there's any credibility to these charges or to that or to the justice system it is an injustice system there's no question at all in my mind about what's going on in myanmar and the protests were not sparked in my view by the arrest alongside suchi in the present or start by the fact that this democracy has been overturned that a country on its way making its way to respect for democracy respect for human rights on the road was completely overturned how is it possibly on the road to end the u.n. is saying in testimony at least in the in december of the worst paul graham's of the century. i mean i mean the i.c.j. said it wasn't genocide against the ring yeah but and the i think given for months but how was it on the road before these present protests to some kind of democratic

nation. right it was a developing democracy and by that i mean if you look at what me and more looked like before we began to see elections we saw thousands and thousands of political prisoners. in prison under horrific conditions you had a total military authoritarian state in which people had absolutely no rights whatsoever then you have an agreement then an agreement to begin to make our way into democracy now the generals call it discipline democracy they had control of key ministries which of course we understand that they controlled for. over i want to pose a quick history you mean it was like that when hundreds of thousands and tens of thousands maybe were being killed when the united states government was backing the gent i have had throughout my career concerns questions and i've been very clear

about my criticisms of any inconsistency is with the united states government or any government when it comes to this but my point is this things are bad in may and more but sanctions that were established. before the elections that happened in 2015. had the effect of forcing there to be at least some semblance of a democracy so that you had some civilian leadership controlling some ministries the military controlling key ministries and 25 percent of the parliament so it wasn't what i think on the road to democracy i meant it is incremental progress it was steps ahead of when there was a total military authoritarian regime but by no means was it a regime that fully participate in democracy nor fully respected human rights the atrocities that occurred in 2017 and the discrimination that has continued with

the previous government in a kind state i have been very clear and we all should be very critical of the way the regime to have been and we're continuing and continue to be treated but my point is this is that what we're seeing right now aren't. hundreds of thousands if not millions of people coming out in the streets from every corner of me and more cities large and small all ages all social and economic backgrounds to protest this coup and to protest this violation of of their of their country of their government that my answer your question was that is what is clearing this that is what is generating this not the arrest or any particularly. the arrest of well over a 1000 people. including uncensored she and including the president of me and more

but it's an assault on the relationship that is what it is that is my point there is a lot less than the numbers arrested in paris during the john but as you say it has been deadly and the pictures are awful coming from me and ma why are you not in beijing the united states flights apparently have been occurring between china and myanmar in ma a really important component of china's bell who rode initiative the bangladesh china india economic corridor or. is it is china not the key. china is very very important very important and it's why when china issued statements criticizing the coup when china has publicly called for the release of political prisoners. china has expressed its deep concern about developments in iraq that is very helpful of course china will be very very critical when it comes to trying to

address and resolve this crisis using china's very important is it difficult as a special rapporteur given your defense of man thanks to jeanne in the past knowing that before latest arrest she seemed to be excusing human rights crimes she had said in testimony to the u.n. cycles of into coming all violent and not not the worst program of this century yes we've been very critical of the government this crisis is not about her or any individual leader or political party or entity this is about the people with me and they're under a shot and they're sliced into focus it has to be now you know there and some might say you know examines against me and now are just the poorest people there war would you would you say to companies like gates you know. who still in me in my understand there have been some companies that have been were drawing from the

country care in beer razor gaming the company from singapore. well i think what's important is that we have a sanctions regime that has garden recipient will we want to make sure that the sanctions have the maximum impact on the generals and their interests the revenue flowing into their pockets and the minimal minimal impact on the people of me and more so that is why we're calling for targeted focused sanctions and we also want them to be coordinated between countries will have to step up and engage in them in a sanctions regime so for example people ask well what about 8 that going into mean more development aid communitarian yes it's important that that flow in the degree that it's possible it donors can provide those funds to i n g o's to the c s o's on the ground the humanitarian development organizations who are providing vital services to the people of being one that's very very important

