ah ha. was accounting onto gas deployed by poland as it continues to resist the 10 spot migraines, to storm the border from bella. ruth, in order to reach the you question defense ministry slams the usaa hypocritical off. the washington criticized most guy for testing a weapon in space when it's done exactly the same. well, nobody likes to pay more. on average, we have the money to do so. if mainstream us media outlets repeatedly claim that americans are better off on the joe biden, despite inflation hitting a 31 year reco citizens respond, we have to buy food and do things like different ways. i don't think you save money

. i definitely feel in facial more so on food. i think a lot of people are out of work and they're spending their savings just to stay alive on the regional government in australia is on cause to get sweeping new powers. an epidemic bill, despite long stitch amendments, from the public outcry of more details on those stories. you can check our website, r t dot com. we'll be back in now with the latest headline and with hello and welcome to cross talk. we're all things are considered. i'm paid a little when there are problems like the energy crisis. europe's illegal immigration on poland border or even when the wrong political party or politician.

and there is a culprit, always waiting in the wings. and that's russia. scapegoating. russia is the excuse used by failing western leads. i cross sucking perceptions of rush. i am joined by my guest roberts in court. he is a meritus professor of history at university college court and a member of the royal irish academy. his latest book, his stollins library, a dictator in his books in paris we have got a moral. he's the founder of the center of political strategic analysis strap poll . and here in moscow were joined by vladimir goldstein. he is the chair of the department of slavic studies at brown university. gentlemen, cross sack rules and effect. that means you can jump in any time you want, and i always appreciated. let me go to jeff 1st in court. rosa phobia is very real . we see it all the time, particularly, and po, and politics and popular culture. if you watch netflix at all, and i have, i have you in ireland to have as of yay in paris. and we have vladimir moscow. but

he is a resident of the united states. so, you know, i'd like a little bit of a how it's expressed where you are. is there a specific kind of russo phobic expression that you find in ireland? go ahead, jeff. well, i think this, sir. no sir russell, as soon as some other countries. so for example, you k. okay, so i live in on bobs, i follow the british media and sometimes it seems stuck on like been bombarded with kind of the anti russia. you images, stereotypes and claims are not only just recently. okay. the migration process being blunt blank on russia. there was a had money, a major bridge newspaper the other day about the possibility of a rosman tax on, on the new crime. or the british chief, a defense of staff, a district just retired. it was talking about the danger ward, russia, and of course, the new demonization of putin is a come, is

a constant in the media in the british, me, british media. but i just wanna say something else. yeah. yeah. okay. it, there is a lot of rasa foger about non to brilliant in many other countries as well. but i'm not convinced to how important it is. yeah. but with his own point, i think it's about this discussion mclawrence program. i think it's actually a rather superficial or phenomenon film, or you, you mentioned in your instruction that no russia is, is, is a scapegoat or domestic politics. i think that's, that's very true. but also there's also a genuine cadillac perception on the part, many people in your li, popular and these people are not raso folks. you can set perceptions about, you know, rushing danger russian friends ah, all of that carnage. so i think we have to be careful about not overstating imports that are rasa phobia and understating. you know, the import,

the significance of people's real fast. that is not re entrance english to russia. that point is cost is not a lot we could do about rus russell phobia and russell much, but there is something we can do about our people's prejudices and mr. sections about russia and vladimir. if i can turn to you. i mean, i think geoffrey brings up a really good point. i think it is very superficial and away. but at the same time it, it super physiology is the excuse. it does become that excuse if something goes wrong . there's always some a country or a group of people that you can blame where there's actually very little downside when you think about it. okay? i mean, you don't see the american lead scale going again, having the same kind of animals towards china, for example. okay. but they will with russia. what are your thoughts on that? let me go ahead. well, it's always a lazy, but he's teaching kind of, excuse. are they the last excuse, always, calendar, always or should be around for via that is, you know,

