economic strategy for greater eurasia and in london we're joined by alexander me curacy is a writer on legal affairs as well as editor in chief of the duran dot com all right gentlemen crossed out rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i was appreciate it ok let's go to glenn 1st there we have president erewhon of turkey announcing that one of the most important if not the most important church in the history of christianity will be converted into what's going on here what is the importance of that church to. the political ambitions that say of the president of turkey what does it mean to christians all around the world in 2020 now go ahead paul. well it's one of the key religious buildings and christianity so but he did it or how did history and christianity but also for the muslims again it was it built into 6 centuries it was a cathedral and this lasted for almost a 1000 years she'll be in easter christianity's all for the orthodox christians

until the amounts conquered. because of the nobility in 4053 and they are converted it into a mosque now under other turkey in the early 20th century they made it into a you see it was part of that secular sation to make it into well as i should put it positioning it urges a secular state and also along with and or sister to be a good bridge between the east and west so imitating some of history but also being more european so again i can understand why turkish muslims then would like to we would not care for the fact that our most cus been clear to me see him for almost a century and it would like kept returned to a place of worship however they shouldn't also recognize that for christians to have similar concerns a serious affair was not billed as a most eldress like a funeral. and this kind of this is the national sovereignty of

course of turkey to decide what it should do and how everything indicates what kind of country turkey will be obviously things like pluralism and respect for other faiths this doesn't really signal that this is our skipper to use a rather specific itself. well essentially history now represents one of conquests and subjugation of christians so it's it's i mean this bridge between east and west the seems turkey a suspect or worse as setting itself on the front line and that clash of civilization by session it stepping all over a christian landmark. by solely converting it to mosques now run the thing that. if you're not going to hurt us and we see if you can at least how does a place of worship for christians us who are so far the turks are simply are you. know it will be you know buddhists hindus increases their ok coming this is a tourist destination. but it's not of this sort of this nation it's a christian landmarks

a country of the so going to miss the whole point about seniors yes social robots are cathedral but you know alex even i think what glenn said isn't as well said because this is a obviously historically important to christianity however the nominal christian west was kind of hohum about the whole thing i mean that there's very little. reaction to a unilateral decision to critically sense turkey is under international obligations to be sensitive to the religious artifacts of other religions and now that seems to been abrogated and and this tossed suicide go ahead i'll wait i mean i think this is punch at the fact that christianity is not a simple things in the west is it once was in fact you see in the west increasingly not just the secular i say she's friends but perhaps tear i say it in some places

anti christian trends we she's been gaining full size and i think that these events does not have the significance in the west that he does over there he wants to act in the east and east and also doxie it's different i mean also doxie to a great extent actually develops in its present full as pawns hope this system of worship that's to place in this chip and it is as important tool as the talks christians as say peter's basilica in rug is to catholics say he's easy radek. full of events and the other concern that i think many orthodox new students would have is that of course he's full of precious leftover from the time when he was a church their existence is inconsistent with it being a mosque there may come a day when the more militant form of this law decides that these. christian symbols

and christian artwork and simply inconsistent with these present. there is another factor which i think is not me given the attention that he deserves which is that when adults are made the decision to confess the church in the last back into the museum he was doing to say things firstly he was secular icing and westernizing tacky now that is being rude 1st he was also doing something else which is that he was signalling to the neighboring countries the neighboring christian and former christian countries greece so union and all the rest the turkey was intent on being a good name is very much part of kemo letter to extol assiut that's on a major route across not with soviet union people tend to forget very major red cross more with greece now by who's facing this decision at the same time the

gun is a joking a much more assertive foreign policy that signals to many people in the in the area around turkey the that policy that answered so cannot insert had is being abandoned is being pushed aside so it has a major resonance in the east is not absent such great interest in the west glenn if they're doing making a statement to the muslim world i mean obviously he's made this decision because he can do it i mean if the sovereignty issue. in a modern sense but this is and he certainly doesn't care what the nominal christian countries of the west now say and and of course it's of an affront to to greece being the most important orthodox country neighboring it and this is a message to the muslim world that is a kind of been

