means china of argument, we shall low point, particularly in the wake of accusations over a woo lab leak. and we get genocide. nevertheless, communist china is the only major economy that hit record economic growth in the 1st quarter of this year. amidst the current pandemic. joining me now for a special show from shanghai, venture capitalist and political scientist. eric lee, thanks so much eric for coming on. the g stands for a group, but i don't know whether you think it could stand for globalization. you said before that globalized door globalism, injected globalization is dead, has been dead for a while. was the g 7 basically another funeral? well, thank you for having the i will call the funeral. it, it's a small party. listen, i grew up my high school. i went to big high school, 300 kids just in my class. well, if you want to have a party with just famine people you could do. that's okay.

i tell you these, these guys didn't go very far in life. maybe go to a far life because they wanted to nationalist enough. well no, they were 2 exclusive to too much into themselves and they thought they were hot. they were bullies and they could run the world was much larger than that. and you've said that you can trace the current society as, as configured in western europe to, to new liberal reforms after the fall of the berlin wall. you see what the swedes of the world has basically failed. they failed western europe is failed. the 28th crash. i think you said that china failed to understand quite cataclysmic. the so called western economic crisis was that we're still

living with today despite the impact of the pandemic. well, i think it all transpired at the end of the cold war and we all know america and west one, the cold war are somewhat de la co. but since then, i think western society has gone on an indian logic who say within their own country, they thought they got the magic formula, which is global, or liberalism, taking around the world liberal market economics. electoral democracy, all these things they think is what made them succeed and they're going to universalize it and push it to the extreme in their own countries. and that led to the new liberal doctrine of economically and politically and socially if you will.

and i think i have run the ground in the past 10 years. they've gone too far and left too great unraveling of their own societies and a large number of bathrooms. the countries that adopted those values and those systems are not succeeding. developing countries among developing countries, post cold war china is the only major country that had really prosper and delivered for large number of people. deliver to them a better life in the world really. and the analysis that you'll see in the west for that is because it abandon socialism. i understand you've said actually the years between 949 and 979 of state socialism were the fundamentals upon which the chinese 21st century was built. this would be an evolution

from the time of the creation of the people's republic. well, yeah, i had said that and i think you know, people miss and miss. since through the history of modern times, they tend to divide it into the 1st 30 years and their mouth cho, about late shopping market reform, which china to what it is today. but i've always said that without the 1st year, the 2nd that the market with mom would not have been in the 1st 30 years. obviously we had a lot of problems and a lot of mistake. but it was in the 1st 30 years, we go like expectancy. he might be 49, bailey about 40 or i think what, what do you one, you, when i live, i'll live life expectancy in 1949 when people to publish mounted to already in the late sixty's. in the late 1967, i think

a literacy rate went from negligible to over 80 percent among young people. in emily, 970 industrial base, was built in the 1st 30 years. and more importantly, national independence china acquired. nobody's invaded. and that allowed it to pursue it, don't pass after the 1st 30 years that the people at the public so shopping warms were successful in many ways because the foundation was late in the 1st 30 years. and profound you've argued has been the relationship between political power and capital. you claim that will these g 7 leaders in capital exerts disproportionate influence over politics here in britain, in nature of countries. whereas in china,

capitalists just don't have that power. well, i'm a capitalist, i got no power in the medical power anyway. so be, i think what has gone astray in the where in america and maybe in europe and who is after the cold war. they've gone on the new liberal path where the capital has the interest and capital risen above the interest of the nation. so capital began to pay politics and they looked after their interest. so that's how you see the wealth capital in liberal society and solidified authentication. in america and west and indeed, equality has exploded their food banks down the street from me here, remind us, what is the precise difference between capitalism in nato,

the liberal country and capitalism. in china, we don't have capitalism. we have a market economy. we do have a capital and we have people like me will manage capitalism. to me, means a market economy that you managed in a way that it generate efficient time allocating efficiently. ok, capital is to meaning somehow capital the interest of capital rise above the interest friday of the whole and they capture the process for their own benefit. and that we don't want in the country evolved in extol the virtues of merit, socratic, communist party congress. the definition, philosophically of meritocracy, easy in equality. you don't see the dangers of the increase in inequality in china, not just because of how successful the, the market,

