strikes. to attack human. race now you know that the country i'm speaking to you from britain imposes sanctions on say venezuela or it recognizes a different president britain also sanctions north korea there are u.s. sanctions being imposed on different countries why has the u.n. secretary general said that coronavirus should mean a lessening of sanctions anyway. indeed there are also conscious action in sanctions and the different purposes also and it's going to need to protect human rights in a number of countries and this seems time b.c. really if you lived in europe especially when we speak of all the sectoral sanctions branson economic sanctions and the chief minister of number of syrian. euro and in particular interests ultimately was an ringback easter interest might

humanitarian matter grieve. different sorts of terrorists not be population anti muslim nation no please just not you're not a good person and that's why he takes into account that not going to see other people to. ask how not only math and math. he had no possibility. of the house and contents and if it's not beyond know what is the charity of itself and he had not was admitted to using it was just pretty sure to get him and that's why he not only made a special room it's be your my commission on human rights in the us and very good and share our. teeth so ringback please i'd really like you know it's our actions especially. if sanctions are not on the line to see that

human rights being right in my nation writes a letter i'll give it i mean mention syria and there are no i'm trying to ski and others have said there was no chemical attack on. the syrian people by the assad government but the british government says they were that's why they bombed it you presume radio on the bombing syria that's why britain has sanctions on syria and also britain says we give lots of aid to the vulnerable in syria while we sanction the syrian gov. and i'm. just to different aspects are public insurance option the best commissioner sure doesn't mean there it's alive right it's there is out of the money and there are actually live lives as a result of not just of that it's a guest of your many turned 80 and well that's an. irony that's no me nervous it's a human rights let's have

a conscience and well i want to hear you can study human rights including the rights and our rights and rights any right to access to information and parents alike but i didn't you know did your actions as well but must be around the humanitarian agency momentary. and. i have every advert every single actor to be right here in their embassy. but it is the system it's not sufficient. i'm going to be there man i'm a human if you should ensure well rounded well it's not complicated to get a license. and masson and sometimes it's impossible to get it done and. it's only going to get it in the interview matter and as you see bill right and i think that this humanitarian need is not i don't want to give you an example of euro. up to the united states have imposed sanctions or we. not screamers to

nice to you're on your back. and have no possibility to rightly many challenges us nancy yet here. and there was a highlight is an example of the european union has reported that for example yet ringback yet again companies so. massive write about one. and a grace formerly well being you know humanitarian he's. actually just on a practical man. what advice would you give to countries and presumably you applaud the e 3 u.k. france and germany for not following up on the sanctions what do you say to a company that may want to do business with one of these countries and may be subjected to 3rd party sanctions what are they supposed to do we had may have a contribution to health care or. indirectly what are they supposed to do should they just not do the business or risk the body sanctions from washington and no

receipt from the platen purpose to protect human rights and. germany's business to grantee the basic needs of people. and. eastern accumulator and. here well being action. that they have reason the doorway rumpel human it's very big today in the. human rights not less than sanctions. in india the majority of companies here. on the nontransparent be not sure that the sanctions. are not yet any. reason and companies graduated sanctions these really i think it's really going to really my sanctions 1st and 2nd even the grim eyed. humanitarian.

is that it is very transparent very creepy and. and. and one of the nature is not. you know actions any ground on. its own through the majority of sanctions here like to. well if if sanctions are so destructive as you say and as the u.n. secretary general says why is it that apparently countries like iran russia china they're all sanctioned they appear to be doing better in terms of coronavirus death rates than the countries imposing the sanctions britain has regard say syria and the united states and then national negated cherry pecans mentioned for example like the china and russia of europe and share. the brunt of. these people was not here and it seems i'm not. now here you still got.

