ah, i'm after dancing, you're watching, going underground in another week of u. k. u. s. e, you nation armed. saudi arabian asked strikes on the poorest country in the middle east. yemen today, meanwhile is 48 hours ahead of the 74th anniversary of the united nations partition plan for palestine that arguably capitalized so much bloodshed and population displacement as the u. n continues to struggle to deal with the most important issues over time, from climate change to monopoly power. i'm joined now from geneva by professor how for de zayus. he was the 1st you an independent expert on the promotion of a democratic inequitable international order. and author of building a just well daughter, alfred, welcome to going underground. again. the book is a myriad of issues. i mean, some might say it should be embalmed in the new york and horses. i mean, that's just begin though, with a question that you know before before we live in

a society where a book that dames to save every, every human being alive on, on the planet before it's given to all the ambassadors of the u. n. is a mandatory requirement. can you understand why people don't trust the united nations today? the united nations is a great idea, and if it didn't exist, we would have to create it. not o course, it's a 190 british bache. and it's not antonio banderas, and if not monkey moon, i mean the organization is the state. and anything that is human is, of course, in a way is functional in a way corrupted. you know, way i, jack and the united nations, very good things. i and i plan, especially all 3 work done by the world health organization and the international

labor office and the world intellectual property organization. but of course, those highly political issues are, what does the security council do to preserve the piece that is actually the principal or on the united nations daughter commitment to human rights, a commitment to the right for the development in all of those areas. we are limping and we're limping badly. and of course human rights. we have the standard. i mean the norms are there, the mechanisms are there what we don't have is and for the special rock will occur for the human rights council. they are like, and the procedure of electing the expert is anything but perfect is extremely political. and for that reason,

usually most rock curves are those people who are going to told a lie in friend is just to interrupt that. we've had very good ones on this program arguably. yeah, i think that's a good news. the good news is we have a meals meltzer, good friend of mine. we have a good friend of mine. we have a good friend of mine, but of course not all independent like these 3. yes, and when they write their reports, that you obviously value and you and you mentioned that would be able to see our interviews with some of them are on our youtube channel. you mentioned them in, in building a just well daughter. there, there letters to governments are ignored. i mean, obviously, julian assange comes to mind and you, you make it clear that before we, i mean, along with the importance of pace. the right to truth, you say is so crucial in bought of bought a building,

a just world order. a neil's melts his letters to the british government were often unanswered. i think i'm not even sure with whether they have been answered about what torture of a journalist in this country certainly is a case of torture. both physical and psychological and a working group on arbitrary detention or rate 2019 declared the detention on the conditions in which up a song was living in the ecuadorian embassy in london. if violation was 9 of the commonality of political rights, arbitrary detach, i hammered on that several times when i was rob motor on international audit. and what did the british government say at the time? they thought that we were ridiculous? that's the word they used. we were ridiculous asking this back to you,

but you say to quote, perhaps the most scandalous and immoral example of the multinational corruption of the rule of law of our law fair as regards a, as regards the sanchez case in the context of a and this is a constant theme in the new book in your new book, the degradation of language. well, it's all really. i mean, if you thought that this isn't all, see i added by, well, you know, see i, everybody was intimidated. what if they curie, our age is that we're being lied to every day. we are swimming in an ocean of life, and we're happy about it. we accept the fact that cnn and box on the b, b. c, on the new york times, the washington post light was every day. and i'm not saying that they are disseminating only fake news. of course, i read the new york times, i read the work, and of course i must be informed. i want to know what you're saying. the problem is

that they so correct information. these are correct. sometimes 50 percent of what really crucial to understand an issue. that being the case, you are b like to those media organizations and say for purposes a space and they reply to a criticism like you just made by saying no, the faith can use problem stems from people who defend juliana such well, the fact is that if it was only great news generate big history. i were dealing with fake law because b, u. s. president, department of state ok, downing street burly. they make the law, i think all along. and then they a book principle, which actually are not hard law as if they were. and that leads of course,

