vaccine colonialism of the rich benefit from the virus in part 2 will be speaking to a danish minister about how a vaccine wealthy countries building an energy island but 1st guinea is declared in a bowl or epidemic in its 1st outbreak since 2016 when over 11000 people died after the w.h.o. criticize rich countries for over ordering covered vaccines joining me now from a boogy in nigeria is one of the world's top coronavirus health care professionals and senior atlantic fellow for health equity at george washington university dr if you know so for thanks so much affinity for coming on i've been a 1st start off i know everyone's talking about combet certainly here in the e.u. how bad is it in guinea and the rest of west africa the w.h.o. put 6 countries on alert ok thanks again arjun for having me on so i think that's part of the bullet concerning guinea. that there is a high sense of allah but having said that i think the country guinea i feel like

the african union would be africa and that's what it is on our mv it could be due to particular great because of all the lettuce dobby lentil but the and the capacity bill i think have been and existed back again it's also a plot that it didn't help. the restaurants in this current ugly just goes to show important vaccines are i just want to ask you what your reaction was i mean you probably knew it already when the w h o's boss said there were only 25 doses in in africa while millions partly because i'm beyond that yeah what was your reaction so i mean i was shocked to be on it going to going to be 25 that was actually a unique aspect of that which i was punished you would know better but that's not the way to deal with the pandemic if i'm them expect every conflict you know everybody everyone. so that it would mean you and doug back to new york because

they act like this because we're sort we are stronger you know i think we can rest one into this by many. conflicts that have equity or you know doing things the right way now you know bury our heads in the sand to. to think about the president well. it was quite shocking to me to be on i'll quite well ok that was january 25 doses for guinea 39000000 for the richer countries macro has just made an announcement we will give africa some of the leftover vaccines you must be really happy. not to be honest i'm not because coincidentally a publication came from the economist about you know showing the fact that if rich up on trees are not holding back and they are billable boxes now if you don't everybody so it's not

a question of which i'm not africa for instance let me stick to africa. not consistently be add to this event and not where you are don't ask me to your people that you think about africa it was i think i've got some doozies from the the johnson and johnson back then it was celebrate that the presence of us in this one i was just $50000.00 for a country of you know almost $60000000.00 people or more well as i say the rich countries say they're doing what they can and actually here in britain we are getting information that there is a vaccine kind of cold war sheiner and russia area using coronavirus for their evil geopolitical intent it has to be said nigeria has emphasized the astra zeneca vaccine do you think more than the sputnik 5 and they sign a form chinese one yet and i think that has and i think partly because. no the

coach and situation or what astra zeneca you know is something that we're already have begun our united nations to stand and. i think if you if you if you look back you see the before the russian back then was that that for instance in the u.k. but also have results that you know everybody could look at and the russian one hasn't been tested here actually we're not really hearing much about sputnik 5 in britain. so so it's understandable why the nigerian government says you know. it's kind of going outside after that it got back in because our system here would be able to. ship that backs and the particular brand in the radical change or. hope for the submission but i think again if we look at it in the sense of equity and shorten that we have been of do this to back this up people i don't think we should be to deny this point in time

as far as the particular vaccine has been shown to be efficient and safe nigeria's science minister dr. on you has in the past few days been saying that they're going to cooperate not only. with the bowler because i think there has been cooperation with the border with the cuban government. but they will be working with the cuban government on covina how did politics affect the coronavirus faxing distribution boxing you know permits everything because. definitely i'm not privy to the kind of discussions that happened happen at the president. and i don't know who's been on. the properties on what i do but if there's anything we've learned from this particular responding to one thing as from last year remember this is not the 1st time that what punishment are for the you know commodities you know. what it is the i pod ads but not processing equipment that are pretty good about the past time and

i think automatically african countries are like in 5 all you know how do we what do we do when it's all that we get what our people need and also to meet our own political aspirations our independent mission to which of course some rich countries will say nigeria is rich in resources why doesn't it have its own homegrown vaccination program and i understand you have something called diu sin vax but the funding what is the biotech industry in nigeria a country so much more populous so much richer in resources than britain why can't you make your own vaccines i mean that really i mean that i think that for me though the last question that's quite a point i was going to be you know recently where actually express my anger not got that nigeria but africa nation because. but governments over the years have