the nice yeah you're on. your nerves enough. yeah iggy and i'll do the you know the position and actions so well because i didn't hear you i'm not able to. 'd answer this for example you summary and if you do not easily imagine for 2 grand of people and do your duty your i'd be in the have no idea. that this isn't yes you're. on the ground advice for example here if asked he cannot possibly say to myself. or one if it's a robertson insulates there is. no evidence this concern humanitarian you have but even from this i give you money. this i believe who gets to see that the sanctions countries and sentient countries and and he messed around about

not being not bitter munitions that is much more up ok i joined the russia was sanctions the us as well in that some levels is it credible what president maduro sad about the e.u. sanctions british sanctions american sanctions on men as well no. sanctions may have killed 40000 people the retired un reportorial for disaster their crimes against humanity that britain does not recognize the government of venezuela has just lost a case actually about gold in the bank of england 40000 killed by sanctions is a possible. if to tell the truth and not careful and usually comes about. in the very pipe that is the issue to disparage the beast but i respect it i usually try to correct myself. not in front sanction countries function. engineer. rights of civil society that's what i meant. yes.

the status as. you know it surely that's humanitarian you know reach or even almost to the situation since the jury in the. president and i believe your story. because. they granted it certainly your original sanctions and mine because. he did not meet people. and have as regards iran it's not only problems over medical supplies during covert it's also about media well and the speed not in media earlier than one could ever imagine is imagine bill you title sanctions actions and it cost to you and probably because much of the group is very you're not your average i mean to us and now.

that information has to be met no you can't call it and it's really us. in the us and them. this seems your financial. news actions. it is your i'm not in any media company so distributed information. yami. intervention. and actions so isn't that fair enough oh are you going to. just finally the famous cuba military blockade has been opposed by more or less every nation except israel and the united states at succeeding un general assembly here written a letter or made a statement urging the us to lift sanctions on cuba have you had a reply and question spectrum which i thank you. and. after the break with 54000000 americans reportedly set to go hungry join the

coronavirus pandemic does the middle class the trump and biden the trying to appeal to actually need to sink to create a better world all the more coming up in part 2 of going on the ground. computer communications were planted in humans and their communication 30 does a lot of things better than we do so the possibility not just being restricted with their brains we go out with a fine art no group growing but even today even just combining 2 human brains to go . i mean somebody has a lot of the advantages. in the 1920 s. and thirty's several 100 african-americans moved to the soviet union and many of their descendants still live in russia. looking at the cost of putting it on the

wash but also up at a stop yes it. will cyclone things on your way. back home black american suffered from racism and a complete lack of prospects. is that columbus month that he'll be a loser one by else a store on but by doing. so they decided to leave everything behind and start a new life in a country about which they knew almost nothing at all some of the african americans who were thrilled that you're in the united. around great credit. to moulay a golf you you're going to call you and now almost a 100 years later the history is repeating itself my great grandfather george time went to russia. probable worst crime to go anywhere why not me. when i come here.

welcome back 54000000 people in the united states may go hungry because of the trauma government's response to the coronavirus pandemic according to the country's largest hunger relief organization feeding america that 17000000 more since the start of the corona virus outbreak that can't afford to eat now the so-called richest president in history all trump and democrat big business ally joe biden who constantly appealed to the middle class for votes have just one week to win over those that have arguably been left behind joining me now from lawrence in kansas is professor david rohde good author of the sinking middle class the political history david welcome to you going underground people watching all around the world know

about how rich the united states is they see the glamorous images of middle class america arguably who are the middle class in the title of your book the sinking middle class. well depending on whom you're talking to it's either are of 40 percent or 96 percent of the u.s. population politicians in particular want to claim that higher figure and regard this is a group that they can talk to in an undifferentiated mass and if they can win this 96 percent obviously they win the election i think the middle class is bound to be an amorphous term because it doesn't like the working class to find a really material position in the world it's it's a subjective position in the world that traditionally has been around categories of entrepreneurship white collar labor sales labor middle management those give us the bulk of the of the u.s. middle class at least in the 20th and 21st centuries but you can see in just naming

