but. make up the core of the european athens in whose image they are theirs have to be remade well it's it's been set up all of the in the beginning of the ninety's and it's still like that so it's the night in 93 copenhagen create tyria establish are all over law functioning market economy for democracy and within democracy protection of minority rights the problem is that in the western balkans . after 2000. and especially over the past the 78 or 10 years we have of the climb very visible decline in all of these crew so the market is not functioning efficiently according to. the competitive gritty of yeah we shipped them across to decline very visible to the decline. we have here are not always but we have problems with protection of minorities. in some in some places

or at least some kind of problem with between majority and minority but the major problem is the will of law we simply not only serbia but everywhere in the western balkans have a judiciary and public prosecutors which are under to have the influence of politicians now i know that you specifically identify state capture that is the misuse of state funds for private and political benefit as the main obstacle to your europeanization but i would say that this kind of france seeking and self-serving behavior could be found within the court ear itself in countries like cyprus or italy do you think you're of the old to your has itself leaned up to the standards of the europeanization that it tries to hold others to you could also have mentioned the paul or. hungary right over the past several years right the problem with the origin of the problem is that the european union these

not able to solve this problem we've been utopian you know with these kinds of because hungary czech republic poland are the members of the european union right now and you. capture there are you also. the theater nation of other very important to have established member they're not able to solve this there of course then they are not able to solve this in the western balkans when this is running much much larger scale. in this country it's always been a bit counter to many observers that former soviet satellites like bulgaria romania poland became members of the european union before the constituent parts of former and on the line yugoslavia having looked at how those various countries measure against the yardstick are you sure that it's always been

a function of janey and democratic or economic development rather than let's say geo political expediency i would say that is one of the geopolitics in this process and of course the european union wants to bring to take in these countries become some kind of shields. other countries especially russia maybe some some other countries but i think the. in 1809 when the berlin wall came down i think that the during the night these and even after 2000 the majority of the prevalent mood in discounted is was that they want to join european. paul and for example i mean this goes without saying countries like paul rudd so they wanted to join european union more than anything else because they want to sell some kind of protection from russia you know this is all that matters it's only about the countries wanting to join i mean obviously much of eastern

europe and that i wanted to join not only because of the quality of democratic institutions but i assume also because of the quality of life and economic benefits but speaking about poland you mentioned that there has been a deterioration in democratic progress across eastern until within 5 cross western europe lately and. you know the popular narrative in the west is that in countries where russia is present that's understandable because russia is supporting autocratic tendencies etc but poland is very notable. example contrary to die theory because it's been staunchly and to russian for a number of heroes and yet as we all know there's been the backsliding on democracy how do you explain it then isn't it perhaps isn't it perhaps an indication that the way people thought about democratization. 20 years ago is not accurate it's far more complex than perhaps violence lay near them i would say i would explain the polish case very similar to the one gettin case and some cases in the western

balkans all has to do with the way the countries were democrat and what happened with the distribution of resources basic resources i think that in in polish case and other cases i mention the 1st couple of decades some of them. improving of material wealth for every citizen but the genuinely these these people they saw the whole process as unjust or unsafe there is a polish origin political scientists. who mention this in night the night the one so even the process of democratization europeanization is not failure so that everybody stand to benefit those who are the losers they will get back and they will the strike back so i think this is what's happening in poland this is what's happened what's happening i'm going to this what's happening in serbia and some western balkan balkan countries so i have to also innocent germany and the initial

human who do you know that's right so now there comes the opinion you and you and the enlargement process this self i think that the european officials don't really recognize that so they don't they support i mean when it comes to the balkan countries they support the balkan out of crypts they simply pay no attention to what's happening today and i think this is what is genuinely putting the whole thing in danger let me just mention one thing for example in a couple of years back in serbia. group of masked people tore down several factors of houses and buildings in the downtown of belgrade. 3 years on we have no idea what happened who did that the public prosecutor is not saying anything and the european union is not saying don't do such or. such or huge violation of the rule of law now this is the most interesting part that this