actually brought us here and you know what i can't say. if we had good governance over the years that he has given the police or well most of the manufacturing are back to that other point in time so i'd let the particular business all find ourselves if we have to depend on what time is and what the question is what is the government in nigeria and what are african leaders doing to prepare for the next pandemic how are they preparing for a show of our by the time we have the next fund then we will be will have the capacity to manage money for the pontiff. well to be fair to the nigerian government they funded a chair r.d.s. health care sector research and development. scheme to fund research and development which has come under some criticism i think the budget for research $1300000.00 a vaccine compare the $200.00 to $500000000.00 it cost to get a vaccine on the world market so optimistic now obviously that means that we're

just not making a difference. but to me if i look at helping out in nigeria i'm much more interested because if you look at it to has expenditure in nigeria about 7.777 percent of that amount which i must about $7700000000.00 out of pocket expenditure just about $1.00 is going to not do not support $1200000000.00 it's about government support so that you know i didn't need to get to this issue where we're able to channel those huge part of pocket expenditure into say our initial i help it sharansky that it's quite responsive that has the size and development of part of it and hopefully the country or investors. to begin to put money into the space the government does the amount that the government has budgeted definitely we're not making a dent as far back as well nigeria is not to learn many countries that

arguably have military political alliances with the united states are indebted to the washington international monetary fund so there's only so much money to go go around what do you think will be the pressures to further privatized vaccine research and maybe distribution of covert vaccines as we go through this pandemic the progress that the living very important thank you there. was a question him is what lesson would learn from toby one thing is how the private sector man you know i really do. around. africa we just met all by all the private sector of media camp together forms the private sector quietly sort of reading a couple before so i'm grateful but a few $1000000.00 within one year to support the rest point and then you know so to me that's an image or lesson because the question tonight is how would government good with the private. what lessons can we secure from kobe so that we can use

that to. stop epidemic preparedness for the future but also you know to ensure that the private sector company a very important role in you know getting the back we. will refocus on the ordinary walk on logic because if you submit the vaccine for the private sector hardly very probably. africa and i'll go think that africans we need to come to the point where we're well what's on the stand that if we're forgetting something for free it does not mean somebody stop paying for it and. sought public private partnerships like aquavit in nigeria you know i think it's probably your way to go in the future in preparing them for wanting to fund them because the debate here ugly in richer nations is the private sector is interested always in profit and in fact the british economy is kind of in soviet the state is playing

a much bigger role in society and is paying the bills wages and there are some calls to nationalize the big pharma companies since after all the big pharma companies get their research from publicly funded universities and and then reap the rewards in some cases not all big pharma covered vaccines reaps massive profit . i mean that i think just you know. you know maybe good luck acts like that are. those privates that i don't think the best because you know that comment you know chris will be all you know based on. what the called the. i'm the privacy of the lot so you know i you know michel you know all. the typing with us all that the you know i'm gone i'm done very well so i don't think that i think public private you know either we go oh yes we go but

most will check you know the right will be. the i'm not there. for granted you know goes all who we don't. want the private sector. i'm job i'm sure many will dispute whether it's the private sector thinking the risks and i'm just sure the i.m.f. would even allow the nationalization of big pharma but dr venus for i'll stop you then more from one of the world's top coronavirus health care professionals after this short break. but underneath no certainly no borders i'm just delighted to announce another tease . as americans we don't ever say to you we don't like seeing the world peace to be. your

. judgement is coming very close is the sentence. we can do better we should be doing better. everyone is contributing each of our own way but we also know that this crisis will not go on forever the challenges created with the response has been masked so many good people are helping us. it makes us feel very proud that we are in it together. this is really the beginning of the changing of the guard in our now handing the baton off to china as the number one economy in the 21st century the numbers are there the statistics are there the relationships in your hear can you are there the relationship or it's the russia and iran it's their you know their and their

relationship all over africa is also there. welcome back i'm still here went on for a few minutes before as regards kovacs the w.h.o. is saying that some vaccine dossiers have not even been given to kovacs in full to analyze efficacy of covert vaccines would you want to do you make of the. yes so i think that's probably part of the delay in the call but the boxes on the box. that's public private yeah yeah i think about part of the standard because it obviates or ask you you know. about to get the company. the dot com where it was that of the. i mean if that was your best bet the number 90000000 believes by the end of february when you pointed out stephen bach the president

already across the continent i don't know what one would listen i government mix all that all the data requires the president to sean all africans love the beginnings of once a vision or that is it but is it kovacs that failed or as a dummy h.-o. into mates the private companies that have failed in adequately giving information so the vaccines can be given while the private sector companies because the military is also what the whole what's. you know the village is bought up with a public private partnership yeah yeah you know again i think in all the discussion on their own about the nationality private sector companies want to make profits i don't want to give up it and talk like that so. humbly have to go to the private companies and i just hope that they have to come pick up one grant and will fall i mean the pentagon wants $239000000.00 for war in in africa