just rather than acknowledging or facing certain issues, both in, in the one's own country in russia. what, what i find as a professor in a student over russia, he's, there are some literature or some culture. i find the country endlessly fascinating . you know, every time i come here i just my eyes just wide open, whether tremendous changes was done to the goes through. how many things happened in the last 3040 years when you deal with it? unfortunately, it's like i already for a 1000000 narrative. you know, as a crazy good, a g and what your board is, everyone would ship it to a diffusions, a wonderful, a west and you know, well world machine. and this is, you know, it's, it's the 1st of all, it's a, it's a betrayal of through. second of all is really bad for average people. you know, i agree on some level that may beats aids like skin deep or maybe it's on a superficial. but a lot of people, you know, they rely on the way in use of presenting or whatever. and rather than go on to

russia, rather than seen things for themselves rather than mine. and my, you know, learning was started in the country. they just get the same 2 stories, how they see, you know, russian police or how and they see sort of in are a, does everything but, and they, they lose the interests of coming. and i already think we already know everything. and as i find is very, very kind of disturbing and dangerous. and at the time when we, you know, you have internet where connected at the same time we're, we're pull the pot. that's was of, i find this for you to because france and russia traditionally, historically had very strong ties, very strong bonds. and they're not always so bad. bad moment. i mean, in, for some people and we can discuss is we want, you know, some of the origins of currently a modern day was supposed be go back to the crimean war. other say, goes even further back to their pollyanna wars. but i mean, you know, a france and russia have a very long history together. but then we just,

a couple days ago, ah, vladimir putin was talking with the french president and the french president saying, you know, we, we guarantee our ukraine security. i mean it, that, that, that's very dangerous for not only for france, but the are all of europe itself, particularly when the crisis in ukraine is being generated by the west and not by russia. go ahead, la garza in paris, but i think do the situation in france, it's gray, the send admins, i mean that the, the french elite, the governmental elite and the, the french, her menstrual images are, are, are so phobic, i can tell that her a represent, of the french tv channel, our on to russian, and maybe 90 percent of the newspaper and magazines are underwritten, but it's concerned elite and concerning the french people. there are quite early, so feel i can say in the uh, for instance sir, sometimes even though retina, which is quite popular because yay, gave the maids that is a strong main. and the,

there is a lake of stronger political men in france. so is a, is quite popular and to be honest, french people are on the do interesting in what i've been in ukrainian. and then of course, there was a, you turn it in 2014 and even in 2012, when the foster alarm came to poorer because his, her is a, is a, is a socialist. n a and the left in france is a very her refurbish. so are at this time we can't edit the governmental elite and the mainstream media's elite are, are risk of fabric, but not the people in chapter. one of the things that i'm, i'm an american, obviously i'm a long term resident in of rationale of over 20 years. and i've always sounded really quite interesting how the west constructs it's identity. and it's always a very often it's at the juxtaposition of russia. and so when they say russians are aggressive, they're actually trying to divert attention away from their own aggression. okay.

and, and when native and looking at the quality of life or the level of civilization, you know, you know, the, it's always projecting all of their negative traits on to someone else and rushes, a very good foil for that. what do you think about that, jeff? go ahead. so just a great way to put the rightful funds to xavier might use that. okay. rus russell, phobia ross of phobias is it's an element of the elite western politics. it's not, it's not popular to no problem. i don't, the doctor does any kind of widespread, a, rasa photo as chipmunk, no general problem population. so certainly i'm certainly not to call stats. it's carla. it's weakness. yes. she may appear to be car overpowering. any your face all the time, but it's not. she's at the front, the front i, she's of it are actually quite a friendship. so this was apart from my, from this program. let's not over into our, the russell such as times i try to rush,

phobia the porch rush to talk with him. but jeffrey, jeffrey george, everybody, i mean you, i, we were all in agreement. it's ubiquitous. i mean, it's everywhere. okay. i mean, so, i mean, even, even if it's not it's, you know, more it no more than skin deep. i mean, it is always with us. i mean, we, the u. s. went through this, russia gave nonsense here, and it continues here. so, i mean, we could talk about, you know, how disturbing or dangerous it is, but it is ubiquitous. and i think that i find it very, very curious because, you know, i me go to blah, blah, to me here in mosque. i mean, it's like a one size fits all of your problems. are because of and then you point the finger a great piece piece are great you big, ubiquitous, of my argument is that many respects it's quite superficial and i had it lacks purchase at the societal decide to look at some point. i'm trying to bring a gun to your question about yes. in relation to the western politics on that down,