could have never been told that the german in berlin this could have never been tolerated yes european officials mentioned this at no point while at this point here are not officially a member of a european every month they have an excuse of not interfering in into the affairs all obey they they can interfere because there are certain chapters which set certain standards that the aspiring countries has to fulfill and those shots of 22242324 it's long been believed that the enlargement policy at has dual objectives democratizing eastern european countries as well as fulfilling the e.u. foreign policy agenda one element of which is to keep russia at bay to keep its influence minimized and yet i get it from your writing that it it's not always working as intended and sometimes they say and to russians trick is actually contributing to the rise of autocratic leaders and these toleration of the lack of

the rule of law that you mention how does it work so in some confidence you will find the other objective about having a country democrat ties and then at the same time being. serving as a shield against russia is work for example take an example montenegro despite very massive population support popular support for russia the monthly need to be in leaders somehow managed to get the government and you go into nato and you know induction of all democratic way are right but it doesn't really have to work so supporting out the crowd in the ball. once could. ends the way you did in one thing you don't so it will become one day part of the european union needs all of the part of nato but it would be a it could end up in a different way so one of some of these confidence could go closer to russia so

serbia is one of this country which is neither here nor there in the foreseeable future it will surely never become part of nato but will go closer to russia we don't know that public service cause a part of. the same thing is on the other north mustard on the under the rule of nikola whoever skit was doing the same thing so and he was heavily supported by the european official i mean one of the foreign minister was even coming to his electoral rally a couple of days before the elections to give him pats on the back and they give him up a european supporter do i understand you correctly because i mean they they can pick a european narrative has that mosque a supporting autocrats because they are more amenable to. the kremlin's nefarious a. essentially saying that brussels is guilty of the same charge that it supports a leader who it finds more amenable or easier to deal with about it it is for

stability or for geopolitical purposes i would say it's maybe not in this war but i would say if we see in the future that some balkan countries are driving away from european these asian union and going closer to russia one part of the responsibility will be with utopian the fissions and so the whole process of a large meant i think have to be rethought if you will especially when it comes to its applicability how you are ply all these standards are you consistent double standards maybe somewhere that's i think what should be rethought 3rd as you mentioned is an interesting example because it tries to strike a balance between the russia and there are multiple at. ization the president of which is has been is european power and controlling of the media etc but he also appointed the 1st openly gay prime minister which is a major progressive milestone for this country is serbia indeed more european though they then it has to be is it being europeanized or is it just trying to look

at a part you know. i mean we have prime minister who is openly gay but that's all fake i mean fake in terms of. promoting european values because the major thing his state capture extraction of publicly sources from private bad things and this is what's going on right now if a gay prime minister is not really putting be seen then ger the political elite is 5 wins and with many other things right as far as long as extraction is untouched the state capture is untouched everything is acceptable and even the european union is acceptable at the moment in this i think that the major thing that european officials have to understand the moment european officials seriously i ask questions about extraction about state capture in the west and balak as they will get in the conflict and serious conflict with the latest well professor polish we

have to take a short break we'll be back in just a few moments. join me every thursday on the alex salmond show and i'll be speaking to guests of the world of politics sports business i'm showbusiness i'll see if. you know world's big partisan group of law. and conspiracy it's time to wake up to dig deeper to hit the stories that made stream media refuses to tell more than ever we need to be smarter we need to stop slamming the door. and shouting past each other it's time for critical thinking it's time to fight for the middle for

the truth the time is now for watching closely watching the hawks. this is a story about what happens auster a stray bullet kills a young girl in the streets. what happens to her family and daughters in florida the mother daughter is buried in a cemetery it really messes with your head what happens to the community the public was screaming for a scapegoat the police need is a scapegoat so why not choose a 19 year old black kid with a criminal record who better to pin this on than him and what happens in courts be . shocked shocked as far as society we feel. we don't know still just for the. end of this trial

unfortunately you. will still not know childress. welcome back to worlds apartment addition pile of h. associate professor and the political 5 at the university of belgrade professor problems before the break we talked about how the large one is perceived outside the e.u. let's now discuss about how it's seen on the inside i'm sure you've seen this latest interview. 'd in the economist magazine that french president a man gave and he firmly stated that there would be no all for their e.u. enlargement until the membership procedures are formed do you take that as just postering which is not entirely or into mishear electron or do you think it's

