more towards getting people back to work which means not paying them to stay home and we need to reopen our schools that is a that is a factor as well that is a good point so it's not so this won't fix the problem as far as just removing the benefits but we also need to reopen schools there's also the fact that there are a lot of people especially here in austin texas who are just afraid to go back to work one because again the benefits and because they're still afraid about kobe so it's a variety of factors but we can't say that the that the benefits have nothing to do with this so that brings you up to date sefanaia here on a national was good to have the company just come hamas 5 and mosque i will be back with the story of the day plus the headlines in about half an.

hello and welcome to crossfire for all things considered i'm peter lavelle who is a fascist well given the state of our politics a fascist is your political opponent even mortal enemy tragically and dangerously the term fascist is more times than not a political slower to destroy someone's character fascism is an odious ideology and political practice we all should be careful when referencing. cross talking fascism i'm joined by my guest lattimer goldstein in providence he's the chair of the department of slavic studies at brown university and in budapest we crossed to george he is a podcast or at the gaggle which can be found on you tube rumble and the locals are

gentlemen crosstalk rules in effect that means he can jump in anytime he want and i always appreciate it let's go to vladimir 1st let me i'm very glad to have you and george on the program to talk about this very important topic because being a trained academic historian in modern european and russian history and still dabble in it because i get to talk to a very interesting people like yourself and george on this program i'm very disturbed in mainstream media and in. political political diatribes so that people use to term fascist it's a very important term it's very dangerous term i think we have to use a lot of precision when using it because if you don't you. womanize the the the fashion to experience that within the 20th century and what could possibly have happened in the future so maybe your reflection here i mean i'm sure you hear the same things i hear how do you feel when you hear he's a fascist she's a fascist go ahead yeah i think you know there is

a double edge sword is in it's dangerous and bores. me for geishas 1st of all this tendency to demand is' your point of going to call them a freshness is not very good but by using your bait chipping in the term 'd we actually ran the ease of me saying the freshness of a system fish is rich can it be you know me there is you know there is a definite elements of culture oh a legal mentality and eventually you know result in certain actions which can be called faces but this storm you know as you said have to be used who completely should be analyzed because i for example in the movement which were seen in the united states of the us what they call themselves and faces you know that a lot of. vicious kind of thinking it was a shit what they do so we really have to be very careful how when do you think it's

really important to come back to the jurors in understand was it whether behind george the same question to you because it's over use makes it meaningless and that's what i find terrifying as i stressed in my introduction my 1st question to bottom here it is a very odious ideology and if we don't keep tabs on it in the right way then it can be applied to anything and if it can be played to anything it doesn't mean anything go ahead george. that's exactly right and i think that if we think about one of the smashing of the many factions it was obviously. a political movement or a series of political movements that arose in the autumn of the of war one and again a response of a collapse of several of the european empires the collapse of the states economic dislocation and the year all the rest the great inflation in germany of the great depression and so on and so the fascism has to be located in a particular historical phenomenon and. look even within

that phenomenon there were a wide variety of right. i mean it was may have been an ally of was lenient but listening is fascism is very different though national socialism and that exam was very different wrong frank frank it was a time very different from 40. so if you have to somehow really tried to find me what aspects all of these movement has are common and then you know to extend it into your chair what is it that we really find dangerous and threatening about any possible revivals of fascism and i think we're in the blood in him mention or answer. and it was a black lives matter can see the the parallels between that rational phenomenon and go 100 years ago namely the result to political violence and

name calling and etiology and the opportunism of supposedly democratic politicians can use screen moms in order to achieve their political goals and i think that's a kind of a as soon as the legacy crashing movements of those types i think in a such of a. tacit point because you know the way the term is used today in the mainstream it has some kind of singular meaning or conjures up an image or something like that and that's simply not true that is a historical here because i mean it's quite fashionable and i can understand because of the cold war is it you know fascism is the right and then communism is the left here but you know and you can make that argument in a in that's fine but i don't think it's satisfactory at the same time but only because it's not really left to right in georgia picked up on and already it's

a set of political practices ok and i think that and i think in its very astute on the left to say all this i think that fascism is a right as phenomenon and people on the right are that way but no it's about political practices and that doesn't have a political got grounding in left or right maybe what we're finding out if it's actually in the center go ahead lot of there i would say the size of the mention of what we have to stress is sort of kind of you know cultural sort of movement there's a you know many levels you know we have to do finally and then to understand what it's not but you know that we may need historians sions of that version you know observe nowadays is there's a cultural going to phenomena which somehow religious certain certain kind of we all seem to it's paul's some go to he had been his enjoy your job you enjoy music

