hello and welcome to cross talk where all things considered i'm peter lavelle well it's finally begun the impeachment of donald trump the president and his supporters say the process is nothing more than a political witch the democrats and the liberal corporate media say trump is a national security threat and must be removed but in the end it would seem democracy itself is being impeached. cross talking impeachment i'm joined by my guest in washington she's a former g.o.p.

strategist as well as co-founder of women's public leadership network also in washington we have. he is a g.o.p. strategist and in monterey we crossed to spencer critchley he is a former communications adviser to obama for america 20082012 as well as managing partner of the communications consulting firm road group all right cross talk rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate i'm only going to go to you 1st in washington ok the whole process has started we've been waiting for 3 years because they've been planning to find a way to impeach the president and they finally got in there they've crossed the rubicon and the senate will pursue its proceedings but as i said in my introduction i'm i'm i'm i'm a politico i like politics i'm a political junkie i follow a lot of stuff ok i really can't get my hands around this one ok i get i don't know what the crime is ok i do know that there's a lot of animosity. in hatred towards as president 5 everyone can have has their

taste in their opinions here but the way i look at it is this whole process in is impeaching democracy itself i mean this is such a severe remedy particularly when we have an election a couple 100 days from now how do you react to this go ahead in washington. you know it's absolutely worth acknowledging that the democrats planned not since trump's actually inauguration but since he was elected in november of 2016 their goal was to make him a one term president so what we're seeing now from democrats it's really an extension of that you know the what we heard from nancy pelosi and democrats is that you know the president actually represented a existential threat to our democracy and so they carried out these impeachment hearings which ones are in articles of impeachment which interestingly enough none of them were actually criminal and the obstruction of congress charge i think people kind of confuse that obstruction of congress charge with an obstruction of

justice charge well that's not what happened and i think that it's probably you know what the unfortunate thing that for me is that when there is a democrat in the white house which is that will happen you know it didn't know if ands and buts about that but when there is a democrat in the white house the republicans are going to do the same thing that democrats are doing now with this president and i don't think that it's something that's ultimately good for our country when spencer would would you wait on that here because it is an extension of what we just heard here i mean it just ends up being a political tool not a remedy and i think that's the danger that we all face here and you know i'm a conservative and i thought the impeachment process again against clinton was wrong ok but it was for the wrong reasons and he's a immoral person yes but he didn't reach the stature of impeachment and i think it was wrong to do that to him in this case as we just heard there's no crime here and it seems to me this is just a political. match against the man the in the oval office that you just don't like

and i understand why people don't like donald trump how do you react to that spencer. i feel like it's a rhetorical shift that's being made not necessarily just by republicans because i don't really feel this is a partisan issue but certainly by pro trump people to say that this is a question of democrats just not liking president from what they don't like is the assault on democracy and of course they feel passionately about that as do you know many leading conservatives people like george will for example who. feel exactly the same way as so many democrats do. i hope if we have a democratic president in the future who behaves in the same way that president trump has i certainly hope they're impeached and i'll be at the head of the line demanding their impeachment just like we. just used a word or the havior used the word behavior is that impeachable is bad behavior

impeachable is that a crime had spencer in this case you know this in terms behavior the definition of what's and p. h. well so another rhetorical shift that's going on here among the pro term folks is to say but it's not a crime and of course that's not relevant it's like claiming you do you just don't like him no that's not the case here it's certainly there are many people who don't like him on the left and the right but of course i cannot grounds for impeachment. and it's the same here and this is just another one of these rhetorical shifts on fortunately his behavior is impeachable as it would if if. and madison were to arise from the grave and look at this they would say this is what we were talking about just the simple i mean confession on on paper and on camera so what he's going to do with ukraine is impeachable and there's a long list of things before them but i mean to choose ok well you know that's it that's a good point a long list and for that ok let me go to rain ok and that's exactly it here ok the stormy daniels thing didn't work out and then they had russia gate that didn't work

