terry focuses on such things as strategic balance and the west, so called rules based order. however, what is missing in this discussion is the rise of a civilization that challenges western gemini, is the west prepared for this arc of history. the nato stays cool for a strategic review of the block with france, warning political dialogue within it is non existent for the dispute deepens over a security between australia and alliance members of britain and the u. s. europe was any shortage in decades rattles the politicians with consumers facing its surely winds and without fuel. there is a familiar escape as lawmakers demand moscow pump more gas on separate is lita car fusion. mom has been arrested in italy after 4 years on the run for his extradition to spain off to the east,

stripped his parliamentary community. because the report is up next to while the view is, can capture the latest episode of sophie and co back at 7 am of your time. with that, i just want to forget that ah, welcome to sophie, go visionaries, me. so shevardnadze digital art is rapidly grabbing the attention of not only tech enthusiasm, but also venerable auction houses in decrypt art crazed, a bubble high by the pandemic. or is it real? and it's here to stay. while i talk to one of the top 3 most valuable artists of today, mike, when cool, man, i got people they do tardy is mike winkleman. i can people

great. have you with us, mike? it's been ro to i got you to talk to me, but i'm happy that you're here. i'm happy to be here as well. all right, so in march, kristen sold your work for almost $70000000.00 and become like the 1st purely digital work of art ever gone under the hammer and a major auction house. these made you certain most expensive living artist in the world. i mean, yet you don't like the term artist deeming it too pretentious. but really, why i, i don't know. do you find it if somebody of you like of were like out or something and somebody was like an artist, but you kind of thing by but are you when do you kind of find it a little pretend just maybe i all grade are all grade professionals have that like charlatan syndrome where like they don't want to be called what they are, but it's actually a good thing. i think now be,

be yeah, i'm coming around to it, i guess. yeah, i mean if i sold my digital work for a 70 me ways, i'll be calm around real quick. i'll tell you that much and how it does not hurt. ready like, honestly speaking, it was your tremendous success at christie's and when i 1st heard about and of tease and everybody's been talking about them. since then, can you explain for our audience in like really simple terms, what is and non fungible token? it's basically a digital proof of ownership and that ownership can be over a bunch of different virtual things. in my case, it was digital art which before this there was no way to class. there was no way to . ready like, truly prove that you are the owner of this piece of artwork that i've made. and this is work that i've made over the last 20 years. the everyday needs to call the

christie that was made over the last 13 years. but it worked, it myself and literally tens of thousands did not hundreds of thousands of artists have been making over the time. and there was no way to really. ready sort of so that's what i did for what i did, but, and i are broader than that. it's really just proof of ownership. so it can be applied, you know, will be a bunch of things from concert tickets to. ready property to your car, like there's a bunch of different things that eventually asked me, well, well, most likely be used to sort of like transact, right, right. so if this is some sort of like a digital code from what i understand that is unique and, and all these major piece of digital art to which this code is designed practically affordable or really read. exactly. you have to sort of like, it's the strongest, the block chain, but right now nobody's been able to sort of past the block chain. there's not,

you're not getting people sort of, you know, being able to create points. and so it's really the same sort of like underlying technology. so yeah, definitely by far the strongest sort of authentication we have as a sort of species, i guess some of our practical person. and i'm thinking can and if t be used as a collateral, like a physical piece of art. yeah. and a lot of the work that i do because i feel like that's a big part of that is you're going to view the art somewhere. and so either you're going to view it on a phone or like a tablet. and to me that's not really that interesting. so the pieces that i've done in the past few months here have all have like a physical sort of like little digital sort of video brain that they come with. you can just sort of put in your how to sort of be like any other piece of art is something that you just sort of tacitly enjoy. and it's just like anything i was just kind of in your how in your environment all the time. and i feel like you're

going to start seeing that more and more with digital are coming into the home and be just like any other piece are you know, earlier this year i've heard hacker are still digital artwork or a thousands of dollars from one of the biggest of team marketplaces. does that mean that despite all of these, like crypt logs, hackers will still find their way around? so the way that they did, i know the way that happened is they told people passwords tend to be old fashioned way, and then they just log in with their password. so it's one of the things where we get wind off in terms of keeping our information, say, keeping their stuff out of hackers and you know, everywhere because that's the thing. when you get hacked like they can get into anything. so they were using sort of real credentials that you know, they had gotten to other i still can get at around the following. what's the point