a lot you know. harmony in the press it projects in the future but right now in the present there is some kind of obstacle you know it's not as it is it's clear you know grades are i hear jews you know who are many. what but you know we can move on and we see the same person. you know that you know in this movement for example call and try. ephesus the whole of human kind of a bad guy we're going to go now as a you know that for many people say i'm a liberal democrat the democrats and you know that there was greed and obama will be greed you know if i was asked dick if you know a and a biden was are going to read over this drama this mean an obstacle in those who help him this is the same guy mentality just can be seen again and again are you you know in united states they have this concept or wall wall of people who know who see this musical kind of nonsense or the best of their way or or you know like

now if only we're going to read this usual legacy or way where everyone who you know there were some others you know in ukraine for example after 24 do they came up with this i'm going to answer straight gomery a tsunami like those who are not going to know or where so they are aware of their legacy or are so into it was forgotten you know who bring it up you know do you want to sell it in so you know there was always political correctness seeking an informant who will go there you know but these are just basically the simplistic money. out of. the wall basan use not only ality it is also going to get jenn's jew knew that we're like whoa whoa whoa now i know and this is just you know it's sort of that nice week it's and he just needs kind of something for something i mean culturally 3 may differ but it is what we see again and again in all forms yet it's

a completely exclusionary either you know in if you don't know you're not part of the in-group knowing and this is what it makes very exclusionary and very dangerous as i said in my introduction you could end up being a mortal enemies ok because you you don't know the truth you you know george and it was brought up here you know this kind of mythical past but i think a modern version of 21st version of it is to destroy the past because the only way you can have a president. it is acceptable and a. future that you want you must completely obliterate the past when we've seen this historically tried over and over again and it never ends in a good place and this is being done what i would say on the left go ahead george. well that is an excellent point peter because what most people. have traditionally not on the snow on that what we term fashion is really a dynamic and i rest there culturally and nihilistic of phenomena and yet people

are always going to use that i thought with a conservative clerical conservatism i mean as i mentioned earlier you know people refer to it or see it as an ashes order was a clerical conservative same with franco american conservatives i mean even if they have rationalised allies and so what you talked about the the these mobs in the street who tear down statues who chaired their own history and who you know just see or see traditional as just and a relic that needs to be swept away that that is goes to the heart of our passions and because that does that it is exactly that was the mentality of hitler but that wasn't a good sort of a very you have absolutely no interest in poland in history or german culture he was a nihilist and he's the last that he unleashed to blow on books that you know about and then your legacy in the parallels between the models that were tearing down

statues last year and who go around today your own eyes university is there a saying oh this is white supremacy this is white imperialism this is anglo-saxon political tradition which means that it's just slavery and the oppression of the colored people by the white man the lesson of this got well in the city the george zimmerman the interesting thing for me i'm watching all this you know. changing names of libraries i taking down statues how can anyone explain to me how does that end systemic racism when you take a statue away how does that how does how does it solve their perceived problem go ahead george before we go to the break. when it goes it doesn't and you know and it's really just a matter all you know jeremy. the public into accepting your generally you know you're close us because of course your friend tradition your defender

white supremacy your independence. well if you're already going to have to jump in here we're going to go to a break here but you know you mention the right word you're terrorized for it ok we're going to jump in here we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion on fascism state with our kids. a new gold rush is underway in garner sounds of ill equipped workers are flocking to the gold fields hoping to strike it rich. as a day of particles that work children are torn between gold. was very poor i talked i was doing my best to get back to see which side will have the strongest appeal.

so country that just. today. has created. both. you've got the end of the spanish empire the end of the british empire the end of the roman empire and you have some similarities some differences but the 3 cities traffic we talk about the rise of one nation in this case china and the fall of the ruling at the time this case the united states we've got all those kinds of things happening right now the people who are least informed about this are the americans

themselves because the cable news network of mars the corporate news it's not in their interest to actually prepare people for this they're just considered to be expendable. welcome back to cross talk where all things are considered i'm peter lavelle to remind you we're discussing fascism. ok let's go back a lot of your let me in the 1st part of the program we discussed the varieties of what could be described as fascist movements fascist ideas fascist practices here and now we can and you brought it up so i'm going to go back to you one of this whole phenomenon swope ism and it's. of we focused on race and it's coming from