out now you have ukraine gate which isn't make any sense at all this is just an extension it's a continuum and it is about you hate this guy in the white house which is ghana is turning ugly fine ok but is that grounds for in pietschmann go ahead reign in washington. peter may think it may not make sense to you but the reality is this impeachment has always been a political process and people really need to see this for what it is this is democracy working we have 3 branches of government that share equal power and what they're doing right now is exercising that power and the president now that the impeachment articles have made their way to the senate the president can defend himself this trial is going to be democracy in action because we have representatives of the people essential able to be that impartial jury now i know that senator mitch mcconnell says he's not a part i'm going to reveal which are really sad if we didn't publish you acting on

american it's going to be impartial another vote on how is that ever going to be impartial not going to riddle me this 1st of all you already defined yourself by saying that you don't understand this ukraine situation do a little bit or reading understand it right now and i'm not i'm not i have banged on your letter a let me finish i've been to ukraine it doesn't times also i understand the language i understand the politics i understand the political figures let me finish my i actually. thought i saw that panel. talking about ukraine and none of them really knew what they were talking about whatsoever so don't lecture me or out of all right panel don't i mean america no one bar owner i'm going to entertain showing up here today we're very proud of the finish my day on every part well don't you know i didn't tell you let me get my point across go ahead yeah i'm going to insult your intelligence when you say it doesn't make sense that it's not the only thing an objective journalist need to be objective listen here's the reality

of an american president should not be asking a foreign government to look into their political rival that's un-american ok if you let me but i don't really care you wouldn't understand did this on the right and finish your point let's share time with everyone else on the panel here. in washington we don't really i mean the other is because the thing is we've all are you're saying well ok don't filibuster please ok go ahead and watch. i'm very good at that so let's yeah let's be clear on the ukraine situation here according to the ambassador all of the really all of the ambassadors and even our intelligence community the ukraine this situation that was happening in ukraine that was an actual that was an actual valid point of investigation that there everyone knows that there is and there were problems with and there have been problems with the resume over the years now the question is whether or not donald trump should have asked for that favor now we can make the assumption that of course in my opinion i actually think that whether joe biden was running for

president or not donald trump would have asked for that same investigation now if you're going to make the argument that well this is i don't i don't necessarily agree with the argument that this is really democracy in art and in action i think it's actually an attack on our democracy because of what we have if we get to the point where we decide to tack on if you wanted to the right we're going to decide if. well if we get to the point where we decide that the behavior of a president is a reason for impeachment because that's essentially what we're talking about here is the president's actions now people say well it really has nothing to do with whether or not you dislike the president this is really about saving our democracy well if that's the case then please explain to me why is it that every essentially everyone who is affiliated with donald trump whether it's his family whether it's a cabinet officials they've been attacked in public they've been attacked in public they've been attacked online and everyone says that this is just about well we're trying to save our democracy i actually disagree with that what we have we have 2 articles of impeachment that as we all acknowledge that are not criminal if we get

to the point where we say that you do not have to have committed a crime you can say something we don't like you can ask and in fact we can actually bring up the end up struction of congress charge which is about the president. agreeing with subpoenas sending over documents you know those are process arguments so the abstraction of congress charge which ironically is the very same thing that republicans could have leveled against barack obama when barack obama decided to not cooperate in the fast and furious investigation and with that fast and furious investigation he did not comply with congressional subpoenas and that went to court what democrats could have done they could have gone to court they chose not to do that because they said that donald trump was an ex that exists into a strip for an. essential threat and then they sat on it for what a month or so again that's kind of you know playing politics here spencer i mean at this point in time you know we don't have to get all get our hair on fire here i

