such cars are are. you. there are such. utter. there's out on. welcome to the alex salmond show where we examine britain's long slow farewell to europe the talks interchange agreement i know not just an injury time but the injury time of extra time and it's unlikely that the bells will be ringing across the continent when big ben bones in the new year and liked it today we take the long view because these talks in brussels are not just for christmas but for ever 1st we talked to the only minister who was as red lines as margaret thatcher in the tory government of the 1980 s. that a possible. we ask this born again breaks

a tear whether europe the issue which has haunted the tory party for half a century i finally been lead to based then return to form a leader of the ulster unionists might now as the emulate and ask him whether borders johnson has broken 2 years for the price of $1.00 and we ask rebel scottish nationalists angus macneil m.p. why northern ireland to stolen a march on scotland but 1st alex that you think emails and messages. well lots of reaction to last week's show or with a professor look at meal of the college dublin and dr chris murphy of cambridge university they were talking about covert vaccines and also about what they call the common sense christmas and that's been drawn into sharp relief this week with the dramatic joint declaration from the british medical journal and the health service journal to politicians about the consequences of the proposed christmas relaxation but on the vaccine issue terry says there would be with these fantastic

scientists chris and particular manages to get complicated messages across in a way that's easy to understand norma johnson reminds us that $4000.00 people a day currently dying in the u.s. going up every day i think a vaccine is very unnecessary i'm jordan says now where did you get your loan for norma johnson i'm on the side of the ocean that's about 2300 a day but that is still too many short martin sounds a lot of skepticism he says norma johnson you won't find many disagree but anyone any sense won't trust an untested vaccine rushed through our broadcast says check out the brand new book by the c.e.o. of the world economic forum titled the great reset way too many convenient coincidences coming out of all this but in middleton says the virus is highly contagious and could easily advantage of control and swamp our health services it's not just about the mortality rate the back to. back and it will agree to

cutting with almost as well known as market factor and higher than politics he feared for authority prime minister well i knew it so have part of the bible and got breaks a guy are there for their traumas to come alex is in conversation with a to b. in a county and in a car a welcome back to the alex salmond show. to be here with you again. this christmas drama and process. going to be the end of it one way or another even when ben ben bones and hawkman me at midnight will that be the last time we have this sort of crunch talk and an hour standoff in brussels well i think we all hope so and it looks as if that might be the case i mean the u.k. is prepared to go out with no deal of business people have been this point sell many times before everyone's going to be heartily glad to see the back of it reacts

sick and tired of breaks and we're sick and tired of all the rouse you know we just like to get on with the living globally which is what we've been doing for hundreds of years but they're going to come from our i remember you that you would have a fancy pro unit pin you had one of this cute tory ministers who is prepared to stand up for britain's place in europe and what's happened you know a born again breaks a t.m.o. . that was then of this is now yes you're absolutely right and i stuck to the archive polemics in 1904 i looked at sandy again in 1909 but i think opinion was by then became need to be really quite critical of brussels i like the idea of a big international group of nations coming together voluntarily countries which had forced each other we used to throw bombs as each other from each of the cities struck and i like the idea of these countries coming together in peaceful trade i think what did happen though by the rustic treaty was it was clear that some of the

people in brussels have more ambitions and that amounted to build a united states of europe and a lot of brits just began to feel uncomfortable by the time we got to the referendum i campaigned to stay abreast of the campaign to stay in europe but we must stand a great believer in democracy and increasingly actually joining the negotiations the all. difficult the no curate and. upscale ranch a stash of work i'm looking for mold just bloody minded brussels became the more i thought to myself then i just didn't trade they're interested in bringing this rebel to heel and the more hostile i found myself becoming and that was what i was funny on the doorsteps of here in the north of england as well so we got to be done with it be glad to be ousted it and i'm quite sure we will strive perfectly well without being told what to do any longer by the last week there was

a stop by the ministry of defense about deploying the royal navy against french official and minister to you the p. and peace is not just a quest for there's a gunboat diplomacy perhaps utopian peace can be taken for granted. well hey you do realize of course that we have 4 naval fishing control vessels anyway and that they check all sorts of ships including those for example from russia to make sure that they are using the right size nets and not taking more than that catch and so on is one of the reasons why the north sea is thriving and fish stocks have recovered so well whereas the mediterranean which is substantially controlled by the e.u. is empty if they should so it's an important thing that we're doing a conservation terms but the minute we can't classically britain can't save itself from from you know. a utopian country where for utopian nations like untold normal