to a clash when you have a representative of the european union. but who is it with the foreign minister or the president of poland or of congress? they're not speaking the same language. they don't mean the same thing when they're talking about your mock rossi or freedom, or identity or culture. it is a problem when the united states wants to say, come back to the agreement on not iran. well, they're not speaking the same language. let's pick a phrase, humanitarian intervention. i think people would recognize that i don't know the soviet union, the duration of our, which was humanitarian intervention. i think italian intervention is

a pretty established phrase. in the book, you explain how that, that phrase, which is meant to save lives, kills people out of humanitarian intervention. they invented a new term, which actually is pure propaganda responsibility to protect our 2 p. i. so i don't see a scam, as we say, as well as that the purpose of our to p, the purpose of humanitarian intervention is not you monetary. the purpose is regime change. the purpose is to circumvent the absolute prohibition of the use of force laid down. and article 2 or 4 of the un charter that is hard law and the your charter. trump's all other agreement as you

well know, but with this pro i can they pick up say, a strategy that say we are going to bring your mind a terry and assistance to libya, 2011. if you're a council resolution 1973, i mean that was seen because what the intended, what to help the population all that libya and not to destroy the country, create total chaos. i don't even get a b simply functioning them on chrissy afterwards. so here you have the emblematic case of correcting language and you said that in

itself is something that you and i both agree and we do want to help individuals. we do want to how you saw that. you saw that at the time, but russia and china can easily be blamed to for abstaining on that. we have to say to you and not security council. you know, when i spoke in the general assembly, i presented my report. that must have been 2014 and i was pushing for the idea of reforming the security council and doing away with the legal power. i actually explained that like that, how you can graduate not from now to tomorrow, but gradually move away from this veto power. and the russian delegate took the floor and took me to and say, look, you know, we were full by the french and the bricks. and the americans and we went along and only put in our ah,

ah, to resolution 970 great. they're not gonna lie to us again and they're not going to for us again. we just had i 3, if you have them though that was under president meditative and of course then we saw syria and we saw air strikes on the biden administration, launched as strike from syria within the 1st 6 months of his inauguration. all illegal, all illegal and our sank and normal price winter up. barack obama, the king off the ground. no one has killed more people with groans and back obama, but he still are said, this is of course the kind of indoctrination that we get day in day out in the new york times. i mean the washington post. this is that per section of reality, that the narrative managers are trying to impose on the rest of us. i have to get

to another theme me in the book here. you talk about investors state dispute settlement systems. there was a, so of course assange, you revealed the power of corporations to subvert me in the convention. and i suppose it's particularly timely your chapters on that, given what has happened to a lawyer defending indigenous communities in ecuador, i must ask you in the, in the context right in this book, what happened with steven don's ago, why is he in jail right bo, this is 2nd law fair, this is a correction of law, shall we say, a collusion between our corporate power and the judiciary. and that is not uncommon in the united states. and it's, it's really a matter of concern how the administration of justice and the administration of criminal justice has been hijacked by the billionaires by power and

the, the military industrial complex. and everybody remembers it was on the 17th of january, $961.00 that my president, dwight d eisenhower warrant us america the where off the military industrial complex is the greatest, correct? who are democracy? nobody listen. the military industrial complex today is the greatest, shall we say, destroyer off democracy in the united states. it's either one that fuels war all over the world. the one that while takes in money away from health care from education, from maintenance of bridges, you know, bridges fall into the mississippi for lack of a maintenance. and why is that? because we spend more than 40 percent of

a budget in the military in procurement and more nuclear submarines and more grounds for as a disaster. i'll stop you there more from the author of building a just wild order after this break. ah sure don't seem an official and was just there for sure someone at the, at the, from the tech hockey, with some dinner washed them with. and what if you have a bomb yet theme you supposed to do this? as i said below them, giving you, besides, next line me at the within the now they should usually should almost failed. so what i'm going to pay and she knew companies, it took us once initially, right?