there are kind of, i guess, to say, i'm jo, i touched on russia. i stay aggressor and to themselves on, on the defense. it will cost us a classic example of that going on among the relation to that the migration cross. it's on, on the polish ballot by the roost. a nice, so the west western politicians are pointing the finger at russia when it's ashley . it's not russia's problem is why it's not russian promot, others don't. it's a pretty use problem. misty is to probably use the migration policy because of what exactly the reality of their own policy, which, which actually is a very current watch, aggressive policy across all he used front is the other theories is pointed to russia. and deborah, the longer we talk, we always end up agreeing here. let me go to vladimir before we go to the break. if you wanna comment anything we've just said here, go ahead, vladimir. yeah, i agree with a very particular with both of you that it's an issue of identity in particular,

maybe what i find fascinating is identity of this liberal elite that, that so there you show that it may be, it was like right wingers or was kept yellow socialist russia, or khomeini's said whatever there was always in on the fifty's in the sixty's, they will always blame. blaming their openings were being software communism solve soft on their ads. now somehow they left has to find their, bought their identity, and they have fallen old backwards by blaming russia. i remember when there was a, you know, competing among democrats, so sort of up seat, obscene trump. and the roy would watch the debates of democrats and it was ridiculous. people who, who are like a local governors, could don't know anything or they wouldn't find rash on the map. just bite is big size and they will well dual booting, these old equip. i'm letting me hold that thought. here we have to go to a hard break. and after that hard break, we'll continue our discussion on perceptions of rush and stay with our team.

with. oh, when i was showing wrong, when i just don't know, i mean you wrote yes to shave out. disdain becomes the attitude and engagement equals the trail. when so many find themselves worlds apart, we choose to look for common ground. ah, there's a patch of water around me. try seal island that's in contention. between canada and the united states, northern gulf, a man i suddenly become optimal for lobster. our population here is exploded. one

of the most valuable fisheries that's ever existed. suddenly you had me and canadian fishermen in these waters at the same time jousting for position and tensions or high violence is bound to happen. this is the last land border dispute between canada and the united states. it could be magnified to the point where there could be costs that would be significant to post countries. border disputes don't go away, they just fester. something's going to happen. mm . welcome back. across stock were all things considered. i'm peter roosevelt remind you. we're discussing perceptions of russia with okay, want to go back to vladimir and finish up a point,

wait while we're making them before we went to the break. i'm glad we, we all seem to be in agreement here. that risk phobia is an elite issue here. i mean, why is it just the elite here and, and it's very, very interesting considering the type of, uh, victory, all that is a directed against russia by the elite in the media. it's really interesting that those of us that live here in russia is not reciprocated. there is not that kind of animosity directed against americans or in the british or something like that. it's not reciprocal. it's a very weird phenomena. so why don't we, why is it in a lead phenomenon? because i think we're all in agreement when it gets sent to the population, most people kind of whole arm. they like jacob ski dots gab skis. great. okay, great. so be a film. so, you know, i mean it's really a mixed bag here, but the, at the very top it's very different. why go ahead? well why one reason i would suggest is that i think most of the, a western western elite fray and germans were,

they were very much americanized. and that's what they were like it or not. that's a power of american media or american propaganda or american power shape, discourse, american liberal, you know, discourse ease. now this is a shift in the sixty's, as i said, you know, early barrels or, or other sympathetic towards a soviet union. now i was all the saw that it became the center of all this. what back things conservatives this and that. so americans sort of dictates a discourse, and i think a lot of french intellectuals or a leads or whatever they study here as, and they in a sort of a one way or another by as much as they repeat it. but what i find very disturbing about this, the shift is this, the same liberal elite which seems to be running, you know, like at least media in most of the western countries. there would be a, you know, would we stop right away blaming any other group because it is right politically.

