sound sources the, this is great for me because i'm always looking for a way to give things away. dr. because the tax laws, you know, definitely do benefit the wealthier people and our society. so it makes sense for them to throw it out right off rather than give it to somebody who could use it. and then that person is not going to buy it. the ah, ah, ah ah, ah hello

and welcome to cross talk. we're all things considered. i'm peter lavelle in the us democrats talk endlessly about the so called january 6 insurrection. they're less concerned with the real possibility, general mark, milly, when, constitutionally broke. also, the art of stabbing, an ally in the back, france is furious. me to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess, glenn, these and, and also he is a professor at the university of southeastern norway as well as the author of the new book. great power politics in the 4th industrial revolution. and who depends. we have george semi welly, he's a counselor at the gaggle which can be found on youtube and locals. are a gentleman cross off rules, and that means he can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciate it. oh, it's going to george, 1st thing, budapest, george. you know the, if you, if you look at the liberal media in the us,

continue to be obsessed with january 6. even on the 20th anniversary commemoration of $911.00. they had to poll january, thinks into it, and then over the last week we have a story about the joint chief of staff, general mark, milly, according to news reports, we have that and have them confirmed. and we know the general be speaking in front of congress before the end of the month. but instead of saying, oh my goodness, what a breach of the constitution of norms coming from such people. there seems to be scant really interest in it. i mean, when he did it because he's a patriot. well, since when breaking the laws. patriotic. yes. this is entirely correct. and we're already used to be around the, during the trump years, we had 4 years of the intelligence services actively working to subvert the administration. all duly elected president, and this is what we have in the case of general milly. i mean,

let's keep in mind his 1st, according to the woodward book, i mean, his 1st meeting or the conference with the chinese took place on october. the 3rd before the election is before the election. he give them a warning and says, well, i think trump may want to attack you, you know, even when you play a women's and i, the chairman of the joint chiefs will into seed and give you advanced warning. so this is an extraordinary thing. imagine you're going to an advisor is a great power and you're telling this great power that you will come to mom, any orders given by your president. and this is indeed shocking. and then there are further shocking revelation. remember, we had the previous book in which milly was supposedly worried about a coo,

organized by trump. and he said, wow, don't worry about a thing, you know, where the guys with the guns. so which suggest again that he's the military is planning on using guns against the do like the present. and it was, this was all a complete fraud. he was just simply an accumulation of power use a basin of power on the other. milly. i mean, compet given no indication that he's going outside the constitution going beyond his power. you know, he's gone to court on everything. some cases. he's won some cases, he's law, but he's always expected every decision of the court. everything it, it also the lecture was again, entirely in accordance with the law and the constitution. in apparently one of the phone calls, the general mentally tells his counterpart of general lee. i think his name is, is it, there's no political instability. him, you want us to say something along those lines and mean, do you believe that there is instability here for

a general to be doing that out of the chain of command is breathtaking. li, scary. ok, glen? i mean, you know, we've seen a deterioration of the rule of law for political purposes in the name of an ideology. george is absolutely right. you could lover, have donald trump. there's never been any indication that he wanted to study a start a war anytime. anytime during his administration, and we know because of the poorly served president by john bolton and he had a golden opportunity am in like a 90 minute window to start a war with iran. and he, he stepped back and he was political capital for doing it. so, i mean, it shows that, you know, these institutions have very little value. if you're ideologically possess, that's what it tells me, go ahead plan. no, i agree. and i think that this a great fair enough trunk would undermine democracy. fuel this uterus system,

which itself became a threat to democracy for me and throws them in situations. it's a large extent, the result of what they referred to as a deep they've now usually people are hurt and indeed the theory, something right winger and bring up all over the place. they simply means that you have an, almost like a bureaucrats on the military leaders supposed to be an instrument of elective obligations. but instead, the beginning them to function to some extent of the independent graduate power and pursuing their own agenda, which can be ideological. and in this case, often linked closer to the democratic side. and what i was going to call, i mean, generally called chinese general li sounds shang, behind the president back and give him a warning that promised him a warrant. if they would use military force. i mean, this is quite extraordinary banding civilian control over the military and also not the 1st case. and again, george was right during a trump area,

you saw military leaders in the bragging going to the media that they were able to subvert civilian leaders. and by making well, by rejecting the saying that they didn't want to carry outcomes orders, and they leaked all his calls. they tried to undermined him undermined him time after time. and, you know, general mill, it pointed out it's, you know, those expressed the belief that russia was the real, or they're not china. so that's kind of his foreign policy and he is running with it. so it's in glenn if, if, according to general, lily russia was the primary adversary and we've been out of things. why didn't you call the russians? i think is a point out. this is not just the case. the one about an indication that it is a stomach because you can see, based on the reaction and how did the democrats react to this small, nothing by them below say they seem to be quite fine with how really active and

