hello and welcome to cross talk where all things considered i'm peter lavelle the world is struggling in different ways to cope with the kobe dying thousands pandemic and governments are taking the heat for their actions and inactions well the coronavirus be a referendum on globalization. across talking some real news i'm joined by my guest here in moscow dimitri bobbitt he's a political analyst and editor in a semi internet media project and in london we cross to marcus papadopoulos he is

editor of politics 1st magazine article in crosstalk rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i was a preacher let me go to markets 1st in london as this pandemic continues and there is no end in sight different countries are experiencing different levels of this pandemic and there's been pointed out by the media and by people around the world what actions work and what don't work but there's a much broader discussion that needs to be taken in that it's the nature of globalization and how globalization has allowed a pandemic like this to spread become a pandemic itself here and when i say globalization i'm talking about the nature of trade borders the very nature of the nation state and even talking about sovereignty again which is for bowden on both sides of the spectrum but it's something that has to be talked about because at the end of the day the nation state is required to take care of its own citizens your reflection there go ahead marcus. indeed that's one of the consequences of the emergence of the coronavirus

as beings who shine a light on the dangers olf globalization and that is something of course battle western media principly american major and british major is not going to discuss because globalization is a very day dissonant and at the same time the coronavirus as demonstrates it the importance of borders of security all nation states and incidentally in britain and america the worst. along with the worst coach are and religion are regarded as dirty words which is not just idiocy but it is absolutely laughable now will the coronavirus results in the downfall of globalization in the downfall of the new world order which is being in existence since the end of the soviet union and the soviet communism i believe not why

firstly because a shim in because there is an assumption that the ordinary man or woman in the west principally britain and america has made the connection between the emergence olf and the spread of the coronavirus and globalization and in the in the case of the european union without without borders so that is a dangerous assumption the 2nd reason why i do not believe it will be so silly ends of globalization is that there is no alternative to globalization ever since the end of soviet communism capitalism has a math test itself that has evolved in itself today to corporate capsule ism and one of the mentions of corporate capitalism is of course globalization so there is no alternative in the well i know but a bit of if that's it. very interesting comment de mint i mean i i i'm i'm not

suggesting that globalization is going to go away because of the corona virus i'm not saying that what i'm saying is taking on board what mark has just said is that we have to take note of its weaknesses and how it needs to be adjusted i don't think we can turn the clock back 40 years but at the same time this this horrible event that is affecting the world on a scale that is only increasing and we're going to in later in this week on this program we're going to talk about the economic consequences of it but it does beg the question is it really working that well and what needs to be adjusted so we can we can avoid such a pandemic because it will be other pandemics this is a test case and how to leverage what we have now and what needs to be done in the future go ahead while i agree with a marker of. the nature of northern cape that is an easy expansion expansionary to not only territory for example a lot of people blame for their coronavirus they had been so they cheney's but

didn't we hear from the western experts that we should consume insects we should change our food patterns you know we should expand and expand you know their sphere where humans interfere with nature basically it's becoming more or less clear that they survived was a result of human interference in nature it did not it was not produced by nature itself so we see how the system is fragile because not all only. is it effected by destruction you know the story in the spread the story but you know expansion is already a good tragedy and all people losing money in history is still the system is vulnerable to go back to markets like i guess maybe to fine tune my comment introductory comments that is is that we have glow. it was ation and that is a that's a very broad brush but i think kind of demons kind of teasing

a little bit of what i'm talking about here i mean this is a corporatization globalization because when countries have to react to this pandemic they they they have all of them have a different tool box and they're not necessarily connected and the end we've seen today that the the inability to contain it i mean globalization in a very broad sense would have to seem to suggest that but we don't have that because it's more of a corporate driven globalization go ahead marcus or let me let me make a case in point look at russia russia has borders and leader asleep dispended its board says look at the decisive steps for us it's to confront and conceal the corona virus once once its threats from china straight away the russian authorities took the responsible decision and loose the

