tragic footage is emerging from the syrian town of morag on new money after its liberation from terrorists even asco list of museum has been destroyed syrian army found after recapturing the area in the province last week most of the artifacts have been successfully recovered. and police have fired tear gas at anti-government protesters throwing rocks setting tires on fire and blocking roads in the colombian capital activists have been on the streets since november they oppose tax and pension reform and demand an end to the killings of rights activists protesters also want a peace deal with the country's rebel movement. that's a global news update for this hour but don't forget you can always had to our website r.t. dot com for the details on all of those stories and many more. i'm

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a low and welcome to cross talk we're all things considered i'm peter lavelle but 2020 presidential campaign is beginning to look a lot like the 2016 race but this time around the insurgent is bernie sanders who is not even a member of the democratic party voters again are not interested in establishment politicians in fact they appear to be rebelling against them will we see a trump sanders showdown. crosstalk in the 2020 alexion i'm joined by my guest lee camp in washington he is the host and head writer of the comedy new show redacted tonight on our team america as well as author of the new book bullet points and punch lines in milwaukee we have jennifer to master she is a an attorney and policy analyst and in syracuse we crossed through how we hawkins

he is a candidate for the green party nomination for u.s. president or across the proles in effect that means he can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate you like my and now it's. this year 2016 we had an insurgent in the g.o.p. . vanquished all of them in beat got the nomination and won now we have bernie which in my opinion it was stolen from in 2016 will he prevail in 2020 because from c.n.n. m.s.m. b.c. in the democrat the d.n.c. and everybody else is against him again and small donors keep giving him money so what's in the cards for bernie this time around go ahead lee. yeah you're absolutely right i mean it is shaping up a lot like 2016 especially on the democratic side just fill in joe biden instead of hillary clinton and everything that we were horrified to see in the last election when the democratic side is shaping up exactly the same they've changed nothing all

they did with push the superdelegates to the 2nd vote in the convention but if they can have a brokered convention all those superdelegates all those elite democrats will then put in their candidate tom prez just announced who he'd like to see running the convention and it is all the same neo liberal and wall street goons that have been there it is it is bringing the cockroaches out again to fill the convention i mean the media is using the same tricks against bernie sanders but the difference now is that bernie sanders has a large impressive machine set up to deal with this more so than he did last time he's got the most donors the largest audiences coming out and it'll be interesting to see whether they can steal it and they being the corporate democrats steal it from him yet again as they did last time it's interesting jennifer let me go to you in milwaukee i mean you know i'm everybody knows who watches this program i'm a conservative here but i'm really interested in process here and i look at the democratic party and every single barrier they put up against bernie and not that i'm rooting for bernie i'm more i'm rooting for fairness fairness that's all

because i think it would be a very interesting showdown between these 2 guys sanderson trump here why is he so appealing in my writing my introduction is that there's a rejection of the establishment go ahead absolutely you're right and that's one of the biggest the biggest downfalls i think that the democratic establishment has seen in the establishment in general i mean republican and democrat that's what helped trump win that's what's giving bernie so much support now and even if you want to say that bernie is the into this is them trump in many ways he's not they're very similar in the fact that they're trying to go up against the establishment they speak out against the establishment and a lot of what's been exposed. even against donald trump is the same stuff that tried to dismantle bernie sanders in 2016 so people are starting to see that and donald trump himself has been calling out the d.n.c. propaganda push against bernie sanders he's donald trump himself has been doing that he's noting that so even people that might. but are still listening to him

that might be wanting to vote democrat are starting to give sanders a 2nd look now but that is what america is desperate for to see the dismantling of the establishment that's been in washington you know that's a very good point howie. i was told by my producers that you don't really believe that bertie sanders was a socialist could you explain what you mean by that. yeah the traditional definition of socialism is economic democracy to social order shipped all the major means of production in bernie's more in the tradition of which you call social democracy in europe or new deal liberalism in the united states where you don't. take over the big corporations and have the workers and consumers running or you tax them to fund your social programs the problems with that for a socialist like me is that you leave concentrated economic power in place and it translates into concentrated political power and so they can undermine those social

