tv Documentary RT November 15, 2020 1:30am-2:01am EST
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jane, how did you get into this work? i was a public defender in manhattan here in new york city for about 3 years. and we saw a lot of police misconduct. do you know we were doing arraignments up until 1 am in the morning and you see people beat up or, you know, people whose cases get dismissed who get no compensation. so my husband and i left the legal aid society with the hopes of doing civil rights work. my name is a distinguished professor of psychology at john jay college of criminal justice. once a false confession, a stake in the case is closed to nobody really can tell the difference between a good confession and one that is a problem with all of this is that that can be used to get innocent people. and i don't just mean vulnerable, innocent people, i mean people who are sitting around the world to confess, to crimes. they didn't commit
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any time you do an exoneration case when there's been a false confession. it's like trying to write a try. so everybody's already against you. the person's been convicted by a jury. the judge thinks he's guilty. the jury thinks he's guilty. now you have to convince everybody that they're wrong. so ok, so you're deeply invested in is a case of an alien ship who has been in prison for 20 years. renee lynch was a case where he took about 2 and a half, you know,
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maybe 3 years ago now. and she was accused and convicted of killing her landlord in buffalo, new york in 1900. and it's also obviously a false confession case. the police are going crazy and they can't solve it 18 months go by. and bernie's connection to the victim was that it was her landlord. and so they are start looking into renee, who at the time was heavily addicted to drugs crack cocaine. and because she gets arrested for something else and they start interrogating her. and she confesses to killing her landlord with this guy kareem. so she says kareem and i went to my landlord's house. we were going to rob her. the robbery goes bad and karim stabs her, so it can make it a felony, murder being present during the commission of a crime, and somebody gets killed. we started sort of doing, you know,
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just regular google searches on the players' names and detectives and everything. and this women behind bars comes up and they've done an episode case where they got in the, in the prison and interviewed her and then interviewed this joseph court was the cop on the case. the way her body was time to tell the truth. i believe her confession is kind of nonsense. there's inconsistency between the physical evidence and what she says and during the show he says, well, i mean we knew that corinne walker was in florida at the time of our crime. kareen was of the time i guess they knew kareem walker was in florida at the time the crime then rene's confession can't possibly be true because she's confessing to going to rob the landlord with kareem and the defense been able to put that on her confession would made no sense,
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but the defense was never told the whole thing is so full of holes and so bogus. i can't put my finger on to say like, you know, this is the thing, but i think if we dug in it, we could find out things that could get her out because it's all, it's just all of it. so it's messed up. how do they record this confession? and didn't know, i mean, did they make her write a statement? they typed it up and then read it to her maters. so there is a type of confession is the only version of the confession. there's no like original notes they have or something that we have to wonder about. she says she knew details about the crime scene because they showed her photos of it. details that she know how the body was lying and being shown her those photos. so you would have to find some kind of new evidence that didn't exist at the time of the trial
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or didn't, didn't exist at the time of the trial, but it wasn't known right? and it wasn't presented during the trial. and if we have to show that if it had been could have likely been a different outcome i think we can, but it's going to be hard. our goal is of course to get renee out of prison, but it can take a really long time. sometimes many years, and one of the 1st things we do in cases like this is to comb through the confession and find all the consistencies to clearly show that the confession is false. and if there's a cream walker drove me to 90 longmeadow, and the plan was, i was going to go into the front door and cream was going to come up the back door . he was going to tie her up with a piece of white extension cord that he brought with him. at that time,
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kareem hit louise in the side of the face and louise fell to the floor and kind of went out. if that happened, he would be standing punching her here right. here in the face, he knocked the wig. a wig landed on the floor in the kitchen kitchen. he tried to tie louise up with the plastic already has then cream comes from behind . louise. he stabbed her at least twice. however, we know it's 8 times louise fell to the floor again. it was a large amount of blood on the floor next to her body. so the only thing she gets right is that the way gets knocked off. that there's a plastic cord involved in this case is correct and the phone cord is where the extra d.n.a. is. ringback just
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in these jean fisher byron nelson, rene lynch's attorney. i have a call with her this morning. oh good things. how i oh oh oh oh oh oh. oh oh. oh oh oh oh, why? earth are quite high. oh oh. i know it's hard for our remaining one to trial, she testified, been very incoherently. she was high during the trial in which she was not
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a good witness for herself. she recanted right away afterwards and her confession is that it was coerced. and when i talk to people about this, they're like, well, i would never cross a contests where people say, i've been talking about this for 30 years and that's the 1st thing. everybody says i get it, but it wouldn't happen to me. it's not one kind of person that is a false confession. we are all fall into the circumstance of interrogation. we are all there is some training to texas. i've spoken to who say i can get anybody to confess to. many of them will boast that they have a 95 percent confession, right? conceivable. unless you're a lesser near perfect, at identifying the perpetrator, that is every suspect you identify is the perpetrator, right? if you've got a confession rate at that level, you produce an awful lot of false confessions the renee lynch, when i talked to her about it, she explained to me, i was so shocked that they convicted me. she said,