a neo ottoman ism issue headline well and it could be because so a lot of us authorities. express this the cyrus take a bit of a leadership position in the role and again as you mentioned it's a neo modern and. their position is how it was to some extent this also influenced this all takes in syria i think it's been very gone and now i think this ability to essentially stand up to the international community and also stand up to the west and say listen we will do as we want to please. you with that are we to this case you know islam and in this fight against the western christianity i think you know that has some. cultural. value if you want and obviously this could have your negative cases for the wider region because if they really want to be kind of a role model and a leader of the wider region now is to be noted out across the middle east

christians are treated as you know sir court record and us a lot of oppression of christians so therefore turkey. has a special abound in. this protection of this. trial and for christians it's just found out as being a very negative development also dangerous for the rest of the region so but again it's not quite clear if if it's meant i mean for the mystical audience or international. well i mean every aspect of it is that it is making a an impact in the muslim world i mean you know i visited that not just of it is a stupendous architectural achievement considering when it was founded and built but right across from it is the blue mosque which is an absolutely exclude wisit piece of architecture as well it seems to me that this is being made for political and even religious reasons because there's no shortage of mosques in

turkey obviously and the blue mosque itself was built and designed as a mosque itself in the huggett sophia. it was designed for very completely different purposes and i truly regret that the international community secular or otherwise doesn't want to step in and and exert some kind of pressure to preserve the essence and the origins and the meaning of this church and i think not and that's what's most regrettable in my book this is actually region because of course he's in fact age of caution from traditional muslim practice to convert a church into a mosque if you go back to the 7th century when the muslims captions jerusalem the patriarch of jerusalem christian patriarch invited the colleagues. to pray in the church of the only sad and he refused because he did not long stick to convert the church of the whom he sent into a mosque he was consent of the interests of christians and also establishing

a new religion we had sent places of worship this is a departure from the tradition of his mom think it is also an assertion by. all the new policy of tacky which is to try to become delete all the form of this long since it's a signal all sects that other countries which has been asserting its own. recently as the leader of this which is sound you arabia it's a turkey is now really turned and it's very interesting see the country search our lines saudi arabia in the muslim world like egypt egypt has a major role eastland. scholarship see all of the the islamic leadership we need chip has opposed this because they see it 1st

isn't. but they also see it as a challenge to these stoutish leadership all places like mecca and connor as a center is all these let me well so it's actually a very assertive step that guns done it puts you back in the tradition of the ultimate couper of cosc also claims leadership of islam when they were in that in the primary when they were the primary and at least leadership a sunni islam says it is a necessity step one which i didn't think is fully recognized in the west as it was a major challenge is used and can you're going to say you're absolutely right when you mention it's huge on tissue significance this is this church as an extraordinary. example of arts and again that is perhaps discounted and maybe. being a little i'm going to talk about this but i mean if

a major cost outside of the muslim world were converted into a church or secular i see be a huge outcry again i think this is a more of a comment on the. lack of faith in the west than is their doctrine about their ideologies like secularism communism postmodernism right gentlemen going to jump in here we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion and some say 30. well the pandemic no certainly no borders and a slide into nationalities. this summer if we don't come with the we don't look like seeing the whole world needs to

be. judged. come in a crisis like this sentence. we can do better we should know. everyone is contributing to each of our own way but we also know that this crisis will not go on forever the challenge is creating the response has been masked so many good people are helping us. it makes us feel very proud that we're in it together.

we go to work so you straight home. i know to no crowd. no shots no. action i'll speak. with well dr no 1st 12. points your thirst for action. is you'll media a reflection of reality. in a world transformed. what will make you feel safe. high salacious full community. are you going the right way or are you being

led somewhere. direct. what is true what is faith. in the world corrupted you need to descend. to join us in the depths. or a maybe in the shallows. well too much across top or all things considered i'm hearing about remind you we're discussing some. real. ok let's go back to alex in london we have this major diplomatic brouhaha heating up over the north stream pipeline they gots line gas line from russia to