and everything in it in energy is every added possible to avoid funneling that money through the the government of me and all that all that to the good while u.n. security council members like russia china the united states. britton there they're all condemning this is this violence much less about where the crowd control weapons to fire at these peaceful apparently protesters. where that's coming from you think u.s. special rapporteur may investigate where these weapons are coming from or is it the case the weapons are coming from. members of the u.n. security council well it's a good question it's a very very good question but what we're calling for is a is a global arms embargo the security council of the united nations certainly has it within its power to establish a global arms embargo but short of that it's not possible to get there through the security checks there what we're asking for is for countries to accordingly their

their their arms embargo regimes so that again we can have a maximum impact right now there are 41 countries in the world that have some form of arms embargo in place we want to increase that number and we want to make sure that all of these indoor goes are coordinated so that we can make sure we keep track on not just in weapons but also dual use technology so that we can we can control what is going into that country and to the extent possible started from getting into the hands of the whole or me and told me a joyous sanctions in the past have caused untold misery to go balls out of countries i just want to ask you. i'm not saying your job is easy but. the other special report says in the u.n. that we have on the program have terrible times convincing people about a freedom of julian a thunder or a poverty say here in britain is there

a geopolitical context that makes it easier for you to convince governments about the myanmar issue and human rights who are the cia on your side in the and the communist party of china. well you know what what we're trying to focus on and i think what is. extremely important and i think we see evidence that is it is getting emerged is that this is a crackdown this is horrific what we're seeing on the streets. of me and more and it requires a a unified response that is outside of the context of geo political backgrounds even though they exist and obviously that dynamic is there. but it seems to me that we should be able to say. as a people no matter where you're from and a matter what your ideology is is that what we are seeing in me and more is borne

out and it has to stop and that we need to do everything possible to make sure that it's does so which china comes forward and says we we find this this coup unacceptable that political prisoners need to be released those are encouraging signs and encouraging steps forward and we're hoping to be able to build on those encouraging steps of the we can have to the greatest extent possible a unified stance against the horror that's going on in me and right now so as robert i thank you as leisure after the break we'll be speaking to david bowie's photographer and singer more why about challenging politics through art.

this is. the heat actually physically pulled it out of the ground he would have well well well well. there's a lot of money and with that comes. a lot of

a lot of people from all over the country. all of your. position. here maybe. they were. a hard worker well workers not easy. and so they want to relieve their stress and how do they relieve their stress. that outlay that comfort these many. people have been murdered up here people can raise their massive drug issues up here give a boom you have everything else that comes along with money. welcome back in amongst the claims of neoliberal corrective action and promises

a future cuts universal credit you catch on to the reason that's a recent budget also included an extra $400000000.00 pounds for the 0 ups but with the musicians union raising the many and still flowing through the cracks what hope is that. a cultural revival here post coronavirus while one photographer reminds us what greatness in art looks like is mick rock who captured the defining images of legend reality with like david bowie bryan ferry and debbie harry as well as taking iconic photos for albums like the reed's transformer and he pops. rock joins me now from new york his new collaborative work title my dollar is on show in sale on the west contemporary editions make welcome to going underground tell us about this new interpretational and this you are i'm going underground there is a because we're certainly i love to chat. mystical tell me about this new interpretation of your work may daro with finn dax some of the proceeds are going to the cash. give me cash of n.h.s.

your income of it later y s 202 sir both mary and trimmed back i think that was the 1st sugar loaf. about fruit was the name. but what really struck me. as the. worst were you're all so kind of people. so one of my agents about. here in america. the graphic novel we were looking for somebody who only skewer the words through right but you see the pictures it's a graphic look anyway it's i saw something. trimmed back a trillion it was just a rough sketch or something but i said that would be 030 regular army stuff because i wanted to do a certain since bush it was. liam's are idea the thing is i don't know if in

sharing what we where are. my food a bit raw the 1st 2 that says a very chipper which is m.r.i. . they are her so are certain. that they will avoid say pictures which strains of barry. a lot of these were pretty severely certainly was a remark there are other literary. love pictures. then and send the significance of this date to have the release them in r. o. the 2nd of march why isn't one of the elite terminated inferior methods if. it's the. loo is a significant artist's early for british rockers as a spinner of the last of the last 40 years still nobody sounds like bubbly.

