bed you know much worse objectively day but there was an expectation the things were going to get better. there was a real sense of hopefulness there isn't today today's america was shaped by the turn principles of concentration of wealth and power. reduced democracy attack so low down engineer elections manufacture consent and other principles according to. one set of rules for the rich opposites. that's what happens when you put her into the. narrow sector of will switch which is dedicated to increasing power for chills just as you'd expect one of the most influential intellectuals of our time speaks about the modern civilization of america.

thank. the the. i. don't have a. i. mean i've been up with. a low in welcome across top where all things considered i'm peter lavelle ever since they arrived. all of boris johnson to 10 downing street there is

a growing sense have been evident ability that breaks it will be executed on october 31st with or without a deal do we get to this point what lessons have been learned or should have been learned. cross knocking bags and i'm joined by my guest we're now here are to in paris he is chief foreign correspondent at le figaro in london we have allister donald he is an associate director at the academy of ideas and in edinburgh we cross and john white he is a political commentator and writer originally cross titles in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate let me go to john in edinburgh 1st here in my introduction i said there's a growing sense of inevitability that we will have brags that on the 31st here and my off the mark go ahead john i think with a ton of answers you need slightly off the mark because there is one hell of a bottom to completion and if you keep all of our well orders johnson is. trying to

shoot almonds and i suspend the moment for 5 weeks and having bricks it so well i don't think it is inevitable now i think it me be more inevitable that we'll see the end or distortions very short term in government it's a general election does come to pass that his statement that you know save the colemans and i'm saying is plan for parliamentary procedure to ascertain whether he will get as we get breaks it delivered on a technical support or what it reminded me of neglect church e'squus and to missed last speech and because it's an $889.00 evolution 8 years of the protest it was almost succeeded in germany and voters chosen him so this is a tory establishment in complete and utter traces unable to loot and the already and i think the creator says no maturity but it is beyond bricks that will remain and even be argued over it's never about this corner relic of the british state and i don't really stand on the ground of socialism or solidarity with jeremy corbyn john mcdonald at all or only get over it oh yes but. john i'm. it respect about we

feel about it it's still on the agenda here let me go to reno in paris i mean what what could boris johnson get from the europeans from brussels that to resume couldn't ok because he's saying he's still open for a deal even if the window is only a matter of days that are open go ahead in paris. no i don't think that he will get anything because for 2 reasons number one the big countries are really fed up with this british visitations. that you know like 60 years old so they're really fed up and the 2nd thing is it's too complicated to have like 27. countries agree on the new proposal because for foreign affairs matters you need. so technically the techniques of a european union it's too complicated so boris johnson will not get. anything more

he has been told that by. and by emmanuel in paris ok the same thing to you i mean it respective of how democratic or undemocratic the tories. gambit is here it is ramming it through it but boris johnson and his associates will say but this is what people voted for and he's just doing the will of the people irrespective of well it's a bit devious but then politics and being devious are synonymous so go ahead alistair in london well yeah i think that's correct that he's. on a democratic mandate and he's trying to get to a situation where the u.k. actually leaves the european union the problem just and the problem that he's got in terms of concluding any of these arrangements by the 31st of october is that steadily and even. and rapidly the rulebook has been torn arpan terms of how

politics works there's all sorts of constitutional issues being arranged with parliament grabbing hold of the order book and determining the order of business there's legal challenges to what to his capacity to get us out so i think all bets are off just now in terms of whether he can get us out by the 31st of october and you know 6 you could argue that and indeed i would argue that those people who want to delay breck's it's in fact want to do much more than that they want to actually stop that and right from the outset the mechanisms to stop or exit those are have always been posed in a kind of democratically friendly way but that mass their real intent which is really to stop or exits away other let's say with intentions i like that look this go back to admiral john i mean to resume was the worst person possible to negotiate

brags because he didn't believe in it ok she wasn't she was the remainder now we have boris johnson which with very kind of a checkered past he's really kind of grabbed this thing and made it his own and he's going to fall on a sword one way or another when it comes to bragg's it here but least he's really stop him he's going to get this done deal or not to go ahead john well their own. nation. under we ready don't know who actually is being released to test the legality or. should we don't know that question is yet to be determined and of course the series out you know a bit of dynamism a book oddity of girls there are also a cultural corpus that was really lacking in our culture our spirit realm it was treason was his base but given what he's trying to do in the last week it was all true to use a queen to give them permission to suspend parliament of weeks early. shit that's