do you think the u.s. military can help here in iowa grander public private partnership 239000000 dollars for. more. u.s. military in africa perhaps military medics from the u.s. army yeah because if you look back at your government could the u.s. department of defense has been supporting you know public health interventions across africa. or the impacts of them. and i'm hoping that part of the money they mention on. would also mean that you know why investments go into public health preparing point in fact with our brain and i need a response and not just you know our call paper fiore in. you know equipment for walk of like that. they've done they've done a lot to the department of the pencil by the years. and i'm pretty sure the

pentagon will say this is this is about combating terrorism nothing about helping public health care in any sense i mean how do you compare there in a bridge or the responses of different african countries to the different vaccinations or an awful because we are hearing that china is sending masses of vaccines to countries and is preparing to and will send be sending far more vaccines than those from native countries i think it's a welcome development because one thing that the african union. have triffids its rep on coordinate in response across the continent is that africa backspin up we saw back to you know the article by a president of the post as it's up of the african union so i hope those efforts to be part in it that you've got particularly because of responsibility but for me as a public health official as somebody who was helping whatever have to come into the continent a lot was through the body of the court made

a part of the confidence our level but also you know it's not enough now. that that doesn't pose to give up about 400 bucks and to be honest that the people because obviously if those things are not done i think the doctor at the back with a novel suspicion that people already have about the virus and across the country. well 15000000 people vaccinated here in britain what is the state of covert vaccination in nigeria today because we're hoping to get 20 percent 30 percent 40 percent over the coming months and people in nigeria talking about 20222023 year i mean we've not i've passed i know we nobody have the budget that we could get next year there's a population of about 200000000 people but also with you know the from the combustibility we hope to get at least about by the end of february hopefully

elements that eventually call doctors went back we saw in fact what do you see my i'm going to get is that even if we get all the duties that we've. got to go but as you said that idea it will all be back on its 20 percent of our population just to be clear no one person in a country of 200000000 people has been vaccinated against coronavirus as of today not in nigeria accepted the fact and travel out on monday as i've traveled that city to buy. one of our form of vice president i pick up about that i was lucky that in 2 but i don't most people have gone to the back in country no one has been vaccinated tryphena so far thank you. thank you so much well if coronaviruses taught us anything it is that the rich just keep getting richer largely by hiding their wealth in offshore accounts denmark is giving offshore a different name an offshore energy island the size of $800.00 football pitches in the north sea joining me now from copenhagen is denmark's minister for climate

energy and utilities down your guns and minister thanks so much for coming on going underground of to start with just tell me about this project 25000000000 pounds is it well it's a huge project what we are basically doing is saying offshore wind into a new face usually until now when countries have established option when you have one farm and you've connected that to the shaw and that's it based now we're going further out in the sea and we're making many different of show wind farm and then connecting them to an artificial island and island will then serve as a hub that can be connected to our own country of course but also other countries in europe are you going to export any of that energy to britain here and here in britain because we are opening up coal mines actually have wells too early to say which countries we are going to leverage but can go what's capacity as what we

saw and now that stand off that it just sits so supply 10000000 homes and since we are only less than $6000000.00 people in denmark goes without saying that this needs to be in collaboration with a country which we are right now negotiating with belgium the netherlands and germany on this. other swale will probably follow. wait a minute though the european union countries when will you actually make these kinds of decisions how far down the line me if indeed you are going to export electricity to britain well actually we need to make these decisions with in the a year to 18 months because the whole economy of the project depends on us having these agreements went with other countries is it true that denmark will shut down its entire oil industry within 30 years yes we have

decided to stop exploration of oil and gas the next station upon gas and so $1050.00 and we have cancelled all licensing rounds from now and in the future not an easy decision because we're the biggest oil producer in the us it is and we've chosen to do it because we need to be counter neutral and so $1050.00 and we want other countries also to also foster really keep producing oil and selling it to other countries while we are on the other hand sell them that we wish they were kava neutral doesn't really make sense it's not an easy decision because we've made a lot of money on fossils in our country during the years. now is the time one denmark a lot of then must be flooded by 2030 is this a real decision now well we we cause a small country with a lot of house and we will also be affected by climate change no doubt but it's