babies are made from elitists. and so it's a made isn't significance in a modern culture sure. unfortunately. a lot of their friends including. and they are instead by our friday and. rory gallagher make runs i mean there's loads of. nola story in the course really so years ago but it was you know the almighty says whatever quiet were in my ear it was. challenged our. because if you are saying this law if you're. so firm graham is a terrier neal gave his last long form interview for going underground and he said

that it was about is it a lot of things you know was going on in the ground because he you know to answer i think he had it when he when i had to meet him but he was he was talking about how he looked from the outside in and he was also saying photography was pointless now bands because they're being run by managers and p.r. to an extent that you can actually get a photograph done everyone's that's. where are we showing every moment of the roots or the figure that sort of trees it's so excess of my own and you get to start my wife's sex good pictures of her firm on. good so as civil as they are they need to be under more and i will know it so why is he you said they you are from the inside out because you were inside the rock when i was a really sure 3 story i was. just so no it. is. it was true that the early

days of doing yoga will yoga and still the reader. probably saved my life forward when i was throwing some thought to be over it. and as a commission maybe giving money to the national health service and and to repairing repairing hearts here i will what i also ask you because woody woodwinds the last surviving spider from oz came on the show and he said he said the amazing thing about david bowie who you of course photographed so memorably in made videos for the amazing thing about david bowie was he involved different classes of people social economic class some people might say you're a cambridge mediæval. english graduate. i'm going to smear you proved was that true. how is it how how is it that you came to be

working working with often working class artists often needle class artists argue for his worth. of the blues a sense of middle class he was. well if you go solo things are. and david david was very structured. and i love it's over story but willie was a be are all are aware of the war and they will call me a around or i just remember this poetry should. do or think of shock when. it goes up in which very very so i need a lot more. to explain. oh you're a lot better some things but street barua sure. he knew something about it. he was like mama he was for. work but he was very selfish or for we all he don't condone drug taking on this program we give in the span of your work. do you think

it not only influence obviously the arts influenced ideas about war i mean he could have been a war photographer i mean sometimes you make it sound like you were a little while i know why it should have been a war that sort of a great respect for those who are. true of the current and i well know how they could hate the pictures they took worse the very famous in the school don mccallum exactly. 3 years these are only certain pieces of length skirts and we've talked to my room a camper a lot on the program i think and we've also talked about l.s.d. and most recently most recently about m.k. ultra and the new revelations about the cia's use of it for the beat poets and all sorts of experimenting with this with this hindsight what do you think the

influence of l.s.d. has been on not only western culture but international culture. well i think it opened up western troops or so eastern troops so the inflow to the late sixty's where really you know it's a ship all these different discipline and they're very powerful so i can seriously which i do that's right so serious that a bit of summary interviews last a bit of cessed with. with the surgery were very risky i was obsessed with altered states as to get there were no music. tell me seattle to again say we don't condone taking any drugs although some drug influence people are still on the curriculum here the romantic poets who you have said you you got inspiration from how how did the romantic poet influence the

photography i mean we know shelley particularly at the moment because of jeremy corman and the fact that shelley was a socialist. you isn't the environmental element in there either you know no one has all anything political other than somebody who certainly have a very intense dislike but that monstrosity without saying they are really gotten so bad is the poetry work in the photography writing this just the way our problems sit over so experiments or sit through david a fairy i saw them through the prism. oh mon of the saddest things you may have said you say in the amazing documentary actually about you the psycho spiritual mentor of rock his how rebels get absorbed by establishments culture i mean it's been said said before but given the you've

