is often very dramatic developments only mostly i'm going to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very political time. time to sit down and talk i use welcome to the alex, i mean sure where we are to be one of the great campaigners of the last half century. someone who had graduated from tablets target as the most hated man in britain to a new find national treasure. with his neighbor to lead means team alex introduce peace or talk to about his career and play out to them before the launch of

a new film which tells a story of his lifetime of human rights campaigns. but 1st, to teach, you know, if a message is in response to actual last week, when we speak to legend football or undo what's on the england scotland game, wembley also spoke with lou walker. if you'll my dear john barnes, my walters, i'm jim now showing says this is a very interesting story. this is a course onto watson story. i've never heard of it before. yvette says just shows you how history has been censored. can't trust anything. gordon says, what is your previous program or non to watson? totally fascinating. i don't, i don't know on last history. he said, great pro, great backdrops colourful muffler to that. of course, there's my scotland scarf. and finally don says, really ensure very revealing. i'm not usual humor, mixed it. now when the full features, say ian mckellen and stephen fry, and both l from john and david furnished as exact to produce it,

he might expect people to fill out and take notice. however, this is no ordinary film. hasting pizza attached to which mark so died a total deep you of christopher in this is a don't commentary feature relating the remarkable campaigning life of controversial good rights activists, peter tactile. let's take a look at a clip. the comes down, take a pretest today for, for being arrested by the being targeted by the time come to the territory. like you gentlemen, patients, i don't know like the chris stating for homosexual when people empower, won't show compassion. sometimes you have to up the ante rights to book on how to

do protest pieces, perform and artist recognition from his extraordinary contribution to the happiness of millions, who've never heard of him. the whole gay community owes you it goes on your bravery and your courage, gay activists, they detach or refuse to move on the way. we are not to speech and have a need. you need me to finish up. i'm trying to shut off. this is no, or i know of a this is the most a smoked man in britain. from the early days, i thought it was a brave mother. we've tried to play by the rules. it hasn't worked. now we're going to break the rules in the me that i thought. so welcome back to the alex ivan show. great to join you. peter. the most hated man in brooklyn. but an actual treasure.

to follow my name flicks, i'm the films coming out in august. my goodness was happening at the peter gordon. main street. i haven't changed, but the consensus and society shifted, and i'm so proud to be part of that movement will of course, many millions of other people. well, the films fascinate the i see the exclusive preview of it. but let's, let's help that. if you are somebody who is actually culture the most hated man. and let me say that the title hating people actual came about because the director christ of amos, when he thought about making the film, was shocked by the scale of hate and vitriol against me. nowadays, i would say that public opinion has dramatically revised you of me in the life of my work, not just on l g, b plus right. but also on human rights in general. because i am a universal human rights campaigner and i stand to defend the human rights of

everyone. so let's go back to where it all began your life as a protest of campaign bye to your date of failure. your 1st real campaign was against vietnam, and that was the huge issue of the late sixties and early seventy's. so that would be right to say that you are a vietnam protest before you became a l g b t activist. well, that's right. i mean, in fact, my earliest awareness was around 963. when i was 11 years old and i heard about the bombing of a black church in birmingham, alabama, where 4 young girls about my own age were murdered by what races? i remember at 11 years of age that was so so shocking. and i didn't spied my interest in and support of the black civil rights movement led by doctor martin luther king. and ever since he still, his methods and model of activism has been my template. i didn't really run and so when it came to the warm get nom for the 7 i was in australia and said it was funny,

long side the american were getting on. i research what the ball was about and concluded that it was a very unjust war. so i joined with others and many, many others to organize a huge mass protest in my home city of melbourne against the war. a 100000 people turned out to bring the city center to a standstill. that was almost 10 percent of the entire population. and it did mark the turning point when the state and government finally began to think about withdrawal. so, i mean, most people over read about the anti war protests in america. how the impact on the american politics had the same sort of impact on the politics was failure? absolutely, i mean, in the $960.00 australia was grip by its own version of mccarthyism, an anti communist, which almost anybody with liberal opinion was labor the communist. i nearly lost my job because i was seen as an anti vietnam war protests by to fight to the now to

