his faith. in the world corrupted you need to descend. to join us in the depths. aura maybe in the shallows. riots broke out in several u.s. cities just hours after new president joe biden vows to overcome the deep rift between democrats and republicans. we must end this civil war. the pitch really gets blue. in the ground running biden says he wants to extend a key nuclear arms control treaty with russia but at the same time work to hold moscow to account. and the e.u.

wombs a step closer to introducing covert vaccine passports to swap hostility from several member states. serious talk about human would stand up comedian daniel sloss that's next on visionaries with sophie and. get an hour to get you right up to speed on the morning news headlines. oh welcome to visionaries me sophie shevardnadze. that time is the most unknown of all and no thanks to talk about it's mystery i'm joined by professor. theoretical physicist and best selling author. professor carload of a least theoretical physicist and bestselling author it's great to have you with us

today welcome to our show thank you very much for having me all right so let's start with something blunt you say there is no time in the sense of the term and correct me if i'm wrong and that time exists only in the i would be holder and depends on what that i wear the beholder ease and what they're looking at but we do feel and experience the passing of time or the sense of something being after something and here i am waiting i don't know grabbing a phone for instance right and putting it down and it was in my hand now it isn't isn't that time. yes that is time and of course there is time there is time for us we wake up in the morning we go to sleep time passes we become older that's real what well when i say there is no time what i mean is that there is no time in nature by itself in the fundamental

level let me make an example. if i see. the sun does not move or. it still does not move it does not mean that there is no sunset anymore we still see the sun going up and going down and going up and going down. but we understand that it's not really the sun which is moving it's a complicated story between us and the sound we're sitting on on a big rock which is spinning so from our perspective we see the sun moving. the movement of the sun that we see is real but is not part just of the sun alone and this is about time time it's a more complicated story that what we usually think that's what $26.00 has shown that time is different than what we usually think so the time of our everyday life is not really nature nature the kind of nature is more complicated. if you give you

an example. suppose your clock. or watch. gives time and we all know that the the property of clocks is as a they measure time for this is the same time for all of them if i look at them and they have the same time and i look again they're the same in time well actually if you measure precisely that's not too. good clocks not this one this is my grandfather watch is not particularly good day good well we make one a little bit higher in a way little bit. and then come back and look at them they're not they don't indicate the same time because there's more time up here the time there and this can be measured today in the in the laboratory so time is different that what we think the time of usually magician is false is an approximation is like the setting of the sun. great but. we're actually going to come back to this experiment

a bit later but before we get deep into the more scientific aspects of what your notion of time is i just want to you know get it right for us plain humans because for me the biggest proof that time exists will at least the way we feel it is in our bodies aging and mass eventually dying i mean we're part of the nature right we're part of the bigger picture as well i believe that lake i'm part of a something huge and that huge is part of something that is me. so would you deny that time in that sense exists also for me even though that i'm part of that huge nature thing that you're talking about but time is very i don't there i don't make is i don't know i don't know i think you said it very correctly time it is for us we age. is more than that we remember the past are right and

we think about the future and we know we are mortal so we have all this story now ahead about or a life that the past the present the future this is all real but the guards us that's not the way a star leaves a star does not remember the past does not expect about the future so we are part of nature and we experience things which depend on our own natural properties and not universal mimic another example that's the up of their action right and that's a down direction is that forced of course is it's too i mean that's up and that's none and things fall talwar down but i'm in canada you're in georgia when i point out that if you point up you're pointing in a different direction so which one is a true up it will look the same but in reality we are pointing in different

directions because the earth is round of course so we point in different directions so which one is a true up which is all true up is up to me and up to you and if we if your brother was floating and astronauts outside the earth that. doesn't mean anything because for him all directions are the same there's no up so there's no up in the universe the universe doesn't have an apple direction in a down direction but these are not to me in one direction as an app for you in another direction in the same time there is no global time in the universe the unit doesn't have a time but we. creatures that are an environment in these heat then there is a long story around experience a local thing which is our own time and if you look very very clear carefully we see the differences even from a time a different altitude classism things so why does time if they exist at the