mean it looks like you know that it's going to go to trial and. acquitted i mean so what's the whole point of the process if we know what the outcome is going to be go ahead in monterey. and really it comes down to just a question of constitutional duty nancy pelosi as everybody knows was extremely reluctant to go ahead with this despite many voices do you think i really love her to go ahead do you think their reluctance she asked the staff of the was she had to impose a great deal of discipline over her caucus to quiet some of the voices because she was so reluctant to do it again we have the rhetorical shift it's not a crime it's about behavior of course it's about behavior how can anything be inoffensive it doesn't involve some kind of behavior unless it's some one of the rare examples of speech that isn't allowed. and of course it's and teachable to solicit help from a foreign power to interfere in a u.s. election this is was at the top of the founders minds when they were discussing

impeachment they were most concerned as a brand new country that angle and would interfere with the government of the united states and they were concerned that other countries like france might do that even though france had been our ally during the revolution alliances are always shifting this is one of the core reasons we have impeachment is to protect our democracy from foreign interference and certainly to protect our democracy from a president acting like a king another of their top concerns by using the public resources for his personal benefit a good mental activity good job and i have to jump in here and say sorry added rock to jump in here we have to go to a hard break and after that hard break we'll continue our discussion on him pietschmann stay with.

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studies one magic bullet you could actually come up with something to talk about his baby by talking about ways we get access capital and capitalism cavil's important so we could actually have programs that actually help folks who want to do that but when you give everybody a $1000.00 i'm a poor person i'm going to consume that and then you're rich you're going to invest that equity the wealth disparity is going to grow because you're not using your money to do it going so you're literally buying more crazy things and then my landlord knowing that i got a $1000.00 you just go raise my writ so then you get your flesh and go all in there . welcome back to crossfire all things are considered i'm peter lavelle to do it to remind you we're discussing any pietschmann.

ok let's go back to reno in washington. the election is coming up here why go through all this process why don't you just ask the voters to decide what they want don't you think that would be a more democratic way of doing it go ahead. well it's going to come up anyway and i think this is this is what our founders wanted if it any point in time if anybody in an elected body such as the house of representatives has a problem with the president's actions with his behavior yes then we should be able to bring it up in the process should play out so it doesn't matter when the election is frankly it just matters more so that the house of representatives have voiced their concern and the democrats have the majority so of course those articles were voted on in and approved and now it's over the senate and listen here's the reality behavior matters it was the same thing with clinton it really gets under my skin when people are like what clinton did was not impeachable 1st of

all if we don't ask our presidents to act in a proper manner which is again do not engage foreign governments in our business i find that to be treasonous in a way and i mean that's defined different everybody and then also acting improperly sexually which is what clinton did i know that this is not make a lot of people happy this is the 3rd time in u.s. history we've done this nixon of course didn't count but we need to let the process play out this president needs to be on trial he said so a month ago he wants us to go to this that he wants witnesses in the senate what's so wrong with that nothing well ok. fine but you know why go through the process let me go go to molly q again you know i'm kind of dumbfounded why do you have to go through the process of you know what the outcome is going to be and how it's not going to affect governance afterwards ok i mean are these are the democrats going to look for another impeachable offense and just do it over and over and over again i mean it's seems to me that you have a very weak case in talk about election meddling i mean the democratic party the

d.n.c. was all over ukraine when it came to trump ok i mean you make it sound like it's a one way street everybody was doing it if you look at it that way go ahead. in washington so. to that question about why not wait until the election while they're not comfortable that the confident that they can actually win an election without that stain on the president's history the. speaker pelosi has it has said that you have many democrats who are now in effect they were cheering the fact that the president will now have an asterisk by by its name so let's not confuse let's not fool around and just act as if that this but the political part of this is not calculated democrats cannot win if they don't believe that they can actually take down they could have very well waited until the election again i go back to and i've asked many people this over and over again the obama administration obstructed congress period that's what they did they obstructed congress in the republican

party republicans did not decide then to file articles of impeachment against barack obama for ups truck being congress now are there implication in that mallinckrodt was shame on the republicans than ok but but it did not have i been talking about press that and it did not happen it did not happen and i have one all right that we have not meant to day at all one where we have not mentioned today and you have not heard it in weeks is quid pro quo that is where we started the whistleblower said that the trumpet minister ation would have engaged in a quid pro quo with the youth with the ukrainian president there that did not happen apparently because there is not and neither one of the articles of impeachment deals with the initial claim that this was a quid pro quo so now we've morphed this into protecting our democracy and other things and i do believe that all of this is really designed to take donald trump down because of a personal dislike of the president of the united states it has very little to do