germany the germans are still are dating in their heels here give us the background of the story mites and or can not stream is the latest pont law and it's being built between russia which used to generate clear the all the supply of natural gas to central europe it's the east built pipelines to germany nord stream one now there's no one to stream to than this to stream which is a sullen lot lawdy partly these are intended clearly this is a far away from the pipelines that went through ukraine but they're also a economic the economic construction which makes sense but as we hear it and for russia russia has lots of gas which is wants to sell central europe specially has need of gas which it wants to vote like what is now happening is that the united states is increasingly. against these

economic developments and if he's trying to block in the street just as he has tried to block why way in britain because he's trying to impose the law just all the members of the western alliance he doesn't trade china it doesn't want to try to russia it wants to shake only with the united states all with each other and to separate themselves from the larger world that exists in full is openness slee of a. keeping a very strong reaction in just me because it is going to be a blow to boost germany's economic independence from the united states but he's also. going against germany's interests as a country that he's feeding more moral self-confidence and wants to such itself

independently since it's obsessing about this ok look let me i know it's didn't mention probably the most important word and it mean i'm not and i'm not downplaying his wonderful answered my question here but the word sovereignty comes to mind here i mean the germans are expressing their right to sovereignty in their own in energy security and not just germany's energy security but for central europe is this these 2 pipelines will essentially be a hub but this is something the united states of course i mean they want their european allies to buy liquefied natural gas from the united states ship but sent by ship that is far more expensive ok and i would like to point out to our viewers during the worst times of the cold war. europe imported russian soviet and natural gas and that conflict is over let's let's what's in play here let's go ahead let it is interesting because every since the 2nd world war this set is huge and the

presence and influence 'd of the united states over a year as opposed to the bid to protect the earth and indeed this recent. by the united states was to ensure p. and energy security so again it's america will then be our protector however this kind of this ng to david a little bit from the plot here because they're not going sanctioning the russians all in other sanctioning sanctioned europeans so it's like america is now the guarding of europe however. exactly what does it or read about souls or captive nations on the us or we merely in our children of the us must an issue if we're unable to take care of ourselves so sanctioning european companies in order to keep european energy security it does seem a bit absurd and obviously ad and this is where you know the make conflict comes in between the u.s. and germany now as well so of course there are many contradictions there for one of the europeans i've been saying european security it's our energy security as

a concept where they would have greater ownership over the infrastructure of their you know course insurance if your current form or forms however now that european companies are fearful of american sanctions a lot of this is not ending up with russia so it is unclear exactly what they're doing in denmark now so you know it's reasonable to speculate that they've been loosening restrictions lately only under german pressure and it this is only because they want to finish it sooner now because this either american sanctions are coming in so let's not drag this out let's finish it off so there is this very weird dynamic at the moment and again the u.s. is very mush reacting to losing this economic levers of power salis on. i know that they have similarities with roy i know of course that you know they had taken the streets they're losing a bit older it's so different the dysfunction of their allies as well the russian energy section their ally the new transportation corridors well you're also

threatening the european allies new investment banks their payment system you also threaten your own most of the more the u.s. loses its leverage you see the more it will use economic coercion not just against other serious are also allies and as alex put out puts a critically i guess that outcome is. dog sit up to countries like germany more incentive not to not completely the couple at least the 1st 5 or ties. and that is an interesting outcome the germans are now taking a stand against americas this is very unusual this is very much american a result of their policies well alex it's some it's something that the u.s. has initiated i mean it's not germany looking for bad relations with the united states apart from it ok but i mean it's forcing the issue i mean germany is not a country that you trifle with ok i mean it's it's making sovereign decisions about

its economy and it's thinking about the well being of the european union is well it's trading neighbors i mean the most amazing thing for me historically at least is that the last time we have this kind of blot discipline is when the when the comic-con countries the the countries are in the soviet orbit they were forced to trade with got countries they know it was mandated from moscow ok and now and now you have the same kind of behavior being mimicked by washington because the more they do this the more they're pushing their trading partners away this is exactly the point and in fact what they gain she says it is that they can to encourage more will come to this to find ways around the use the american dollar system because that he's been used to enforce the sanctions ultimately. asia is a self defeating exercise the whole country's you sanction and sanctions now almost out of control the united states is sanctioning left right and center as glenn correctly said they're not sanctioning their allies the sanctioning companies oh