mcchrystal topic state of things right have a direction i mean why is it never pointed backwards. this is a great question. it came as a surprise in the development of physics. slowly. that time is different than that than our usual way of thinking so this is they said the time goes a different speed. it was understood about a 100 years ago in fact the 1st one did that and he 1st got to this idea theoretically sort of try to match since we know about nature but now we measure in the laboratory so it's not an idea by our study something we do something to that we can measure but even before that a brick surprise was that the laws of physics do not distinguish the past or the future that's so strange because for ask the past is completely different for the

future ride buses 6 it cannot change it i was born the someday they cannot change it. was a russian revolution. the beginning. and that's it the future seems open so they seem completely different stories but says it does not distinguish the past from the future so there was a a lot of discussion or what it means and it turned out that the difference between the past and the future only can comes about when we don't. look at all the details that what we do all the time because we don't see the individual atom moving then. the big story all thinks moving in in one direction and this is what the physicist called it the growth of entropy this is a name for for this a difference between the past and the future that we use in physics is hard to

conceive that because we think in terms of past and future but once again it's because we are very big things compared to the atoms of the molecules the you see the new nolen film i mean would you is it possible theoretically whatever is going on in there. lowell took this idea of entropy. yes let and he took the idea which is. the basis of an idea correct which in principle it could be possible to move toward the past and toward the future by by by playing with entropy by changing their arrangement of the molecules in principle is true but then of course he made a movie. which is absurd that because we cannot arrange the molecules in the way so it's a bit of sort of hollywood stuff is just a lot of fantasy in the movie and i found it a little bit confusing and complicated the beauty of the problem of time but what

fascinates also all of us about time is that there is all this complexity there is there is a sometime last bit of time which is in the mechanical things in the time of the nomics of things namely when you have many many atoms moving in in our brain and even in our psychology i would say because you you started and i think that was very good you said we time for us is our growing older and you know time for us is also what takes away everything we have right we know that we're going to lose everything we do we are today we're going to die all the people we love will not be going to be there we are going to be there so there is a sort of anxiety and at the same time time is also what brings us thing so we have a very emotional connection of by the way we are we're wired in our in our brain is that we attach to good grasp something in in the future and the future of losing something in the past when you say time and that's what we mean to

a large extent so. a physicist i'm a physicist i do science but a physicist make a mistake makes a mistake if you think that ok i don't want to think about psychology just look at the motion of things and then you don't see anymore what time is for us time for us is a lot. this emotional. right now when we're back we'll continue talking to. were talking about.

what we said in 2008 right here on this show was that because there was no attempt to reform what the banks had done and the global financial crisis was caused by the banks who were hoarding the cash they were sitting on the cash they were lending it here we are in 2021 exactly as we predicted they did down reform the banks in fact they just expanded their credit card they expanded their capacity to print and borrow and then give away the cash to their friends causing now this huge crisis. right now there are 1000000 people who are overweight or obese it's profitable to self. and sugary and salty and addictive it's not at the individual level it's not individual willpower and if you go on believing that never change this obesity epidemic that industry has been

influencing very deeply the medical and scientific establishment. is what's driving the obesity epidemic it's. and we're back talking about the notion of time is it an illusion or does it truly exist talking with professor lot of valley theoretical physicist and bestselling author professor if time also is mostly a human perspective because emotion is a very human lee thing grade or even a delusion in some sense. how come physicists like yourself use it to find out what exactly happened during the big bang i don't know i'd always like sas

innate in me when i read about how this or that appeared on a 2nd or 3rd nano 2nd after the big bang is all that also a delusion. well it's also fascinates me is a big part of my job is to try. to figure out what happened near the big bang and that's part of my daily daily work to do so to contribute to the study of what happens when we study the big bang right was this long ago what does it mean i mean we say the big bang was what 14000000000 years ago well it means that if you take all the clocks and we go back in time they're different but only average if you go back 40000000000 years that's a big bag in then we get confused precisely because of the big bang or. it was so hot so compress there when a quantum situation is