all chines and i think that the plane get is issue shout be against i'm idol think there's huge out of date for whom back to their mean i sent me it some would use of course you to be in an election to and the referendum pillar because not because i support you look at course i believe this is a kitchell hugh our be watched and it is east but i think there's a sigh a ship towards a new khushi a t. bricks at rather than or bracks i think matt's you tube ault or or which most people are standing in on this issue at this current moment take both course it is a huge amount of breaks it's a cheek a nickel she people want to see this this old one rear the other look tired of talking about a and i take to he's of meat there's a lot of criticism for the read it she dili dell and along with 13 or these past 3 years and he's dealing good solutions with the well i or anyone let me go to pay you impairs i'm i'm sick and tired of talking about brags it is well i mean from the president position in europe a mean it this bill lay aid to lay a 3 months 6 months i mean you need to cut the gordian knot ok and i did i would

suspect since boris johnson and his supporters are determined to have egg regs it executed than make at the 30 first's and be done with it i me why i keep delaying it ok i mean uncertainty is the worse thing in politics go ahead in paris yes i think the were thing it was thing and put exam in the united kingdom is a mario throw the world forward so ole democracy but on your to a pen matter is british policy and british a democracies are total failure there didn't want to go do the beginning you know in the confound also of missin in the the confidence of room in $57.00 they didn't want to draw on the common market their tried to do something a competitor of the government good which didn't work so when they're realize it men work they are asked twice to for a to talk of the going to the common market so are the twice then they insisted

again and again and finally the and then they needed a new refund and and then thatcher came and said oh but i don't like the rules i have to change their own and so on and so on we made you know they didn't want to utah so it's their way voting and now they decided by referral and them to leave but even to leave it's complicated with them i mean after 3 years they don't know what they want and the house of commons does not know what it wants and so i think at least with boris johnson we have. square policy i don't believe that it is the interest of britain to leave the european union but it is britain's problem and britain's this is it but at least. in my view is doing square and the stand the ball politics. let me go to

alistair i reflected by what we just heard from our guest in paris interesting go ahead yeah yeah i think the thing to understand here is the shift that's taken place over the course of the last 3 years we had the referendum in 2016 the political class were overwhelmingly for remaining within the european union and the vote went against them so it came as a real shock to them the initial response from theresa may is as as been say it was one of fundamental a damage limitation in terms of how the how britain withdrew from the european union she wanted to moderate the way that we withdrew so that we could retain as many links as possible and stay in sync with with our european partners the problem that she's hard and the problem that boris faces just now is that the damage limitation he's faced with is the very existence of the conservative party because the people have taken against to raise a maze. poor attempt to leave and continued to exert pressure on us to have

a break from the european union so boris is forced into the situation of desperately trying to leave in the 31st of october because he has he has the challenge of keeping his own party together personally i'm not convinced that he wants a new deal breaks that i think this is a ploy for him to come back with some sort of moderated version of the withdrawal agreement which i don't think will be overly different but which he can hold up and say well this is what i've won we're going to leave so i think you know his problem is a tricky one and the situation we're in just now is that in a way the middle ground the more moderate positions of fall in the party you remain yourself become ever more confident that they can push towards a situation of revolt and those that one breaks that have been forced by the remaining pressure to avoid leaving to go for ever more radical solutions which is

ended up with the desire for a clean break system or no bricks it or however you want to phrase it ok well it's there it's very interesting here i like what you said you went with the you have been the moderate views on both sides of the issue kind of fading away but that's what makes october 31st day or do were die in a many ways for both sides here are a gentleman after a short break we'll continue our discussion break stay with. the word of this you know so many people referenced the marie antoinette let them eat cake and then you know historians have gone back and they said you know it's actually like it's 30 ish brioche you know that so i brought in actual what a mess we brought in actual brioche this is a brioche just by the slice there at the patisserie and so this is what she suggested that the best of this should be eating. because they run out of town they

say this is a british is a slightly nicer version of there's a few in the cupboard let's throw that to the peasants and maybe they'll shut them up but. i. ready ready ready am sure to stop at the 2 during their grow. i just never know very good about the idea of bringing. it into the world because i didn't feel like things were in very good shape that a life was just going to be a lot of software programs. there's no reason. to take things that are to me the there's no reason to make something. to everybody's

scared to talk that survival is really dependent on us addressing this issue and if we can even talk about it every chance even have a conversation or that it then. we're in trouble ready. welcome back to crossfire where all things are considered i'm peter and we're discussing bragg's it. let's go back to john in edinburgh ok let's work under the assumption that briggs it occurs a risk even if it's on october 31st or january 31st of next year it's happened at sites are supposition right here there's a lot of talk here that the you know we you k. will drift into the us or bit because we have people like secretary of state mike.

