i got an option or kind of say we're going underground on living. the story is buried in the so called mainstream media coming up in the show. soft power promoting the ideology of new liberalism or vital humanitarian aid for the global self as u. k, p. m, or johnson's attempt to flash for an aid comes on the scrutiny and weapons. what sort of world is a self styled g $71.00 to come out in southwest england. this weekend is rich countries are accused of coven vaccines, apartheid, and 50 years up to the africa uprising. just why is the usa with less than 5 percent of the world's population, detaining 25 percent of the world's prisoners. we investigate the arguable mythology. the turbine used to force to legislation responsible for the mass, disproportionate incarceration of people, of color women and the l. g. b cooper, community, all the more coming up in today's going underground. but 1st u. k. p m, birth johnson gouged. what could have been its 1st defeat in parliament as he tries

to flash so called for an aide to 10000000000 pounds, but what is the true cause of international development as well? leaders gather in congress bay this week. the g 7 is the cost of vaccine equality to political price of oral johnson was yet to do a single dose from $1.00 of the wealthiest countries on earth. joining me now from london is the director of global justice. now, nick did, and the facts coming back on the show, you know, what happened to you during co lockdown and whether you turn into a cold war warrior. why do you not support boris johnson is cutting a foreign aid. foreign aid that we know has gone to destabilize countries and foreign aid that the opponents of johnson admit is soft power to attack china and russia. we've got so many problems with foreign 8 and i agree with you want to look that not just about the kind of stabilization, the and the way it's been used 20 years ago. but even today, i mean, it's still being used to fund private hospitals around the world rather than create public because of the accessible services it is still being used as, as

a kind of flush fund for big business. so i agree with all that with all of that and i agree to match the problems with that. however, i don't think that the reason for is johnson is cutting it and i don't want to give him any credit for that. i think what we should be doing is, i believe we should, we should redistribute wealth in the well masterfully. i believe we should be paying reparations for the damage this country has over the century to countries around the world. the budget for me is a small, small example of how you could begin to do that in a different, but it needs to be in a radically different way. and i don't think if we allow boys to cottage at this point, we're hoping that that cause to create a fair, a farewell, which is not in any way to let them all the way that they're spending a thing we shouldn't critique will criticize that. but simply touching it, i don't think it's automatically going to give way to something better, could well give way to something was. well, some might argue that just because you don't like bar a strong. so, i mean,

you know, given the benefit of a doubt, i mean, this is a b, b, c story from a while ago. and when bars johnson was foreign. secretary giving 4000000 pounds for the u. k funded access to justice and community security schemes. according to some of the free syrian police, i lied to al qaeda in syria. you don't think that was an education for him, that this money is going to pay for al qaeda in syria, going to pay maybe for overthrowing the venezuelan government is gone on the water privatization. andrew pradesh, who does what is going on in hong kong. i mean, you, you are a veteran of this struggle. just remind us of the malays. yeah. go down scandal. this is a case back in the 80 used 8 as a sweetener. she promised to build up to support the government and building a damn, but in any case was not particularly useful with great actually for the business, but reinvesting it. but it was a sweet and for an alms deal with the malaysian. and we actually, yeah,

we couldn't call and said this is like, this is a completely obscene and inappropriate use of the, of this project, which was tiny at that time anyway. i'm one. and so for me that that's a kind of what i'd like to keep doing, really, to criticize the critique to stop spending on bad stuff. but to say, actually we do have a duty given what this country's done over the years to, to help countries develop that health and education sectors to help them develop a decent livelihood textbooks. what sort of textbooks would they be? i mean, one doesn't have to disagree with your viewpoint on reparations. one can full audibly support that some of those developing countries might say, one reparation would be to stay out of those countries. sovereign states, business agreed, but you know, you don't have to be an extreme right wing torrie m p to say there are people homeless on the streets of britain. there are people in food bags and this money more often than not to my exaggerating,