a very different physics of the one we're used to the deep in a quantum gravity gene that even the physicists notion of time is a good anymore we have to change a little bit we're not we don't we haven't figured out exactly what happened at the beginning perhaps there was no time at all there it just started time so these are trying to write equations. that tell us what happens and compare with observations of the sky and come up with a good story and one of the difficulty is precisely what you said that the usual notion of time even the physical one the one in them actually accretion in the newton equation the 11 studies at school when one study physics you know a pendulum moves in time even that notion of time is not good any more of the big bang so that's really the beauty of physics it forces us to rethink our basic

notions sometimes in a completely clear way we have understood right it's a. we're not still we're moving and so on and so forth sometimes like today we're over the border of what we know and even the notion that we use are not clear so not everything is clear about what exactly happened with time of the big bang is a topic of discussion. but can i ask you something said previously that you know that the time never goes backwards it's always goes forward right so time's an arrow which is moving forward do we remain static in reality because there is no time really or or are we moving along with it. no i don't think we remain static. and it's not that easy when when i say i will if you say some time there is no time. people try to imagine or write so the universe is just a block down there and nothing happens. but that's

a wrong imagination because if nothing happens what you're really thinking is that there is a rock there in time passes and the rock doesn't change. so nothing happens it's a way of thinking time passes but nothing changes and the correct image in issue is the opposite universes change you know as is happening a lot of things happening in the universe just imagine or just a many many happenings but they're not all do it in a common time the sort of disorder it are it's our. our way of organizing them a lot to memory in 20 anticipation that we read the rule of happening of the universe as a single sequence of things happening that's a mistake but there's no. there's no. you see when i say the sun doesn't move. right so we learned at school i mean the more. we see the

sun going up and down up and down every day and then we are kids who go to school and the teacher or father or mother tell us you know it's an illusion the sun doesn't move but this does not mean that the star in the sky walks and is not going to move in the sun keep going around is just is not the sign is going to move is just more complicated story. i wanted to also use the example of music if i may it's a thing that doesn't really exist but only does because it is happening in time right instruments play together and their rhythm or a pulse that brings time alive and we only feel something when music changes in time and on changing becomes a drone and stops having meaning like you know my refrigerator making a noise so if an elementary physics lab will time doesn't matter or doesn't exist why does it matter on a non elementary lab or on

a level of music for instance does this music essentially create time. this is a great question and in fact you know in the history of thinking about time music played a huge role suppose you hearing music ok if song in some moment right now you're hearing one note. no not the full song and then in the next moment you're hearing one no so you're nearly hearing the song you only hear one note at a time in every moment you hear one note so why do you react to the to the song ok there is never a song up there in the emitter at every moment there is only one note at a time and this was before harmony. it was just melodic ok so what is the answer the answer it's using for a moment is obvious when you hear

a note your brain still remembers the previous notes right so what you're hearing in the using of the melody just think of your preferred melody in a moment you hear a sound but you at the same time remember the previous one and so if you think of the time of the militant cells is really a memory stuff is not you know there is in your memory that stayed together out there there's one note at the time and this sure that a lot of our. our. feeling and perception of temporality it's connected to the fact that we remember and it's in a sense if you want in let me put it in some way a stone or a cannot hear music. because he doesn't have memory to hear to hear music you need a memory and memory brain or a computer that has memory not not the brain because we are spiritual things different from the rest of nature i think that we are just pieces of nature like

everything else but we are very cool or pieces of nature with a lot of wiring. and stuff it is this peculiarity that allows music to exist. in a very precise since music. can only exist because we have this brain which remember not only that because when you hear music. i think everybody knows those music you hear a piece of melody and your brain anticipate what would come next and music is all a game that the music is coming in part it comes what you expect ok the next note you know what it is so you're happy that you get it any imparted to prise you because it comes something it's all just game of surprising and satisfaction which makes music so music it's. in some sense this does not mean that there aren't you know sound waves moving around that's all

true that's all real but what we call music and it's what unique was all that. so interesting. so you can say your experiment you just showed me with your watches yes. i mean the whole thing really just blows my mind because i mean i see time as something universal right like a minute is the same here in georgia as it is i don't know somewhere in new delhi 9 hours on the plane to new york would be the same 9 hours here on earth if there is this difference in the speed of time why don't we feel it i mean how far a bar do i have to climb to feel the difference and when my subjective perception you talk about memory but i feel like perception is also a big thing that actually distinguishes time will my subjective perception of time even allow me to feel it even if i'm high enough. yes so let me answer both