yes. the key moments which she is legally. and she showed back i just financial survival guide. when customers go buy your dish right now, well, reduce a lower that's under cutting, but what's good for food market is not good for the global economy. mm. welcome back. i'm still here with professor alford, is asked to for me, you an independent expert on the promotion of a democratic inequitable international order. and the also of building a just will do you make a recommendation that essential services should be kept in government hands, which obviously i'm talking to you from britain where everything's been privatized when you really think water, energy internet, the u. n. should, should make

a global back to the essential services should be in government adds, as you recommend in this book. i think that if you read the comment on economic, social and cultural rights, ah, you will see that states already had an obligation to guarantee those essential services. and of course, there is no enforcement mechanism. so all state bodies, truly covenant on economic social cultural rights can violated with unity. the united states systematically ignores what the human rights committee says in concluding observations, including what with regard to indigenous. i mean, you realize that the indigenous of the united states, which we call indian, so they have nothing to do with the indian subcontinent. but the creased on the seal and the now horse and the cherokees. i mean, these people now who were massacre,

but we stole praise of dollars of their natural resources. and these indigenous are completely, shall we say this in franchise. you say the w t. o should be incorporated into the united nation system, presuming it would have to be if, if those native americans are going to get the land back. obviously the dummy deal is something britton is particularly interested in because of bricks and how could the w t o ever be incorporated into the united nation system? well, they already has an association agreement, but it is not for the secretary general of the united nations. i'm going to go back to tell the director general of appeal what to do. the same thing happens with the bretton woods organizations, meaning the international monetary fund. and the world bank are they have

a very loose relationship with the united nations. and essentially, they work against the interest. again, the purpose is on principles over united nations, rather than advancing the right to development. what they often do is that they can was a male country is a little bit of money. well then you have to prioritize everything. and then you have to cut the civil service and then you have to cut the investment in education and in the health care. and that actually is at the source off the pass for a fee in so many african countries that have not been able to come to grips with it. or for that matter would allow, with that matter, with all these and then mix that break out in africa regularly

because the money has been taken away from the hospital. you read all about it in the lancet. it's not like you have no access to information. i clearly internet is a fantastic source of information to prove that the i am asked if i didn't, the purposes and principles of the united nations and the dominant. you know, he denied things. they claim that they are, for the measurement of mankind to their public, private partnerships. it is again brought back end and nothing less. let me give you a quote by i me, the old former, the director general of the w. if you know, he said training is human, right, in practice, quote unquote, i say, oh wow. human rights in practice. well,

how about help me, you know, the pressure men in bangladesh or the fisherman and wherever overcome the over fishing that you have by the commercial. enormous fleet that just sweep up everything. the main we say sickness of the system of human rights protection today is what i call the red herrings, the wrong priorities. the money is being spent for issues of gender, not that gender is not important. what is not the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd priority? the 1st priority is peace. make a and in order to have peace, you have to control arms straight the arms race. you have to make

sure, but if there is so much trade in arms, you want more so that they blow up the drone. so they blow up there and they need new. i'm going i'm going to say that, i mean, obviously when, when countries do say they want to evade that new liberal model and not have the public private partnerships to an extent. although lately that's not quite true anyway, it's venezuela and the human rights industry. as it's cool comes down hard on them, you finish the book talking about venezuela. you probably know the president maduro believes that gold has been stolen by the bank of england here for a strong to consider the door and not even to be president. some of the put it up. so i mean it's like a crass violation of international law and international or the international the wrong place. or did they call it?