what i think it's fair to say from the left here and it's completely self-referential because. he hears nothing you can do about your you're the color of your skin you're just born that way ok and this is so there's no in this kind of woke asst. ideology there is no redemption because you were born an oppressor i mean that is such a self-referential ideology and george used the word at the very end of the 1st part of the program it terrorizes you go headline america you need both you know it 1st of all those babies and i don't you know on the reality you know i've been a serious analysis of kind of historical circumstances and so i'm going to be musical thinking of you know say you know walkies now with all their might columbus you know imagining is it right there live on these shores he was totally

a deal be knowing that like in america under my eyes are stickers that he can oh yeah and then the bad white man showed up and once we got the leader over he said it was in the fine and but as i said this is a president of kind of faces thinking that you know i mean look the has you do it in future and sometimes the office of the group and we know that if you are mentioned as to it's in my has you know when when they saw this threat of the danger coming from spain you know what would they do they came up with this idea of center of lies in thousands of people that in their hearts out hope vigil to find a solution they didn't find a solution this is this is just draft if they're rising vicious which is a way rather than sort of walk in altogether just some kind of you know meaningful you story going to be used you know as a solution if i get somebody who needs to secularize just throw these amox there and you know this is so destructive ultimately and we've seen his be only be the

beginning. again this is the star you can scapegoating some going to group and by elimination it will get somewhere this is the this is our communication but i would add one more thing the digital this it i think the situation of the states is really you have to go that high priest intellectuals you know if you gave people what is that basic you know you know where it went just crowd screams and yells you know down with these down and it's one thing but intellectuals will say guys let's look at things historically it lets us acknowledge it would we don't know all the truth let's let's be kambal you know now these intellectuals kind of you if you could were the kind of. create it was kind of more and more information about the abuses of whoever they want to accuse so there's a very dangerous we're going to so so i leave the little home my job and just a silence sort of accused all or denies it because we're going to we're going to have a dialogue and you know if he's up to to while they will they're cowards and tended

to say it they're cowards all right it's a professional manager ariel class that legitimize this here you know you know george i don't want to go down this rabbit hole too deep here but you know let's look at the issue of of racism in and slave lee and reparations i mean in if you look at you know white people didn't invent slavery were white people were enslaved of all through history ok and the historical fact is that it was white people that ended slavery as we know it today and the world almost completely eradicated it it still does exist in some pockets but it was it was and i have to give the the english the credit you know they said this is not good we're going to use our our vast sea power we're going to start hounding these people to destroy this trade i mean then that happened over the last few 100 years from time immemorial there is been slavery but didn't want to do these woke us walking around it it's something

that's been around for 300 years i mean it's so much a historical and it's cynical go ahead george. exactly right and the exact. the green collar people are not the only ones who have been in slavery and as you say slavery has been around since the beginning of time and 'd you know i mean when you're to talk about philosophy remember the the great tables philosophy and revolves around the mosque the slave dialectics because he's that crucial moment in the growth of self-consciousness of man in other words slavery was just went part and parcel of war and the new orleans labor to reconquer all of the conquer so there's nothing at all that this is uniquely whites against colored people but what's really happening now is that the this a historical that the destruction of people's lives and careers if they refuse to

follow our culture because what we have not this black lives matter is a cult and he demands going of the reasons just as you know the fashions leaders of the offspring obese and so if you follow. football in the in the united kingdom before every single match every single day all of the players have to sit and take the lead and no one has any charges on it no one says well i don't really see why we have to take a need for this organization black lives matter i mean i you know there's a lot of very. unsavory aspects of this organization no everybody has to take the name and if you don't take money your can feel the her off of her. believe. it is and i say you see this through out of the culture of the people who are you know expressed some skepticism as they will you know why and why don't you know why why do i have to accept this idea well you know you do have to because if you don't

you will lose your position and worse you know there is also the criminal penalties that might come. on the pike because you know you're might be deemed gauging in hate speech and so then you. are it is so you can see how this mentality now melts together with the state and to create a mission to help those who follow you know the correct your logical doctrine yeah and it obviously creates a chilling effect ok you do you don't want to express an opinion because you don't want the wrath of these people here you know a lot of merit george and i'm going to date ok on this program here i have to admit i was very interested in the frankfurt school the critical theory i mean i read about it was very very interesting to me it was a new iteration of marxism basically putting in culture and taking out race here i never thought it would be a user's manual i guess that's what really caught me off guard here let me talk