retain him. and that was very typical of the era. but the mass protest of that time to demand australian withdraw troops from vietnam that did really fundamentally change australian politics and led eventually to the election of golf with them government in the early 970 you arrived affectively as a refugee was say, nice shows where you're fleeing from the draft, or was it the repressive i'm to homosexual legislation which could have senior jailed both and it wasn't just the anti gay laws that exist in the street at the time, but also other very liberal laws, the death penalty, the censorship of books and plays ban on abortion, a woman's right to choose a whole host of very liberal measures were in place. but of course, the vietnam war and my willingness to be drafted for that was because i had

a conscious objection. that was the driving force that led me to come to britain. and i intended to stay only briefly, but the permanent stay permanent. stay here. and you arrived in a huddle, wilson had plenty sensibly kept out of the the vietnam war. but nonetheless, it was still repressive legislation against sexual fact. you're coming out at the age where i would have been illegal heal at that time as well. but i rived in london in 971 age 19. and although there had been a partial, the criminalization of male homosexuality in england and wales in 967, still many aspects of game male life remained criminalized and in fact were not fully repealed. until 2003, and you say you see male life because of lesbianism was it was not what i say, a legal correct. that's right. yes. there was never any legal legal law

against sex between me. and they said, because creed victoria couldn't counter the 5 to any such thing, could possibly have gone on. well, that's the allegation pop cups. the apocryphal story you arrived in a society which was changing and certainly give a sec, timothy was changing fast and the 1970. so you so you arrived in a flushing game movement that gave paid months was lasting. key organizations were starting up as well, so that was a good environment to come to as a gay rights activist. well yes, it was incredibly exciting to arrive in london from melbourne, australia, where there were no l. g b, t plus organizations. and wellness actually was still a criminal offense, punishable by several years imprisonment in all circumstances. coming to britain with the partial, the criminalization homosexuality and the formation of the gate. abrasion front was an incredibly exciting personal liberation to be able to join with other l g d

people and fight. right. that was a nominal very exciting moment. what perhaps did distinguish you from, from other campaigns, as you also chose to, to promote your activism for conventional politics, for the labor profit, and famously became the labor candidate and what has been described as the ductless bi election of the 20th century. and that's been blankenship duct, the bi election. so balance in 983 doesn't live up to that title, was it the duct, the bi election has? well, a lot of commentators at the time said it was the dirtiest most violent and definitely most homophobic election in britain. so that's, that's sort of where with pride. but it was very, very tough. and of course i wasn't just standing for l g b plus right? i was standing for everybody's right for social justice for

a fair or more equitable society for everyone. but when they get you, because you will get to us, so to get you because you were a read, peter and the gay gay of time was just that convenient mean means of settling hush. while i was targeted on 3 front, i was targeted because i was born in australia, even though i can trace my family back to england in 1560 in somerset i was attacked because i, yes i was a left wing campaigner. but indeed, all the extremist policies that i had a now main street, you know, argued for a national minimum wage. i was told that was extremely, i argued for negotiated settlement in northern ireland. that's now happened. i argued for a comprehensive equality act to protect everyone against discrimination that is now the role of the land. so you know, what i stood for then is now the mainstream. and i'm so proud that you know, i began the process would help make that happen. because you want to focus,

but for a number of competing interests to get, you know, as the right wing in the labor part. indeed, the bi election was really set up. so you could be targeted by the resignation of the incumbent, m p, the liberal party. we're, we're waiting to, to some, the bi election, the little s d p alliance as the, as the, well them the real bad and the labor will the st manifestations of ra prejudice and the mainstream media. of course, perhaps not emphasizing the, the homosexuality, but going for the extremist, the red tag, they went out to, to you up. so you became the focal point in the target for a number of competing forces. united only in desperation to get you, would that be a fair summary? why didn't get me there out to get the labor party and they succeeded because i lost that election. but i'm very proud that i stood on comprehensive l g