is not reality. of course it is and nobody wants to sever ourselves from here the question is how we will trade in future and nobody is saying that our trade will stop that's the kind of story it's put across alex by remaining us who we call now ramona right but the idea here is that we should have trade as free as possible on the kind of terrorists that have being talked about which would be applied on the w t o rules world trade organization rules are relatively small and also if you take into account exchange fluctuations our exchange that's ration so sterling against the euro a much larger than any tariffs would be so i don't think this gotta be a problem plus we're a very very competitive market very competitive if we can get our avocados from space we'll get them from peru if we count for 2nd from

a silly well of course from chile or australia and we will raise a toast to prosperity as we do so he'll watch raquel's and to invest to him the former tissue of ireland to him in a point dissolute getting new markets is all very well. l b e don't give up the ones you've gone as you're seeking new markets isn't that a good amount of piety sanson home back to him has to say yes of course because nobody wants to give the markets will giving up markets you know nobody's building a wall and saying to british lorries you can't come in here especially if they're bringing parts to build ups truck and in germany you watch and simply waited to be quite relaxed about it in fact the government has already said that there won't be a build up of traffic up ports right dover the idea is to bring all the traffic in and then read directives and if it needs checking and it might be checking because it could have contraband of one kind or another could have an illegal immigrant

said for example that really desperately wanted to leave france has come to britain but it needs checking then it can be checked away from the pool where there shouldn't be any congestion we are not cutting off ties with here we're not cutting off any ties with the e.u. countries all with the hundreds of millions of people who live there they will continue to be extremely welcome when they want to come here and it'll be the very very light regime longstanding companions and can catch it. and neighbors i don't really don't see that big a problem what i do see is that we will develop much closer relationships of the rest of the world because the e.u. itself is a protectionist operation that sets up barriers against the rest of the world and the rest of the world has been growing an awful lot faster we see that as being incredibly beneficial to the u.k. i did it in the end to europe as well but it's not a huge historical anomaly here and i mean it was modified here prime minister when

you said have them government who more than any other figure created the single market place that was a really a prospect of leaving out market function creation. well you're quite right because when we joined the european economic community as it was then it was really wasn't anything to do with trade i mean there wasn't much going on there was a lot of trade going on and it was market that drove through the idea that we have to do is get rid of barriers and get rid of attempts to keep out of the people's goods and services we're not trying to do that at all we never have done and she pushed hard for this to happen and it went alongside the other freedoms of freedom of movement of capital well that's not going to change freedom of movement of goods and services actually there isn't even now a treaty about the single market the services if we want to buy insurance from x.

german company well we do and i have not the least doubt that they will continue to sell it to us and the freedom of movement of people now that's cause all sorts of problems because we are a main destination for people coming from the other side of europe you know they trudge through european country after year thing country and they want to get to britain because here they are treated with more dignity and more equality than a many other countries in europe so i think there are lots of lessons that lots of lessons but what we've been able to do in recent years i think is encourage the world trade organization to become much more effective and with the u.k. rejoining w.t.f. i think that's going to be a very big part of our mission over the next few years not to benefit trade in many many countries could benefit trade in africa could benefit trade rights through south america it's going to be very important going to come away let's take the long view finally if seating for conservative prime ministers affectively fall on

the unit be an issue margaret thoughts of john major david cameron and of course the reason me do this any prospect of you don't know reimagine to haunt the tory party at all is it going to be done with do you think the issue is finished for good or do you think given your long political experience and may come back to bite you. oh i think it will be done and dusted though there will be negotiations over many years there a bound to be an important trading call them neighbor of the countries but once we have achieved the sovereignty that we really want to have that we achieved when we left on january 31st it doesn't look like he has got his head around what it needs at all i think that issue in political terms will will fade we haven't got a general election in the u.k. so 2024 by which time it'll be done and dusted down will be looking more sissy

whether have a long term affects of krenov irish on the economy what have been dealt with whether we're able to look to the future with confidence and whether this wonderful country if asked a will continue to play a very big card globally as it always has. it really complements of the season and frank you once again for joining me from yelling sam until the cast yourself take. care of us after the break when we turn to the north and west to see where northern ireland and scotland figure and a continue main break that trauma china thing. mom will keep me in the. kitchen with the silly.

pseudo love just a little mom who is good to look at that isn't a moment ago i. finally managed. to. even get to. his 4th graders who would appear to. believe in this film.