programs and we've seen that as social democracy in europe and new deal liberalism in the united states is transformed into social liberalism which means you are against discrimination on the basis of race and gender and so forth what you have is new liberal economic policy which creates growing economic inequality so it's unstable from our point of view ok so that you know ok we'll get into the identity politics in the 2nd part of the program the thing that's very very important i think it's could be used against bernie already has only let me go back to you what is the appeal here because of course you know that the g.o.p. and the right will always say socialism it never work again it's fine i've heard it all my life ok and it's not actually a very interesting conversation in my opinion what i think isn't interesting is why people are attracted to it because i think that you know we have the greatest economy in the world well maybe by macro indicators yes but i think a lot i've come across a lot of people that don't feel it's

a good economy for them ok instead of these macro numbers wipe are people attracted to bernie explain it. yeah i mean well how is right this is of bernie's not doing it not speaking for anything other than what say sweden has which is not socialism it's a form of capitalism that had a there are social programs but you don't you don't hear a lot of people talking about of the military is our military is the largest socialism entity in the world i mean it is taxpayer dollars funding something so you know and what does that tell you a question what is the appeal of bernie sanders he's talking about all the millions across this country that are destroyed by our health care costs that are there that are living in poverty we have 4050000000 people in poverty while 3 people have the same amount of wealth as the bottom 50 percent of the country it's incredibly unsustainable it's incredibly unequal and it cannot go on like this so i think the appeal of bernie is it's very obvious people across this country are suffering in the corporate democrats do not offer anything they agree with the republicans on

8090 percent of everything or issues of this country so it's very clear why people would stand up and fight for something different that actually gives them something to live for it's a very good point let me go back to jennifer in milwaukee one of the things you know again looking at the campaigns ok not necessarily policy will go become back to that later but it seems to me that there are 2 authentic candidates and all of this trump and sanders they are authentic they've been saying more or less the same thing for a very very long time you have biden and warren who complete frauds ok i mean elizabeth warren was a republican when she was 47 percent maybe she was an indian at the time i don't know but you know there is this this issue of authenticity and i think that is very attractive to people too and it's they have it's trump and bernie sanders go ahead jennifer. absolutely and i think you know what we're talking about is the same

demographic the same base that is perhaps supporting byrd and sanders these are the younger generations those who want to see more help more government funding but really who are a fair afraid and fearful of struggling economically it's very similar to the demographics supporting trump those in middle america who have been forgotten those right here in wisconsin i mean a lot of those people are the same ones in fact at the trump rally that was just in milwaukee most of the supporters out there most of the protesters out there with all of the trump supporters are also burning supporters was it was a fairly peaceful process here wisconsin but you're seeing a lot of the same similarities and supporters and i think that's what's going to need to be the distinction and the distinguishing mark between trump and sanders if sanders becomes the nominee against all odds is that is to show you know how are you any different you both want a dismantle these dallas men and frankly even if he is conservative even if he is republican trump has been doing better things for middle america for the middle to lower class of the middle class and for african-americans for minorities and so i

think people are starting to see that in sanders is going to have to show either a distinction or how perhaps they can work together despite what happens or if he can continue to enhance some of these policies that really have helped well what america what what it comes up by the standards everyone knows there are frauds i mean the thing they have to do and i would say they're authentic and they're both outsiders i think that's probably the only thing in here. i think you know one of the things i've been fascinated with over the past few years is the political spectrum in the political the way we talk about politics because i would say that trump and bernie sanders are both populists in their own way and i think it is a rejection of the establishment both in different ways go ahead. well i think that's right and i think the only thing that i think we haven't ever says enough is bernie's program is very popular with the people we mention health care but he's also today's got a speech out about inane our endless wars in the subtitle is you know list stuff