the economics china is become because of the system itself based meritocracy. well, i've always said that china is in has america craddick governance, but i never called a america cd. i think there's an important distinction there. kind of governance, being able people can raise, can rise through the ranks and become decision makers. and that's what mary mary govern me. so you want capable people or test it through the years. and just like a good company, you will have people that are capable, your hire them at the bottom, and they move through their track record, and you give them our responsibility. and how i, that's what you know, what, how it government should work. and you see the future enjoying that in terms of combat again and quality a return to some of the more socialist marxist principles that have arguably been

lost. well, yes i, in the past we've seen a great transformation of china last 9 to 10 years. the, i think the paradigm shift occurred in 2012 with the 18 party congress. and china had shifted from the 30 or 40 years prior to that, which was the headlong pursuit of economic growth at whatever the cost actually. and that we're shifting away from that towards what's called more balance, well balance development, which really mean a common prosperity a more equitable society. so there are a lot of side effects of market nomics that we had for food for de equality is one of them. environmental degradation, it's another, an odd and corruption was another. so all of these issues needs to be addressed.

and i think there's been a, a great transformation where the chinese society in china self perception and the national aspiration of the chinese people in my generation, especially among young people in my generation. we work primarily concerned about china being poor and lacking about on but if you ask younger generation multiple wine post 994-2000 there, 34 in your mouth. by the way, there, of course they want economic opportunities, but their primary concerns are about any quality and sustainable sustainability for the future. so if you're a viewer in a nato country watching this interview, you're going to be thinking, hang on a minute. china is responsible for genocide every other day we hear about this alleged genocide in gene jang. and arguably, arguably

a connected to china's lack of interventionism given it's afghan, has done the chinese officials now talk about and you have no free press and you're not allowed to. the chinese people is 400000000 young people. they're not allowed to understand the history of civilizations from all different points of view. what sort of society is that? well, if that's what they want to believe, they can believe. if that's true, china going nowhere. if that's true, china would never have achieved already. as he you know, the young chinese view is jordan knowledge of the world. and that's the fact that we have the post money for 2000 generations. extremely lifelong about. i mean, i'm not saying wikipedia is that great, but we compete is banned in china. yeah. but well,

base they can still get cnn. let me, let me give you one exam. ok. i'm so sorry. sorry. yeah, that's, yeah. but listen, i think that the year before 2019 alone about a 120 a 130000000 chinese people went abroad and came back were the largest current outbound part of the country in the world by far so. so to say that somehow chinese people don't know about what's going on in the world. i think they're battling mistake. eric, i'll still be there more from the leading chinese venture capitalist. political scientists after this break. ah jain me every thursday and the alex summon show and i'll be speaking to guess in the world, the politics sport. business. i'm show business. i'll see you then me

when i was the wrong when i was just don't the rules yet to fill out the thing because after an engagement equal betrayal, when so many find themselves world far as we choose to look for common ground in after the fight in some european leaders, such as germany's merkel and frances mac road called for renewed dialogue with russia. the baltic states in poland said not so fast. thus there is no consensus within the e u on how to move forward. the ball remains in brussels court the

welcome back out to fill with venture capitalists and political side as eric lee. you said the europe, europe ian project is basically finished. obviously, a lot of people in britain agree with you because they voted for breakfast and the largest democratic vote in history in this country. do you see the response to china's rise in terms of sanctions, in terms of what many suddenly chinese officials believe is propaganda and the western media. these are the only responses left for brussels and stroudsburg. well, i wouldn't be so cut the mystic about europe and about china. i don't think your project spanish certainly in some trouble. i think it's in trouble because probably because of take them on a overly logical interaction for some time. and i think from self corrections are needed, and i'm, i'm optimistic about the future of europe and for the correct itself.