those categories that they don't really fit together in any particular way or have a common set of interests to see right mills's book white collar the best us book on the middle class it when you get to subtitle it says the middle classes and right at the end of the book he says well there's really no such thing as you know i was ok well the term the term working class the idea that we have to work to be able to pay the rent that you explore also in the book but if we can just blame biden and trump for exploiting this ridiculously inclusive term you say that the majority of americans self identify as middle class and you also say that to an extent there's an element there of not being black. yes a. little bit depends how the question is asked on that self identification one if working class is given as a choice it splits more evenly right down the middle but that still leaves you 25

percent of the population of working class jobs and consider themselves middle class and race has a great deal to do with that in the united states when we say middle class we don't have to say white middle class but that's what the politicians mean and to some extent that's what the citizens mean when they say middle class because if it's a fake term that is used by powell which i think this book does suggest one i don't know it may horrify some people element in the book is where you say there's an element of it the term middle class being a cold war construct. yes saved it was no accident i think there when richard nixon wanted to debate the soviets about the superiority of the u.s. system he contrived to have that debate take place in a model u.s. kitchen and everybody understood that that signified a middle class home and signify this stay at home at that time a stay at home housewife all achievements of nixon would have said free enterprise

of the. capitalist system in the united states in the debates start to aggrandize that system as against. as against socialism and i think there was a tremendous buy in it's really in the cold war that you get massive use of the term middle class in us media in us academia note have to be clear we're all a bit confused about it those in power like bailed out banks like citicorp or citi group you say in the book in 2011 they've established there's no middle class there's just writ the rich and the rest of us those in power do realize something that the masses don't let alone journalist. yes i think that's right and his it it a little bit to use the old marxist term false consciousness to describe what we're saddled with in the majority of the population i think that there are for

historical reasons there are these miseries associated with middle class life and so people who identify as middle class are not only identifying with the common set of accomplishments and privileges but also where the common sense of intense anxiety they're going to sank and that and these are that they're miserable even before they sink and this has to do with debt and the way that white collar labor is managed in particular the personalities of white collar workers managed not just in the united states but i think to extend the world one of the things it's surprised me about the reception of this book and your show as an example is how much this is been this resonates in india for example and it resonates in the u.k. including in the u.k. . a fear that middle class identity and right wing.

politics coincide well don't trump often in his campaign speeches now uses a phrase the c word and of course many sun does use vs what socialism nomi how there are echoes there are actual echoes of this problem with the term middle class and the term socialism and communism yeah you mention mox you mention mox and why it is it's called the communist manifesto. yeah yeah and in the way back. communism was used to describe a working class classless society the campaign for the working class campaign and socialism was considered at that time a middle class movement so if you think about for example utopian socialists communal experience experiments marx and engels would have said those were both socialist and middle class and so they needed the word communist in order to

differentiate themselves from that by the end of engels his life he's kind of triumphant in saying we've taken the word socialism back and he's no longer so concerned to differentiate between a communist manifesto and a socialist manifest look at i don't know what bernie sanders will make make it valid but you do say in the book that there is a precedence in moxa who saw that the lower middle class small trades people shopkeepers they just sink into the proletariat anyway. yes and the title comes from orwell who george orwell also kind of played with that idea of sinking in that the same thing might not be such a bad thing. marx is often accused of not getting the middle class in marxism is a tradition is accused of missing the point the middle class was going to be so resilient and. powerful into the 20th and 21st centuries i don't think he

got that wrong at all the middle classes that he was talking about that is free farmers and shot as specially shopkeepers in cities did suffer a lot under industrial capitalism and did become a much much smaller share of the population particularly in the us where marx maybe . got it wrong was he predicted that there'd be such a powerful magnetic working class movement that would go from one success to another that middle class people as they fell would naturally be attracted to that movement and therefore become socialists well i do have to say that given that where again and again hearing this middle class term from joe biden's camp and from donald trump's term. his campaign you talk a little bit about how the cultural ideas of the middle class now embedded in the imagination of the militias death of a salesman who think biden and trump recognize that when they're shouting out how