b t plus right platform with policies that are now the law of the land. i was ahead of my time. i think also that it needs to be said that, that bi election because of the way i was treated by the tabloid press and by rivals because of the home. by the way, i was treated that made it much easier for other people like chris smith, the labor and pay to come out the following year. i think that was such a revulsion against the way i was treated. no one dared to heap that upon anybody else, so i made it easier for other than that. that's a great positive thing. of course became a national figure as a result of defeats. i mean the name be the factual. i didn't was no residence beyond sammons as a result of the nature of violation. how comfortable was that laid for you know, the man who lost bam and say, or was it the, the past and who was done don't and lot of people rallied to your support because i

feel really sad that i last election not so much for me, but for the labor party and party members who put their trust in me. but on the other hand, i think out of that defeat, i start to use my public profile to promote a whole range of human rights issues from free speech, civil liberties to employment rights, to the rights of women, black and minority people. i've tried to use the platform for good you to your campaigning efforts domestically with conventional politics i did, and so nationally, and that's what we're going to talk to. and the 2nd half of this exclusive and to me, oh, the next financial survival guide, stacy littler about say aloud, let's say i'm,

it's joy and your time grief on banks of the site. 9 walk 3 prod. thank you for helping me. ah, joy. that's right. fill out that way. the welcome back. alex is into the in controversial human rights campaign of peter tactual about his 50 years of activism which 1st affronted and then compelled the case of media and public alike. me, frank, i don't think peter was always helping the church for 2000 years, but the same with the consent for a moral and we're going to burn in hell. the entrepreneur canterbury was interrupted today by a gay rights protest to carry opposers lead,

engage human rights. he's a bullying kind of trump trying to get his own way. oh man, i don't care about gay man, real man can talk with you. i got you. what keeps me going is the knowledge that the homophobes who are against me want me to give that to show you a couple of goals that well it's called conventional pop the politics and elections . but the basically said in the 980 sure you're real campaigning, f up. so beaten, and white mobilize ation weight of campaigns domestically and internationally. looking by of these, which will show you was proud of me, have done so many, but which one do you say, right? i'm really glad i did the well i'm, i'm pretty proud that i stays the 1st of a l g b, d plus protest in a communist country in east berlin in 973. i was interrogated and arrested by the

stars he bought through that protest help take the ideas of gay, the abrasion to the soviet block. and when i was there, i distributed thousands of secret underground leaflets, circulating the years afterward, the day's work. yeah. and it helped trigger the formation of some of the early underground l g b t plus movement in countries like germany, czechoslovakia, hungry and so on. so i'm proud of that. i'm very proud of the 2 attempted citizens . the rest are president problem regardless, and bobby on charge of the torture. although i did not succeed the publicity about those attempt, help shine a spotlight on the human rights abuses that he was inflicting on his own people. well, let's talk about the night tonight tonight. them, so that was that said, a london hotel described the sucking sciences. what you saw waiting in the for you to, to post and how did you go about that? i got an almost tip off that present mcgarvey was staying at

a hotel near victoria station. so together with 3 other active as i lay in wait outside, he so tell. and when he limousine drove out, we ran in front of it, forcing it to stop. and then i opened the record door and placed him under arrest. we then called the police and even though we showed the legal papers for his lawful arrest on the british and international law, we were arrested and he was given a police escort to go christmas shopping at harris. and how did president gob taylor? the thought was black and he would have been likes to some the opening is cause of the to think he was gonna get shot. you should have seen the look on his face. his jaw dropped, his mouth opened his eyes pop. i think he thought he was going to be killed, even though i held out both hands to show that i didn't have a weapon of the 2nd time you tried to arrest them in brussels. i mean was a case of all noise. hem again what, what happened then?