goes to privatizing the resources of these countries destroying their economies by near liberalizing them and actually offends the whole idea of democracy in the global self. i think to some degree, you're absolutely right. well, i would like to see it is a kind of global form of redistribution. went to another party. i mean, you're right. it shouldn't be up to the british government to decide how this to spend any more than when people pay taxes in this money. they just, they can decide whether they, they're worth like the n h s a or whether it goes to council housing or whatever it may be. that shouldn't be up to the people who are, who are spending that taxes. that's not how redistribution works in our society. and it's not how we work on a global level, but i simply don't see why have cutting it. just getting rid of this budget altogether is going to get us any choice of extra practice if the british and state, if the british people, if the british government need to need to face up to the fact that we have caused tremendous damage in many parts of the world continues to do so today,

but that also suggests that some of the wealth that is accrued by, you know, very, very problematic main problematic trade deals and the way our financial system works and so on and so forth. we need to be giving some of that back. we shouldn't remain in control of how it's spent. i completely agree with that. but i don't think we should just say that the wealth in this country should remain in this country and should not be spent anywhere else in the world. because we know that in many, many instances, that wealth is bought off the back of exploitation around the world. so simply saying, we should keep it here and spend the on our own people to me is to me, is unjust, and doesn't recognize how this country has made it well over the over the years. okay, well you're on the same side as tony blair and eligible criminal launch res may gordon brown, and david cameron, obviously, maybe maybe a comfortable about that. i suppose is a need link really, between vis and the vaccine apartheid that has been alleged by all the britons

giving vaccines to the global stuff. i mean, china exported half of all the vaccines it produced to have a 40 countries around the world. why, why should, why should britain be giving the vaccine out to poor countries rather than vaccinating? it's under 18 year olds starting to 2 issues. first of all, we knew there was going to be a massive problem at the very beginning of the panoramic. in the hope that people discovered, we didn't know that the time, but we knew that when treatment and vacuum, we discovered there's going to be a math problem. why? because we have a pharmaceutical industry way more interested in profiteering based in a handful of countries. mostly rates countries. and if you didn't have one of those, if you didn't have the mechanism the means to make these faxing big, pharmaceutical companies could just keep the knowledge of themselves and prevent other countries from producers quickly on the next bill, sorry to interrupt,

but you know that the mass media in nato countries, especially in britain, is saying that the asters antic vaccine is not for profit and is a great demonstration of non commercial use of vaccination. that's not actually true. well, with the astrazeneca by the shore, at this moment in time, they are selling it. no profit. we believe it's quite difficult to tell actually because the so little transparency, but certainly they are selling it twice to no profit, but that can end any time. now they will make a profit of this vaccine in the long term. they've just not made a profit over the last year. and when you bear in mind that this faxing was funded, 97 percent by public and charitable money. and at the end of that process, it was the oxford, maxine, as we know, not the aspirin seneca vaccine. it was then handed over after negotiations with bill gates to astrazeneca. and they then get to control who produces it and who doesn't effectively who lives in, who died? why earth did we had that knowledge over to

a big corporation to make those kind of decisions what we say? it was really factoring capacity? sure. but they got a lot of money for that too. as to all the pharmaceutical corp, including the ones that are making much the profit, like why they haven't received so much public support from governments. like all right from the us government. it's absolutely obscene. and they should then control who gets this practicing and make those kind of life and death decision. now we have an international distribution network. it's very imperfect and that was set up to try to make sure there was some badness in which countries get which back to the problem is governments like color and both vaccines that are on the market. so it's find them same as presenting, not making any profit. the problem is nobody can buy it because you bought all of the doses that you could get your hands on so that we have way, way more than we need in this country. we will do it by the end of the year. meanwhile, the country can't get that. can't get their hands on. kovacs b kovacs also associated with bill gates. we did invite him on. yeah. but if you

book morocco, as with teeny, they've run out of the vaccine kenya gone, malone, we may run out in weeks his co, but it's been a failure. yes, i mean it's, it's just procure some practicing that is giving out some of those. you mentioned very, very, very small amounts. i mean, by the end of the year at the moment, they may have snakes about 10 percent of the developing world of the global south. now no way close enough to protect those countries from the ravages of this 5. meanwhile, our country will have to make it up, everybody by the end of the year. so. so while the rest are boundary groups and health workers on the front line in countries of the global sales, who happens the ranks and we're talking about vaccinating children, i have to say that's not my main point. i mean, i do think we should, we should that for faxing because i think, you know, if all lives are equal we should treat that. humphrey. i mean, tell me that because you know, when an aeroplane,