peo just essentially drooling over the possibility of a new trade agreement with the u.k. which of course will have all those political attachments and it would be a deal with foreign policy i mean is this something that's going to happen because i think a lot of people on both sides of this issue say britain can't stand alone it's going to have to choose one side is that really an outcome that a lot of people that voted in the referendum are interested in seeing happen go ahead john no i don't think it is and i think that's why it was a lot of opposition both into part of johnson's attempt to root through you know direction because of the trauma administration you know the trauma mission and both antipathy towards multilateral institutions and multinational trade in blocks and it prefers to deal and by lead to the on a bilateral basis no the all seeing rules that only the strong can compromise and all of the equals can reach agreement look good and does come cold and shivering out of the e.u. are there any deal that it will be vulnerable to any day tasks that trump then goes on and you see from this past week he slipped out it's not on the order america's

adversaries but also it on its allies canada and france so everyone's greatly worried about what this would intil for britain going forward clearly what is about the future of the n.h.s. a national health service which is a free health service at the point of need was introduced by the course for liberal government and is a shining example of social solidarity and action and people are worried about how this survived in the trunk gets his hands on it because we know that the us corporations are see the n.h.s. as a glittering price and boris johnson has secured given guarantees bearable guarantees of the n.h.s. we see it but how can we do that for sure conditions on the cheap deal with us in the u.k. of course predicts a future will be imposed by us more than we buy and so yes i think people are rightly concerned about donald trump's. intentions towards britain.

it's feeding a lot of the opposition even only. across their children what's your reaction now let me go back to paris here i mean i really appreciate how you characterize the u.k.'s relationship with the your you were european union for during and i want to talk about after what kind of relationship what kind of constructive relationship do you think the e.u. will have with the u.k. post bragg's it i mean i'm sure that between france and britain the defense cooperation will go on because it's very important you have to realise that britain and france are the 2 only nations in europe that are ready to fight that have soldiers ready to get killed to kill because an army is done for that you know and we saw it everywhere was through it in bosnia for instance and other. armies in europe unfortunately use that for for for

some foreign operations if you like you can rely only on britain and france who are 2 nuclear powers who have a corporation in all fields of military including the nuclear field so i think that britain will remain a very strong partner in defense 2 fronts as far as the special relationship with america of course it will go on but you have to remember remembers something that they's a big difference between some and boris johnson that you saw in ballots boris johnson said openly that is pro free trade when of course is a protectionist and then also boyce would have to remember that british be. bill is

a proud people and they don't like when it's too open to clear that britain is the pool of the united states and when it became too poor to clear you know in you remember this summit in some part of the book when when w. bush called blair or your ask him to come like a pull to his seat you remember that scene and because of that. the labor party actually and britain fired tony blair as the prime minister because they cannot business people are proud people and they will not be the poodle of america and you have seen that in the g. brought our prices in this grace one iran and ship that. america for another you know. british accident again the iranian ship and britain well you.

will not be a total of prudence i mean legally it's a really good example let me go to our excellent example but if and as i mentioned if a new trade deal between the u.k. and the united states is dictated by the united states then you're not going to have that kind of freedom here i'm thinking about iran for example where france has the european position and the u.k. would be open to a lot of pressure by the united states to side with it when it's a very unpopular policy around the world the british the british would be reduced to having to have to follow orders and i think again that's something that's not really been discussed very much i'm on the brakes it's i don't get me wrong ok but there are a geo political implications of it go ahead alister. well yeah the huge geopolitical implications i mean i think though the thing is that if we come out of the european union with anything approaching a clean break where we have the ability to make our own policies are and then to

enter into negotiations then we're in a better position than the decisions been handed down from. which we're part of but which as a people as a demo swede never really hard any possibility of contributing to the making of so there's lots of scare stories yes but i think we should take. 6 should look at the positive side of this of being able to. interact on something approaching our as a starting point on our own terms and obviously compromises will need to follow in all of these things but ultimately if you're talking trade then we've got companies in britain and companies in america and throughout the european union that want to make products and want to sell them at a profit so there's a certain logic in that which will lead to compromises we shouldn't be afraid of that on the political side i think we have we have some big decisions to be made