given the terrorist what they want and i think that is very popular in the climate issue i mean i'd like to see trump cause it's a hoax but the democrats actors if it's a hoax except for bernie sanders is green new deal program is serious and i'm somebody who's been campaigning for this i 1st campaign in 2010 running for governor in new york or a green deal 1st candidate in this country to do so and you know bernie serious i think is a little slow we got some quibbles on what to do well that and the climate movement knows that bernie sanders is the serious candidate among the democrats so i think dex is appeal and i know bernie since the early 1970 s. when he actually was a 3rd party candidate and i've watched him nuber mine and he's popular even with conservatives yes because they feel like he's for the people he shows up at town

all the answers are questions and so for them socialist is like some people are catholic some people are baptist some people have got that is earl is a socialist made how you know how i think you know they were i think it's very and i think it's a interesting way you just said to me i'm a conservative but i like listening to bernie sanders because 1st of all he knows what he's talking about you can have an interaction with him he actually comes up with some answers that i don't always agree with actually very rarely agree with but again it's kind of this authenticity here i was a 30 seconds lead let me go to you before going to why doesn't bernie fight back because that's what republicans like about trump 25 seconds go ahead. well i think he is fighting back in his own way but do you agree he's not fighting back about the way the system is rigged the way the d.n.c. rigs the primaries and they told him last time they made it very clear that if you are going to run we will not accept you claiming that this is not a legitimate election and they stopped him from ever doing that again. ok well then

you know again i think it could be to his advantage to maneuver his campaign away from these people that are just really have a road record of failure and indifference to the voter ok i'm going to jump in here we go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion of the 20000 elections stay with us. but we don't want to tell the windswept empty with an access and the monument we want to kind of. the streets filled with events with the with this in a space that has come from santas maybe i love going to conferences and debates and such events like the battle of ideas and the bobby confronts these are the kind of things this is just riding on gives us an impala making connections with people to set up projects.

welcome back to cross talk where all things are considered i'm peter lavelle term and we're discussing the 2020 election. ok let's go back to jennifer in milwaukee one thing that in trump's favor this time around is that you know he's he's indifferent to identity politics and most of his backers feel the same way i have to say i feel the same way as well here but it's not playing out the same way in the democrat democratic party when elizabeth warren did that despicable thing in conjunction with c.n.n. trying to accuse bernie is being a massage and it's a sexist and all the usual litany of things that you hear that don't add to the conversation. always identity politics in your opinion looking at centers how are

they going to keep are they going to keep throwing barriers in front of him digging up video from the 1970 s. and stuff like that i mean it gets really tiresome doesn't it would you rather talk about policy but they don't because they have nothing to talk about go ahead jennifer absolutely and i of 100 percent agree with you that's been the main problem with the democrats and i think there are a lot of people that's why this walkaway movement has come so big because of the d.n.c. because of the democratic establishment and their desire and intent to only run on identity politics they accuse you of being racist zina phobic against women everything that you can imagine in the book they will throw titles at people rather than actually argue in the issues legitimately and i mean it even catches people idjit honest authentic people like bernie sanders off guard when he can be what he could be cut out by elizabeth warren after on hot mike you know accusing him i think you just called me a liar on national t.v. she knew they would probably be she knew there would be people listening but you do

these things to get these clips to paint sanders as a kind of massaging as against all women so they can only run on identity politics and when you have authentic people that are trying to run on the same democratic platform even if that's not what they've always stood for but they have to because that's the way the bipartisan thing in america works either democrat or republican will when bernie has to play that game and they're going to come out of with a full force because they can't beat him on the policies they can't meet him on the populous vote they can't beat him on all of that so they're going to beat him on identity politics but keep in mind this is also a democratic primary where we now have what however many 15 to 16 white candidates and all the other minority candidates are going out rapidly so i mean it's just the hippocratic party that doesn't care about the policies and can argue for all the talk of diversity that you got joe still i mean i didn't is i mean it's laughable ok but they keep pounding away at it and they did joe. what it is you know you're a pin. and because it's if it goes on that it's