with protecting our democracy it is about protecting attacking the president of the united states because you don't like it and there are valid reasons to dislike plenty of them plenty of them to dislike any of them absolutely but whether or not you should take our country through an impeachment is another story and i just v.t. mutely disagree with that you know spencer and we you know have the ass trick there . to his name it's a very interesting way of putting it but if you look at the polls it just galvanizes charmes base and recent polls are showing that independents which are very many independents in the united states they're not keen on this is well i mean we all agree impeachment is a political process is this good politics as you go into the election cycle go ahead in monterey i think ultimately the politics of course there are they always have to be considered and always will be considered but i think the politics have to take a distant 2nd by this point a constitutional duty so really politics one way or the other i just don't see how

there is any choice here if we are thinking about politics one lesson i think the democratic party could stand to learn is the value of simply being seen to the standing up for what you believe in instead of looking like your web side this way and that way by polls i also want to counter a few just outright incorrect assertions that have been made and remind people that there's a very big difference between an assertion and an argument that supported by facts and logic an assertion is just whatever we want to believe this is not just because people don't like donald trump and i agree there are endless reasons not to like him but it's because yes his behavior is clearly impeachable as far as the claim that other people have done the same thing with the claim that obama supposedly obstructed congress 1st of all if we go by there's a lot about ism standard then any behavior so loud as long as you can find some malefactor who's done it and say well he did it and so therefore your true argument when you're using the word about as an argument is i'm fine behavior i just want to be done by my guy and obama did not obstruct congress they released. untold

documents in the fast and furious scandal which turned so-called ground 0 which turned out to be nothing as did so many of those made up scandals you can look it up online see the results of the multiple investigations of fast and furious which completely collapsed and where attorney general holder disagreed it was attorney general holder who was at the center of that not president obama where the attorney general disagreed with their demands for some documents he thought it a legitimate way through the legal process he didn't simply deny the authority of congress that denial but congress has any oversight authority over the president rests on the assumption the president is essentially a minor and it is one of these attacks on democracy we're talking about we have a co-equal branches of government it's absolutely fundamental to the design if we don't we have a king and in america the whole point is we don't have a king ok you know arena they're talking about democracy here i mean i was watching

the last democratic debate and i was watching bernie and i'm just wondering if his primary is going to be stolen from him again i mean you you prize democracy so much but within the democratic party they don't have it is a very high priority if we look what happened in 2016 and if you look at the the the antics of c.n.n. i mean that was just absolutely atrocious their behavior in dealing with and i'm a conservative i'm defending bernie because you know he's out there peddling his ideas good for him that's what we need to do we need ideas i mean is the democratic party so wedded what democracy then i mean they really don't want to come to terms what happened in 2016 and that's why they want to impeach trump because they miscalculated and this guy got in the white house and they could never forgive that that's what this is all about go ahead. you know it's not surprising that you say that you're defending bernie i have the mag of folks that i've hung around with

that love bernie why because these are 2 extremes are strong over here there's bernie over here it's no surprise that both the trump and bernie camps always scream that everybody's being unfair to them that the system is rigged it's real that how our country is so polarized these days and people are so quick to rush to the fringes people do not want to look at things and say let me take off my partisan glasses for a moment you know i mean my career in the republican party and i'm ashamed to say affiliate with this party today because the thing is that the mob rule seems to make its way on both sides and make a you know basically games with both sides republicans but i don't think they're going to want to hold the others i'd say all the time decided preachment make this worse the supplier's nation. you know what i don't think so because there's some polling out there right now that the shows and there has been for many months it shows the country is really split now do i really believe all the polls not quite because 2016 taught is that lesson it's really hard to capture the sentiment in