it's not political, correct. but somehow political correctness stops at the doors of russia in all bets are off and they come up with is mostly dick was a kind of. 1 a conspiracy theories. russians in walton this roger weldon that can you imagine, you know, any western politician blame in any other county, you know, from aerobic wall israel listen that he would now imagine it pointing the finger there behind it. it would be the ice cream to the people will be viewed as anti semites, whatever. but it's absolutely fine for this most. it leads sophisticated liberal obedience to blame. russia for god knows what and i, i find it disturbing, but basically it's, it's, you know, i think if a big big daddy in your uncle, sam is doing it, that means, you know, i'm in a little german station or little french. since i can repeat that to them. oh yeah, exactly. yeah. it's really quite interesting. i'm glad that vladimir brought up all that because during the cold war there was an ideological conflict, a very, very real one. okay. very easy to discern here,

but the cold war is over. russia is no longer a communist country. it actually has no state ideology, the speaker, which i find regrettable at times. okay. but it seems to me the animal that the west has to rush is that russia does simply won't accept neil liberal ideology. that is its greatest sin. okay. he will not become like the west. and on top of it, russia and russians have the ability to say, no, we don't want your political correctness. we don't want your woken as we don't want any of it. we can watch it on netflix, but keep it in to yourselves. we're not interested in it. the, the west hates rush of that go ahead. zavion paris. yeah, i think there is a 2 bonds. the 1st one russia is seen by the french elite or as a conservative power. woo. pray beated early to get pride were privy to the wedding . sir. the gay wedding, her and we will always support such country like her and gary her and such kind

of sinks. so for the french elite whizzer, mostly you lift the oriented it easy, that is her arc enemy. the 2nd point is like, is or that russia is like a therapy for our elite. when some seeing it went wrong, or we need to find the, or would we can take o responsibility. so we need to find some, somebody we can take the the guilt and it happened was a brakes, it bracing didn't up and because of the opinion. and he's a complete, feder. but because risha organizer refer them to super dunsen, where everybody knows that is a very, a fan of russia. look at what happened during the course crisis, france is, are one of the country were, was the worst managed during this crazy. so zacharon, sir, croner, management of the crises is accompanied shredder, but look at our mid. yes, it's her always talking about always it worse in russia. her that the delay about

the figures and so on and so on. so russia was, or was it a therapy for the, for the french leftist elite and it will continue because it's very, as you say is it's very her comfortable and lazy approach. and jeffrey, a comfortable and lazy approach. i couldn't say it better than i think it's absolutely true. i mean, dr. r putin god trump elected president, r o you, europe will freeze this winter because a potent well now it is because of european incompetence. okay, that's why you have an energy prom. there's actually ample energy in the world. just manage very badly. okay. oh and oh, but since rach adds all its energy, it must be, it's fun, it's fun. i mean, these people don't make any sense because, but then again, very few people and this program is we push back because it's not hard to push back against all of these ridiculous commentaries. go ahead. jeff and cork, a great job. yes. is very comfortable and lazy. tabitha, russia,

but your politicians don't, you know, not just on council lighting relation to ra russia. actually, in my experience a couple of laser relation to too many issues. i'm not sure there are fair fair. i can't be. i agree with the prostate might rushes conservatism and it's resistance and push back against certain forms of western liberalism is, is part of her case is paul, what's going on here in terms of the western prejudice, most of the teach was russia, but also i think there's also, not fundamental jill political issue here, which is russia's, you know, challenge to, to, to a western dominated world older, the russian, we'll turn it to, you know, to, to the so called western rules rose rose by st older and also to note the fundamental failure of the west to actually contain and deal with the problem of russia in the post cold warriors, the reemergence of russia as

