hello and welcome across the uk where all things are considered on peter lavelle is anyone safe in that era of the wrong bank conservatives are the platform the monetized and shadow ben those were the easy ones now the mob is turning on its own wrong thing demands conformity and does not bring a set is freedom of speech now only for the woke. there's guys this and more i'm joined by my guest david freiheit in montreal he's a practicing attorney and you tube and in washington we crossed like rico's interest he is an adjunct professor of legislative politics at the george

washington university and a health care law originally crossed out rules in effect that means in japanese i want i also appreciate it ok let's go to david 1st in montreal very broadly speaking you know we've been seeing a lot of deep platforming democratization south platforming all kinds of things going on and we can talk about some of the specifics but is this a cultural revolution or we have a cause a cultural revolution or had i don't know that it's a cultural revolution is a is a loaded term it's a big term i hear people using it i hear people comparing this to the french revolution so the fall of rome a lot of sort of i won't say exaggerated talk a lot of lofty talk whether or not it's that serious there's definitely a pendulum swing and it's definitely swinging very far to whichever side i just see using example but it's swinging hard to one side right now where people are getting punished i think excessively for what some would feel to be minor indiscretions.

like they're always characterized as you know severe indiscretions that warrants cancellation on social media the platforming etc there are strong examples where it's still even arguable but then there are strong examples where it's totally not arguable but just a question of excessiveness but you know it's a revolution it's definitely a current a tendency and it's the pendulum will swing back sooner than later because i can sort of get a feel for it from from the silent majority that nobody likes the way it's going to be feel safe and it's going to swing back the other day sooner than later yeah i wish people wouldn't be the silent majority i wish they'd be more talking we can talk about that here whether because same question to you is this a cultural revolution because a lot of a lot of lives have been destroyed here i thought we came from a culture of redemption and forgiveness ok i mean some of the infractions are just absurd ok and then to see in the mainstream media 247 my intelligence and

sense of morality is insulted all the time by a lot of neo liberal propaganda but that is that's just never touched us because it's part of the normans part of the coals my friend in washington so i agree with david to the extent i don't think that this is a cultural revolution and i dare i say that if you were if we were to use that term cultural revolution then i think you know we have had moments in history both in the states and globally where we have seen sort of these moments arising from the people so to speak but i think the retaliates is that there is a bit of a question of revisionist history and there's a fine line between intimidation public shaming you know economic rowing to. 2 words that are being placed in the public square versus the cancer culture and that is currently what we have particularly i think almost bill sites right so it's not just liberal such as concern. i think both sides are are contributing to this

fact and what we are seeing it particularly from the progressive left is this rise of a question of revisionist history so i think it's calling really to the stage but issues and histories we have not faced up to our own ups you and a past where we're also seeing this on the right even if we look at settling we know that we have conservative right wing conservative leaders that are bialek across across the world and so there is polarization on both sides said i think that we ask you ethically how the conversation and bring that conversation to the public square and it's late. but you may not think they're ready to sire but where is the public square where is the marketplace of ideas because of the destruction of statues destroying memorials that's not a conversation is it no it's not a conversation i think that we need to talk i am i was

a trained historian and that is what i focused in on it but mostly it was history augury the philosophy of history exactly what we're talking about right here but you don't go burn books and have people fired if you want to really understand or reinterpret history that's a healthy thing your baby you know go ahead and jump in on that because i am it to my core fascinated to have conversations particularly with people that disagree with me because i learned i mean i mean i obviously totally agree with that i have a you tube channel where we touch on you know political stuff from the legal sense and i don't believe comments i don't deter discussion to the extent to remain civil and nonviolence that the tearing down statues is an interesting thing or let's call it the removal of statues to avoid it slanted toward a better deal if you hear noise in the back of my dog i've got really don't worry about it there and. it's something i think it's totally counterproductive to to remove the statues it's sort of the orwellian memory hole in that age don't learn

anything from history because you tend to forget it but b. and this is my major point right sort of take flak from from the right to some extent is the statues were not directed to celebrate the flaws of the individual they were erected to celebrate the successes or at the very least the defining absolute of the individual and so bring that to the the george floyd protests where you have people the same people by and large tearing down statues because of the bad things the person did but directing murals because for george floyd because of the way he died and i say i agree with the murals because you're not directing a mural to george floyd to celebrate his flaws or his wrongdoings in the past you're wrecking it to celebrate what he represents now and that's that holds true for the statue and so you take him down. 8 you have no longer a discussion about what they are the bad things that they have committed and throughout history you lose that debate and you also lose the history of what they did in fact contribute to the very society let's yannick what it is i mean it again