they're going to help. people middle class people and now i think one of the things that we've lost is this o.c.a. not only from the left and much of the best scholarship on the middle class does come from the left from germany to the united states and in britain as as well. we've also lost it in kind of mainstream cultural criticism even into the early cold war our mainstream sociologist who wrote a survey books about the united states kind of identified me. class and middle brow and thought this was a. social formation it was oh the empty and. without culture and also miserable and we've lost that i mean at least at the political level. middle class is simply something to be defended it's a perch it's not apparel and when you talk about misery is that related to this a bipolar kind of world you describe had an ism and asceticism the something at the

core of being middle class that makes the miserable yeah i think this is dumb depends on that mass middle class identification with both. overspending and over working and being willing to be managed in a very close ways to take drug tests to have a 5th of your performance evaluation be on how happy you seem every work all of those things kind of seep into that into the culture and get taken for granted after a time i mean over here labor did have a about the socialist leadership jeremy corbett he's being replaced by cicada stahmann who says patriotism flags we need the white working class you say in this book there's a misunderstanding of this term white working class in fact it's not a good time at all. yes in the united states the aggrandizement of the middle class

in politics which really began with bill clinton's campaign. kind of deliberately confuse the terms white working class and middle class so when you were wanting to talk. maybe to a trade union audience in the united states you talk about the white working class and if you were on t.v. for everybody you would you would talk about the middle class and in the last years the last 4 years since trump's election this term white working class. has really really strongly resurfaced in certain quarters and by then it was a leader of that research. surfacing of the term white working class i think it's both usages middle class and white working class and saying that they're going to pay attention to these groups and not really develop any kind of a program that would address the plight of working people once you say white

working class and i'm going to pay attention to the white working class you always as a politician have the option to simply pay attention to them as white and to promise them to hold back on racial justice issues to be tougher on crime to lower taxes to kind of indulge in all these code words and dog whistles that have been so much a part of u.s. politics for 40 years now yes african-americans half as likely to self identify as middle class whoever wins whether it's biden or trump though do you think that we should allow the maybe the middle class themselves to say basically. i would love to see the term sink. it pains me a lot that our trade unions even fight campaigns now in the name of defending the middle class instead of defending working people and that's bad on class grounds but it also is bad on the grounds of racial justice because everybody assumes that

it's this. or a typical white suburb that's being appealed to when we say the middle class and is being appealed to in its worst possible instinct toward differentiating it so from black people professor david wright to get thank you and that's it for the show will be back on saturday yes or the day since the u.k. was promised a halloween bricks that you know if so but according to prime minister morris johnson but it was then delayed triggering the transition phase which is set to end of this new year's eve possibly with no trade deal with the european union until then catch all our interviews on you tube channel and don't forget to join the underground by following us on twitter facebook instagram and santana. is that amazing country with so many friends in russia and i'm very excited to be

here. i love that idea i think i can do that. every nice i make a lot of money with them but they make millions and hundreds of me. can can can can. he has a nice. a great wall and nobody builds laws better than me believe and i'll build a very inexpensive like a great great wall. and just in case you're worried about who's going to pay for it mexico will pay for. it we'll see what happens. we'll see how the film will be successful.

not only speaking the role of the media is to inform the public this mission is now on hold large parts of the media landscape particularly big tech actively intervene to determine what the public can know and how is controlled speech please freedom of speech. the maternity town the slums go in and you may never get out some sort of the most of. my teenage gang rules here. wanna. be my good good luck. but. maybe it will be very. nice seeing her. but now it's looking for

the yeah. as soon as me and melanie went up in the food. you know the mccain little communes all i see.

france intensifies a muslim country satirical magazine she adds fuel to the. president is now threatening legal action. racial tensions spike in the united states just days before the election there philadelphia is shaken by a 2nd night by the protests and looting after a black man shot dead by police and in the home of a global role with russia across the world health organization to register its new . infections in the country.