but the important thing i think to remember is that even within the european union just no it's not all harmony good from parts of the european union the think different things it's a league wants with china germany more that's where i want to go here that's exactly where i want to go john what the what are the things that brussels is so infuriated by briggs that is because it sets a precedent and always a tappy in the european home ok and i think all of us would agree with that but once one gets out it creates a model for others to think at least start thinking about it in i think that's one of the reasons why brussels was so rigid with the u.k. and they were actually quite. or to have such a weakling as in may so but the president will be there and it's something that the the mandarins in brussels certainly have to be thinking about go ahead john. oh yeah touching on one nor scent of a grown b.

in our akun in excess of where in europe over the last 4044 years of us involvement in european union it's been a mutation brussels' us completely also mishandled this process because us stuck to a rigid of shooter lane not making any alone so the side of the little skepticism crush it up as know who'd become a mainstream political current. when it was always on the margins this are really course in government which is indeed in italy or buying or only the rise of marie le pen and get rollers and all and then of course bricks or so brussels has advanced norse anal of willing to reform its institutions or forest practices and democratize and sorting is a castell fertile and well well monetary and absolute right you don't would suffer a lot of damage if you came or to leave the 6th largest economy or 1st but largest economy 34 percent of all you keep imports are from the e.u. $46.00 of all you can export judaea so that would be

a sizeable chunk taken and specially in germany come manufacturers who have a big stick and what happens with this breaks it process so and also has a lot of prestige around the world and its and its potence would be under we we know that people at macro want to see the e.u. politicized and to move towards being a super state i think it's part of the reader never largely because of the e.u.'s handling of this process and the us for the units on which we're not to touch the point that was one of the best things that britain did was not to enter you know who that ended up not that's testament to the 4 so-called golden brown who was the limit chancellor 10 years ago and made that decision not to enter leaders on your contradictions that are you know one does not lead in order to begin but it's that if you have a little model that sustains your opinion that is incomplete and not ok russia let's talk about that little or no this go back to you in paris what is the biggest lesson from this whole break for experience from the continent's perspective go ahead. you know. i interviewed the friend secretary last he had

was when he go in on the lawn of his embassy in paris and you know what he told me at the end of of the individual finally. charles the gold was right yes they bothered us like 60 years of that i finally saw a little was right. i'm not. you know it's amazing. when you find other jobs ago was right but. no i think that. the. your opinion is not in such a bad state you like it or not you know is a really good competitor for dollar it's a very strong currency it's used by everybody is getting stronger and stronger people said 5 or 10 years ago you know will die i don't see the death of you at all you are you are telling us that. europe is not united yes there is

fights among you know but not so so such big fights because i remember that the italia in the said funds and on the on the on the sanctions was russia that they would they would they would they would vote against the sanctions and you need only one you would have been a country to say we don't want the sanctions to go on and you have no most european sanctions against russia they the talent's did not do that so you still add some kind. of unity and politically i think that the your opinion union is actually in a better state than the you like it or at river aren't you gentlemen would buy a rocket out of china who sparked a run out of town i don't want to realize i want to repeat the most important sentence of this program goal was right ok many thanks to my guests in paris london and. burl and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at r.t.c. unix thought i mean remember crossed the tools

there's things leap to hear me during the great depression which are old mr remember there was an most my family were unemployed working plus other wasn it was bed you know much worse objectives

listens a day but there was an expectation of the things we're going to get better of the was a real sense of hopefulness here isn't today today's america way shape my the ton principles of concentration of wealth and power reduced democracy at tack soloed douched engineer elections manufacture consent another prince holds according to know i'm chaunced one set of rules for the rich ops a several shrewd who are that's what happens when you put our into the announced of narrows sector of will switch will is dedicated to increasing power for of chills just as you'd expect one of the most influential intellectuals of our time speaks about the modern civilization of america

millions of serbian may diminish and reportedly end up in the hands of terrorists in yemen and syria after they were born by the u.s. and its allies according to leaks documents obtained by a bulgarian journalist i had a baby but. you. don't . think. the british prime minister sees his brags that planted a huge blow in parliament by legislation blocking any no deal departure from the european union. and a un report highlights the potential role of the us britain and france and human rights violations committed in yemen the countries continue to follow mr.