of buying a file for the price of a monet, if it still oper, display in your instagram? and absolutely, everyone can enjoy copy free. yeah. 100 percent. and that's the thing that i think is, is one of the hardest things for people to get their head around. because an a t's are not about restricting. but that's actually a really good thing because the great thing about it being available to everybody think a bit more like a public new or again, anybody in the world can view for free. that's not the case with that monet. you have to go. busy to a very specific museum. so it's very different, and that's the thing that i think would actually be a huge benefit or not recognize, with an ascii. but isn't it the whole point of paying so much money for an our piece is that, you know, you can choose who sees it or not, or like,

know and say that the more people who are the more popular become more valuable. if you really do not want to refer back to you want everybody to see it and everybody does the most popular image in the world, it will probably in most valuable. so i, let's say if a rembrandt got stolen from a museum or destroyed by vandals, it's gone, it can be lost forever. nothing can ever happen to a digital piece. that's not true. and that's not where you could transfer this like into a wallet. and then you move control about all it. and that's happened with people a big point. they had their money in a like ard, like, you know, physical sort of like device. they forgot the password to the bite and nobody will ever get it. and though it again is a big me, things like they and sort of, you know, under control. so it's not again

a 100 percent infallible, but i mean, you still have a copy, you have a copy, you will have the copy, but you don't have the original sort of, but yes, you have a copy of it, which again is, is another sort of benefit of digital art, we're over sort of like bar we're going back, it's burn, it's gone, you know, will have images out there, but we don't have that sort of original thing, but then it sort of can, might live on and i look at it as being able to pay different physical forms over time. so like the 5000 days that you know, christie's back to be turned into, you know, a giant brand, it could be turned into a protection. it could be turned into a bunch of tv screens with, you know, an animated version of it. it can sort of live in the real world in a bunch of different forms and still have that like, you know, native digital form that's like unchanging and sort of tied to the block in here. i

mean, i'm a very tactile person and there is something very kinaesthetic about possessing physical arts because he can judge the same thing that the great artists have touched and done and you see the same thing. they so, and you own it, nothing like this is possible with digital art. so by buying do you basically basically buy like the copyright rather than the last time you denied it, similar to what you buy. you know, i'm on a or whatever this of that. i don't know about when they, but if you buy anything, you're not on the right. it's probably may as well that you do not own the copyright you just on that. and so it's very similar to that in terms of most, most and teeth, summer starting to sort of, you know, and that one to that because again, you can sort of program anything. wow. and so some people are starting then after, right. so that might be a thing that are standard, but here we out. i mean there's still lake,

something less glamorous when they aren't worth. i bought a christ is a actually my phone, people like owning things, right. owning softer is also great. it's just not the same as owning stuff, right? we'll owning a file, be less attractive option for let's say, art collectors and owning like musical pays just because of that. when that's where i and that's for, again, putting them all the stuff that i've done. because i do feel like that is a big part of like if you want to like see that thing. i don't know whether that will become standard in the future. there's definitely a lot of what i, what i will say it does do a decrease friction because if you have a purely digital thing like this physical thing attached to it, you kind of have to sort of ship it to the next person. so there is some, some drawbacks, you know,

having physical combined to these things. but to me i think it's outweighed, in that, you know, you're able to experience that. then again, i think that people are want to be something that represents the thing that they, in many cases a lot of money or that they can kind of show off. and i think it's a better way or the physical culture and the physical screen. the thing come in, that's a piece of the art or it's designed very much for the artwork, the digital artwork. and so i agree, i think having a physical component to me is very important. i think i can see both sides. yeah. also because in a physical world like you can see the craft too, you can actually, you can say like, oh my god, this isn't amazing mac master without even knowing who that is. and he said, this is crap. you know, like a 5 year old can do that. when i look at your like, you have this static about them there edgy and alpha times with commentary.

beautiful can sending messages. they want to see a cat man going for $600000.00. i'm thinking has it will go crazy. i mean, i think it has, again, you know, line between good art and bad art even exist in the digital were rare old. so i guess i personally don't look at that as art, per se. i would look at it as sort of like a collapsible, and it's not a collectible sort of like internet culture. again, because that image became very, very popular. it's bad. why it has that value? it exactly sort of kind of what i was saying for there is nothing great about that image. it just became very, very popular and was used in a 1000000000 thing and toys, seizure, video games and whatever. and everything tv shows, you know, it became worth $600000.00 because many people knew about it. and i think, yeah,

