective listen today but there was an expectation that things were going to get better. there was

a real sense of hopefulness there isn't today today's america where shape by the turn principles of concentration of wealth and power. reduced democracy attack solo doubt engineer elections manufacture consent and other principles according to no on chomsky one set of rules for the rich ops etc. that's what happens when you put her into the hands of a narrow sector of wilf which will is dedicated to increasing power for chills just as you'd expect one of the most influential intellects. tools of our time speaks about the modern civilization of america. through all fighting oh oh oh dear it's great you know. we've been a real good shots few begin murders life. but

sometimes our last communities young people are deciding this they want to be not like their parents not liked and liberals. always struggle. again you always have problems but you are going to focus and walk is the most ubiquitous going out there most police departments use it almost over stores in the school that they could get their hands on condoms in twenty four hours. each of these kids are both racism both police brutality taking pride of them being all these kids are a part of all history.

not. least the. terror attacks in new zealand mass shootings two mosques in christ church kill forty nine people and injure forty eight others many of the survivors are still in critical condition. the monument less money and i'm going on my road oh my god it's going to happen to me now it was on believe and everybody destroyed of. course just. four suspects are now in custody one of them.