program i suspect that we're going to have a referendum perhaps next september perhaps the year after 2017 but we are going to have a referendum it's pretty funny balance at the moment but i think that the majority of people can be persuaded to vote to leave if we phrase the argument properly and then i think it would get incredibly exciting well douglas cars well as new book progress versus parasites is out now and he joins me now douglas welcome back to going underground tell me about that new book in there it begins with discovering a stone while digging potatoes well when i was an m.p. i used to relax by having a vegetable garden and one evening when i was in my vegetable god my came across what turned out to be a stone age hand-axe and as as often happens i got a very simple thought which turned into a book i was holding this stone age hand x. in one hand i took a photograph of it with the i phone in the other it struck me other phones are available other things are available and then i suddenly thought to myself how on how how how do we get from a human society where the most advanced technology was

a piece of shop in stone to one where we've got a small phone in pretty much every pocket and the more i look into it the more i came to realise that actually there's been incredible human progress but it's all happened very very recently within in many continents and countries in the past generation or 2 but even within western europe only within the past 23 maximum 400 years relatively recently i want to get on to progress was in who the parasites are in the title but while you were writing it did you think and this is a kind of history of the world there was more than a little call works in the book given that it seemed to talk about the power of capitalism and it was at the core me that's where the 1st will know where i was in love with the with capital and actually i would say it's a repudiation of coal marx's view of history komaki tends to look at history as a story of claw struggle i certainly agree that through. history many societies

have had small parasitic elites but marx then argues that actually the the answer is to try to organize society by blueprint by design and i did mean marxist prescription but before you get to the prescriptions you talk about the power of capitalism to transform human society is this recent phenomena this is talk of absolutely the driving force for human progress i argue historically has been the free market they've been to specialize in an exchange it's the opposite actually if exploitation it's people freely entering into mutually advantageous relationships economic relationships from which they get societies where that was allowed to happen very very rarely did that happen until until recently flourished but most people who ever lived were poor precisely because the parasitic leads at the apex of society prevented the free market from coming into play some readers might be surprised though that you attack the jacobins and at the same time many would see it is the real exponential progress economic progress is made up of the english and

french revolution well i argue in the book that actually the french revolution is a disaster of human history for human progress this is temptation you were marionettes the parasitical you told not to talk mantra net was representative of one crash it parasitic in each but the people who took over would just as bad when it came to telling people how to live their lives and it's no coincidence that france for most of the previous 1000 years had been the economic superpower in europe since the french revolution of the previous 10200 years will say france has become an economical state run it's often argued by historians that modernity and human progress is a consequence of what they call the enlightenment the 18th century like mint just some truth in that but the enlightenment a bit like an also gives rise to what you might call rationalism and you see this particularly in france. and in russia the homes of the 2 most dramatic revolution

are peoples far from actually delivering human progress the revolution in france and the revolution in russia actually arrest human progress catastrophic to see sure winston churchill would be saying he needed industrialization and after the russian revolution to win will go to it is the nut imagine if instead of replacing the russian parasitic czarist regime with bolsheviks they had replaced it with a constitutional system of government then i think you would have seen russia take off and take off and have a far less bloody 20th century history if it is military well that is really india and china because china of course are the more violent revolution than the indian revolution of india independence revolution well since it's very interesting if you look at those 2 great asian powers china and india when they simply exchanged outside parasitic elites for their own homegrown centralizes they didn't take off it's only really since the 1980 s. in china and the 1990 s.

in india when they liberalized internally and stopped trying to have their own politicians and bureaucrats run their societies from the top down that they've started to take off arguably the reason it's taken off so much better in china than india is the structures that were built way mao when you talk about the great progress this book is not about this is not a pessimistic book is it's very very optimistic is very optimistic but surely most of the human progress that's been made realize it was just 6 of the based on communist china it doesn't really actually no it doesn't say that our was the window shopping area with mao was a very bad thing in terms of trying to taking off china throughout its foreign parasites in the 1940 s. it then made a series of catastrophic blunders in the fifty's in the sixty's in the seventy's under mao who tried to organize trying to buy top down design it's only in 198879 often when china stopped trying to run china from the center that's when china takes off it's no coincidence that the. economic success stories of our time the

united states with its sublime constitution that disperses power between states china since 1000 some china india more recently these these are taking off as great economic success stories great blocks because they've begun to decentralize economically the one part of the planet that has started to centralize economic decision making of the past 30 or 40 years is the one part of the world economy that is doing relatively badly and that is the european union and that's why a majority of people in britain voted for break that but surely when you talk about the united states we think of the constitution you call it supply we know thomas paine when it comes to russia and china and india hugely influenced and there are independent struggles by karl marx you just mentioned the european union tony benn jeremy corbyn these are characters that for the centralization of europe and regionalization what is the difference here between what the history difference is

