i. know. today announcing that we will no longer grant any exemptions we're going to zero headlines washington says it will no longer exempt any countries from sanctions if . that's just its own crude and not produced by its gulf allies as at all times the . u.s. democrats pledge to present a united front over plans to impeach president trump so use the word back to the version of the approach from russia collusion will be introduced in congress on the way the first. government admits it failed to heed multiple warnings about it one of. the policy

choices the families of the victims over the devastating news for something. french police are accused of cracking down on press freedoms after arresting reporters during the weekends best purchase. of course read all those stories over on alt called back with the headlines on the top of the hour in the meantime no. welcome to sophie and co i'm selfish over not so have securing a close victory in a hotly contested election benyamin netanyahu has become the first israeli prime minister to hold office for five terms will his right wing coalition very all hope for peace with palestine once and for all i ask danny i. forward foreign minister

of israel. president of the israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu is a victory for the israeli conservatives but it leaves the palestinians wondering whether any progress in peace talks will now be achievable will the newly reelected netanyahu be brave enough to make steps toward solving the main middle eastern problem will his coalition support depend on him taking a hard line away from peace danny i am former deputy foreign minister of israel welcome to the show it's great to have you with us lots to discuss when i mean that's when the asshole has won a new record term as israeli prime minister now he supports the settlement his backers sabba hardline view on the palestinians and says next term going to be absolutely nothing to advance to peace cause forward. i think actually that there is a better chance to move forward because not only because b.b. is on his fifth term. and a veteran and these very secured himself he's

a man of. history scholar his father was a history professor and i believe he is very much. interested to put his mark to leave his mark. on history and for that any agreement with the palestinians a long term agreement would be very very important for him and i think on the basis of the trumpet playing which we did too much and i think we're going to talk about that through and yeah we're going to talk about the plan a bit later in the show before if you allow me i would like to go step by step and deconstruct all possible sides so whatever is going on right now between israel and palestine so the public is the israeli public getting a bit tired maybe of maintaining they occupying force of the fans budgets of rockets from gaza and the war that brings with it are they ok with it well i can

tell you that the israeli public. israeli public would very much like to see peace with security with dignity would recognition and everything that it entails you know that in the nineteen seventy eight's egypt was our. biggest enemy when an orthodox came to jerusalem and he was found to be trustworthy and on this we have peace with him the same thing with. jordan this was the same attitude that israel came with the ostler agreement and i can tell you during the agreements the first years eighty percent of israelis where for a palestinian state eighty percent. no it's just the opposite and what happened in the middle was the intifada because in two thousand came david and i was part of the israeli team we met with arafat and the palestinian team which was the prime

minister made a very very generous offer including dividing jerusalem and arafat rejected it and not only rejected it but he started this worst intifada where one thousand or more than one thousand israelis were killed so this is why the israelis feel now a sense. of betrayal by the palestinians in today if you ask most israelis they are against a palestinian state ever and this is sophie i think is the main point if we will see a leadership of the palestinians who are ready to negotiate and without preconditions and to negotiate without the threat of terror all the time without the political terror that they are trying in the international organizations then i think we can really move forward because it's a win win we do want peace it's important for us it's important for the palestinians and we can move forward quickly but the b.b.

now is the same certain power yeah but the problem is. these are all. that were to happen if there were no preconditions if palestine is we're in fighting and they're fighting within each other so it's kind of hard right you have the given facts it is what it is some at this point it seems like a vicious circle that no one can move forward because israeli public figures keep telling me that palestinians don't want pace of palestinian officials tell me exactly the same thing about israel so nobody is really willing to make the first move to make concessions to like or you keep blaming each other for not making the first move or enough at enough efforts but that's like a never ending circle how do you break out of this dad with the given facts of life that you have as of today. well this is exactly what the trump plan is designed to do to break the deadlock and to put two think out of the box into