slaughter and if the european union and it's written that britain is out of the e.u. you know how the borders if they had totally secure and defended borders then maybe maybe there would not be the situation that there is today it's for example it's early and germany and britain were guarding the coronavirus so i believe that the russian authorities are demonstrating the absolute necessity or have always markets let me get let me ask you a question then so you're telling me and i'm extrapolating from what you just said is that western elites and their vision of globalisation their ideology trumps public safety is that what you're telling me. oh absolutely well good that's what i'm thinking as well resolutely expand on that it's us who has been one of the beneficiaries or the corona virus western media because western media should have created. an atmosphere of awareness and calm about the crew and if i

was they should have told the british public the american public that a news virus has the most it is potentially so it's all it could become and dammit you must remain calm and you must put it into perspective because year in year out for well over 100 years now the world has been livin with a pandemic in the school or influenza that would have been the actions of a response major but the last british mainstream media and the american mainstream media did not do that they deliberately creates it and say a claim didn't yap enflamed it and what has happened in britain for example the sale of newspapers has increased the amount of clicks on newspaper websites that are advertised since so it is and it has let me go to demean yourself so. exactly for doing so even though even the business model for media for media trumps

public safety ok we could go on and on and on go ahead well i can just give you an example the heel an american publication they published an article us plane term or keep big chill russian disinformation of coronavirus so russia did liberally misinformed the us public about coronavirus would are not calling itself is of misinformation well the article called assistant secretary of state for europe and you're a sheffield precursor seign rushes in to intent is to saw discord and undermine us institutions and the winds us from within including through covered and courtesy of a line in for. and campaign by spray disinformation about corona virus russian maligned. vine is a gauge that one example cited in the article that you could find of misinformation as usual with a side report which is classified the public cannot cede they are not providing

any evidence of any fact but that's not an individual case that's not a separate case in europe spiegel magazine they published an article headlined when coronavirus need sporter got a crisis but it got me a supporter in and out of that so the cuellar sportin and that are gone or weaponized and made gratian you know all driving coddled macias to europe it immediately it reminded me of an headline in their corner missed a few years ago and that their hard old monsters in and now you're speaking of sas it's put in and out of the same get all of the water but there's really no market so if you've been listening to that i mean there is no self reflection of the malign foreign intervention into arab lands muslim countries they created these migration waves in the 1st place this is just how my optic western media is that their countries create these problems their media blames the these problems on

a 3rd party that wasn't involved in the 1st place i mean it is so circular so sad satisfying and again a business model that praises ideology over the public welfare of people go ahead marcus. absolutely the world is the emergence of a new virus it can be followed so it could become. what we have. since the beginning of 2020. 1000000 americans. in a few years ago in britain in the person sense since 2008. 1000 british people die from the sleuth so we have to be. aware about the drug it's all a risk we have to teach you basic hygiene i hate if for example washing your hands really often solet when you come back from the shops or football phone a restaurant but i haven't lost go into let's british mainstream media which is

tough and logical outfits create c.-a it's also based on the people who claim that saddam hussein has weapons of mass destruction they say the people who claim to mass murder i think he makes it also and in libya and in kosovo they all compulsive lies and they do it deliberately in order to achieve a financial win so themselves they are despicable creatures yeah and we you know i did biggest loser is we in this segment here is public confidence in the end in the media itself it again it's a circular vicious circle here markets popping up all of us thank you for joining us on line and we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion on some real news stay with arcane. the world is driven by.

dares thinks. we dare to ask. for the super bowl. and news media to make sure that you. feel and i mean the city's full wolf with. no i don't i do. but i will. assure you i mean you know.

welcome back across top where all things considered i'm peter about to mind you

we're discussing real news. now to nicosia where we're joined by alex christopher he's the director and writer for the duran dot com welcome to the pros program alex. we see how in the 1st part of the program which i know that you listen to when we had markets papadopoulos we talked about the globalization in the pandemic and how we have to reassess globalization at least we should in my opinion but let's bring it a little bit closer to the u.s. domestic politics here donald trump up for reelection the democrats have anointed their all but anointed their nominee joe biden. and it looks like to me that the democrats and their pliant media are going to make this entire election go past the going to the conventions and to the general in november as a referendum on trump's handling of the corona coronavirus is not a good play on their part because and to be honest here trump has not presented his