in this book and say something that jeremy corbyn might come up with i think maybe superficially a look a lot of the analysis and in common take someone like thomas piketty thomas because he is has written the french economist has written about how at the moment we see what he regards as inevitable emergence of a an economic oligarchy but where picotee and coburn and co would argue that what you need is state fit state intervention to disperse power i would argue that in the past when you try to attack on a donkey with a form of redistributive populism you actually end up playing straight into the hands of the emerging oligarchy colbert is no he had to develop what i think anyway i think that will blairite that goal with his of course it's a long time as you've been on this show and that was before the vote. what do you think about the fact that so many in media in this country so which people would call elites believe it wasn't the people of this country the voted for brits it was

the russians that manipulated to vote and this is a serious accusation made by award winning journalists. i think part of the problem here is that detachment between the professional opinion formers in this country the commentary of the people who write columns for newspapers some are some of them are very good but a lot of them are completely detached from the russia country and so they can't quite believe that a majority a 1000000 strong majority would vote for something that they regard as a complete anathema to their worldview and so many of them are not just offended by the decision of this country to your opinion they they they need to try to explain it to rationalize it away so they look for some sort of external force to blame they might blame a foreign power they might claim that they believe somehow chichi i think the truth is that they've got psychological problems of their own in coming to terms with the fact that they and not actually in touch with a country about which they

a pint and they're not really that representative of mainstream britain now one key passages in the book is about the goldstone to the nixon shock as you call it what would happen to a politician today if they well rex it is one thing if they argue against these supranational institutions against fractional banking basel the go leverage is for banks let alone the i.m.f. the european union and these big organizations that come under fire in your book i'm all in favor of super national corporation but what we need to do is return to the principle that governments that we elect to run our nation states are accountable to the voters within those nation states and anything that they've done to try to avoid that democratic accountability through the ballot box and through the reps the link between taxation and. plantation we restored i suspect that actually if you did this right if you went into a general election either as a center left candidate or a center right candidate and argue that it's time to not just take on the banks but

actually take the central bank i suspect you would have middle britain sharing with you now see i think many people recognize that as nothing to do it centrism it's more to do with the with the kind of politics we now have in this country whether it be corbin whether it be the right of the conservative but do you think any of the candidates understand the principles of your book as to how britain can have a successful and prosperous future i think they do i think they all appreciate that once we've left the european union the success of this country in terms of increasing output in the next generation the generation before that depend on north only managing while our relations with the e.u. once we've laughed but actually opening ourselves up to the world we we see every year tens of millions of middle class people joining the global economy in china and india in indonesia in asia even now in sub-saharan africa whether or not our children have

a higher standard living than we do depends on our ability to trade and engage with them it's good to have good relations with europe too but there's a bigger world out there that was god's will thank you after the break the militarization of britain's post crash education system will these british children grow up to 5 illegal wars as britain this week announces the deployment of royal marines persian gulf for a possible the american war with iraq british m.p.'s chair and to teresa mayes legacy as the frontrunner to replace boris johnson is branded a racist and a liar the prime minister's questions well the simple coming up to him going underground. came here where did you work before you came here when you lived. in many us states

capital punishment is still practiced convicted prisoners can spend years waiting for execution but most of the time the victims' families they are very much in favor the death penalty there are some people because of what they did have given up the right to live among us some even proven innocent of 2 years on death row and how many more exonerations is it going to take before we as a society realize that this is not working and we actually do something about. mass geysers financial survival guide liquid assets not those that you can turn into a mass quite easily. to keep in mind no as if i'm into a place. where. we had one man 3540 years old. enough to start out in the water.

some 30 fisherman well this child later in this letter. addressed to. me that i went to the. man of the mfi was stubborn and. i believe that this is one of the therapy is so. charming that absurd really harsh things that happen in life. welcome back is the slate clean for those who will replace drazen is u.k. prime minister because some journalists appear to forgotten that those those seeking the top job all supported to raise amaze alleged cruelty to britain's most vulnerable is jerry corbin shadow housing minister referencing the manta rays m h

o's to be her chief of staff accused of ignoring warnings about britain's worst post world war 2. 3 successive ministers were written to over a total of $21.00 times over 4 years by the all party group on fire safety urging them to act to make sure we have void another fire following the lack of house fire the last of those $21.00 let is was written a month before the grand full tower fire and no action was taken spring what does the prime minister believe those ministers should have done when they received that expect advice but for tourism a inquiry run by a judge previously overruled by the supreme court over alleged social cleansing is arguably kick the whole issue into the long grass the whole question of. what has happened and the advice that was available is a matter that will be looked at in the 2nd phase of a public inquiry and as for the dangers right now u.k.