worked with he worked with the sex pistols and worked with some of the most and important arguable rebels have ever continuing in florida only you were with lou reed 'd a very popular summer of well into you know it's sort of. if i sort of. still are this far because there. is so heavy i mean the words of crystals but that starts to rock it was icky restart in 67. so. who says summer so it's so so air and. it was on so you know what the who who live in c chair of the. great choreographer who took a bit of. estates from the make up you know a mess where i snatch it i mean this is a political program i would ask you given that jagger obviously is without a vietnam protests debbie has there and he war protests and he nuclear protests

bowie the celebrated line about nixon on young americans. we conscious of the politics and the antiwar messages of all the artists who were most famous for photographing looting fairly it was there just as. he played so he lived anywhere where we turn we can learn some lessons i don't recall having you know i mean sexuality no subject i knew it. so you know over the stuff. and. they were you know the answer of the hour they didn't really get into politics and rule our but i've never voted. yes i have issue ations and sentences but i'm not going to your room go a whole lot of cheering from. us but clearly your pictures are so

redolent all these stars the importance of these stars i know. you. spoke to david bowie about it when bowie told you we don't exist these stars so is it really only your photographs clear for ya'll if you say we were your sister well actually . it's a cd system they did was good philosophic if you're sure. but charlie resurrected sure it was special look at them all silent so i just want it when there is no photographs that are the way the way they these toys appear in our minds i'm going to also ask you how safe your archive is because in the documentary i saw you got them all in cardboard boxes i hope there is no metal pins and thing on this earth there where there's a lot of stuff goes oh. oh oh oh well if you don't know the right somebody to.

live it's a sure much much chair in the box is a good enough shoe far to climate change and the effect on the boxes. so i'm scared it doesn't matter if you could get that. that's not true either. you should see or are interested in the pictures there were no more lots that's for sure thank you in the middle our images are on show and sale on the west contemporary additions platform well going underground every other to charlie cook has also been looking into the future of working class art and recently caught up with stuart braithwaite lead singer of the scottish coast rock group more why we're just come from scoring hits italian crime drama 000 to secure their 1st number one in 25 years with a new album as the love continues here is talking about the future for working both musicians post look you're actually see you know already if you look at the kind of artists the major labels are sane and most of them are from pray wealthy by kone's

because they can afford to teach him how to work and the music you can afford to go into or with needs and help from their labels because labels have less money and yet i think we're going to see less less people from kind of normal to be honest i mean. it's almost quaint divisive word i mean we're talking about normal people because most people are working class most people haven't got rush parents or loads of money in the bank so my guess is that it be a struggle for for music to come from who is going to people which is a shame because you look at the has city of new music. just thinking off the top man has bands like. happy mondays like deals like the store nosies you know late. and that full interview with a discuss everything from political music to nuclear weapons can be found on going

underground you tube channel make sure you subscribe and hit the bell like one did 10 of the patients of the never miss interview that's it for the show will be back on wednesday see you.

there are tactics that can be used to get innocent people to confess to crimes they didn't commit i don't even think people in the us really get that the police are allowed to lie to the person who falsely fast actually came to believe the lie that they were told about their own behavior once a false confession a stake in the case is closed and nobody really can tell the difference between a good confession and one that isn't. the binding ministration is still young but its foreign policy particularly in the middle east is an echo of past failures this ministration simply just not a learning curve ball so does washington really support democracy in the world ukraine's crackdown on independent media changes.

in headlines this 8th of march profiting from the pandemic to see. quitting in a major scandal for allegedly earning hundreds of thousands of. face mask deals. and elsewhere claims of financial mismanagement during the pandemic by the u.k. government which is spending millions of pounds on a brand new media briefing room health workers get just a one percent pay rise. plus as president biden's long awaited relief bill passes the senate people may end up getting even less than under donald trump.