best face when it comes to talking about how his administration is dealing with this pandemic he's good at rallies it's not good with the teleprompter alex and the . yeah i agree with that i think that the trump administration started very very slow to handle this and the big sign was with the testing there was just a lack of testing kits and people aren't getting tested now i think they've got everything ramping up now and a little bit more into control that wednesday oval office teleprompter speech to the american public if you peter was absolutely awful that was terrible in the markets reacted and the people reacted i think we saw a lot of panic because that environment for trump is not beneficial to trump trump needs to interact with people he is not good at talking in front of a machine trump wants interaction even negative interaction even the press going adam is where he thrives so i think that latest press conference he gave at the

white house with the media there with his team behind him i think we saw a much more confident and a much more secure trump and we saw a little bit more leadership and we saw trump in an environment that suits him i think he needs to stay away from the oval office period as this crisis unfolds interact with people speak with people have some give and take with the press answer their questions push back and i think people will start to feel a little more secure and they'll be a little less panicked because the united states in the world now needs to see some leadership and god knows we're not going to get it in europe that's for sure so the only leader that i can think of right now in the western world is trouble and i think he really needs to deliver on this he started out very very poorly but hopefully after that press conference in the white house things will start to get under control that well i hope you know you have to see this unfold yeah i mean and

of course the i mean i think we'll all of us have to step back i mean they're watching american media there unfortunately there's so many people that want to score points and not really address the real issue and it's a pandemic ok and then. why it's very frustrating watching american media because it's all about politics for them it's not about people as usual ok that's why i got elected in the 1st place you know. the media's presentation of it just from what we just heard from alex and when we heard from marcus in the 1st part of the program here they're doing a huge disservice to the public because they're they have weapon dies this issue in a way that is to their own benefit that serves their own ideological interests and it's not addressing the real problem but one of the real problems is here is the patchwork of american medicine ok there is no national medicine and in it's basically individual corporations so no wonder it's very difficult for this

administration because they have to talk not to officials in the administration but officials in the administration that are talking to the corporate world they're not all on the same page and they all in the corporate world will never move away from their bottom line that's one of the difficulties alex brought up the lack of testing that's that's from a corporate point of view go ahead well again just a few facts weeks before they spend them extent that. asked for $740000000000.00 for what you know we read the newspapers the primary targets are russia and china so a tiny fraction of these mining could to have provided that thousands you know millions of tests you know and the coronavirus would not be such a great danger right now and no one is talking about that and pentagon will most likely get get it's something i wouldn't go into with you deem the pentagon every year waste more money than all of the money times $10.00 that will be spent on

dealing with demick in the united states where you bet and we see we see that basically. there is no universal health care in the united states and the system see. to be walking now we see that it's not what can you know wealthy people get in fact it because they go to bars more often you know the meat moral from working people are sometimes just glued to their walk by he says and who gets infected you know the wire for the canadian prime minister you know what sort of people in the media world lots of people in the keys to quote we see how unprotected the reach have become simply because they were so greedy that they provided no health service if you know if so that's a really good point to go back to alex and nicosia i mean again this is this this pandemic it's poor people it's elderly people in the case of the united states people that are not insured are under insured and you know so people are going to

stay home you know the rich and powerful the. you know the all of silicon valley. and they'll bring in their food bring in their dry cleaning but what about the overdrive are ok in the dry cleaner and all that see this you know again watching how the administration react to this you know and you know i suppose if you own a lot of stocks you're going to be really worried about the stock market but the stock market exists because there is an economy and economy exist because it has to serve the people you've got all of their priorities all out of order and this pandemic shows it glaringly go ahead alex. yeah i mean i think you know when the penn demick runs its course however long it's going to take absolutely the united states to stop and reflect are they going to do it most likely not because they don't stop and reflect when it comes to regime change wars and like the most said the military spending the military budgets so i doubt when this pandemic runs its course the u.s. will have an open and honest debate about health care now you know it doesn't