labor leader jeremy corbyn question may on mitigating any imminent further instance of alleged corporate manslaughter of the relative poor the 2013 coroner's report into the deadly like no house fire recommended sprinklers should be retrofitted to all social housing currently only 32 out of 837 council tower blocks above 30 metres have sprinklers 2 years after grenfell 6 years after the coroner's report will see the prime minister now accept the recommendation and set a deadline for all highrise blocks to have sprinklers retrofitted tourism a said he got his facts wrong i think he has inadvertently said something that doesn't quite reflect what the tarnas report said what the coroner's report said was that landlords should consider putting in retrofitting sprinklers it did not say that every building should be retrofitted so no mandatory sprinklers will be

one legacy of resume what about another which was supported by those seeking to replace at the end of her career will the prime minister take time to reflect that her creation of the his aston environment led to the windrush scandal to a catalogue of errors in immigration decisions to people feeling unsafe in their own homes to an atmosphere of distrust and suspicion and to xenophobia which is damaged our relations with our european neighbors gerri willis she apologized to resume appeared to blame not herself but a combination of a labor leader defeated winston churchill and the revolutionary liberation movement which won independence from brutal british colonial tyranny what may be behind the issue in relation to the problems that some members of the interest generation have faced with the fire. when they came into the u.k. they were not given documentary evidence of their immigration status and their

countries gave gained independence they were not given that documentary evidence of their stance in this week's hugo of poll claims that tories are choose the next u.k. pm or arguably less colonial they don't mind giving up ulster and scotland if it stops jeremy corbyn but if the leader of the scots nationalist in westminster is to be believed the frontrunner boris johnson might eject scotland from the u.k. for different reasons does the prime minister to agree with the frontrunner set to succeed the scottish people out of their ministry that should be pleased to get to was and exterminated tourism may seem not to agree with the sentiments published in a right wing magazine once edited by boris johnson but it is of course scotland where britain has cited its nuclear weapons and in a week when reports emerged of a possible u.s. air strike on iran's civil nuclear program some asked what would people think of beijing in moscow struck the 1st plane submarine base north of glasgow there's

certainly no doubt that london is more in line with washington than any other capital perhaps by tell of eve of a tensions in the persian gulf so who will fight another middle east war and who will britain recruit for a future u.s. war as war school a new film exposes british government recruitment tactics targeting children as young as 7 its director mick dixon joins me now to make welcome to going underground tell me about the film how it suggested by stealth the government is militarizing britain's youth and that's 7 to 11 year old something to think about i suppose now there are reports the troops are going to the persian gulf again but it's interesting you say by stealth isn't really by stealth it's all out in the open they have these plans to have a coherent strategy for encouraging people to support the military in this country is all there so we're open but. it comes across in a way that looks is that it's benign it looks is there it's just fun and games but

it's calculated from what i can say to encourage other than really the country to support the military when they do do things like take on the wrong for whatever reason but now to encourage young children young children to be supportive of the military and to be proved in the military why this is 7 to 11 year olds i mean the u.n. committee on the rights of the child say that vulnerable groups of children and so on should not be targeted and yet you're talking about presuming you're fighting that is using gauge when review 2011 taking place shortly after the financial crisis and the bailouts of the banks to get vulnerable children. i don't think you can say that they're. targeting vulnerable children however is what you put out a number of reports recently and one of them says actually there is a quote where he says we're looking at households which have an income of less than

10010000 the last year so that's the way i phrase it it's clear that's what they do they but weighs down and so 11000 school visits is a statistic used in the film and in fact david tory leadership candidate. of being a systems which the defacto u.k. subsidised britain. they seem very proud of running education road shows 213000 young people have seen they have 845 brand ambassadors or. teaching this stuff they say they're there to inspire the next generation of engineers it's not about. 7 year olds with ideas of going to the persian gulf to fight war i think that i think it would be wonderful if. forces continue to be put into creating the next gen generation of engineers but creating them to do things that were positive

for our country and world can i say this and this is the figures that coming out went to a meeting with mo and pay on the issue around yemen and they put it in if i can say it is stark terms the exports of goods from this country total is $500000000000.00 pounds per year of that 20000000000 the manufacturing 20000000000 is. ok so that's a 5th of a 5th if you want to work out the stats but that 2xb6b is what we're selling to ourselves. so it's funded by us. is not essential for our economy it's a myth now 100 new cadet units have been set up a target of 310 by 2020 and yet some of these m.p.'s are against the military covenant they've they voted against to strengthen the military government did you

