24 weeks 1918 when between 40 and a 100000000 people died of a pandemic influenza this is the greatest mortality about and human history there have been 2 subsequent pandemics 19571968 neither were any where it's deadly as 1918 and then suddenly in 1970 this new flu emerged in hong kong and scientists discovered to their horror that rather than being incubated in a pig or a human being been calm in fact it was several strands of the flu it jumped directly from birds to him and that's mike davis speaking in 25 on the threat of a flu type pandemic killing in the owner of his warnings were arguably not taken seriously by policymakers think tanks and politicians is 25 book the monster at our door is now called the monster and is with a brand new preface and he joins me now from los angeles mike welcome to going on the ground you've been on well i understand just take us through how you came to

write to the new preface as the full horror of the pandemic became apparent the book the regional book was. published right out to the operation in 2003 i think i wrote it in 2005 this is avian flu and at the time it looked like the world was in no way faced with a pandemic flu the biggest disastrous is the 1980 spanish flu it was warning about the emergence. of the i am told aged 5 n one. which had an extraordinary high rate but since the book was written several newer heidi's of influence a equally steadily. and troubling have arisen in on a very limited scale infected humans the threat of an influenza pandemic.

is generally is 189-9900 remains absolutely no minute and zooming as samin discussed during a pandemic is the. importance of developing a universal flu vaccine there attacks the in very in their area parts of the service in of influenza and can give us some unity from every poor even in influenza has we should realise that this is not a pandemic it's the beginning of an age of pandemics. that researchers in china face at the institute. that's come under attack from president truman. have done a service in research and discovered a reservoir of the more than $350.00 per pervert $500.00 varieties of viruses all with the potential to china to mammal other mammals and

eventually humans. in china you know whose knees most of the largest food mammals in the world. fly their bats 1500 species about 200 is species have they have been surveyed to some extent or another so there's a whole universe of trona viruses there has well as many other kinds of viruses that. are part of the natural reservoir and it is corporate law again an expansion of clear cut in and agriculture breakdown of barriers between a sunni. animals in the rain forests around the world as we destroy israel floors were ever increasing the possibility of transmission of viruses and the possibility

of new pandemics and you kind of imply that there's no cover up when no one else was conceived as concerned as you were the information you say was out there similarly when hoping to all now we live in the age of coronaviruses plural because why because there's no cover up but there's a structural. well one of the things the troubled ministration did and in this country the attack on. research on potentially pandemic diseases and in general one public health started the day or 2 is not your asian is he defunded. in american sponsored program there was an early warning system through the emergence of novel lyra says in diseases in china and southeast asia. he also of course wired the team on the national security council that obama had

created in the aftermath of the. it bloweth deadly ebola happy demick in. western africa. to deal with a pandemic which it was universally agree. was in the needs threat the united states and other countries i mean the warnings about this since. the beginning of the millennium have been constant the planning. has been kind of there are reports that we have been diets and in his son when the united states it's in your country and. most countries of western europe are always planning came to not it was a largely. ignored and now in my country. president tried has who it is desirable on which is

a medical spokesman james scott apple as he's a parks news commentator who exactly parrots the line that the tribe in ministration expresses that mass probably useless schoolchildren don't transmit the earth and to make the test change should be limited to only people in critically endangered groups trump obvious he says things that he says off of the united states doing better and he certainly is doing better than that the united kingdom on deaths per capita well in the case of britain i mean i think. it is so obvious that a deliberate strategy of herd immunity. was followed that the johnson government. deliberately decided to minimize damage to. the economy by letting the disease essentially spread and the catastrophic

failure of the u.k. government. to come immediately to the aid of people in senior homes and. nursing moms nyquist same thing as news sweden which explicitly. herd immunity and behind this there is a kind of. would i would consider an ominous new nazi cancer germs or were told lies unworthy of lives and the whole idea that some part of the population is sacrifice that will prove the greater good of the economy through credit diabolic their well obviously we invite the swedish ambassador. to london and on the program sweden did say that they had made some mistakes so that it has any nazi activity and as far as johnson they

moved away from her the unity and there are presumably going to be a public inquiry here as to what exactly british policy was but more systemically since you mention the economy rather than just talk about the preventative elements now we have that pandemic. is. we to expect pandemics because of capitalism we've now seen. how rapidly the virus can be transmitted around the world but the point is that this resides a very old debate about global health and one side of it was focus and it was represented for instance the 19th twenty's and thirty's by the rockefeller foundation which was the largess financier of disease prevention early global scale and within the british empire and the rockefeller paradigm was not areaway campaign sargon as pacific at the german

or as civic bacteria that. passage out and here this side repeated i think it is something social medicine which said that attacking the pathogen alone without attacking the poverty of the population the lack of primary care would always be a put side of the whole and this is could not be more true than. today we see around the world and not only in court the teens who use public help pages. have been ravaged to realign it's generation but in the united states and united kingdom we're health care and public health authorities. separate back their peer attempt to particularly out to the 2008. economic crisis