a wider shot as far as the e.u. neighborhood policies concerning i think that the. french president actually express the idea which is pretty consistent with what we've been talking in the in the 1st part of the interview and this is that everybody sees that something is going wrong with and large and process of course what part of the problem is not only is not happening at all in the western balkans but part of the problem is in european union itself because the union is undergoing pretty huge. changes and i think that some things that he mentioned in this interview call for a total revision of the whole approach to european union rights for example one thing that i think is very important is that that is that there was a huge change in the us and the us was a country which basically security. for european union rather this country is now changing if mr trump wins yet another term this is 4 years of

this change that will be applied and everybody will feel the consequences now this calls for reform of the opinion of the position of the european union in the world right now you have on your borders countries like russia. china is also somebody there is terry k. 30 war in syria this is war ready close to your door maybe we should think about already organization a security system and if we do this what kind of position the western balkans country should be. understood well but i think it's a it was not only about the western balkans per se i mean he was speaking about that and the larger context accepting new members and we all know that he wasn't just you know putting ideas on the table france is actually blocking membership

talks for. northwest and on and it has come up with its own system 7 step system of i think they call it a gradual association not even accession do you think there is any chance of that system being accepted by are they are in pain countries given that they all called statements a historic mistake do they have a choice not to i think it's going to some version of this will be accepted because it's a very nice way to have a cake and eat it still read some of the say no without saying no he will say ok we are continuing our on our path of integrating more confidence but the essential is going to be a prolonged on a long long way until we reach the 7 step right with my base several decades right you could see the media after they explicitly say as the european officials explicitly said no to the north macedonians and binya what kind of problem with

coles and so pretty basic diplomatic rule is don't say no explicitly just to put it in some kind of. very nice wording good that everybody wants something in that same interview president across the thinking about the e.u. neighborhood policy in terms of access to the e.u. was quote absurd what else could the european union offer to this neighborhood if it's not very remote. prospect of joining them what else you know i don't think that. there is anything else but some kind of hold to that these countries will become your members if this is. the mood of the table i think that we can forget about any kind of neighboring policy so. countries here want to call part of the meeting in the western balkans want to cooperate because there is some kind of. in the end of the tunnel there's a light that the light is not very material i mean like you cannot feed of their

life you cannot deny them to live i mean given the what you talk about extraction state extraction i mean from the point of view of elite that's. just going back to my previous thought so you have to give them some kind of hope and then you will have them as somebody who will cooperate with you if you shut this down this channel down and say look we are not you are not going to be members in any foreseeable future but let's try to be neighbors i don't think this would really help the plans that european union has already itself because as i said one or 2 to argue the current. e.u. enlargement process is actually doing. some very thing itself so the interest that the european union has on the balkans is actually working on the long

run against european union now the reason i ask you that question was because while the prospect of enlargement in practical terms is very slim many european officials are still talking about this range and in very possessive terms for example the incoming president of the european commission their sole of one that i said just the other day that if the e.u. fails to offer a european perspective to the western balkans then others and she named china russia turkey and even saudi arabia will fill the gap do you think that you can still count on exclusivity or if you will monogamy on the head of the countries in this region i think is an unfair to ask for that no i think it is. but that's what i'm on no must go on wanted to express so we have to rethink the whole thing that i think that he didn't say anything more than that and this is very true if dupion union pulls itself out of this area or somebody else will come they'll get it

doesn't have to be either or why couldn't it be you know china's influence influence here helping to build a railroad russian influence or russian presence here helping to by the 3rd been a vital european influence here helping to strengthen the institutions i mean this is how you would normally think about international cooperation and yet when it comes to the western balkans it's either you belong to me or you belong to them i would say that the countries and peoples function as families so there is a european family there is about the within european families about the family they somehow feel some sort to say with your father your mother right there when there isn't a certain age when you can move out of your house and get married then to have your own children and well that's what i would always held. sort of my kids and my parents then the kids and pet as i don't know by that absolutely but it doesn't mean that you absolutely should be held hostage to them and you have no rights you engage with them i don't think that anybody is held hostage the brunt is that in