about that there because this is it i'm not just saying this is a marxism now this is what we call the in the in the literature western marxism the frankfurt school many of their members came to the united states during and after the 2nd world war and became very influential thinkers ok there's a man named martin j. he's written a wonderful book about it if you want to read about it i think it's called the dialectical imagination fascinating book i've read it a number of times but like i said i didn't take it as a user's manual it was actually a warning for me go ahead lot of. yeah unfortunately you know we basically do have to go back to their roots and i believe you know that economics lies are the foundation of many things and improvement of humor lives is fundamental in substituted of all there with some kind of engine you don't have symbol has on the identity politics are or any round of less and it's nearsighted so maybe it's

easier to do you know it's right cheesier to introduce some kind of new legislature than the change of the gnomic center and make you know who would be but a go say can only quite so that's why a lot of intellectuals welzel that it's much easier to deposit but there are it in reference to our previous discussion of slavery i would say here we have like. clinton champions of walkies and and they're tired of it so what actually accomplished for example is that they sense that libya they wanted into sort of not exists and believe that it's out and it would have us right now we have there was a war didn't leave militia now have it so they were market then and now the elite is destroyed when you now they bring slaves so that let's that there isn't a way but also it will result of this kind of very it may your big implication or some way of you know sort of pawns of the who call the g. whether you think that you know conniving is a bit and you want him to do something and what would you you end up just throwing

it any down and sort of just in out of the earlier games of people selling you know in slave people is the same lay people who are they fighting so this is a bit off of the you know. the whole this this project seized on this yeah i mean if george i mean absolutely i mean they don't they i mean this is just one gross form of virtue signaling because it's really people you know it's kind of white liberal suburbanites you know professional manager class that push this here they donate money like is eternal somehow absolves them of the of their collective go. which i thought we were supposed to believe in collective guilt ok and then they just kind of walk away from it in a bit for me it's kind of like the people they go into a room they they take the pain out of the grenade they toss it in then they leave the room i mean there's not much downside with them but everybody else gets a trap no go ahead george. yes exactly and of course it's much worse than just paradox i mean there's

a i wrote the sinister agenda to it because i'm going to release logan splash splash and splash this they move into ukraine and align themselves real those were actually russia. explaining that it's the russians who are the function of the same thing of what's happened in yugoslavia where the stars led by milosevic who actually wanted to maintain the multinational multidenominational yugoslavia want to keep it going they were dubbed the fascist. crashes apologist after all and just in croatia were the democrats so all of this is a kind of there's a very sinister game that isn't right and again you look at obama by the terrible at all of this i mean what he did domestically how he use this a slogan and demonizing his political opponents with this racist clashes but you

know look at again what what he did in syria where you know you have very cynical way aligned insults with people who exactly raised its we're in complete oppressors you know whether it's oppressive and we can george we can add to that we can add to that every single year waffen s.s. units you know they commemorate the collaboration with the nazis in ukraine and baltic republics the state department tony blinken where are you i thought you were all about you know norms ok and values they never say anything about it it's like a little cult. sure a lot of people these people here are gentlemen that's all the time we've had a fascinating discussion here i want to thank my guests in providence and in budapest and i want to thank our viewers for watching us here r.t. see you next time and remember crosstalk.

no one has ever cruised around the globe in an inflatable catamaran before. you go. to see a ship but. it is such a cruise you need a solid crew people you can share folks whole with so to speak. you can do with your business that want to let. the people.

who want to have the money you will be the limit for the most if you don't ski for just well the middle of march we directed the group with such a good little room what do you need for us if you could get the one the free do if you maybe only going to join your group. americans love by and. this was a fundamental part of how our political leadership and our country a large understood the bargain you get a whole and then you know rebel right as the things you don't revolt if you have a stake in the system. the really interesting is dialing back and think about the longer deeper history housings men in the united states not just that old question of the american dream the bigger question of who the dream is for.

palestinian demonstrators reportedly killed in over $100.00 more injured in the west bank as they faced self with israeli security forces the burning ties and a highly stunned. palestinian children are killed in an airstrike after israel ramps up military pressure on gaza with ground forces joining the air assault at the border there was bombing everywhere the planes were above us and the tanks in the view were shelling so we couldn't move the children along with women and manliest screaming i have never seen anything worse than this in my life tell me this is busy city and only the roads are busy at this time she is simply feel.