and to stay with the statues here i mean the most horrific period in american history was the civil war and i really want every generation to know that because that was the defining moment of what made the country that we have now and the. after the war particularly the south that was imperfect and that and that's an understatement ok but that is a learning experience and you know and i am agreeing with david here i mean so many people think of history as something to celebrate actually it's something to ponder and think about the mistakes that have been made in the problems that need to be a result of this day but because well peter let me ask you do you believe in ghosts because i do this we know are meant to disturb we know that ghosts are meant to disrupt a nerve and to hot relief and hayden said something i think that's particularly germane to this conversation he said the only thing we learned from history is that we were nothing for fish and so memory is

a classic street in memory if history are not the same and so there's a and there's a national memory at least in the states of the ghosts of yesteryear that have somehow it again emerged in 2020 right a memory of an america that was great memory of america that was not troubled by people who looked like me and had my hair style as it were seen really other girls of the days of the women that are rearing their ugly head again and i don't necessarily agree with the removal of statues but i understand why people are calling for statues so if you're going to have a civil war they're going to talk about a civil war we don't need a monument. that that is why we have textbooks if you freaks but if you are going to karaoke or remove these monuments then i do say you wrecked new monuments and statues to people who are who have contributed to all of humanity so

given those statues and a clear head and you're diverse you would need to have a consensus about that person and the act and that person committed in the past ok i'm all for that ok but you can't can't you shouldn't cancels out planes that make you feel uncomfortable history is not about feeling comfortable histories about learning something david every single culture creates miss about themselves ok because it brings together a society gives them common meaning and i think that will take leave the civil the the civil war the civil rights movement those are those are defining moments in american history and if you take the physical culture and dispense with it i don't think books and receipt memory is enough i think it's physical culture is very important that well very 1st of all it's only a matter of time once you answer i'm not even calling it

a slippery slope anymore it is affected we have free fall once you accept that you can willy nilly or even at large remove monuments it is only a matter of time before you censor books before you before you pull them from the book shows like we've seen in hong kong it's only a matter of time because that's invariably where it goes when i sort of i don't take issue with it i think it's the wrong perspective to say that we have to tear down certain monuments in order to erect others at the into the city of who to whom we pay tribute doesn't require the removal of things which have been for hundreds of years which are part of someone else's history some part someone else's lore and the counter-intuitive aspect about it is if the entire goal of this is unity and sort of. bringing together society you're not going to do that by. literally tearing down someone else's history regardless of whether or not you take offense with that history and so it is a divided society more by taking down these mine it's been up for hundreds of years sometimes as opposed to let's just let's you know let's change the money let's get

another face on the money like we've done in canada let's erect them on your let's let's let's be more inclusive not by eliminating but by adding i'm not and so i think at the end at the end of the day it's absolutely going to produce the exact opposite reaction to this action whether it is if you work at the george washington university should it be renamed. well i think in some cases you know they do but i'm asking it the reason i'm asking is because it's the that's the the ultimate conclusion i mean if this is continue to be pursued then washington jefferson the whole lot of them have to go i mean where do you draw the line right you draw the line in telling the truth history and memory again are not the same but they are related you need very const you hear shrieking in this country when it comes to history in the states for that matter we have to tell the truth and that i think it's part of the problem here is that we're not telling the truth about a lot of

a lot of people who these monuments and the statues are ready to yes george washington was a great man he was founder he was one of the founding fathers of america he was our 1st president under our current structure but he also was a slaveholder right that is often left out of the huge st george washington so to your question so the university changes say absolutely not i don't necessarily think that it should but what we should do is tell the complete florida history and well other reasons why we still have the terrible race relations in the states is because we have not told the true history we try to hide we like to have a revisionist history as sort of telling the fool and i think using it. already true about what happened to these individuals and what they stood again i think that's fair enough but i don't think it's a secret that the many of the founding fathers i had that were slave owners i mean i i was brought up in the public school system i knew that and it was it was the

reason why it was pointed out because our current sensibility tells us it's very very wrong but if you're using it you're going to break it down saying sorry to interrupt we still have textbooks in the state of texas that are teaching students that a civil war was not an issue of slavery that was an issue of states' rights well that's simply right gentlemen i'm going to jump in you know we're going to go to a short break and after the actual break we'll continue our discussion on all of that state. is your media a reflection of reality. in a world transformed. what will make you feel safe. tyson nation for community. are you going the right way or are you being

so. direct. what is true what is faith. in a world corrupted you need to descend. to join us in the depths. or in making the shallowness. who put oh here they are supplying you. oh yeah it's wrong to pre-board it yet spoil yet sweep toward it for the protests we've gotten pretty traditional as it looked to me at the medium but it just came to be you know pretty good work for you. oh yeah it's. so. good just to be you they take you to where the. men who can't imagine life without fashion without a sense of style without things that might be seen as weakness in this masculine