a great power. and it's, you know, since it's assertion of his interests and you know, challenges embarrass experience and i'm in police novel cost. so, you know, i think it's not just a question of prejudice. so laziness on far western politicians from their perspective, russia does present a real problem real chance johnny is a real problem and, and i'm out of random under room to room challenge. okay. with med, vladimir, i mean, how can you talk um, sanely, dispassionately about geo politics and at the same time, talk about rules base order, which i have no idea what that is about to me. it sounds like our way or the highway. that's what that phrase means. to me, i mean is that it's a, it's a mistake, it's a fools errand to say geo politics. and then you can kind of ideological preferences. i mean, you have to separate them. but if you put, when you put them together,

you end up getting this kind of rules based order. ideology, which means are, are rules and you have to be ordered. okay? and you can do both at the same time and rush, it says no to both at the same time. again, that's one of the reasons why these leitz hate russia so much. you know, i agree with jeffrey that, that is, you know, that it's time to reconsider relationship with roger. but many, many, you know, politicians ill lazy or just, you know, they get used to in it. when you have a 10 year old child, you can say to, to this boy or girl don't do that and they would listen to when the child is 25, you can do this anymore. it requires a different approach. while the west a but the asians, they don't want a different approach. you will know it's not in the door. raja, is it major energy player? russia is a major culture power. russia is a major play in terms of, you know, climate, you know, it has a big, a steady story, a walk on this as it should be,

the 1st one to be considered in order to, into the game. so it's time to sit down and negotiate. but you know, it's, it's much easier to do with the 10 year old child say do what he did, he says, or else. but it just shows a failure to prepare. i would also say in terms of media, it's a failure. it either to understand or understand anything. you do have to invest your morsel, love an interest in the country, but it's much easier just to go touch the surface water crowds abuse, arrested my wildly. here we have a media story, but that's, that's a totally unfair to any subject. one studies if he has to be approved for the love and with deep understanding. well yeah. exam. okay. i didn't think we would mention i mr. navarro. he name, but he has it in the valley's name has been mentioned here. suppose that the, the russian foreign ministry of they, the americans want to play that game. then why don't they say, well, we want to know about the human rights condition of 500 plus people that are being

kept in prison as a result of january january, say hi, and i mean to can play this game. the russians don't do it. they might start doing it, i don't know, i don't speak for the russian government medi, no human rights. again, this is this one sided that human rights means one thing. and it means only the that for the, because if we say it, it has to be applied to the russ rob, but no one can criticize us for human rights. okay. this is the arrogance that really puts out more and more of the world. go ahead. is xavier, of course, and a snowden is inertia. and i saw her is in her united kingdom in jail. so it's difficult of freud's had complicated for the, for the west to criticize the russia on the human right. if you look at what happened, no, with her with a song. but of course, again, it's her, it's a kind of therapy or look at what a burner in france during her, the yellow jackets, ah, 2060 paul luster and i, because of the, of the repression. it didn't happen. her, of course, not in russia,

but even not in barrows, you know, in the wearing, in a, in a, in europe. it happens. and so, but anyway, if you look at her or the french room in 3 majors, there will continue to criticize saying that a put in is a dictator and that russia is not a free country. and that the do political or opposition is in jail. a gunner and claiming that the never only represent something strong in the russia, which is completely a fake news because the men, though a position is the communist party. okay, gentlemen, this, i'm in a fascinating topic. i didn't discuss with you. i think we need to talk more about different elements of here because as we've all agreed, it is very ubiquitous and it at the end of the day it can be very dangerous because it's a nuclear power. okay, i gentlemen, that's all the time we, i'm one of thanks them i guess in paris court and in moscow. and thanks to our viewers for watching us here, r t c. and next time. and remember, cross like with

ah, a hello driven by drink shaped bankers and those with dares sinks we dare to ask

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ah, fisher or not made. this is a different world. fisherman visited regularly this morning. we're familiar with chapters still to come. is perhaps, is hopes assessment all like 20 fathoms deep, rocky bottom of the coast of maine. ah was a good living to be made in the atlantic ocean if anybody will go get there's a patch of water around in the try a seal island in contention between canada and the united states north of the main, they suddenly become optimal for lobster. our populations years exploded one of the most valuable fisheries that ever existed. suddenly you had made an canadian fisherman.