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because there was no evidence of a confession so powerful it can stand alone. so here's the jury. on the one hand, they've got the confessions alone and they're going to delay the confessions trumped. the d.n.a. changes everything. and sometimes i'd like in the final product of a confession. holywood production is scripted by the police theory of the case is rehearsed and action, camera ready to go. and that's what the jury sees. they don't see the whole production, they just see the final. i don't see how a judge or a jury can look past a false confession. if they don't see the presence, we have a number of documented cases in which the person who falsely confessed actually came to believe the lie that they were told about their own behavior. which is
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a whole nother level of insanity. and some of those believe it for a long time afterwards, right there . here in the melted thompson case we had he was a danish inturn who came to danish, he was a college student studying to become, a teacher. and he came and interned at i.p.s., which is really, you know, like a $20000.00, a year preschool up by the u.n. . and it was a code teacher who accuses me of molesting all the kids in the class. and he's on the cover of the daily news. they take his focus, his facebook profile pictures,
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him with his niece on his shoulders. so they put that on the cover of the daily news and write sex monster. and they go arrest him in the morning and bring him into the station and they have a female cop interrogate him. she tells him while, you know, we have video of you molesting these kids, which they had videos, but he's not molesting anybody. so they had this woman who accused him, had taken videos of him in the classroom, interacting normally with children. and so either the cops had watched it or they had watched it and were blatantly lying to him, but there was no video of him molesting kids, but he hears that right. and he thinks holy, well, if i'm on video, i must have done it right. they let him continue to believe this lie that he's caught red handed on tape molesting these kids. and i think that, that, you know, he started, you could tell through the hole when they finally are recording him. he's doubting
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know, some really awful lives out there where nat is the person that cheesiness and they are considered the most dangerous of criminals. she's in a still falling off 23 hours of the day. tell me that it's not in a condition in the world of women on death row, on r.t. . during the vietnam war, u.s. forces also bombed neighboring laos. there was a secret war. and for years, the american people did not know until our mouth can rebound country per capita, all human history, millions of unexploded bombs still in danger, lives in this small agricultural country. so i really don't think it's happening there. even today,
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kids in laos full victims of bombs dropped decades ago is the us making amends for their tragedy and help to the people need in that little land on mars. mr. thompson, can you tell me why i'm here because in order for inappropriate behavior, it was ok. so why don't you tell me privately and how this started? what happened? you know, what you know? well this i can remember just had to go down just
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a few moments ago and then proceed in the present. and i had taken its place and playing around kinsler on my shorts and you know, short of going forward in that or question where you're going. and so what, when you say gave him pleasure at one time that the central of it would have to be i don't know, you know, my memory of it. it's like, is this not of it? if you read out the statement i did as your handwriting, and if i am just waiting over briefly,
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does it look like it's been changed in any way? and that's your signature. because you're at this hour earlier today, you're going to show it to the camera. i don't even think people in the u.s. really get that the police are allowed to lie to you. i think most people would think that if i am speaking to a police officer, he's telling me the truth. but now to times, i mean in denmark, it's illegal for the police to lie to you. so he really, i think, was, was, you know, really says extra susceptible to something like that. it took us filing the civil rights suit to even get access to these tapes. the district attorney wouldn't give it to us when the criminal case was pending. we asked the court, we moved for a court order to get at the judge just wouldn't give it to us. but they sat on these tapes for 8 months. he had this case hanging over his head and they knew that there was nothing in the tapes. right,
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and the truth was there was the only evidence there was yes, luckily mel to never got convicted right. we were able to stop it before that happened. but it took, i mean, it almost killed him. there. sexual abuse involving very young children were brought to the attention to do the district attorney's office to thoroughly investigate and involved with your children. particularly in this instance, people are willing to dismiss this case after all, and gather in our past. we have to have
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it on your head to give them a little for a little better if they're flat. because if there is some clue feed, then the hair is not like it's just like a 3 to 4 inches of phone cord at 10 days case, we're trying to get permission to test all the old evidence for d.n.a. . but to do that, we have to collect as much information about her innocence as we possibly can. and go back and interview all the witnesses documents, go back to the crime scene. i keep coming back
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to this thing that the cops knew. he was in florida and kept going with the story that they did together. like if they know he's in florida, why don't they like your lives? they're lying to us because he's and we know he's in florida. why don't they are confronted by hearsay? that how can they be permitted to go forward with a serious of a case that they know is not true. name names and trial basically matter. so that's why the trickery and the only way to convict somebody of this was to do it that way. yes. it just makes me so jaded and really disgusted with the district attorney's offices. and i feel like, you know, you know, they're supposed to be at the top of the chain right there is supposed to be the ones making sure the cops made mistakes or people below the cops made mistakes.