erosion of the control, the military so i'm glad you brought up george. this is just not nilly. i mean, this is an unelected official that works in the executive branch concluding when the speaker of the house. now this is what is called a conspiracy. ok? a real one. ok, inspiring. going around the chain of command, so burning the rule of law and i'm to burning the additional value principle that the military serves the civilian order. george yeah, yeah, that's right and wrong, but i mean below state is in the legislative branch. she's clearly not in the chain of the bomb and she's a highly partisan. this is here, but this is a so she has a very much a political agenda and mentally those perfectly well that she has a political agenda. so when he starts talking to her on the phone, she tells him,

well, ignore the orders of the president and then they, they dressed it up in some phony. so we're concerned that he might use nuclear weapons to total nonsense, but eventually what is going on here? general, the joint chiefs is colluding with a highly partisan legislator to disobey combines they did you like the president? it is absolutely shocking. and so you only, you measure be to that you will be testifying before congress and we know what's going to happen there. and the democrats will run interference for him. you know, that will all be asking him the usual questions. you know, general milly, you know, you are patriot. why did you feel when somebody like donald trump came along and started undermining the constitution? what you're feeling when you that's, that's not going to be and so glen glen is right them you have the democrats will just perfectly happy with this. and it is really quite a shopping face of

a radical. it was even more shocking here. is that according to milly and well, and we know other people are involved if the reporting is true, we have to have that can be on. it's very important copy on here. but, you know, trump was criticized endlessly for trying to end wars. and now he's being, being accused of starting a potential war. i mean, he can't win for losing this one here. and i'm glad that george brought up. what we could potentially see is congressional testimony. i think we know what the democrats script is going to be in liberal media. they've already shown their carts here, but i have a lot of doubts that republicans will be particularly aggressive because the 2 words that you already mentioned in our program, the deep state or the administrative stage of the permanent site, whatever you want to call that. ok. because it shows that the,

these elected officials either are very dependent on, or you even fear be in the military and the intelligence community. what we have here is we have an inversion of what the power relations should be. go ahead plan there. remember us. yeah, about a year ago, schumer or in the 2018 or 19 you had the schumer and janet from if you go against the intelligence agency, they have many way of getting back at you and you know, he didn't see anything wrong with this statement. they can act as a member and the power, but again, this is what happens when you have other polarized. so this is the political system . you know, if you consider the political position to be illegitimate, then there's no exceptions for this new centers of power. effectively intelligence agent in the military to the couple of in, from this was deemed to be the legitimate sybil in control. and a effectively accept that as part of the resistance to counter the president. so

again, i would often going to, it's a bit ironic that the accused him of trying to start a war with china, which, you know, there was never an indication that should've mentioned this before calling the chinese 1st but, but the way they really around the obstruction against trauma was when he wanted to pull out from syria, what he wanted to pull out from a gun is done. it was his effort to stop this war when they really went in to, to mock him. so it's, it's a very, it's a very dangerous development which none of us benefit from, i mean, and i thought it was a great that and brought in the comparison with the russia gave years because this was the same. you have intelligence agencies in the, in the branch of power effectively, deliberately spinning different formation and undermining their own precedent. because again, there are, they didn't agree with this policy. and how else can you define this in a deep state if you have on the bureaucrats like the security age of this one run in procedure on foreign policy. it's more of the worst for it's, you know,

you know, for free for years and, you know, anonymous and anonymous source, whoever that is, you know, ran the new cycle. and then you have to prominent not particularly virtuous people in my opinion, but prominent journalists, laying out their sources in their and their findings here. and a few people just kind of scratch their head and say, you know what, what, what's tomorrow is whether going to be, i mean it's, there's them in the face. they do not want to come to terms of that. and what the, and any president that comes next, or even the current city, you know, how much competence they have with the military is going to be following them. you don't have that competence finish george sense like, i knew they really shouldn't have gotten it because the democrats may say, oh, great. well, you know, we've got the, the military on our side. you may not have it because, you know, you know, who takes gym to the joint chiefs, you may not like the democrats. was there any clearly feel? it's highly unencumbered by any constitutional inhibition does it?

i mean, we, we talk about russia again. well, i didn't like it policy towards russia, so i'll take a little jump in here. what goes around comes around, all right, we're going to go to a short break. and after that short break, we'll continue with discussion and some really stay with you. now. one thing we don't talk about america is class or other countries from class war like great britain is a prime example. but in america to play no take step now. yeah. the ah, is your media a reflection of reality?