since visible and most here in trains east asia. has been an exception. just some except for various here is reasons but in the atlantic not always and i will now see the price paid by conservative fiscal policies in a new liberal economics so you really think that it's comparable thing in fact that of the 1918 spanish flu famously. spread through the trenches it's comparable to post 2008 infrastructural incapacitation after the bank whale at well they're 1918 example the knowledge is very serious constant way but in 189090 new jersey people new world died of insolence and more than 20 orian died in india and in western india

as a result of food elite grain picked term and other policies that exported massive amounts. in in grain just feed the indian armies in the field of war. it was dissociated so food prices rose. and india the same time there was a drought and bad cholera epidemic sooty had this huge party lation. were people with compromised immune systems and i am bargain that in fact today we have to recognize that some in immunological standpoint newly to humanity's in the u.k. or the united states maybe a 5th of that argue lation. is immunologically compromised it's not just

because cancers and diseases but also because of malnutrition co-exists seen sections like hiv but in poor countries in sub-saharan africa and south asia and many parts of white merican. the majority depart. 75 percent. is in this position a big gender of true. and demi i should say and then the un special rapporteur who talked about increasing malnutrition up to $28.00 in britain have but he said it was a political decision the british government denied that completely michael stopping that more from mike davis after this break. so what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have

a crazy confrontation let it be an arms race is on offer and scoring dramatic development ali and going to resist i don't see how that strategy will be successful that a critical time time to sit god and ta. da. there's a war the public the most least mutable little more than. live. long . lives and the. truth about those of us. if we were to use the book with the ghost discovering that those would be was obvious is the belief. but. of course.

welcome back i'm still here with the american scholar who forecast a global zoonotic lee transmitted pandemic more than a decade and a half before coronavirus mike davis you say that in the united states where more people are being killed in any other than the nation with the most deaths you believe the john bolton trumps that former national security adviser is key to understanding why the pandemic planning went so badly. well bowman's decision was to reorganize endemic preparedness to fire the crack team that obama had put in place he wanted

everything focused on on bio warfare but the larger phenomenon of course is trumps absolute obsession with destroying and dismantling their everything that. the previous president if put in a put in place remember this regime came into power valley to destroy the fordable care or obamacare and is constantly trying to do things like take the budget earth centers for disease control. if you look at this internationally you see that the media agencies traditionally lead agencies in disease have been marginalized in the view issue is how to totally marginal. the center for disease control in the united states has had a totally marginal role in the european union where there exists

a protocol. for countries to cooperate in responding to transnational disease or soon as totally new or to which both are troubling ministration would say about the cat had many critics left and right and that has many critics as well. of of course but the fundamental problem here with the show is in structural this financial countries started pay their dues their dirty ratio has become totally dependent. on aid coming from a handful of governments and from the former city people and history and from a few philanthropy well let's just go to the big pharmaceutical companies because in this book you do talk about the role of private health insurance and big pharmaceutical companies as being maligned act as i mean this pandemic was that

well the big pharmaceutical industries. which are always represented as being a main saved towards earth to disease the heroic innovators to earth new vaccines in the end drugs they become anything but they're in the case united states and through $950.00 s. . leading force the development of antibiotics for incentives was actually armed forces the u.s. army there is an important state rule in other words in the development of new pharmaceutical treatments put under big pharma. the the profits are made in developing heart medicines or serious fruit erectile disfunction and old men like like me not in developing a new generation of out of batteries and above all not in an i vy roles in vaccines

which have to develop may only be used to. once so big pharma his coat back massively on on research and spends far more on average tyson and it just doesn't take any leadership in developing. jugs and bank c.d.'s that are not highly probable but absolutely necessary for societies or home as you know they do devalue that they say they're doing their best they're involved in a new super national initiative against coronavirus just very briefly i did mention private health insurance you see that is symbiotic with us in october of last year . the council of economic advisers issued a report on oswald and demi. it is already seen as

is imminent in it they point out and advise the president that big pharma will be incapable of meeting. the challenge of a pandemic prove precisely the absence of a strong profit motive in developing a nano by rules and in back scenes this is would every big pharma says essentially bit of knowledge by by the government or new cures might in egypt. critics of big pharma private health care a court is it's lead to new reasons of americans tens of millions of americans without health care and that number has dramatically increased to poor is as people have lost their jobs in july base. health insurance and i think this sanders campaign really sent to skinny was absolutely correct to put. universal health care ridge at the forefront of the campaign and then is actually

massive support of you may think it's a minority position. which if you're on the news but survey out a survey shows that a to 70 percent of americans just want some form of single payer. health care which of course it was or course by reject that he wanted but in the book you also talk about the c.d.c. is this not just all private bad public the c.d.c. with such a reputation around the world for disease control in the united states and around the world they rejected the w h o developed covert testing kit that shocked you. yeah it is it is shocking they also had another alternative which was the other test kit insists it is centrally 3 separate ters and they could eliminate the flawed 3rd tears and so had a viable so why would they have done the well that's

a very interesting question they were defending true the problem with the tears was it was actually contamination in their own production lines in georgia the c.d.c. totally. loses and losing through 4 weeks of testing allowed the disease to grow exponentially so and marge who started off with a handful of untested cases by the end of march it was increasing exponentially or over. there were several $100000.00 cases of it's continued to urge to grow hair in that the c.d.c. is obviously we invite them on and there they say they're doing everything by the board you also actually talk about the fame thing happening with the immunity test i understand but the p.p.a.