world but they still demonstrate incredible strength of spirit to live as they choose. for. welcome back to cross up where all things are considered i'm peter lavelle to remind you we're discussing wrong think. ok let's go back to david here we had the last few days but very wise. up editor over at the new york times. and she left with a very strident resignation letter and she's getting some praise i don't praise her

i think she's part of this problem of this council culture and this very strident partisan. media environment that attacks you basically your character is destroyed because you have a different political view and it seems to me that she's the platform because the mob was coming out of her and she knew when to get out how do you feel about it is the revolution itself in the area police and people tend and this is where i see the pendulum is going to swing when people say hey but i like that person or he but that person was actually nice i know that i was reading an article i will not remember the name of it but as the left wing the left wing right are saying about this individual that they're now accusing of racism i don't personally it's not racists and that's invariably when people start to realize it's easy to pick on the chair or tries individuals like alex jones like miley not lists it's easy to pick on them but then when it becomes i see more nuance for others then people start

realizing where does this end and they realize it's not going and ever and they will invariably find themselves in the proverbial guillotine because of something that they tweeted a while back or because they no longer yes i was the right police or they don't suppose the right least part of. it yet it's all a system and i think people even on the left are realizing that anything i don't like category. as in less than the right on this and i do tend to equivocate it but people say well it's much more left than on the right and that is true only because the media by and large is massively leftist compared to what is what is there right it's on both sides it's just massively more on the left and now the left is targeting their own listen elana ows the leftist some twitter they and they're going to do something that gets them into trouble and then people realize this is going to you know that why it's go back to washington i mean well i i he see no value in the spirit that attests whatsoever because who is actually pure and who differ who determines what is purity i mean it is this is

a fool's errand and it's very very destructive and unfortunately unfortunately i actually pride myself on not mentioning the president's name in this a my program because everything is about trump which i think it's not and i think that's the problem here the problem is always invoking the bad orangemen which distorts everything and you know again going to this party weist me she just needs her everything from said the administrations that he she's against ok it's not very nuanced and not very intelligent it's not very great i go ahead peter i think you said something that's really important here is not very nuanced right people in our society unfortunately whether it's the right or left they don't like complexity they don't like the great area they don't like new arts and just this gets to an issue within the human condition generally speaking and that is human frailty we don't understand human frailty we will write comp short and so we have to be very

careful whether it is the right or the left about our past and how they sort of emerged and how their helmets to those standards to speak out in the wrong way is violence and not to speak out it's violence but we have to be very clear on what that definition of violence is and what that means the reality is a lot of the lives that we live particularly in the public square and in the political that are a myth. it's great it's you us it's complex it's messy and we have to get down there in that messiness we have to delve in that you want us to really understand the complexity of individuals as are we should not beat kathleen out unless of course that their words are surely inflammatory or truly violent but that's not the case then we need to let people be human and that is a humane. ok look you know you david but again who determines the rules this is what really bothers me all of the time because you know you said you don't like these labels and i don't either i consider myself

a conservative but it doesn't mean i'm against universal healthcare for example ok because my conservatism comes from looking at the interests and needs working people and families that's where my conservatism is all about i don't worship capitalism that's is the ideology ok l.a. and always this invoking that socialism with the right always does right doesn't really know what socialism is all about they invoke it might make art on people. this is again going back to these purity test here is that if you have to be in a certain category and if you deviate and this happens also on the right but primarily i see it on the left they didn't then you're not challenged and sometimes cancel. the purity test it's a symptom of social media we're talking about nuance and i've always made this joke that twitter is the only place where you get further by being short on character and literature because if it isn't a place for nuance nobody wants you know that i will steal that's all i want it's

copyright because i said it publicly i think it's no joke it's like you succeed on twitter by being short on character by being inflammatory by being like i follow james woods on twitter i don't like to see it all the time but i follow it so you know it is the stuff that gets popular on twitter is the black and white cut and dry evil vs hero a mentality in social media is contributing to the problem there's no room for nuance there's no room for compromise there's no room for genuine understanding because you don't literally have the room for it and nobody's really interested in it doesn't sell and so i think social media contributes to the problem but what is one of the definitions one of the rules there ever changing because it is specifically designed to be weaponized for whatever the object is whoever the target is of the day and that is the very. problem is you don't know it because there are no there are no objective rules are the objective criteria you don't know if you're going to be the one with your head in the guillotine tomorrow. and i

think you know i sort of hedge my bets if only in terms of being courteous in discussion i think that's the only way you can guarantee or at least interest on it . but that's considered weakness compromise to consider weakness of k. and then when you compromise they move the goalposts again ok i dare i've come to that conclusion over the last few years that cavanagh saga. hit me i'm out moving the goalposts constantly moving it ok and destroying a man's character humiliating him in front of this family that passed the stop here could because there's something you know everybody knows i live in moscow and i'm i'm a historian of eastern europe you know in russian history and during the soviet era you know there was kind of it was a joke that you know the future is certain but not the past ok because the you can wake up one morning in the mix and so ideological tenet has changed ok and you better get in line or all you become called the deviation this is happening in