the in the world transformed what will make you feel safer? tyson lation, whole community. are you going the right way? where are you being somewhere? direct? what is truth? what is faith? in a world corrupted, you need to this end. the so join us in the depths will remain in the shallows. ah ah, the ah, the welcome across that were all things are considered. this is the home addition to

remind you were discussing some real names. i okay, let's go back to glen and also the french are kind of upset right now, and i think this is your statement here we, we have the united. thank you. ok in australia, inventing a new i don't know what you call it alliance with, but really official. it is essentially it's a p r campaign at this point. that is, everyone knows that is focused against china. but in the process, a major submarine deal that the french are counting on went up in smoke without them apparently being notified. and of course the u. s. and the, and the u. k. come in and fill the void. what does this say about nato unity? because and but you know, why do you feel if you're the australia and they said to him here, it can be you okay. you know, doing a bending one of their important allies,

friends. mean, what do you think? maybe they'll do it to me. i mean, a very few people who bought out the implications of this here. this is how you treat allies, i thought from, with the guy that treated allies badly. go ahead when a little often pointed to trump, there's also development on began under obama then trunk, and they told them to with, by coming in the big difference. however, due to the much broader change in the international system. but if you're not a state of new priorities, which means it will focus less on europe, which means that the relevant front in the world will diminish. now it's important to point out the west that the unified region only really developed in opposition to russia when it was the principal adversary during the cold war on the union. and after the cold war, when the west wanted to collect the money which relied on marginalizing russia many times the right in the rise of china, changes on this course. the u. s. and resources will now be directed towards asia,

and so they will still be in to follow us lead by the us will be less willing to devote the efforts and resources to europe in our d and something changed. so i think that maybe your p and american interest are also changing their down prioritizing europe want to be, are being supposed to do so to some extent and go along with this, you know, making, they took chinese power as well. about the end of the day, america's interest is not in europe anymore. so this is, this is why the french, i think, the strategic relevance declining and how i was going to really interpret this a friend how to deal with still straight for $10000000000.00. the us when behind their back stuff, the deal scraps and put in a new deal. and it's kind of make sense from the american perspective as well because they see the chinese now being the main threat. so they're building up regional security outlined against the chinese in the alliances cold war. the americans tend to favor trade deals and the technological transfers them, you know,

having this interconnect focusing more on the key allies. so simply, the role of france is diminished and said if you're really wants to have some relevance, especially problems, the really need to have an independent foreign policy because retreat under a us, which doesn't care about that in a more. so i'm sure right now there's someone in paris speaking about the need to charge a new, an independent for its policy, especially towards china because this rent and then this public having to reduce the ability for the pm's for an office. and instead of grades relying on the u. s, which doesn't prioritize europe. so if it's something more than the making and if i did a biden will be different from it through the obsession with child, but he was the source of all evil. it's called national interest. george, me, it kind of choice words coming from the french minister a. but i can quote,

there's been lying you pleasant. he may hear marie's trust and can tell. this will not do well. what are you going to do about it? you, the french died themselves students to do nato, and to the united states. what leverage did they have 0 george? that's why they were notified. her, their feelings well cares. it's nato. we run it. and when we think it's relevant, it's important. if it's not relevant, it's not report. okay. you see, i mean, i think it's almost like child's play. the see the french reaction. they mean all this, you know, know, you made the bed together when you slept in it. go ahead george. yes, yes, that's exactly right. and where are you, what i yearly should have for now is france, germany in europe will reconsider what made those about what the foreign policy is really about. but it's very unlikely to happen. i mean, you know, 1st of all,

nato has expanded to co op, a whole bunch of states that are rabidly anti russia because what would clearly make sense now for europe would be to forge some kind of a, a working friendly partnership with russia. i mean all this that that should have been the policy in the 1990 the but it's going to be very difficult to do because you've got all of these big phase bolen and you know the unit, the less frequent romania and so on. what really and ga, they are going to tolerate any kind of move towards a rough, rational with russia. so what's really going to happen, i think, is what the americans envisage is a division of labor. they say ok, we're a global, we have the global reach. so we're going to focus on containing china, you, the europeans, you focus on containing russia, and then we'll have this d,

a dual containment policy. and i suspect, but eventually those are the french, are picking up a foster. they'll probably go along with it. they'll probably be the blue, you know, the next the meeting of whatever the g 20 or whatever no problem. yeah. okay. with the u. k. plays a crucial role here because the u. k. is in this agreement, we contain china agreement. and that'd be also blustering about what we're sending our warships. busy into the south china sea, but do you guys also in may so, and it's going to push a strongly anti russian line. and so it's going to be very difficult. i don't think germany really having the will to forge a new direction. okay. but we've been glenda that assumes that russia really is a threat to, to the european union in, i would say it's not, but i mean, can, can, can you play that fiction forever? i mean, considering the resources you're going to have to devote to it, i mean, sir. ok, it's still up in the air. what we're going to have the german election,