a new plan which is quite maybe refreshing you know sophie for twenty five twenty six years and four different american presidents tried the same thing over and over again and every time they hit a. brick wall so if you do the same thing over and over and you have failure you have to find something else so i think what the trump plan is and i know we will talk about it but i think here that trump is going to engage the regional leaders as well which were not in the you know in the center of things before so i think this is giving us a better chance for the. going forward and even though you said so that there is a lot of infighting among the palestinians in gaza and hamas is a big problem but for israel if we see that the palestinian authority is willing to

come forward and negotiate we can agree and achieve something range mintz and. agreement with them irrespective of hamas in the in gaza can be dealt with sometimes later or when they are ready for it when the palestinians take back what was taken from them in a coup in two thousand and seven by hamas so we keep mentioning this trump detail as if it's going to take care of everything but we don't know if it's going to take care of everything and if the status quo as of today drags on for longer if settlements keep growing if protests like gaza or even missile strikes and skirmishes keep happening things will boil over and a lot of people fear that there will be an other intifada one there. well you know the hamas what the hamas is trying to do they have

a real strategic goal and better is to take over the entire palestinian people and territory and they really to take over from the palestinian authority in order to do that they have tried and they're still trying to recruit many people in the west bank you know gaza is in the hamas is in gaza they are trying to actually recruit many many terrorists who would do terror in the west bank would go against the posted him or thirty and for that matter they didn't succeed they really thought that old they are a terror and launching missiles on our you know civil population will encourage the palestinians in gaza to come out to the streets you did not happen and you know why because the people in ramallah but people in the west bank today have

a lot to lose they arrest standard of living has gone up so high after their violence stop that they are thinking twice and three times before they want to throw all this the way and at the same time the gaza people under hamas are in very miserable poor conditions because hamas would not put away their arms and would not like to open gaza to free trade under supervision to make sure that they do not smuggle arms so i'm not so much afraid. it's in the father now so let's elaborate on this palestinian divide for a second hamas and fatah factions are fighting each other with their sins like this allows israel to say that there is nobody to talk to so let's just keep on doing what we're doing do you feel like this divide is kind of playing into israel's hands israel actually interested in facilitating palestinian unity like really ah. honestly well i can tell you that the bottom line is that israel's goal is to

have peace and security and we know that we will not have peace and security without a political settlement everybody knows that it is true that we can withstand all the attacks and we can go on forever but of course everybody would like to have a much better condition no threat of violence and terror and really move forward you know today israel is one of the strongest economies in the world in oil per capita income in israel is forty forty five thousand dollars but if we solve the palestinian conflict we can be double them that we can be among the highest in the world so of course we want to solve the issue it's there for israel it's not just a political interest it's a it's a strategic interest i would say almost a moral obligation but you have to do it in a way that we we will ensure our future and our security and until this moment

any offers that were given from the palestinians did the opposite and offers that we gave them they either rejected or didn't answer so i would say we would like to have peace absolutely. but not at any cost not at the cost of our freedom or our independence or our wellbeing or our future but for that we need a true partner if we do not have a true partner of course the second best you know if you ask me what is better the best thing of course of all conditions is to have peace that everybody is happy with but if we cannot achieve that the second best is to keep the status quo as it is now not whether we are happy with the divide among the palestinians i don't know there are some speculations that israel is interested in inviting the palestinians into two different entities gaza and the palestinian authority this is very very short. i would say. short sighted if you look long term i think we would be

much better if the palestinian. leadership. but by everyone there by the international community that we then we can really engage ok . negotiations let's say let's say a miracle happens and palestine has one government one leader the current peace idea in that construction is a two state solution right with israel and palestine living side by side now at this point from an outsider's point of view we don't really understand how they would just six work if you look at it as a lego construction what the settlements being built in the west bank they now crisscross west bank like a spider blanket how can there be a palestinian independence state what it would be covered with and clubs of israel . well first of all again i think we must think out of the box you know that eighty percent of all the jewish communities in the west bank which are then some area in