matter where you lie on the spectrum with health care there's no doubt that the united states should reassess and discuss their health care structure but peter the whole idea here is that this pandemic is shutting down everything in the united states but it's playing into the media's hands and it's playing it to biden's hands the it's perfect for them to not have biden speaking it's perfect them to have biden hidden away and it goes against trump to not have trump at rallies and speaking so going forward in a whole of this what you're seeing right now is a pandemic that the media is going to utilize and capitalize on that biden is going to utilize and capitalize on because biden now can just get 5 minute internet speeches and internet life streams and he can disappear and even there he shaky and trump can't go out to those rallies into those big events and play up to his base

so the optics right now really work towards biden and really work against trump the health care debate is something that sanders could have capitalized on if sanders wasn't so weak. that's the main issue this plays into sandra's hands as well but sanders is god now he's god he's out of it biden like you said was even have to one even has to wonder and i think it's a serious question to ask is it will there even be conventions will they just be you know avatar conventions ok we're well they will they be done through skype i mean you're bringing up a very serious point here because it in it's actually controlling the media has the ability now to can completely control the narrative they can turn people on and they can turn other people off in an instant by i don't want to talk about health care i mean people think that bite is going to do something with health care he's already said we're going to not he's already said he would have. well it's just a lawful you know this week the american media was full of concern about rush or

you know going to chance to run another time when he was going to be the president for life for goodness sake biden is 11 years older than. this state is perfectly happy with him being the next president and if you read the media 90 percent of the media wants this guy 11 years all of those on board in the in the next president of the united states so it's just absurd it's laughable you know the problems that these people in the media invented like russian influence russian mending and they miss the really big problem that coronavirus what they believe and what they really miss is the elites meddling in the american election and that's where the real meddling is here you know alex that's just it for me and it's it's it's fascinating is that while the primaries are over we should cancel the rest of image joe biden you know this is just this they snow they're snow balling you ok they are gaslighting you are saying it's all over ok it's a it's if we know well because

a tribe administrated such a bad job he should just resign and we should just annoying to biden and leave that up and everything will go back to 2015 and everyone will be happy again i mean they have gotten everything wrong for the last. 4 years and again we should step back a little bit everything will gambit they have played against trump they have failed well they succeed this time it's hard to say but they have enormous resources mobilized around this story and it's the wrong story they're not focusing on the pandemic there but they're focusing on the politics of the pandemic go ahead alex yeah and you know they're going to get the pandemic wrong as well there's no doubt about that and no matter what trump does peter it's not going to be good enough no matter what he chose oh we open the borders he's a fall close the borders he's at fault stop flights from coming in he's at fault open all the flights he's going to be at fault so trump needs to just block all that stuff out and i think he's very good at doing that he needs to focus right now

on the short term the next month or 2 he needs to flatten that curve the pandemic is what we now see from china from south korea from italy at this pandemic definitely has a very steep bell curve. he needs to figure out a way in every country to figure out a way to flatten that curve out the pandemic going to run its course but they need to flatten that curve out they need to double play the spread of the virus and they need to work on getting people the care that they need for the short term and then after that we really really need to have a discussion in the united states about health care is anyone going to do it no unfortunately i don't think so but in an ideal world in a perfect world that would be the course of action that health care would be a big topic going into the presidential election with biden it's not it's a fool's errand to believe that the elites will learn from their mistakes 20 seconds to finish talking about these statements you know now people in the united states can feel what we felt and what people in iraq felt what people in there with

a lot of felt when the u.s. media at the act would lead us you know whatever milosevic did he was a criminal what they were put in as doing he was always a criminal but in reality of the statements from their western but if you are a lot more responsible when. you let merkel who has stayed in power all longer than 2004 she has the chance of all germany when she says that 70 percent of germans can be infected that means 58000000 people and we're going to follow that story here that's all the time we have many thanks to my guests here in moscow and in london and in nicosia and thanks to our viewers for watching us here r.t. see you next time and remember crosstalk.

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which. has a number of coronavirus fates how i see suits up in a wrong the country's leadership claims the crisis is being exacerbated by the west sanctions. with infection rates increasing dramatically in other countries 2 politicians are being hit hard as the al breaks these ministers go into quarantine we asked me when nouns live in a handful of the 1st level is exactly how he sees the crisis affecting every day life. it need not be the same a lot of miley miley you can be completely. critics accuse the u.k. government of pursuing a high risk strategy for battling covert 19.