the greens have any kind of bill power. i would tend to agree with george. ok. but brand certainly doesn't feel that way, natalie sanders and so forth. i mean, it's going to be kind of an internal nature minus us will be the nico members in europe. it's going to be a real interesting squabble. ok, because you end up in a way wag the dog situation with the eastern. so we know what these to be and their role in the, the coolant in 2014 and in give me to didn't serve the purpose of the mission. but they got stuck with it to get to get stuck with an anti russian agenda in georgia, suggesting yeah, well, that's the problem. that's how the your pm security institutions have been set up where you have got to have the europe completely unified except the largest country . and obviously in europe without becoming against automatically you will have

conflicts, someone didn't. so the problem gets them to go back and looking at some of the have to go back and looking at some of the initial structures in a 990. of course, this can become an opportunity to maybe reconsider about the of the, the members of nato. they, you know, they're like you and banjo. they just have this time rushing component to the foreign policy. and while they're loving for and so, but again, like from there, there is a bit of a dilemma here because if you want some strategic relevance in the world, on one hand, traditionally and for the past decades, they're relevant to hinged on the us having a key interest in europe, in the front line against russia, which is why then how this central role. well, now that says shipping to another place to keep the relevant, should it further coming to us, which doesn't really care about them, but then they will just become independence. they will, who will then become even less relevant, or do they try to form their own independent foreign policy break coming from us

maybe. and the policies were china and russia, but in this case, americans might undermine them again or punish them for this or so. then they had to do have a real dilemma simply because the world strict and this, the center of gravity is no longer in europe. this is knobs where the major politics is. what i one of the french going to do to remain relevant. obviously this is the price of being here. you buy your enemies and you tell your friends, this is carla can explain this. so surely they can continue this way. they all in the germans. they strike deals with the russia when the american strike deals with russia and the point out before the streaming, probably concerned a little bit as well because, and they went against the chinese pulling all this and they lost a lot of trade to the chinese and a lot of people picked up by the americans, so they have to start to have a fun point whether or not in their national interest or the bidding on the wrong horse is there's

a lot for the stigma. so george americans back bills. i think that they just continue with what we're saying here is that in all of these calculations, the weapons, the center of gravity problem is, is less less attractive because what they would have been doing us ahead. yeah. well, i think, you know, if the europeans want to be irrelevant, if bronze wants to be irrelevant and wants to get washington's attention, spanish, are you a foreign policy? the washington doesn't. why? that's, that gets washington's attention. if wrong. a gall, yeah, exactly. if macros saying, hey, i think it's time for a new relationship with russia and he was signing, it was sort of agreement visiting russia put in visiting barriers. and so that would get washington's attention. if you go whining, oh please, please, please pay attention to us where we're still, frankly, in the well,

you're watching those that we thought all this, you know, we've been hearing this for decades. you know, we know that he was going to come round and do what we say in the browser in here, you know, but it's a question about germany, but prosperity has an opportunity and out, as you say to you, i goal is the foreign policy about it. would then have to go against the u. k, because the u. k. still very influential within nato and would have to then see what happens with the weather in germany. some new kind of leadership going to merge. that will be a york railey. can't just go on hiding behind america wherever you know. not telling them the, their nato allies, they were leaving now. then number one, then we have this submarine deal. number 2 in very short succession. we have american patriot missile system being removed from saudi arabia and other places here. i mean, a lot of things are moving around right now. one thing is for sure,

the, these old in stone principles about foreign policy architecture. they're all moving away. they're crumbling, like deaf and oh, and on this, nato has a good opportunity to rethink. and so maybe we think itself out of existence to start talking about its own real national security gentlemen would run out of time when they get off slowing in budapest. i want to thank you for watching us guarantees you next time you remember cross ah ah, the

back guys are financial survival guide. when customers go buy, you reduce the right. now, well, reduce the lower the best under cutting, but what's good food market is good for the global economy. ah, working machine, she popped in, she said, well, i'm getting ready to go shopping for christmas and we research there was a good device, another shooting another safe part of american life shattered by violence. the gunman was armed with a r 1570 automatic rifle. when the issue comes home, it's time to act when we're filing on this issue, the other side window by default, lady that lived over there. i was walking one of the dogs. she said, why do you wear again? were you scared to death and i took it off. i think the people need to take

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