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then they're the ones who are responsible for fixing it. why not do d.n.a. testing? think why not? they were all, we're not infallible. we can all make mistakes. why not check? i mean, her name is going to be in prison for the rest of her life. why not just check? you know, they can never answer that question. so you just end up in court with, you know, them opposing your motions for d.n.a. testing and unending ability gating instead of working together. in rene's case, it's especially frustrating because, i mean they certainly believe that this was done. not the stabbing was not done by her. so there is a set the, i mean, they're basically admitting that they have a cold case and there's a murder out there. and they still don't want to do it. you know, it's did 2 people either 2 people or somebody other than renee, committed that crime. and that person is out and about, and d.n.a. contesting could show who they are, but they're still posing as am
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you know, the central park jogger case was my 1st interaction with false confessions our firm represented corey wise on his civil rights case way to start i mean, you're diving right into the deep end there. you know, the circumstances at play in that case were huge amount of pressure on the police and the authorities to make arrests and make them step
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forward. 7 years in prison. was one of most notorious crimes in the history of new york city. it was a crime in which a woman who was a wealthy upper east side investment banker was out jogging and was dragged into the woods in central park and almost beaten to death. and there was front page news every day, everywhere, and they are out to get arrests and they got him when you get to the false confessions, in that case, it was a classic, you know, mismatch. they were totally overmatched, underrepresented, if represented at all. i don't know what they could do, corey, even have anyone in the room without his consent is 16. so he was considered an adult, sadly. and so his mom was not allowed in there, and they, you know, had,
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why it is hard for people to understand how this can help, how the could produce a confession, something they didn't too. and there really is a complicated set of stories is there is no one reason you know, corey, why is confessed to get out of this bad situation. he was under pressure from many, many hours. he was likely be told that others were giving stories and that to, to cooperate in order to go home. and it is very telling in the central park 5 case that every one of them, every one of the boys and every one of the parents who were present were surprised . the boys were arrested after their statements. every one of the time i was going home right back. well, you know what, that sounds crazy right here. thought you were gone or confess to a rape and go home. right. but you know that one false confessors were interviewed
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afterward, and they've been exonerated. and the 1st question, everybody wants those, i don't understand why don't you confront the most typical response? because i want to go home. innocent people often say after wards, you know, i was so i'm tired. i was so stressed. i figured let's sign this confession. it'll all work itself out. in the end. the detectives often say, you know, we have d.n.a., we're going to send them to the lab. they think that claiming they have t.n.a. bluff is a way to scare the criminal into submission. it may be right, but if the person you're talking to is not the criminal but an innocent person, then the law becomes a promise of future exoneration. paradoxically makes it easier to confess, right? we're going to do some tests. we're actually quite samples from a lot if i just let you know that if we do that,
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we will probably get an order to take a sample from you. and then we'll compare it to tests or this area because you're in this issue now where if you know that there's an end of the a match, you better off. tell us about it. now, instead of saying something that's natural, part of the story, one of the things i think they made you say was that you cut her out of the legs. and where did you, how did you come up with that? i don't know came from no, i don't know. made it up. i don't know where it came from. no, i don't know. on election night, you may know whether the margin for the winner is so large that it is impossible for the defeated candidate to catch on. so there may still be 10000 votes to count
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them, but the margin is 80000 votes. it doesn't matter if all 10000 votes went for the defeated candidate, they cannot possibly catch up and that's where we are today. joe biden's margin is so large in of all of the states are being contested. that even though some of the states have not finished counting, they still know who won. and joe biden won a majority of electoral college votes which will give those will super wolf to push through the posts of here. but the truth to nobody at the club or was it short order. cook doesn't actually matter. vegetable would have been murdered by hugo. that when you discuss all of this, going to use the word because those don't get me again. we will see in the movie it
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is with seemingly more business, but it is the most severe. some of it is in your speech, come on, and it is the of the 20th century was thing in or of revolution, the great depression and world war, the 21st is the century of mental illness. those aren't my words. that's what surfaced. some psychologists tell us, the only question is, should we accept it as a fact? or no. the world is driven by a dream, shaped by one person of those great snow day or thinks. we dare to ask
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historic peace deal brokered by moscow was signed by armenia and azerbaijan entering almost 2 months of bloodshed in the going to come about. and the personnel have been sent into the region to ensure all certain things don't break out again. i think all means have been taking to the streets of the capital, accusing the country's prime minister of betrayal of branding. the truce a humiliating defeat sanctions against french and german officials says the spot overlooks enough on these alleged escalates. government spokesperson gave an exclusive interview to r.t. commenting on balance refusal to cooperate in the case of information.
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