a repeat kind of out of what i said in the 1st part of the program as a conservative i actually like listening to bernie i like listening to interviews with him i'm interested in his ideas i'm always interested in how he wants to pay for things and i'm really glad that you brought up the issue about these endless wasteful dangerous wars here they did a telsey gabbert i mean god bless her soul for speaking the truth i mean accusing her of being treasonous ok you see that same thing going to be played out against bernie because he's doing really well and i think that over the next few weeks if he continues this way he will find himself in a position to get the nomination even if it's in a brokered convention go ahead howie yeah no doubt just like they weaponize identity politics you know the elizabeth warren ploy it was not about fighting. discrimination against women or massage any it was about getting bernie sanders that it really wasn't about you can't have working class unity unless you deal with those problems so identity politics has its place but it's

a way of getting rid of the discrimination in exclusion and you know bringing people together that's legitimate but when it's weapon as now then it divides us on the other side we've got trump i mean he's either identity politics he's white identity politics going minorities immigrants muslims and so forth so that is how he weaponize his identity politics in in the same thing will happen on a foreign policy question are there weaponize. any criticism of u.s. foreign policy we have this global military empire they don't have bases around the world we're actively involved in at least 7 wars special operations is over the place and you criticize that in a call you a russian asset that happened to our previous green party presidential candidate jill stein recently. you were replying when she without naming her went out to tulsa gabbert also went after. our candidate just starring in without any evidence

that the russians and republicans are grew into a 3rd party candidate so actually it could be called a russian exit yeah so it's oh it's ok how we because these people don't deal in the world of facts i do ok. what is the fascination with joe biden i mean he bernie standards on the face of it i mean the the small donations he gets he's not reliant on the d.n.c. i mean what is it which was wrong with these people do you want to win or not because sometimes and i've said this before on my program it's i get the feeling they just abolition democrats would prefer to lose to trump than have bernie win go ahead lee yeah i think you're absolutely right they would they prefer trump to win because trump at the end of the day still represents corporate america and wall street i mean he claims i mean this is one point i disagree with you on that he's authentic i think he is more of a populist and he will call out the system on like your average republican but in

terms of being authentic he claims he's going to help the working man and then he gives a giant tax cut to the wealthiest americans and he claims he put out an ad in his last campaign about how bankers rule the system then he surrounded himself with bankers you've got goldman sachs running the treasury so i don't think that's authentic but you're absolutely right that they would rather lose to trump because he has not gone at wall street really he has not really bended corporate america where as bernie says he would he says he would change that system and 1 make it more about the average person rather than just a giant extraction process that extracts all of the wealth to a tiny number of individuals in this country and so i think you're absolutely right they would rather joe biden lose to donald trump than bernie sanders when you know jennifer i want to kind of clarify what i meant by authentic i'm going to stick with it and the clarification is because i'm actually agreeing with lead to some extent here. trump is authentic because he you he talks to people that eat people

understand him his base understands him he speaks in a binocular binocular that they get now you know you get these like don lemon some people like that will say everything is races everything is massage i'm from the midwest i grew up in the midwest ok and i listen to trump and i'll kind of snicker like lots of bit of an exaggeration i think you got the date wrong there but i get what you mean i get what you mean and that's what people like about him ok you know he would be good the electorate choirboy ok everybody knows that ok i mean that that's his greatest advantage i mean he says things that i just. really grange but then again i know who he is you see what i mean to exactly exactly and i think that's what the american people were desperate for after 8 years of brock obama i.e. the guy who can talk for 35 minutes and you have no idea if he made a single point the american people were desperate for somebody that they could

actually understand as to how his point on being called russian asked that i got to say and i'll i'll promise you this after the moeller investigation i think america is pretty much done with hillary clinton calling people russian assets if you spend that much money and actually find no evidence of collusion so you're going to be just fine we'll make sure of that but but all of this i think american people have been desperate for somebody to talk straight to then for a lot of the establishment to go out i mean there were reports that came out that when barack obama was in office he got rid of all the white house press and only had his own inner team so a lot of people were confused they felt the transparency in america was completely decimated and as you said the the midwest the most people in the middle class a lot of these people just felt totally left out of these big d.c. politics and political games and have gotten tired of poverty there's pockets see on every side all the time and i think that's one of the main concerns even if you bring up i myself yes i'm conservative yes i. or i approve of policies what he's