they're not honest it is completely out of control the more you do that the greater the incentive for more people to get together and find ways around the united states and that will ultimately undermine it all the system which is not in america's interest however the europeans have to some extent it's been very clear about this rule she's on so because they joined. previous american sanctions exercises against him run against russia rings you sound it is way lower venezuela exactly nothing to the hora they find it this way they hate to some extent helps to construct east mean used against them and this i think shows how misconceived some of those early of policy decisions actually europe which is

a much more open in terms of trade defense germany is a country that's tense heavily on trade so does the netherlands so do other countries a year they should be extremely wary of going down sanctions routes the united states is a much more self-sufficient so concerned he told me it can be seen geo political objectives of the europeans went along with it and now they're paying cross you know glad to have the argument that the administration the us administration is making we've had it from donald trump and from like a oh is it we can't detach all this from nato because it's much their own bridge you know you have a country like germany that wants to connect its energy fortunes with russia but russia is supposed to be the enemy and you need to be things putting more money and nato in for them you know you know that for the germans to say you want to spend what money on nato but russia is our trading partner here and this is what drives

trump and pompei or crazy because how can you be become a trading partner with an enemy why aren't you spending more money on nato and i'll tell you why the germans and most of the europeans say but there is no threat there that's why they don't want to spend the money on it we want to have trading relations because you know what russia is the largest consumer market in europe. and that's been one of the key challenges of the united states in the past there were you know leading military power and economic power but now they see it out there that their ability to convert their role as a security product into this you don't geoeconomic a loyalty to their course is actually weakening so so what did they do to try to make this link that if you if you depend on the security this has to be also expressed in your economic policies again not a very unreasonable proposition to make however as you point out that this idea that you know russia is waiting you know russian tanks waiting to roll into berlin

no one really thinks that it's disparate so you can hide their russian threat in order to create further security dependence and try to convert it into economical it is really it is it seems to be failing and making it worse it's not just it was just russia will be one thing but they're doing the same with with with the chinese and across the board so it's a it's becoming is and the americans are the mounting more and more and they're capable of delivering less. you would think that some point there were to change their ways because this is obviously pushing europeans away and if you get sanctions are best when you use moderately and. and this excessive amount of sanctions yourself should just teaching the rest of the world to live without the united states and that's i think the lesson that you know the europeans aren't speaking up to us about the interesting thing is real traditional prickly alex is that you know we had presidential candidate joe biden outflank trump and have

a new buy america thing or strong has make america great again but you know i guess no other country can make themselves great again because they want to protect their sovereignty is only a one way street ok only one country can have sovereignty everyone else has to do with less well these are the 5 seconds go right this is exactly what the united states needs from last. the history for the last 30 years ever since the so-called unity only moments happened in the united states sees the world very much as being the united states leadership and that most agents economic leadership and it doesn't want to see that challenge of course the question is whether other countries are prepared now to sacrifice zayra interests in order to keep the united states british position primaries every relationship has 2 parties at the very least ok and i think people in washington have to realize that the other party has

an opinion too gentlemen that's all the time we have i want to thank our viewers for watching us here are see you next time remember. when alex or seemed wrong. but i'll roll just don't call. me world yet to see how he's going to come to cancel it in detroit because the trail. went on to find themselves worlds apart when just of the common ground. next as a slight angle survival does stacey let's learn a salad feel like let's say i'm the troika here i'm greece the fight.

thank you for. the story 6 that's right. slavery. the world is driven by a dream shaped by. thinks . we are here to ask.

live from the world headquarters of the r t america in our nation's capital this is the news with rick sanchez. hi everybody i'm rick sanchez and i want to welcome all of you watching from all over the world including those of you who are watching us on your phones using the portable t.v. . you know there is something odd coming out of ukraine today that mandates us to ask questions about our involvement there to find out if where our country our state department is assisting in ukraine or orchestrating is a big difference between those 2 let me 1st say this the foreign policy of our country has directed us from time to time to step.