questions 1st 1st to the 2nd one and then 1st what would your subjective perception matched as yes absolutely. there is. there's some movies interstellar for instance in which the hero. has. goes near a very heavy things and so time slows down a lot for him so when he comes back for him. a few days are passed and when he comes back years past and in fact at the end of the movie he comes back to earth and finds his little daughter. who has become an old lady so the main character is still a man in his middle age and his little daughter now has become an old lady so the subjective. perception of time has been completely different for the 2 so absolutely certain of that this is solid physics since when is that now you ask

well wait a moment why don't we perceive that i mean as you say a minute for use a minute for me in a minute. well the reason is because us longer to stay on earth so ga can and daily we go to the mountain the. highest these differences are very small extremely small and in fact in my when i teach physics i gave to my students sometimes the exercise will compute what is the difference of time your brother go up to live in the mountain the highest. village you can imagine and then it comes down after 50 years and what is the difference of time is always a computer the difference is just a fraction of a 2nd so too small for our. to get it but if you have instrument you can measure it and we do measure it and the spectacular thing is even today we can measure it not just the mountains but even 20 centimeters higher

20 centimeters long we can see that this clock goes faster and this clock is slower and when you know the g.p.s. the little thing we use you know driving the car that locates us it was through some satellite and when the satellites were put up there at the beginning was americans in the seventy's and then it was done you know by the russians the chinese the indians now we have many systems like that when americans put the 1st satellites up there this is told engineering careful because up there times goes faster and this is a clock in the in the satellite because essentially what happens is you know. satellite was a clock and it beams down the time and then you're little machine uses that to locate yourself and if this is still in jury careful because time there goes a goes faster. they nearly adopted the system but that wasn't the hand of the military and some general in the american military said oh come on this is silly

time goes faster than i believe that you saw the beginning the 1st satellites the experimental one would put that they had to use they had a switch they could keep this into account or not and it doesn't work if you don't keep this into account so technologically today your when you drive a car and you have the g.p.s. system to tell sue which where you're going the system works in a way that keeps into account the fact that up there time goes faster so it's part of about technology today really fascinating a president i wish i had another 3 hours to talk to the notion of time but it's been really interesting to at least have a little bit into the notion of that and perception of time and what is it doesn't exist is an illusion thank you very much for this wonderful insight and i was shown the best of luck and i hope we get to do this again soon thank you i hope saw us

well and thank you for your oppressions which were very much on the point and this is a fascinating topic and i hope to talk to you again definitely thanks a lot be safe. seemed wrong. just told. me to get to shape out just because the ticket and engagement equals betrayal. when so many find themselves worlds apart. just to look for common ground.

sweet taste awful like absolutely awful 1st game then a 2nd wave the 3rd is coming now the virus is mutating and i'd walk 2 blocks away from the apartment and i would get confused as to probably get not. meanwhile patients who recovered from cove it started to report some unusual aftereffects the symptoms were different but. my hearing has been ok i think. that's one of the things i read like research is all over the world are trying to determine the many takes pains and other problems and then turn it all into numbers show you my hair. if you like your it could be 1113 there this is throughout the day my hair just fell out various sources reports that couvade didn't just leave for 35 percent of recovered patients look at you so you don't pull the bullshit because the bush.

just there have been many complaints of feral vision loss joint pain and fatigue in the us these patients are referred to as post coded long holos i talked to multiple doctors in my doctor and they said we have a feeling that you're going to have a hard time in recovery you're going to be one of those people that they consider a long haul or. a folks next up on dennis miller plus one we're going to talk to the great front man for the great band kiss. paul's doing a little solo album coming out he's assembled $1215.00 session guys that come over his us they've done some beautiful covers of smokey the times also wrote a couple new soul songs for the album he's paul's a match i always admire artist but i like artists you know a lot of clothes and he's always been a great singer great man made.