you put your oxygen mask on before helping the child. children can transmit corona virus. surely it is more important for us to vaccinate the children, so they don't transmit around britain, even though it's been well vaccinated. let alone the creation of variance in britain, then donating vaccines abroad. but the problem is that you've got absolutely, of course, ultimately i would like to vaccinate everybody. there's no question about that one, but of course, but at the moment children are much, much, much less likely to get serious with this disease. and it seems to me that if you have a limited amount, you should give it to those people who are going to try to create a variant. but there's a much broader question actually, which is, i don't think donations of the answer. i'm not saying we should do it. i think we should start because we got too many for our purposes and this happens and i think that's just a nice thing to do. having said that, there was

a much more structural issue here the prop, the real problem for me is we are allowing pharmaceutical corporation to keep this knowledge to themselves, and we're not sharing it and allowing others to produce themself. so there is a problem of supplying, we know the refractory around the world. thank please give us this knowledge. they know how and the right to produce this vaccine. and we could be producing by now hundreds and hundreds of millions more to ship. the fact that there's factory to like idle because our government, the british government, is standing behind the pharmaceutical industry and we're not sharing that actual. we're not sharing with keeping it to ourselves so that we can continue to make money on this for 20 years into the future. that's the real structural fact. if you're not going to, if you're not minded to give anybody else, ok, but for goodness sake, don't stop them producing their own ok. in fantasy biden's administration, they did seem to suggest a waiver on intellectual property rights. just finally, very quickly, a you celebrating the former goldman sachs bankers. you select johnson here. ahead

of the g 7 summit, glorying in this dean percent corporate tax proposal against the companies that rule allies taxation, right. and that is not going to solve the world's problem. moreover, and huge amount to this tax because of the way that the tax collector going to be going to a creature rich countries like how wrote not help countries that have been super exploited by the facts or just over the so much, much, much more need to be done. on the other hand, at least we have an agreement for some form of global taxation. now that may begin to address one of the absolute endless aspects of the global economy in recent years. the ability of, of cooperation and the super rich to pay nothing back into the society that they have made them on the handle. again, thank you. after the break as us vice president, while harris tells guatemalan migrants don't come to the usa. if you do want to be

in turn like tens of thousands of men, women and children, we break down the mainstream. mit about prisons help propel harris avenue as president joe biden to power told us more coming up about who going on the ground. ah, unfortunately we are witnessing a trend in media and they go from one news fiasco to another. the weapons of mass destruction story, the russia gate hoax, hunters laptop back in bounty tale, and now the possible colbert lab league story. now, why does anyone in their right mind even tune in any more the

ah, me welcome back in the 48 hours controversial form of california prosecutor come on, harris. now drew buttons v p has told guatemalans not to come to the usa. this is biden. has continued to bomber and trump mass incarceration of those seeking asylum from live is arguably blighted by u. s. foreign policy. south of the rio grande prisons make a safer 20 other myths about mass incarceration is a new book about why the usa in prisons more than any other country in history. it's also victoria law joins me from new york once victoria for coming on the show . so biden and california prosecuted v harris. have they read you your new book

because as you say in the book, biden's 994, a violent crime control and law enforcement act has been the catastrophic for incarceration in your country. i don't know if they have read my new book. i should certainly hope that one of their aids at least has it on their reading list. but i don't know if anybody in the administration has read it because again, they are architects of mass incarceration, both in california and throughout the united states and vitamins case. and they are now in a position to start coming those policies or walking those policies back. should they choose to do so, when should they have the political will to challenge these tough on crime war? i'm dogs ridiculous policies. yeah, i mean, i mean, you say in the book that i mean it has to be said by them has recanted. some of