welcome back how do you see impasse in brussels being regarded in the celtic nations of the u.k. parts of england may be gung ho for breaks it but northern ireland and scotland voted to remain so what are the long term implications for the british union from border says battles with brussels alex is in conversation with former ulster unionist leader mike nesbitt amélie and chair of the heist of commons international

trade committee mcneill m.p. . might nesbitt you seem to have got the best deal with a lot you know now in the foot in both counts in the single market in the british market you quite happy with the way things are going regardless of the else legs well i know you guys over in scotland are very envious of the going on with possibilities for us but politically we're not sitting pretty because we think that the protocol which of course comes into effect whether there's a overarching trade deal or not really gives the lie to the thought that brics it meant taking back control because during all the years in the decades when we were on to control brussels they were very few restrictions on the movement of goods between any of the 4 constituent parts in it it came to but of course once we took back control the 1st thing the u.k. government had to do was negotiate with brussels and they become is this new organ of protocol which means there are a lot more checks and restrictions on the movements of goods within the 4

constituent parts of the united kingdom particular goods coming from england scotland or wales into northern ireland and you know that that presses a button for you know sweet we have a sense of sort of perpetual betrayal and the feeling is that boris johnson not only through unionism under the bus see them go into the bus and reversed it back over us. so i just mean we'll work. in the how come no a mile and there's a effectively achieve the status scotland wanted i'm in is up ballers johnston's malevolence of his a scottish incompetence firstly i'm very envious of my mess it's a situation and he's only about 150 miles to the south of me or directly from heaven east and you know he's got options or that we have the same options because that air freshener net landing and the catch 90 percent you know off the m.p. markets i would have greater restrictions than anybody london and makes the area so i do think that. this is ended up on all alan and thereby. accident nobody

particular seem to wanted northern ireland and scotland didn't want it and didn't get it and of course course we're both parts of the u.k. that it voted against it but fortunate for northern ireland and unfortunately for us a different the better of the 2 situations and incidentally the worst affected part of all of you took all of europe not just the u.k. is going to the highlands and islands of scotland so sometimes they're talking about the reunification of ireland perhaps we should unify scotland into because of the bottle city and decision making someone else better off. and i'm in london of course edinburgh but the best option of all. well that's almost a invitation to new delhi either coming there from angus make meal nightmares but look what you were saying earlier but what is johnson the bust trundling over here are you suggesting that i want to break up one union in the european union wallace johnson may be endangering another union the british union. i do of always of the

brics it was an existential threat to the union and you know there's a sort of irony there in that for centuries rather than decades unionists have looked over the sugar nastiness as the big threat the union but of course not and they are supplanted i would suggest by scottish nationalism and the real big threat is is english nationalism and i think in this nationalism was what drew bracks it and nobody who is an english niceness gave much thought to the fact that it breaks it went ahead they would be changing people's sense of identity here in this part of the united kingdom in a way that the belfast good friday agreement said was not possible because of course in 98 we said that individuals to find their own identity they can be british or irish or both i think a lot of people here also embrace the sense of europeans and feel diminished because that sense of european spruce denied them by english nationalism and not

bricks that referendum vote so we do have to think about how we be calibrated relationships between the islands and go back to the 3 sets of relationships from a good friday agreement the internal relationships in northern ireland the relationships north side on the island and east west between the 2 highlands i guess but neal your chair of the international trade committee of the house of commons. you and your colleagues all the way in the putting a but the implications of brics i mean trade there isn't going to the right until a standstill and. johnson right to say those these markets beckon air across the world are full. britain can step into the i suppose the truth is a pain when tend to begin with tradesmen on the go since the stone age and we don't really want to go to that sort of level of hate i mean what would you have is the warning some reputable bodies such as that would holiday association which talk about it being an affected across the short and less channel crossing by

a boat to 65 to 80 percent of the current volumes as there's a deal and 40 percent to 65 percent if there's no deals either way it's by the pilot boat and the new trade deals just give some context about it and no deal breaks it will cost some 106 percent of g.d.p. and a deal will bid for 9 percent of g.d.p. so let's put that into an end to pounds for a comparison that's easy to understand say 716 foot or 90 well these deals these 15 agreements that the u.k. government trumps i will worth the equivalent of the american you'll be worth about 20 pence it estonian deal's off the books $2.00 to $3.00 pounds and you zealand deals with about a penny a canadian deal is worth probably about $3.00 to $4.00 pence again it is japan deal was worth nothing because we were already creating with a deal as so you lose another 7 pounds 60 a 4 pound 90 and gaining something like 2728 pence 29 pence maybe in return now if i take some and i'm 60 way from ya'll i can give you 29 pence and her

. pockets an awful lot lighter and that's a situation and that breaks it in the bank city as a given as well getting on t.v. and talking about chinese trade deals but giving new context as to what they mean like as when miller has a view from ballet you've just brought into the language of everyday people but as your colleagues an international trade committee are they all convinced that blacks is going to be the the big problem that you are arguing is going to be well as opposed to a number of and you insist that it have got to play it with i mean it truly members that i know we know exactly and they will put it. better not speak for them but at . i don't create any contradiction it's safe to what i've said as a the labor members are more intimate with what i've been saying and i think you know everybody speak to whether it's a mental haulage association the british public and so you see the price of u.k. chicken is going to go up in the u.k.