now this is a piece of like culture and a piece of the like internet history. and so i look at those, the sort of like a little different from some sort of my digital art, more like a baseball card. i think a baseball card for sort of like the in for michael. going to take a short break right now and we're back. we'll continue talking to mike winkleman aca. people stay with us, the ah, ah oh the when it comes to the rise of china, most of the commentary focuses on such things as strategic balance and the west, so called rules based order. however, what is missing in this discussion is the rise of a civilization that challenges western gemini. is the west prepared for this arc of

history? ah, the ah the ah, and we're back with mike winkleman,

aca beeble mike. so even though like the end of t is hale is like the new big thing, right. and though our power houses like christie's consolidate there on board with like promoting and digital art, there is still a lot of skepticism about it and you know it in a traditional role that sounds like an empty blog chain business is very dodgy. others question. the artistic valley of crypto art does all that affect you? oh yeah, definitely. i would say it. it would be sort of nice to be like yeah, but i don't know about that or and like where, so yeah, i definitely think it, but i think it's something that i'm e people come around very quickly be quite honest. and i think as people come to know more about this, because the worlds were just buried, my digital art world was know nothing of the traditional world and the traditional

world, nothing. and so it is, it's only been a couple months, you know what i mean. and it's sort of like our history and how long needs are been all. busy been understand what happened and sort of, you know, what's going on. i think it's very quick, but i think people sort of from around very, very quickly. and so i think it's going to be sort of a symbol aided into. ready the broader conversation of fine art very to be ok. so you've aimlessly sad that the craze that the and of t digital art created is a bubble. when 1st, are you saying that that was a little out of time is more so i think it's going to go up and down just like again you look at it didn't go straight up. it went up and then went way down and went down like 80 percent, and then it came way back up. and so i think you're going to see that things happen

with an app. it's one of the things we're going to go through death. but if the technology itself is sort of simple, just proving digital ownership, i don't see that going away. i see that just being more and more useful and sort of being able to apply to a bunch of different use cases over time. and i think digital art again will continue to be sort of like them later into the regular conversation of art. so you'll see a selection of sort of, you know, all have their stuff retained over time. but just like a lot of traditional art, not all of it sort of retains value over time. so you do need to be sort of, you know, very cognitive of what you're buying. because just because something then as he just like website, it's very analogous to like the early back. just because you make a web page doesn't mean it has any value. and it just because you make of the amount of the doesn't matter, give it a value just needed to put it on watching your work as reviews from art experts and

appraisals for celebrated minorities. i mean i've heard damien hirst. he like gotten yeah. he's like impressed after his teenage son showed him your work on instagram. so to me, this is the essence, you know, the glory of the digital art. it is grabbing the attention of instagram and take talk res, tech savvy, young people. do you view digital art as an ard for the new generation? ah, to be honest. yeah. and i've actually talked to daniel, you really like understand that and get that. and he actually just did an ascii project just recently, which was super good, but it's one of these things where i do think the younger generation will get this 1st. and i think it'll be something that, you know sort of older people will get. i'm 40 myself, i'm not like super young. and so it's, it's one of the things where i think they're just more used to sort of

a virtual ownership and their virtual sort of like l. and so i don't think the huge stretch for them to sort of take into like understand and internalize sort of digital ownership. and so i think also it a lot of the culture of the work that i do specifically and many other digital artists very much speak to like the internet and the language of how the people sort of make money and, and also, you know, just sort of exist you know, what i see is people buying crypto art for crypt, a currency and i'm thinking 10 years ago. something like that that would have been a fantasy. is what art partridge now is going to look like? i think it's done well not, not really. i think yes and no, i think it's going to. ready be sort of divorced from crypto very again,

and he's like they should all be able to pass. it doesn't really have anything to do it. prepped out. it's just the sort of underlying watch knology they both use, but it doesn't really have anything to do with like a pointer area. like, you know, it should be able to be it and it will, it will be able to be bought with just every regular, like credit cards. but at the same time it does your point of patronage sort of remove the middle man. and because people are able to go directly to their back, instead of happening to go over a gallery or even, you know, sort of like an auction house. and they're able to much more easily sort of directly connect to, to, you know, the following. and they bills online, you know, the art market is like a finicky thing, right? m r doesn't only exist for our dealers. people need to seed. do you see

a future for digital art and digital art exhibits? yeah. 100 percent. i think you're going to see that if i think, you know, again, it's for me then on here. so the sort of, you know, with museums, they're usually banning show about 2 years in advance. and obviously with call that everything got super messed up, and most museums aren't even fully open. but i think it's something you're going to be very quickly is. and i think there again, the math of benefit of you could have the same piece of art at 5 museums at one time. that's not the case. the traditional art, one painting. it's got to move around all these places, crated up to the next place. digital art is able to sort of like in multiple places at one time and sort of be able to be reached by a bigger community. but i guess like the question there would be, would bring art exhibits to digital realm,