done but at the same time i do also love listening to bernie sanders i appreciate the sanders a lot of his points but one of the things that people i think still get concerned about is the fact that he does say that he's anti-establishment but then even socialist democratic parties or even the sweden model which is good is still going in a way that's going to get a lot of taxpayer money to the current establishment that hasn't yet been dismantled and that is what the american people want to see they want to make sure trump says he's doing it we're trying we're starting to see some changes being announced within the f.b.i. the d.o.j. but we don't know with what's going on in congress right now whether that establishment we trust that even if we trust bernie sanders plan jennifer i wonder if adam shift even knows the moeller report came out watching this but snippets of the impeachment trial that i did watch ok i have actually a life and a job i don't need to waste my time on that how we how is politics changing how is bernie sanders changing the tone if it all ok because this is his you know 2nd bite

at the apple i watched very carefully 2000 and see trump and founders were the only 2 people i watched and i'm doing it again how is bernie changing or not changing the political barometer go ahead. well i think because he's getting so much support he's bringing attention to the policies he's advocating and changing it from you know of the sort of nice and personal attacks in the horse race to the real issues yeah you know i think that's why he's getting support and despite all the things that the establishment in the democratic party can do you know the carcass counting the hand counts or the voting machines or how the convention is set up he can overwhelm that you know like trump overwhelm the steps and on the republican side to go to several you know less say they're going to have to overwhelm the barriers . and so i think that's given

a lot of people oh ok well you know how if you listen again listen to adam schiff they get it that the vote is too dangerous to give to citizens it's simply too dangerous here let me let me go to leave here we hypothetical. what if the d.n.c. denies bernie sanders again what will happen to the democratic party go ahead. well i think people need to start talking and planning for that and be prepared to to stand up and demand their votes be heard there are just so many blocks to getting a legitimate election and i went through them all in 2016 day after day that the 200000 people purged in brooklyn that was admitted to in court the d.n.c. also admitted in court a year afterwards that they are allowed to rig the primaries however they see fit and so i think the people of america one chains of one something different they don't want these endless wars and this endless corporate exploitation i think they need to plan for for how they are going to deal with this system you know if this

is stolen in the same way it was in 2016 and they need to be ready to protest and get active and demanded that they get a legitimate vote because you know i large harvard studies show that the u.s. has the least a legitimate election system in the western world i mean we are not a democracy we're not a democratic republic we're an oligarchy and people hopefully will wake up to their well some point hopefully as these things are the most important thing in these troubled times the most important thing is to have the vote and people need to use that many thanks and i guess in washington milwaukee and in syracuse and thanks to our viewers for watching us here darkie see you next time and remember crosstalk rules.

dream agreed to pretty. old must remember that it was most of the family were unemployed. oh that wasn't it was bit you know much worse objectively. but there was an expectation of the things were going to get better. there was a real sense of hope. there isn't today today's america where shaped by the turn principles of concentration of wealth and power. reduced democracy

attack solo duo engineer election manufacture consent and other principles according to. one set of rules for the rich opposite. that's what happens when you put her into the. roof. is dedicated to encouraging her to just as you'd expect one of the most influential intellectuals of our time speaks about the modern civilization of america. the plastic is a promise in the food supply in the oceans we keep plastic and i'm a slave plastic in the human body is going to kill you sound life expectancy is down and banning plastic is not going to change the equation one iota right because it's just too far gone so should we care or just the siddur that humans had

a great ride while we did then shuffle off our mortal coil and that he owes. the waves but by now britain gears up this. well off into the murky waters on its coast bright side voyage will appear i cannot mix storms and i'm doing mutiny from both startling and northern ireland. also this hour as fears over the run of virus outbreak grow people around the globe reported in the increased stigma and discrimination against chinese people. and it's a race against time to save a one year old baby's life as his parents try to raise the $2400000.00 price tag for the world's most expensive medicine.