the 2nd time, when i tried to arrest him in the lobby of the hilton hotel in brussel, initially he and his body, god thought a well wish coming up to congratulate him. i got right close, but as soon as i said he was under arrest, i was beaten up and eventually beaten unconscious by 40 god. was robert mc gabby. a surprised this specific county was to, to see you entering his pulpit behind the case of george kerry on easter sunday, myself and other members of outrage. we had tried to get a meeting with the archbishop for 8 years. he wouldn't meet us with anybody from the eligibility community. so we thought we have to go to the cathedral and we're better than on easter sunday when the event is televised around the world to challenge him. and so that's why we walked into the pulpit and we simply called him out over his support for legal discrimination against l. g b plus people. he was not just saying that homosexuality was wrong and he was

saying the law of the land you discriminate against us. did you get prosecuted under canon law? no, i was prosecuted under the ecclesiastical court jurisdiction act of 18. 60, formerly part of the building at $25051.00, which makes it illegal to interrupt a minister of religion in a place of worship. i could have got fined 5000 pounds and sent to prison for 6 months. but the magistrate accepted the protest with brief, peaceful and respectful, and therefore he find me the prince, the sum of 18 pounds, 60. and what are you bound over? no, not bound over him. tested didn't the reaction of the congregation because it was pretty hostile. that is a christian call, negation of aspects to the your fault, perhaps your christ in the temple, or somebody might come to mind that people can be unpopular for making

a protest at a particular time. and then right, the spectrum history judges that definitely but, but congregation. well having another fit when they were clapping to get you out a lot of them, but correctly. but of course, we did not interrupt any of the sacred parts of the service. we waited until dr. kerry sermon and i would say with justified on the grounds that what is more important the decorum of a church service or the human rights of people. and i would put human rights 1st. as we all know, jesus overturned tables in the temple. i'm no jesus, but certainly i think direct action, peaceful, non violence is justified to defend human rights, even in a church. looking back over that law p to fight to be there's some back, controversial things you've been engaged the lot because the subjects themselves are controversial. many if you have use, as we said mainstream. no, but the,

the decision you made and others to people who were closet homosexuals, that caused a lot of angst with in the gay community looking back because i need a grant saying, do you think that was the right course as well? well the way we saw it was that our thing was korea, self defense we, we were defending our community against people who were colluding with the homophobic church and were being hypocritical, you know, they were saying or supporting one thing in public but doing something different in private, and that's your property, it's double standard, and we believe it was right to call them out. the consequences of balancing were very positive. none of those bishop ever again said anything as far as i'm aware against the algebra plus community, and 2 of them, a venture became allies and supported. you've had a consistent live in defense of free speech and not as brought you under attack from, from some transact of as, for example, when you have defended the right of traditional feminist. to argue for single sex

spaces or the nature of the debate. with that type of debate effect, you were almost with in the summer than cabinal debate within the, the gay community. i can understand why trans people angry and i support them. you know? but i think the best way to defeat transfer via is not by ban. don't know platforms, because that doesn't make the ideas go away. the best way is to challenge those people to put out rival speakers, to organize, protest outside their events, to show why they're wrong. it's not just no platforming. does that mean? much them to who questions total acceptance of self identification from institutional feminist viewpoint is suddenly labeled a transfer button on the social media mode that you have lifetime as an active us, you have half century and more of spine, the period from traditional state protests to the suck,

elated pamphlets of east germany and i went to the, the social media age. see to confirm that if somebody doesn't agree with you, then automatically there are a transfer but should be no platform to should be site. it was funny. how much does that cost you as somebody who's stood up for free speech? i do got a lot of stick from people who side on, on. it's about a difference of tactics, not about principles or goals. and it is very hurtful and i do get a lot of hate mail from people who i thought, well, my allied and supported boss. on the other hand, i also got lot of support. and for me, the important thing which my mother taught me is i must stand up for what i believe to be right. i could be wrong, i accept that. but i am doing what i believe to be right on following my conscience . and that's all i think anybody can be expected to do. but for the, the big fellow coming up, give me your rally, some impressive cast list to your support. so you mckaylin was doing the interview