like instagram or something will dilute the important so far. what i'm saying is i going to take to see rothko is an experience in self and i feel that are sort of thing does create a richer context for art perception. internet doesn't like attention focus, you know, that's true. that is very definitely, you know, when you go and see something in person and you take the time to be there and have a much more obvious, singular experience like that. that was very much, you know, toys and had a cough. because again, the games are not free and it costs, and especially if you had like a family, it can be quite expensive. it's one of these things where most people don't have that opportunity. and so it's sort of like a big deal on mine and well, i'm not either, my choice is not the, the roscoe or the, you know, a version online of course they're going to mine. and so just by peer numbers,

most people will the thing online versus seeing it in, in service space. and so i think just kind of recognizing it is what it is in terms of that. and that's a good thing because again, that kid in indonesia couldn't see it at all if it wasn't for the internet, you really know what it is. and so i think that again, it's something that it's everything to trade off with digital art and sort of disco present, the not having it, but i think there's definitely a benefits that, you know, think being burge, on being able to be accessible all over the world so when you create for a small screen because you know, we all use small screens, most of the time these days, do you feel limited by that or, or expression? there are absolutely limitations. like for instance, most of the, the vast majority of the pictures that i create are portrait because that sort of

instagram, you know, what they like the size they like or whatever that aspect ratio. and so i do that, but i kind of look at that stuff as not like a negative having limitations. i always get that sort of a positive because they give you a framework around to build something that it totally blows guy make anything. so i actually view that sort of thing to be honest, but it absolutely is a, you know, if you want to be able to sort of succeed in the social media landscape, it is something that you do honestly need to take into account sort of, you know, roles and sort of like, you know, metrics and ways to format your work. tablet, seen by a bunch of people in your mind, a competition of sorts between the digital and non digital art at all, or are they to math is going to exist in parallel without affecting each other at all? no, i think there, i don't think it's

a competition because this is another art form just like it's not really a competition between teaching and are there just to things like that. and i also don't think they're going to like exist in parallel. i think they're going to be intertwined very much in the future and i think be quite honest in the future, i think all painted and it will just be proof of ownership just to sort of track often and it won't be something bad. you know, sometimes it will add a lot of value and sometimes want to have my cell, you know, it's literally, you know, a piece of paper that basically says, you know, the problem for the piece. and so i think the 2 worlds are going to merge, and i think you're going to see more digital artist, you coming into the much like myself, never pictured myself make making physical or now that's like it, you know, huge part of what i do. so i think you're going to see a bunch of people coming over like that. and i think you're going to see

a bunch of the traditional art people embracing the digital technology. damian, her, they go a traditional are person coming into that the and after world. so i think you're going to see both, you know, both of them just mix together and just be another are form just like graffiti, or street art or, or sort of, you know, painting sculptures, whatever. i think it's going to be another one. all right, thanks a lot for this wonderful insight into the world of of t. i wish you all the best of luck with all your future endeavors. it's been great . thank you so much. i would very much appreciate it. thanks a lot. take care and i hope we meet in person. one of them are we good here. we're perfect. have a great day. bye bye. the

main cost in order to search and focus bittman. lowball got me. oh yeah. oh oh i i oh god. give me. i understand, i

it's a topsy turvy globalized world, as we said, one of the same for 2021 to be globalization. indeed, dollarization dollarization is not happening right now. people are flocking to the dollar. as all these countries began to get more belligerent in their rhetoric and their saber rattling as we used to say, and they were getting on a war footing. right. and china is obviously setting themselves off for a move on taiwan. i think that's going to be the big story of 2040 me. i actually don't want any baby, but i'm happy to hand. yeah. of course. ah, we're, we're not doing anything illegal. so there is, there would be

a law against it, but there is no law against taking food from the trash in. the stores are not giving the food away. the reason that there are stores is for people to make money. there's no announcement that's made 20 minutes before the store closes . attention customers. the food you're now looking at will very soon in 20 minutes . be on the curb. outside. don't bother buying it. you can get it for free. so the reason the stores are uncomfortable or the management of stores, people who work there might be uncomfortable about seeing people salvaging good food that they throw out is because it might be a threat to their business. ah, who are rescuing the food.