the western balkans we have a discussion on going discussion for 30 years whether we are europeans are not humble in serbia this is very very hard to debate and we are not able ourselves to decide these issues are we in russia believe that we are here i don't know about the other. firmly believe that we are predominantly european culture which doesn't preclude us from trading with the east in fact they have this could be an advantage of integrating both influences into international relations the theater from somebody else for another who will who is who will knock on your door and plunder and kill. your your compatibility is very very strong for example the fear of fresh air coming in knocking on your door venting into europe and the present a threat is very very very alive still a so the large one process maybe one of the most important components is

incorporate these countries which used to belong which were closer to russia in the past and have them now because you feel stronger in the families of more countries now the if you ask people in poland what you feel about this 99 percent will give you the clear answer if you ask people here in serbia about this you 1000 such a clear cut answer now speaking about this fear of somebody coming and plundering your house or killing a loved ones i'm sure it's a very salient fear in this region and i don't want to dwell on the crown's interview too much but i think it was remarkable in the in a sense of how often here for it's you sovereignty i counted 19 references now in this region in particular most of the conflicts in former yugoslavia started when people wanted to either expand or accomplish their suffering or to challenge somebody else's sovereignty given this new we rediscovered interest in sovereignty

within the european union what implications do you how do you think it has for the western balkans. when mccrone says some running to think what he has in mind is to think more about the interests of the european nations rather than the interests of the us and the western balkans i think is not still in the picture because as i said i think that he actually called for some kind of free thinking about the whole the whole model of european union not only about the only about the enlargement now this is the word serenity would mean we matter more we are not going to listen to what other people say other masters of our own just like that we decide who to be friends where you don't exist and this could mean the followings if the european union if the united states wants to get the conflict with russia we shouldn't allow that the this involves. incorporates us into this kind of conflict and the implication of these theory is by extension that if you won and the crown

specifically said that we should be able to be. not to be enemies with the enemies of our friends if you believe that on the european level it applies to the western balkans as well you cannot claim this region only to yourself and that leads me into i guess my final question. that people of the european union for many countries for many peoples here is not only democratic but it's also can all mc and as the e.u. economic clout in their region diminishes the cloud of many other powers be china turkey russia saudi arabia trailer any mention is on the rise as those powers are trying to invest in the balkans do you think the process of democratization is going to stall are they going to revert to more a very authoritarian is more do you think the social development will continue you know as barack obama like to repeat that you know they they are sure history i sure

hear things what the european union as i said a lot of you should understand firstly that with such a high level of state cop. sure in the western balkans that there won't be any kind of strong economy growth in the foreseeable future so i think that that's the that's a given right now. it's beautifully on integration doesn't provide stronger economic growth the more not the wealthier it's maybe as i said that some countries will turn to the east doesn't necessarily mean that they will become more autocratic it's may or may not i mean it's difficult to say because you know within the european integration process they become more of the cross that so you know maybe doesn't really have anything to do with whether they go east or west it seems that both sides are able to pull of a certain level of a caucus and hopefully they will also be able to encourage is that a level of democracy professor polish we have to live in there thank you very much for being with us thank you and persia here is to keep this conversation going and

i social media pages and hope to see same place same time here and of all the part . of. what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have it's crazy. let it be an arms race is spearing dramatic development only really i'm going to resist i don't see how that strategy will be successful very critical time to sit down and

talk. and planning another one and i was going to. huevos to assume because they could solve mukti if i. was in this way got to doubt so hard not to think of the mother disappeared this moment the work of the day i was and i'm going to start then if. this is the only thing that we do is music because everybody fights his way to. the floor and you can feel the fee on this bill frist woody allen you have all of the ability to put the payment on the roof but i see it is this is the fans that is a constant. cool.

yeah the belong to the suit in the middest the boots of doom. patrol monument you stuck in the middle of the screen because lucy disconnects he thought the. cargo former did the deal. which. donna suspects will and don's of the. message will. be like the infant daughter not you know be looking in on ya.

doc would call out carnival the still call much of the body. a new report by amnesty international accuses tech giants google and facebook while even human rights by employing the surveillance based business model. also this hour drugmaker purdue pharma faces renewed scrutiny after leaked documents revealed the extent of its effort to suppress negative stories about its widely prescribed opiate painkillers. and beijing vows counter measures after the u.s. congress passes a bill backing on protests. there watching our team for national coming to you live from the russian capital where it's just turned 6 pm welcome to the program. google and facebook biz.