. stephen fry speaking elton john as the executive producer. i mean, these are huge names. gratifying is it to, to see that sort of caster rallying to, to your site does look over the lifetime of protest. what is gratifying to think that i've gone from the margins of the mainstream. it's great that you know, building on public figures understand that support my work. but of course the most important thing is the average person. and that's why i want them to see the film. their support is the most important to me. a couple more questions with the prospect of you becoming mainstream of the views you pioneer personal course back in the 198th is now becoming generally accepted. it's not what are you in this you'll this stablish will say, well that be a part. so he's already here to be fine. we'll, we'll have them off demonstrate against praise to pretend not some international protest. he's all right here. no, because they can accommodate his views of any sort of niggling. what are you for

you right or wrong? i'm staying through my principles and i'm still on the cutting edge on so many issues. you know, we all expect political democracy. i'm asking, why can't we have economic democracy to? why can't we have employee and consumer representative on the board, the private companies and public institutions like the unit chair. those people have knowledge and skills that could help make those institutions operate more effectively. it is also simply an issue of democracy and fantasy. a people looking back goodness, i mean, you'll hear what the federal campaign of bachelor's human rights activists are. the 1st 3 years of, of protest. do you think my goodness, has it been half, essentially, and more audience? like, what's the next camp in a fight? what's the next mountain declined by this bit of tactful survey? the presidency. i don't look back much,

although the spilled hazy piece that she has forced me to do so, but i'm always looking forward boy, whereas the next battle, what's the next justice issue to fight and win. so you know, i'm ready for another 26 years. i'm 69 now. i'm looking forward to talking about 95. that case, peter will be sure to have you back in the show to tell us how you are getting on. that would be great, and in the meantime, i hope everyone will remember. don't accept the will as it is dream of what the world could be and then help make it happen. that's a great way to finish. that is something it is a stable about pizza, tactile style of campaigning, uniquely his mom is to combine thing. i read the things in a civil and courteous manner. that is no doubt that his actions have been designed to be deliberately provocative. there is no more sensitive tame for english christians than eastern master within con to be cathedral. russia jane the well cup

of 2018 would not wish to focus on writing checks. now, while peasant mcgaffey did not expect to be the subject of a citizen, the rest fitting his christmas shopping in london. however, part of the archer protest does depend on targeting the moment, which are most precious to you to put in to publicize your message, and therefore detracting from this. this also explains why, despite his mild manner, peter title has always provoked strong even violent reaction. above all, the pizza, tactile story, underlines a crucial importance of stamina in political campaigning. from being the most bodily cheated candidates in violet and history. to his accolades, as the most hated man in betton, he knows to be the political landscape where many of his views have guided as mainstream. even conventional. whether this restless campaign is altogether comfortable with that new acceptance still remains to be seen. it would not be

surprising if the mainstream media had to dust diner. i made headlines about peter tycho once again that for life and myself, alex and all this, you'll stay safe. i hope to see you all again next. ah, me, in the long when i will show the wrong when all just don't the rules. yes. to fill out the thing because the application

and engagement equals the trail. when so many find themselves, well, the part we choose to look for common ground in the headlines is russia wounded to the consequences its territory. waters violated again for u. k. will ship breaches in black st board and also to kill him and his arse. software pioneer joe mcafee, is found dead in a spanish prison cell. and what the authorities say suicide. although he had tweeted that he wouldn't take his own life on the pandemic. see the number of things rich joining the 1000000 club shoot up his report finds that firms profiting through the crisis. don't spread the wealth to ordinary stuff. ah.