america. j'sbail and understood that history is always present with us we have to understand that history is always present with us the people don't understand history so billers and history they are saying nuance they don't as they complexity . today despite really light beings black and white and simplistic when it comes to compromise in the body of politics. politicians lawmakers cosi makers have to compromise that is the crux of what politics is the pulse of the city state so you can deposit the city state or social media does not contribute well to the humanity of our culture when it comes to lawmakers have to compromise as well as reflect the constituencies to which they represent and that i think of what we're really seeing and that is the breakdown that is the abdication of leadership in this country and the states and particularly around the world so when it comes to who determines the

rules i think this was a rules just a lawmaker's which of course our elected the by the people that they that they represent ok well you know i mean that's kind of opening up another can a can of beans here i mean like i 2 things popped into my head the the body politic if you look at poll after poll they're against these foreign wars and interventions and changes you look at poll after poll most people want something some kind of universal health care but nothing changed so if they don't they go to work and then somebody now of these office holders it never happens again because they're not willing to roll back all no return what you've got other no no because both then there's no that there are no parties once he gets up to that level ok this special interests they we're ok david i want to stay with this you know look i didn't really disgusting ok what do you need elections for that the allegations will do what they were elected to do ok david where is this going i mean what is the slippery slope that we're on a slippery slope here are we get are can we have

a moment where like when. joe mccarthy was told to finally stand down ok and things started to calm down are we anywhere close that calling out the mccarthy moment when what might my fear is that or my fear my concern or thought is that too many people are making too much money by driving this and so can we have that moments. not until legacy media mainstream media decides that if that moments or are replaced by something that decides that it's that moment and that's sort of from a personal level that's sort of what i'm trying to contribute to is bringing you know bringing the discussion together and not continually dividing and like i've said this many times on my channel and videos the problem is to court he goes point about about compromise the same thing with apologies compromising apologies now have been themselves weaponize as elements of weakness and not elements of progress and i think politicians are driving that but i think above all else mainstream

media is driving that if they are they are it is continually good versus evil and evil compromises it's not a question it's not an indication of their of their benevolence it's an indication that they've been defeated by good a good test when harder and harder and they've they've pitted one side versus the other good versus evil quite literally in terms of jargon and they don't seem ready to give up yet they might be turning but they i think they're making way too much money off of the division they've been profiting way too much off of the crisis the last 6 months and i don't see them giving up anytime soon until they are placed by something more responsible but because i'm well you know we started talking about statues and we can maybe fairly black lines matter and and the the the assault on a traditional of values and history and traditions you're always alvis benefiting people of color in the united states well this is particularly probably. i don't favorable opinion i don't really believe the removing of these confederate mine

your minutes or symbols of hate really do anything to advance the cause of justice it doesn't do anything from a policy or economic perspective and i view it does again nothing to move the needle just as particularly when the wealth gap between the lights and after you can buy south americans is 10 times that i'm out we know that 171 $1000.00 net worth of a typical white family versus $17000.00 of its black family in the gaps in the wealth between blacks and whites also reveal of course the economic inequality that has long existed in discrimination so if you're going to talk about removing statues the same private or public funds better that is being used to remove these monuments are just saying private or public funds that can be used to roads public education they can be huge concerns out there on that note i completely agree with

you let's move the needle about inequality and not wait wait that's all the time we have gentlemen i want to thank my guests not rio and much in want to be our viewers watching us here are you see you next and remember. in the troubled 19 seventies a group of killers rampage through parts of northern ireland that was coordinated loyalist attacks protected on the catholic population in belfast tens of thousands were forced to flee their homes come up with strike and put these attacks was a p.r. you see the police actually took part in the attacks so instead of preventing it they were active participants in the burning of the whole streets in belfast at the time more than a 100 innocent civilians were. as 3 of you can see in yours and we found out more i will support. about the extent. to which the collusion was involved in some of

those cases the killers would later be named. i think it went to the very very top i think it is. the water where politicians knew. and gave the go ahead. seemed wrong. but all. just all. get to shape out these days to come to advocate and engagement equals betrayal. when so many find themselves worlds apart. just to look for common ground.

i say very modestly that i have done more for the african-american community than any president since abraham lincoln is black lives massive protest is engulf the city of can oh surely look at how politicians are using the rest there in this year's election. angela merkel says russia's north stream to gas pipeline to germany must go ahead despite the tensions over the edge poisoning of the prominent opposition figure alexina valmy and on the 1st anniversary of the teenager harry dunn u.k. authorities consider a virtual trial for the wife of u.s. diplomat accused of killing him and then fleeing the country. she was the last person to risk it is absolutely clear that the united states government does.