and we know that, but in terms the relationships between europe and china club and the west and china, we're talk about the meeting that just late in the year. i was just looking at the numbers of the countries, the largest 3, the largest economy of through us, japan in germany. guess who is the largest trading partner. all 3 china in the u. k. china, biggest in full market. there are 200000 chinese students studying u. k. universities, right? paying $1700000000.00 pounds a year and tuition is probably the largest source of foreign revenue in k universe days. so they're extraordinary interconnectivity between china and all these

different countries. very there is the indic electricity in china, just replaced, as you say, germany as britain's big, simple market. but you know about the sanctions, what the businessmen think, watching this program knowing the 3rd party sanctions, china is now saying they're going to retaliate against us. trump era sanctions that have been continued through to biden, what is a business? what supposed to think, despite all the big figures of huge indigo activity about the future, is this is, this is unstable. how can i be sure that the governments here in europe and are going to sanction me for some element in the supply chain? well, it's unfortunate, and i think it's like i said, you know, china is the largest trading power in the world today. and it's the largest trading nation in the history of the world. so if the country is one of a and they, i fully china, they're going to be isolating. but i mean,

china is built in to the economic world cannot exist. and i know that it's been reducing the amount of bonds, the u. s. bond between buying the us debt panel is increasing its now $9000000.00 up $1.00 trillion dollars of us debt. and why, why is china so interested in, in optimism for the american dream as we've seen, the recent instability in the united states. i'm not sure. optimism is the right way to describe the national relationship. china, obviously a lot of matter why, why in the dead? because the economic way to china and of the trading relationship equation has the balance going out. well, mentally, i mean, i'm not a economist, economist, i believe they will tell you that the u. s. consuming too much and making a saving and that, that's why it's involved, you know,

one way out of the reliance on the federal reserve, which obviously that is into linked to and lots of talk even in nature, countries about the mass printing of money here in britain baghlan and the federal reserve is crypto currency. was china clamping down so hard on crypto currency? mine is that would make countries all over the world in the developing world, independent of a federal reserve, which arguably operates for u. s. interests. well, i'm not an expert currency, but what i've read is there are 2 issues. one is extraordinary energy come to mind climbs. so i think that's one of the reasons they are trying to control that. and the 2nd reason, obviously it's a currency that poly regulated at the moment. so they're probably out of potential

for financial. i mean the us better i think are cracking down on crypto currency in the future, i think currently does have a role. i think countries that cooperate and work worked together to, to, to, to develop the rules of the road. i think very early stage. yeah, i mean those who are full of your current, so you'll get an agenda or any water in modern development actually is that they should be which is that one problem. the other current that being said, i think china is at the bottom of that and already the united states is looking into that too. but i mean when you talk about regulation, that would be the united states, regulate, regulating the dollar, trying to prefer that. no, i think china will be regulating its own i mean, fundamentally, what is,

what are the big differences and perhaps reforms that nato countries fulfilled suffering. the legacy of the 20 way crisis could learn from china or the history is just to, to different. i mean, britain, have a civil service. people say vaccination program here in britain benefited from the creation of the national health service in the, in the post war period. are there other lessons that western european countries can learn from china recovering from the impacts of neo liberal policies? i think western countries are really, instead of trying to develop ways to keep china down, they need to reform what the west america and europe need reforms badly. they need to reform their systems to make them work better, less politics, less ology, and more. delivering practical good and practical benefits for their people. that's

what governments tell people all the time in the nato countries. that's exactly what they were trying to to. and in fact, you know, what was a big issue, i think with western country is that somehow they have convinced themselves that there's only one form of democracy as called liberal democracy. and they made this length of liberalism and democracy. only liberal society can be democrat and i think that's false. there could be other forms of democratic governance. i, i, for one thing, china is very democratic and it's not liberal. democratic. western countries tend to believe that somehow you have to be liberal democratic. and in fact, i think liberalism has left to a lack of democracy in western countries as make the west let democrat. so i think

that's something that we ought to consider in western countries. and yet the peoples of europe, the vast majority of them are sure they and the ones living in the democratic societies and you are not i, i think, you know, the west tends to measure democracy by procedure and what that for liberalism, it's about procedures. so if you follow these procedures correctly or follow the thing correctly, you find the condition nation democratic. even if you're starving to death, you're democratic. i think, well, the chinese, at least for me, i think democracy ought to be measured by outcome by resolve. so if you're delivering a better life for a large number of people, vast majority of your own people,