their we story name are on eighty percent of the area indeed there are some other what we call you know outside of the major jewish blocs outside of the eight percent of the land but we can think of a future or a solution whereby those settlements would stay there even under some kind of palestinian sovereignty you know that in israel itself in israel. we have twenty percent of our civilians are not jews they're arabs and they voted in the mess that they have representatives they are judges all over so if we have arabs inside israel why would the palestinians reject anybody who is not palestinian it's not you know we're not talking about i hope ethnic cleansing and the palestinians so far they wanted ethnic cleansing of course this is something that nobody can accept

so i'm saying there are many many modalities i do not think sophie and i say to really from the bottom of my heart i do not think that the settlements have ever been the problem all right we're going to take a short break right now hold your thought there will be back with danny i along former deputy foreign minister of israel discussing the prospects of a middle east peace process stay with us. you can live the good for yourself and.

be young. and we have other things in this world sounds like this is an email for everyone and why don't some peoples of also take our thing all the power just for themselves.

and we're back with danny alan former deputy foreign minister of israel talking about israeli politics after their recent election and now mr i want netanyahu said he would push for israel with sovereignty over the west bank settlements and i'm quoting i will make sure we control the territory west of jordan was a just talk to score some political points or do you see that actually happening any time soon. no actually i don't see it happening you know this was during the campaign rhetoric so i don't think that israel would do anything before we see the trump land and in any case it would be coordination as much as possible with the

international community so what an extreme case would you see full an exception of west bank as a possibility one state solution with a full rights and full citizenship for both palestinians and israelis living there no i don't see. an extension of. area a you know to remember the palestinians already ok by forty percent of the west bank with ninety five percent of the population which is already there and we are not there so so they run their own affairs so patient it's not exactly what people think but at the end of the day i do not think that anybody in israel is thinking of a one state solution we have in the palestinians here. we will find a way to have a total separation and again i want to say it's not just one or zero yes or no black and white it could be also some kind of confederacy some kind of relationship

like ben in looks you know or we used to have belgium and netherlands and looks and could be jordan palestinians in israel everything is still possible nothing is etched in stone. so i've read a lot of what you have been saying on the subject and you been expressing a pain the palestinians have the culture of violence but then you know you step back and look at it the culture of violence is only bred by violence right the palestinians who are humiliated at wall checkpoints and settlements like have braun who are bloke aided in gaza who are killed by snipers at protests i mean why should they like israel right they have no reason i mean from their point of view israel has taken their land and it's controlling their lives without giving them a voice i kind o. way i understand why they would be feeling rylan about it and you can't really breed country or culture of love from that. well i believe the palestinians have been betrayed by successive palestinian governments and leaders all the way back

with hodge i mean in which they mean again i don't want to history lesson but he's the one who went to hitler asking him to kill all the jews of. palestine as well and what was palestine palestine was never a state it was a minister of unit they were palestinian jews and palestinians my parents i still have they are a palestinian papers they were the ones who started they one of the one who rejected any offers in thirty seven in one nine hundred forty seven the way to camp david and i went out now i mean the young generation right now living in palestine they have nothing to do with those you know historical events they are just born into this reality and what they get is what i have sat in my previous question how do you make sure that they are actually more loving toward israel is while these realities on the ground right now. israel would love to love them but for this we have to have is human cultural change i'll tell you what is the problem if you look

at the textbooks in the palestinian authority the old teach to kill israel to eliminate israel from the map. they make demands not over the west bank or gaza but all over israel this has to stop they also are trying to attack us politically you know that there is also what we call the pay to slay you know that in the palestinian legislation book there is a law which encourages palestinians to kill jews and if they kill jews they get money for it and you know what even there is a terrorist the more jews they kill the more money they get so if we see elimination of all these the elimination of incitement i think then you will see that israel will be more than generous and more than helpful with all the palestinians so it's a matter of changing their attitude and especially the attitude of their leadership so for right now the united states and its republican leadership couldn't have be no more pro is rally but things look different on the left wing right there you