also clear that. other pos of the world especially the poor countries on this planet will be hit the hardest so. if we are as a show any sort of they're actually on this planet it must be that the richest countries and they want to have the possibility of a show nice to reduce our emissions we need to show that it means transmission is it's necessary we. home to be a front runner in the sense that other countries will look at us and hopefully follow our example and we also hope to do this in a way where it won't hurt us i mean what kind of an example would we be if we lost jobs in in the process if people got on employed if we had to lower our standard of living so this is actually also a growth strategy frost so to people that will lose that job in the oil and gas industry we want to employ them instead in the offshore wind industry well

obviously environmental groups some of them will say the time span is is too slow still i mean do you think greenpeace should take the credit it was only what a few months ago that they were occupying the dan bravo aisle rig denmark's for us . big oil rig in the history of petrochemical exploration in denmark and now you've kind of done what greenpeace asked. well. there's no doubt that a lot of green organizations across the world has been in arguing for countries to do this all for quite some time and it's been important that they're also countries that actually had an oil production of us of a certain size did it and i believe that we are the 1st country of that sort of on this and i think that it is faster say that the pressure. from green n.g.o.s yes but actually more from the danish population as hell does as a government make this decision because we had an election one year and

a half ago and that was the 1st election in danish history where climate change was under very troubled gena now we've we've been true crean transformation for decades now but it's never been d. most important job politically if the voters it is now and of course decision may make us like myself a lot of leverage. the power of the fossil fuel lobby lobby is so famous that in the u.s. presidential campaign joe biden famous they came out pro fracking will you take him to dinner by any big fossil fuel chairman or to even executives telling you this is a crazy idea of course there. has been. companies people arguing against this and i do actually have to be fair and say that even. be possible to oil industry also now beginning to see to rationality in this and i think that also one of the reasons why i haven't actually

seen that much criticism from the oil industry it's what in my view is that we are aiming to do this in in a way where we also project investments that's been made on the short term so we give certain sheep that the jobs that are there now they will be phased out over. some number of yes and if you think about it if you are india oil business and you know for a fact that the european union has pledged to be carbon neutral in 2050 maybe harder you may yeah you maybe you better start making that transformation now if you still want to make money ok amateur with us or michael moore's film revenge of the humans i think your trip took it down briefly maybe these companies are interesting because a lot of money to be made out of it and actually the maintenance than the construction harms the environment what have you been doing in these initial plans

to stop the construction of the energy islands from actually making the climate crisis worse. well it's a very good point that making renewable energy obviously it's necessary for us if we are to have a confusion by climate change but we also need to do it in a way so that we don't hurt them environment in the process and we would have 1st country to actually build an altar wind back in 1901 the companies that are out there nature and want to build these winter bonds and to build the farms and the island they need to fulfill some some quite strict criteria with regards to environment and there's nothing unique about the sector of the north sea that these plans of form are stronger than could order a similar kind of development in the north sea off the coast of britain but we definitely hope that other countries will will follow his example and an individual if you look at what the european commission. has calculated how big the potential

is for sure when the north sea. i would actually think it would be strange if if other countries didn't do the same as we've chosen to do here 1st and foremost because we're also looking into and electrification of our societies when all cars will be electric in not that many years how do we get all electricity also we will have new technologies very soon how to extract knowledge the way you can transform the power from winter vance via an adventurous process into. and hydrogen into fluid liquids and you can then put on a plane or use on a boat on a heavy transport vehicle 'd on the streets this means that you don't all of us and fly are preying basically on our from from the wind. this is necessary development in a world with with a couple of 1000000000 more people than we are now in 2050 and where we still need

to be green. instead on your goods and thank you thank you so much that's it for the show will be back on wednesday 13 years to the day cuban revolutionary fidel castro retired as president leaving behind a health care system that would be well beaten in the face of over the virus is going to join me on the ground on all our social media never miss an interview by subscribing. there are already strong signs the binding ministration is returning to the foreign policy of the obama years obama's foreign policies were hardly a success in this was the time of endless wars will divide the ministrations with the speed skimming and growth on. the british and american governments have often been accused of destroying lives in their own interests while you see in this these techniques is the state devising methods to him to essentially destroy the

personality of an individual. by scientific means this is how one doctor's theories were allegedly used in psychological warfare against prisoners deemed a danger to the state that was the foundation for the method of psychological interrogation psychological torture of the cia disseminated from within the us intelligence community and worldwide among our allies for the next 30 years and how the victims say they still live with the consequences today. the headlines this hour in for triton russian language media documents suggest the u.k. government sought to boost negative coverage and weaken russia also to come a texas family saves energy companies after their.