various demographics these david but the reality is this is that impeachment has to play out and it's incumbent upon a pair of americans to look at things and say you know what look at the democrats right now they're very fractured does nancy pelosi really think they can win in november with such a fractured party with so many people during their hats in the primary i think they're not serving themselves well and similarly i don't think republicans whether they're on capitol hill or living out in the heartland of america serve themselves well when they say we should have witnesses at this senate trial i mean there's a resurfaced video nowadays playing on loop on twitter of center collins and senator graham talking about how we need witnesses back when president clinton was on trial so i just hope that most americans start to do this educate themselves on the issues vote for the candidates are not vote for the party because the ideal voter in a democracy right votes on the issues not along party lines ok. again and let me go to. washington and i can't get away from the point that this is all about one

person and has nothing to do with ideas and ideals ok it's called revenge and it's blind hatred and that's what it looks like you watch the media that's exactly what it is go ahead in washington. it's absolutely what it is and how bring up the point that i made earlier when people make the argument that somehow this is just protecting our democracy or we're you know this really about policies when secretary divorce was booed at but the when university her very 1st year in office that was about donald trump it wasn't necessarily about you the secretary it was about donald trump when you see all of these politicians all of the members of the cabinet you see you know senators who are pretty much accosted harassed in public this is about donald trump and i just want to correct something on the point that i made about the obstruction of congress charge with well actually it wasn't a charge but the obstruction of congress with barack obama with the fast and furious case absolutely right that case went to court and it wasn't until after the

court ruled that the obama administration had to turn those documents over from the justice of from the department of justice is that's when they did that so i want to push back on this notion that somehow that it's not the same thing because in this way you say i wouldn't write about anything to clean stop what the what about is then what what what about what what what about his or her matter what about it's are good and it's well over what about israel and does that matter now i'm sorry but what about ism if if if if what about isms did not matter or you would not have mentioned the tapes of politicians in the ninety's making a separate different argument than what they make now so what about arguments matter when it benefits your politics ok he's done so there and i think that there's a lot of things you're going to dramatically that's the reason they're really talking you're out and they're you know what about it telling it i don't care and. ok we're. going to can sankyo we're ok because what i did i did ok we're going to find we're not getting good guys don't let me down i don't want to know what about is ok all right we've run we've chewed up all the time you know it's all the time

we have you many thanks my guest in washington and in monterey and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at our d.c. you next time remember rules. on a space flight you literally leave all your problems behind you fly high and above everyone and everything and then you see any and all borderlines on earth disappear you see that up planet is not as we are taught in schools with different countries marked in different colors separate from one another you see that our planet earth is just another albeit bigger international space station on a mission in the vastness of space just like the i assess. you know world of big partisan movies

a lot and conspiracy it's time to wake up to dig deeper to hit the stories that mainstream media refuses to tell more than ever we need to be smart we need to stop slamming the door on the back and shouting past each other it's time for critical thinking it's time to fight for the middle for the truth the time is now for watching closely watching the hawks. are no offense but you no longer a young woman in fact you are one of the last living survivors of the nazi ellis asked i'm aware of that. leverage at. all you know.

you can never forget america now auschwitz was really like to be inhaled because you would never believe it was a human can doto as a hobby of course for 33 years i'm open to the contrary of it it all seems so a lot offered by your side to make it feel right when i get out on the farm saw you don't want to take my songs there. next so he can listen and hopefully he bless heard screams. that's.

part of marks the 75th anniversary of the soviet union's liberation of warsaw for nothing germany as the polish government continues to question the role of the red army we hear from eyewitness t.v. about. we were liberated by the soviet soldiers outside the town of flipboard. then i spent 2 months in the soviet hospital there i find that the warsaw had been free. all for this hour and u.k. police for years knew but ignored the most profound sexual abuse by pedophiles and their homes and the planet new report revealed we talked to a former detective who took part in the initial investigation. that promoted being .