have the center left to satisfy in which is more or less friendly to israel but also figures like bernie sanders i found out. it. could a future democratic president whoever that would be dropped the us israeli ties below say obama iran. i don't think so i mean certainly they will not be warm as intimate as it is with the trump but basically the alliance between israel and the united states is the natural one which the united states also gets a lot in terms of technology in terms of intelligence in terms of stability in the in the region many american lives are being saved because of the cooperation with israel so any president who new president who comes to the white house and he looks at the analytical report of the strategists in washington or intelligence reports they will continue maybe not as intimate and warm as with trump but the

alliance will continue after the jerusalem bickel the palestinians denote see the united states a fair broker anymore and we hold our boss has been calling for more involvement in the peace process the table be turned on israel if here up steps in. i don't think so have always taken the backseat i don't think that they have the wherewithal i don't think that they have the capacity to lead we're talking about twenty eight different countries and not all the time they have consensus and they do not also have the means in terms of strategic capabilities and not even economic to do what the united states can do however saying having said that i think the palestinians in a bus they made a big mistake not actually. receiving trump and boy trying to boycott the americans this will not help them on the contrary if they would negotiate with the

americans i think they would be much better off so israel has been developing its economic ties with china and some very recent reports hint that trump would have none of that and he even said this could affect the u.s. israel's security cooperation so is israel willing to bend the knee and lose to china's investments to please its american friend i mean that's a tough choice here. well it is a tough choice but we can here we can square the circle certainly we have very very important relationship with china a lot of interests with the united states of course it's best friend and ally but i think we can find the middle of the road to yes the americans do see china is the chief global opponent to the american interests and maybe israel is in a position to try in the hilt the two sides to come and understand better each

other but in any case we are obligated by the americans not to sell to china and the military technology only civil technology tim trump is about to roll out the israeli palestinian peace plan did they love the century like you called it couple of times and trump said earlier that since he's already given israel but enough to return palestinians would also get something very good is netanyahu in a position to say no to that dale if he doesn't like it if it splits tourism for instance. i don't think that and how we say no he may say yes but but he will not say no you are right sophie's not in a position to say no and trump said many times that you know we got there are let's say advantages you know with moving the embassy to jerusalem the recognition of jerusalem as their capital. he said that there would be some painful things that israel will not like either so this is why i think the

palestinians should come with open minds to the to the negotiation so that the trumpet ministration has recently recognized israel this summer and take over golan hates this unilateral move has been rejected across the board and the international community basically by almost everyone but some of the most staunch trump. netanyahu has been you know lobbying it as another foreign policy victory but if virtually no one else says the golan as israel does that really mean victory. well i think for bibi it meant victory also a political victory and we saw it's in the in the ballot saying in the role for the election he won in a very big way but for israel the golan heights are important today more than ever before because things have changed since iran is trying to take over.

syria which is against the interest of israel or the interest of fair syria or fair of the syrian people or even the interest of russia since they are there and we see the chaotic situation in the golan heights is very very important for us also with the golan heights there is no population whatsoever so this is not something that is you know it's a barren land it's very important to anyone else but to israel's security so that's right now who is facing in that mine on bribery fraud and breach of trust and near their speculations in the press that he may actually use his power mentor majority to pass a legislation that would make a sitting prime minister immune to standing trial doing that could happen. theoretically it could happen because of the french law because according to the french law the they cannot indict or prosecute the president there but i don't think that the israeli legislators will go this way and i don't think they have to

because according to israeli existing law a prime minister. doesn't have to step down only if he's convicted could be a long long process old the coalition members and yeah right now are promising him that they will be here by the law and they will not demand his resignation if the attorney general decides to indict only after a trial after if convicted. mr allen it's been such a pleasure talking to you good luck with everything thank you for this wonderful interview where we're talking to danny ayalon israel's former deputy foreign minister discussing the future of the netanyahu administration and israel's international standing that is it for this edition of so think also next.

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