find that they teach months all this new military those the as you cover in the film the increased vulnerability to p.t.s.d. alcohol abuse suicide posed by particular child records because unlike many countries in the world we still we have little training children to be soldiers so there's 2 questions in that complicated but the 1st one is the military couple that so there's nothing wrong with the military covenant in the terms in which it's written it's the military cover that sets out to tell troops and their families and members of the armed forces that we support you we care about you said military cup and. one level. actually says promises to support troops in housing and welfare and and and all sorts of other things ironically on the other side of this the military or the whoever organizes the

budgets for things a pushing all of welfare for troops to the charities and the charities then feeding off all of the. issues that you see in these images here they affect the p.t. p.t.s.d. can have on soldiers so the charities a building an enormous industry feeding on the issues the problems the really extreme effects of war on our true these pictures are from comic books that you know. being produced. tell me a bit about you know. from the very outset of making this film as an independent producer of a kind of. unknown mainstream film i knew it would be very difficult to distribute it so all along lots of different ways that we can use it use the film and the

things we've learned through it to engage with the public and children in particular so what we're doing now with the support of quite because britain meeting and funding is producing a comic book stroke graphic novel. one thread of the film which will then be incorporated with i learning results with the interactive materials and just as far as you know right now i mean it's a figure like $12000.00 veterans sleeping rough in britain that that kind of statistic is not going to be part of the teaching materials as soldiers go into britain's schools to interest interest children in the things soldiers going to britain's goes to. you because you're going to get p.t.s.d. or your legs blown off when you join up with us they're all rolled tentative but this is another thing that seriously shocked me and that's. when i discovered

that figure of 11000 military visits to schools year from forces while i was working with quite because and forces watch and veterans for peace and these organizations that are putting in an enormous effort to help educate people as to the realities. so this was quite good i asked them how many visits to you ken. quakers who have a very small department but is working very hard to manage to do about 6 or 10 visitors. 10 the number of the visit was not up to 6 or 10 the number of visits the veterans for peace managed to make to schools in the time that i've been with them is one hand counting hands counting if that and. this is what we're up against at a time when we are having break hillary pulls from the main

news media which is so it's no secret that children are having to find food in being outside schools at a time when teach is having to fund their school resources then selves at a time when that the un making reports on human rights violations in schools in education with young children this government all these governments since 2008 been able to find 100000000 pounds to promote military ethos in schools ok these are no kind of random figures this is true that's where the money is going why and because it's all just about school you do mention video games and the singer joss stone was criticised for her rendition of a song we now know from the cia and pentagon they've been involved in hollywood

films and in changing plot lines but what about the popular cultural propagandizing of major nations was up until say the falklands and beyond the falklands said definitely the 1st gulf war up until then the way that the military. actually integrated all parts of society was understood and respected and we kind of did. recognize and work together with that whatever they've got things going on that were questionable but it wasn't like the public to the humanity the reality for all courses and now it is it's calculated it's a calculated part of again this gets a bit political but part of the kind of neo liberal push towards a corporate takeover of our society. make dixon thank you and that's it for the

show will be back on monday with child homelessness having surged by 80 percent on the concept it's 2011 to talk housing is a human right with the u.s. property or an adequate housing at the start of the 41st session of the u.n. human rights council and to lead he would touch my social media even. though why a paradise with some all year round turned into a round the experimentation field the agricultural chemicals we know that these chemicals have consequences they are major irritants there's no question otherwise why would that the chemical company workers themselves be geared up and suited up locals attempt to combat the on regulated experiments that often in day you have many of these people who have one foot into the biotech pharma and the other foot in the government regulatory bodies this kind of collusion is reprehensible while

the battle goes on the chemicals continue to poison hawaii and its people so one has to ask the question whether there is a form of environmental research going on in hawaii whether these companies feel they can get away with this because the people have less political power. some time shows were like a honey pot and everyone believed that it was all on stable and on the reliable and russia but they thought that everyone was great over there russian businessmen who want to do business in the west because they feel that some could take everything away from them in russia it's now it's the opposite dave business is outside of russia was snatched less is frozen the whole blog and now the student whine about. mass geysers financial survival guide liquid assets not those that you can convert into caste quite easily. to keep an. to take me into

a place. for. the headlines an r.t. 10 minutes to spare that's how the us into a direct military confrontation with iran president says you can see a strike on the islamic republic just moments before it was to be little. said i want to know something before you go how many people will be killed came back sure approximately 150 and i didn't like it also to come an f.b.i. agent accidentally reveals a social media post promoting anti russian conspiracy theories during an investigation into the synagogue shooting and a lesson in life a scottish student claims he was.