that mass incarceration the policy work. you say even trump saw short sentences and tried to reform biden defect or 3 strike law. none of which happen under obama. what, why is it the democrats, i so associated with mass incarceration? i think when we have to look at is, there is a long history of both democrats and republicans, racing to be the toughest on crime. so in the 1970 s, when we have richard nixon linking the civil rights movement to st. crime. and people in their living rooms associating black and brown faces with crime. whether it be people disobeying laws around segregation and around racial inequality or crime that is happening to people on the street and calling for tougher measures. at the same time, we have a war on poverty that is not really going anywhere and

a war on crime which is taking precedence. so instead of investing in communities and people in the communities, particularly black brad and marginalized communities, the united states as a government and as many local governments invested in more policing more jail was present in more ways to monitor surveillance control populations before they could wind up and we see that continue through the 1980 to the 990 and into 2000. and this is not to give comp path because he was definitely part of that growing momentum, particularly in the 1900 eighty's when he was not a political candidate and was instead a celebrity millionaire taking out an ad to call for the death penalty for the central part 5 or 5 young, whack and latino young men who were accused of moodily raping a jogger in central park. they were arrested by the police. they were railroaded.

they were interrogated without their parents for hours and hours on and we had use one of the central by 5 on the program. but i suppose in a sense, ok, trump is over. this is by and this is come on, harris going to guatemala governments that routinely criticize human rights abuses telling the populations do not seek asylum in the, in the us say, what do you think biden has left his past behind the one that is created the prison population that, well, we said on this program a while back you know it proportionately it's more than style in our mouth. yeah. well, i think that what he's trying to do, or what he is doing is he's seeing some of the 1st can't impact. i mean, we have to remember that bite and son struggled with addiction and many people who have loved ones who struggle with addiction. find that they start changing their views around drug use and the demon ization of drug users, when it's somebody close to them rather than somebody who is far away and who can be others. so we see a softening of some of these policies,

but we're not necessarily a wholesale rollback. we're not seeing a massive clemency campaign to release people who are incarcerated under these outdated and obsolete drug laws that have been passed and the 1970 eighty's and ninety's. we're not seeing a push for fewer present or fewer penalties or less harsh penalties for people who are being sent to prison. what we're seeing is a rollback for some people and the same old, same old for other people. yeah, i mean, i want to get to the intersection and class war element is clear in this book. but just to be clear, crime in the united states a violent crime in the united states since $991.00 has carved around half of what it used to. so where is all this coming from? is it hollywood? is it the culture industry of the television? news?

i mean, why would people be surprised that crime violent crime is hogged since 991? i think that there is a media fewer in the united states around crime and sensational, lurid headlines. i mean, there's a saying in the u. s. news rooms that leads. so people don't want people will not turn into the nightly news or pick up the newspaper. if the news is everything calm and quiet today, instead people tune into the sensationalistic the, the things that make them feel some sort of reaction. i don't know, people are necessarily seeking feel, but feel thrills, you know, some sort of like some sort of lurid drill. people don't necessarily want to tune in and see everything was quiet in your neighborhood. maybe somebody ran a stop sign or j walked and that is the violence. there are enough violent war stories out there and it said that it didn't actually give,

leave it on the class on the class war issue. you compare the, the poor drug dealer on the street versus the purveyors of oxycontin or a crisis. also, would you say it is a class war? and it's, as you make clear, now, increasingly disproportionately detaining women, l g, b, g, q plus people it's, it's these minority groups that alone, obviously black people, people of color. yeah. i mean, what we're seeing is this is a prison system to target the people who don't have resources and are lower on the last ladder, the class race and identity later ladder, and other people. this is why we see that the sackler is continued to not be held criminally accountable proxy cotton. but you have somebody on the street, particularly during the height of the war on drugs, but even now being arrested,

being held in jail, which in the united states jail is where you are held awaiting trial. if you are convicted and if you are a sentence, you go to prison, to jail is for people for presumed innocent until proven guilty, but many people cannot afford bail, which is an amount of money that you have to pay to ensure that you come back to court every month to ensure that you don't say ok. i'm out. i'm going to just move to another town and live with my aunt and there and you name and never come back to court. many people cannot afford bill, so they spend a month if not years languishing in jail before they even get their day in court to prove their innocence or guilt. so what we see is the disparate treatment where people are arrested, their lives are torn apart. even a short stay in jail means that you lose your job, disappear for 5 days without being able to notify your employer. if you have children who takes care of those children,