regardless of deal or no deal either 5 percent or 25 percent and there is nobody i've spoken to and livestock in medicine human animal in manufacturing as he's anything good from but actually it all seemed damage economic damage and damage to the pockets and to people's jobs and livelihoods probably know that alan was born out of a field of of the backwardness as was viewed of the republic of ireland a 100 years ago but the economic prospects for most people in the in the in these islands near are we're looking at ireland in racine what they can do in the european union and we're wondering what the heck leaders in london have been up to walking away from this when they see the figures these are little government figures i was quoting incidentally this is economically damaging to jobs and there is to people like goods and life chances and the work marcus rushford incidentally has done and food banks and food for children in might need to call in the manchester united team and the england team to get this is sorted into just such the difficulties are likely to beat might mess but you've been loaned anonymous

posters are trying to take a long term view of things give us some of that insight and where you think the deal no deal half a deal in and brussels is going to be in the long term for northern ireland for ireland and for the rest of the united kingdom we're going to think long term that the reality is that business people adapt to whatever circumstances they are presented with so what they need is certainty they may not like the detail of a certain date but they will take certain dates and then move on to to their best advantage but we haven't got to certain. yet and 2 factors are that i just find but musing are the bricks and tears always seem to think that the e.u. 27 we're going to sit on around the table and say well we must give better trading arrangements to the united kingdom and we're recording ourselves and the 2nd thing

is this this talk of the shiny new you market summit or the e.u. 27 soon put it they don't see these markets and if i was one of those markets the question is would i rather negotiate with boris johnson representing a marketplace of 67000000 or would i rather negotiate with russell's and other marketplace with 470 or 480000000 and there's just no logic to these arguments my mess but better have told me in the sure few months back that i can well understand why britain wanted to develop new markets but i couldn't understand why they wanted to give up the ones they've got is a sideshow thing you'd agree with the former. saluki you build with what you've got you don't dismantle it can take use of going to ground 0 now and then transferred again he is absolutely right until to a certain extent bricks of those on down work that's been building since 1908 with

the both us good friday agreement where relationships north and south who are accomplice to flee better than the in history and i haven't been partners coming develop relationships and structures like going to assert ministerial council and to trade our land which isn't a lot of trade but it suddenly because of bricks that we're becoming rivals again and not to me it's a retrograde step finally angus but nowhere where is the future for scotland are you casting or looking at after you looking then be a slave to iceland and to norway how are you going to reestablish these trading relationships with europe that loop and one way or another are going to be badly interrupted or severed over the next few months. there's 2 buying said to do answer that the u.k. is now going to be the only major country in western europe not in the single market as you mention iceland and f. town which is in single market and norway switzerland on all of the single market

believes the u.k. in a very peculiar position a damaging position for those who are creating and selling and importing to the u.k. one thing that gives me hope in the midst of all this madness and i know is because it's quite right but the point of negotiations and destroying what you've got is hopefully we can change and we can rebuild and return to what we had and mended aliza as a scotland would be the worst affected by this but it would kind of lee said in a period when i was 16 opinion polls in scotland have given majorities ever scottish independence and i think people are seeing the stewardship the bad stewardship that we've had from london very recently and the hope is that we will turn this very big economic negative into a constitutional positive imagine an independent scotland as a result of it we will of course remember good friends know that i am be good friends and neighbors to them as we will hopefully to england and everybody else as well right now as a bit of they'll still insignia behind you i'm just mill with the the saltire

flying proudly behind europe thank you so much for for joining me and they'll examine she'll. you're very welcome. in the bush me. in scotland we're ruling the fact that we're the only u.k. nation not to get some of what we voted for england and wales will to believe under leaving northern ireland bush should remain and is staying at least huffing but poor european scotland is being left out in the cold the 3 sticking points in the negotiations remain the same fisheries the level playing field and governance at the end of the day the price of fish determined by market access is more important than the quantities caught while which court decides what and in which order is capable of a political fight each however the level playing field is more difficult because here the tories are victims of their own singapore of a line take rhetoric the european union is not going to concede favored access to

markets and a competitive advantage to its near neighbor that pos is unlikely to be sold anytime soon at least not cheaply and thus this year's narratively renditions of old line side may have a particular point and see right across europe but for now from alex myself and all the short stay safe i wish see you again next week for our christmas special. thanks. to.

headline in the 17th of december more worrying news coming out about pfizer's new covert vaccine to health care workers now in alaska reportedly suffering allergic reactions to the job with one rush to intensive care. the world health organization warns of a post christmas surge in europe as the continent's sets bleak new coronavirus records ahead of the festive period. hold his annual q. and a session on thursday this time by video link the russian president will tackle the most critical national and global issues. and ordeal reveals that wiki leaks founder julian assange tried to warn washington back in 2011 about whites.