of course you're democratic. if you're not delivering how, how democratic are you? i mean, some may be asking, as we hear the rules based international order being recited, here by up all additions all the time that the nature is losing patience with china. morris johnson has sent the biggest warship in the royal navy towards china's maritime borders. china is allowed 400 bases in circle your country. and obviously companies, big companies who are way obviously banned from the 5 g infrastructure of this country. it is if it's, if the torque is being ratcheted up or multiply and the communist party of china is trying its best talking a bit more the wolf diplomacy. i don't know whether she just brings against it. now, the wolf differ busy, but it's as if it doesn't realize how and circled and how isolated it

is in the world despite all the interconnectivity isolated militarily under siege. i think that's an unfortunate development. i think it's contrary to what we know are the facts on the ground and what we know from history. so i'm always that china, you know, 2030 years ago, china, chad, the chinese before this idea called people arrive and they wanted to rise people. and at the time, a lot of people thought that you know that i was not credible. and a very few people believe it. but looking back i think people rise has already happened. we went from a for a growing country to the great industrial power house that china is today in merely 2 generations, 2nd largest economy and the largest economy by purchasing power parity. yet,

china has invaded a single country, not a single shot, fired. and i'm present it in human history. if you review the survey history, arise of every great power on the higher roman empire on the british empire to america manifest destiny to the rise of modern japan, modern germany. almost all of them actually, all of them were accompanied by great flush at colonization of entire continents killing off slaves, months of entire population, invaders wars. all of them in china thrive has been faster and bigger than them all. a so far not a shop has been inspired and that's a great accomplishment. and instead of celebrating this accomplishment

encouraging its further development, we have these hostilities that developing among western powers. and i think that's an unfortunate and disappointed maybe even in the global south recognize the chinese achievements. i know the, the programs in latin america and in africa inside these to asia here in britain, you probably know about media censorship. we have julianna's and being tortured up the road here in bel much prison. according to the un, china's network c g, g n, defacto band here by regulate just how can china get this message out to the world that it comes in peace. if every time any official, medium tries to speak it's suppressed. and journalism, arguably in nato countries, is, well, some people accused of being captured by the military industrial complex. well,

i tell you, i don't have any idea how to get the message across. but if western media and western media don't want to portray to china that's truthful to their own people, that's their law. and they're doing service to their own people. and they're losing credibility. i'm on 1400000000 chinese people as well. and i think, you know, it's on them. eric lee, thank you. and that's for the show what we'd like a wednesday when invited me person needs with joe biden in geneva until then even judge my social media and tell us of using major, major media reporting on china. it's fat ah ah ah ah

ah ah ah ah all the all the next financial survival guide, daisy, let's learn about fill out. let's say i'm a joy and your great grief. i'm thanks of the site. wall street broad, thank you for helping with the choice.

6 that fell out that way. you know, probably going out of my back on it. i would have been like, oh well, no. okay, you're talking lost. but you're so you'll have a lost his boss because i just got any of that. but let me just go to go, we're going to be, i'm on my cell. my don't put up as soon as i mentioned earlier. so i said, you know what? it was you are not. so my pull up, i got my almost what did, i'm already whatever sped up. i really just gotta go in. i mean, it was a lot going on. we went up as i say, i mean, really here. so i just don't get it until then it's fitted to chantelle. noticed that one of this but i'm like this but what it is i'm looking to see if you could ok home. i just got that. yes, he think i was calling with you and your team, samantha, katie. yeah, my thought,

a lot of problem. you just gotta go to the the is our top headlines here on our teeth. vladimir putin wraps up his live q and a microphone with the russian public revealing after weeks of speculation that he has had the sputnik v vaccine. and that russia will be dictated to by social media platforms like facebook. off the recent discovery of the mass graves of indigenous children at religious schools in canada for catholic churches are burned to the ground and suspected austin attack and rage erupt into violence in lebanon, where fuel price hikes have worked in the countries economic crisis and lead to long queues at the pumps also phases seeks to make it easier for teenagers to.