you are more likely to lead them to the foster care system, which in the united states means that you have to overcome hurdle after hurdle. upon release to try to get your children back, you may lose your housing. they were all sorts of collateral consequences to being arrested. the people who have money can easily side skirt because they can pay the money for bail. they can pay the money for lawyers and they are not the primary target of the policing. it should just say the fact we're family very, very rich indeed has given settlements, but as admitted no wrong doing what so ever, what, what happens over there? of course, nato countries in western europe soon follows here the metropolitan police largest police force in britain says stop and search is a good thing. and we all know the disproportionate people of color stop in such statistics. you make clear in this book that people of color are not responsible for more crimes than white people. you know, they are not. i mean,

what we see when we study who commit crimes or violent actions are simply illegal actions. because in the united states, some actions that are now be, are now being criminalized, such as marijuana and the state is that they are equally performed by black people and white people. but because police just proportionately targets travail and stop and friends or people of color, they're more likely to find illegal contraband or illegal items. or find that people are engaging in illegal acts or build cases against people so that they can then face. we've stopped this person 50 times. this person is a person of interest. he's in our database. 50 times we have arrested this person 50 times. even if this person was never brought to court even if the charges were dropped. even if nothing came out of these arrest because there was no basis to the arrest, but it looks terrible when you have somebody that particularly is

a person of color, particularly does not have a private lawyer who has the time in the where with all to challenge the presumption of guilt based on getting color based on targeting based on class, based on appearance, in their presentation, to say, your honor, this person is being targeted because they are a black because they live in a poor neighborhood. because the policing in this neighborhood is like that of an occupying army and that they are not there to be officer friendly to the people on the street. but instead to make sure that they are targeting people and arresting people and presumably keeping st safe well. actually, parents apply to part. yeah. and you detail surveillance, predictive for leasing so many other issues. there is an upbeat note in the book though, why do you think, i mean it's a 50 is in the attic or uprising this year. tell me about the resistance that

social mainstream media isn't covering. i understand. there is resistance, right across the united states in the prison, the mass incarceration population. now. yes, i mean there has been as long as there have been prison, there have been, there has been resistance. one of the very early instances of resistance that i like to talk about is when the 1st women pricing was built in the 1700 in new york, the conditions were so deplorable that the women, why it is we don't often see why. as of that nature, oftentimes resistance is acquired or form of resistance, but people have staged hunger strikes in 2011 in 2013. there were math, hunger strikes in california, people as speech, hunger strike, work strikes and other forms of right of throughout the year during the corona virus to say, you know, we need medical care. we need to not be crammed into crowded dormitories or crap cells where we cannot social distance. we need,

we need you to let us out. and all of these immigration detention centers, people staged, whatever protest they could, they use the video visiting system, which is a system sort of like do make them to pay exorbitant amounts of money. and your connection is often much more terrible to stage protests where people would come up to the screen and hold sign saying somebody was secure, we have not had corporate test. we are afraid for our lives, please hell. others to, to get the word out about what was happening inside. they have contacted family members. family members have contacted legislators to what we see again and again is that people inside are resisting condition. victoria law, thank you. thank you. that's over the show will be back on saturday when british security forces prevent the public from getting anywhere near the g. 7 summit in southeast england until then follows the social media. i don't know whether you think prison should become a thing of the past. i

look forward to talking to you all that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings except where the shorter the conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we should be very careful about artificial intelligence. the point obviously is to great truck rather than fear take on various jobs with the artificial intelligence we'll summoning the theme in a robot must protect its own existence with the

ah, the the french president gets fluffed in the face while trying to get up close and personal with the crowd of supposed supporters in the south of france, germany is calling on europe in union to abolish individual member states, veto power on foreign policy of any dissenting voices. slowly your countries could soon be silent. us vice president been left in america to spread the word the migraines. welcome. after months of the by the ministration denying this a border crisis to folks in this region. we're thinking about making that dangerous track. not com. ah.