catastrophe you blame jared kushner and vice president pat. yes. and in many others earn including. tony fauci who has true liberal americans in fact are majority americans because the the good doctor on the spar talking of truth so long as it's now sit back at the end of 0 year it was showing people absolutely no need so where were mass in the lead medieval samus because. of the drastic shortage of protective gear through hospital were who's who. in nurses but the one you see lied to the american public and this initial blue city campaign to discourage people from going out and trying to buy on a mass is said to her alone lansing in very bitter effect well thought out to

fatty obviously a hero to liberal media played by brad pitt in saturday night live with to deny anything he did was against clinical procedure and best interests of the american people what do you make of the fact they don't no one seems to really be talking about something like factory farming we had dr rob wallace he was telling us about the relationship between factory farming and coronavirus why do you think that's just not the subject of debate about when it comes to coronavirus in public discourse in nato nations. that of course is in part made in the largest for the the problem with the democratic party and the app measures it takes around issues of public health in the origination of epidemic. diseases because instead the endemic threat can be kind of triangulated 2 to

3 things one is factory farming the urbanization super reproduce ation of animals that maximizes. the probability of a viral evolution and transmission the 2nd is the old still destruction of the natural or it's there who traditionally isolated us from these enormous birol rizza poor's. and wild animal populations but the 3rd part and the most important has been the constant reduction of public in basic elp budgets. across the world i mean many african countries only have a very some once of public service some why sierra leone not at all which is why the ball spread so rapidly

a few years ago the in in western africa so each each point on their trying will have to see each side has to be in the address and into we see that in reinvesting in basic healthcare. it's the absolute. a purty. we're going to see. you should be able to mix. in a sense repeating backseats are not the solution a weapon the solution how it's the law needs to be st lawrence opens us she lies to . the destruction truck wars in this investment is basically you know you're just very briefly america since you are speaking to us from los angeles and you are the greatest chronicler of it sir history i better ask you even though tens of thousands upon tens of thousands are being killed in your

country by covert what you've made of the this incarnation of the civil rights struggle the black lives matter protests raging across the united states. well look after 30 sanders concession to joe biden. tens of thousands of young activist ideal words were basically lurked in the desert . who told the bully all you should do is going out there get it for the militant vote and this rebellious generation in a sense was saved by clients matter. and. it spins vanishing movement i can't really think of it there are in terms of its rapid development who could have. that the question basic fundamental question and it's. about easing in the need for police and. would have been put on international

agenda if you know to look for those who are seen on once in impossible so the black lights natter protests in addition to reminding us that civil rights have been under relentless attorney for the republicans. for 2 decades or to create a template for resistance of a far broader scale one of the things that i've been most concerned is the rule of unions in. chancy developing a strategy to run. in a dangerous conditions. this essential work force and health care workers it's absolutely outrageous the other day. a report from the nurses. united national nurses you sounded one 3rd of nurses nicklin 3.

you know access to this project. here they should add to the end i need why. math so months later on stage months into. memory that program unit is yet to be sold well donald trump says he's protecting the most vulnerable mike davis thank you that fit for the show will be back on wednesday 47 years to the day the cia station in chile received guidance from black to establish contact with military offices to overthrow democratically elected president salvador allende in the 911 washington back but feel that can save join the underground in your credit and throw in the face for. trade and investment to become magic spells to conjure economic development. most people think about trade they think about goods and services being exchanged

between countries and the and vast chapter of a trade agreement is about something very different but what when investment leads to toxic manufacturing that destroys sacred sites or ruins the environment. that means local communities that are being poisoned if they object if they do anything that a company feels is interrupting their profits they can be certain. the nationals are taking on the whole nation philip morris is trying to use i guess yes to stop or. implementing. regulations aimed at cutting domestic smoking rates french company. egypt because egypt the way democratic choice trump corporate law joins us as we try to find one of the 2.

prominent russian opposition activists alexina volunteers out of an engine used as alleged nerve agent poisoning a scene a wave of accusations directed at the kremlin also ahead. as protests against police brutality in the united states showed no sign of easing look at how the unrest has led to a surge in gun sales. extradition hearing gets underway in london wiki leaks founder is wanted in the u.s. to face espionage charges. hello monday evening here in moscow and.