was that was completely with a my roommate, an independent expert on international order. and when i asked the very 1st un drop with her, went to venezuela to be on the ground to talk to everybody. i talked to the opposition to the national assembly, to the chamber of commerce professors to students. i went on the street, i spoke with people real people. well, my report because it was not singing the song they expected me to say was essentially ignore. and he was thanks to a colleague of yours, michael selby. green, who interviewed me many months after the report had come out because the report what he needed it. but he did a long interview with me for the independent which was then followed by interviews in your news and on pat huh. and i guess your etcetera. but the problem

is, i had very concrete pragmatic recommendations. b, that's where i'm gonna implemented the release, 80 prisoners that i had requested right away. entered into a new cooperation agreement with the f, a o with a w h o with you and hcr, etc. i brought a letter and said, look, you know, there are too many a lot of there and meet up roy, what do i need a stack, mccracken, please help them. and it's when people, not the government is when i'm people. but anyway, my message was that the 20 terrier crisis, if you can call that a humanitarian crisis in 2007 being that this economic crisis. what i think that this economic crisis was a direct result of 20 years. all economic war waste by washington against women as well. and then of course,

aggravated with these asphyxiating factions. since 2015, it's inconceivable that there is when i was unable to transfer funds anywhere because no back would take a look when there was a year there as well. and embassy or been as well on our mission somewhere. and they had to look for money, the banks would refuse it. and with regard here in switzerland, you know, i'm both an american citizen and it's we citizen. and i'm very proud to be slaves. and i very much believe in our system of semi direct are see, but even that this wish even they, you'll be yes even. you know, the big a banks are afraid of the american sanctions, so they will not even transfer money to venezuela. we just donated in the context

of call the 19 when with regard to cuba, for instance, an association here in switzerland collected money for cuba. i wanted to purchase then 2 layers against the 19th and ship them to get the company here in switzerland refused to sell me a story, told time and time again with sags very briefly at the end, i got to ask you, then if you are a world leader who doesn't want to appease washington and brussels. what do you do in the face of those sanctions? you have to organize within other countries of the global south, away from the united nations, away from the un security council i made, i made specific recommendations with regard to a shall we say global movement. all saw countries that are

suffering under sanctions, that they should know, all of them refused to cooperate with the united states. you can bring down many a lease sanctions if there is like in the case of my gandhi and civil disobedience . if you have a mass movement that says, we will not put up with what the problem is that the european union has betrayed his own business. people as betrayed his own citizens by allowing the extra territorial application off united states legislation in europe, including the helms burton act of 1996 by the way, also adopted under a democrat, our friend bill clinton. everybody price is obama back obama. everybody price is bill clinton, but actually they're not much different from the republicans. they just,

i mean they are lighter and they sell the product better. professor designs, thank you and that's over the show will be back on monday, the international. they have solidarity with the palestinian people observed as u. s. u. k armed is ready, killing of palestinians continues until and keep in touch by all our social media and let us know if you think the united nations still has relevance on the global stage. join me every thursday on the alex simon shows, i'll be speaking to guess in the world of politics, sport business. i'm show business. i'll see you then. mm.

and people is something they cause right on police report. it's an all cash in december 2020. a group of anti finishes. fill out a film crew access for 3 months. so if people are organization, if an idea that there must be a pose as channel out the gate while they may kill their faces, but they can save what they believe in we believe and help with our communities. we believe that fascism is one of the major threats to the united states has gotten reuben, this is a chance to see who and t for really are in order for me to extract my 1st amendment right and say that my life matter have to be on to the teacher that that's how america we can't trust the police. we can't trust the government. we can't trust anyone except ourselves to protect ourselves in. ah, an old hungarian proverb says you can't put everything under one hat. it means that the same rules can't be applied to every one. and yet this is more view to pass,

signed up to one end to the european union in 2004. today hungry is accused of all possible sins against democracy. now does the or by and government feel about its future and place in the european family us dollars world reserve currency in the days are numbered. now they're those, even in the big client community that held out hope that somehow the us dollar well remain on the world stage. but as hillary clinton herself points out a coin is essentially undermining or destroying the u. s. dollar, because the u. s. dollar can't hold its purchasing power because it's via money and they'll be out money over the past 300 years. has ever gave trading to 0. ah ah

ah, a new covered strain in southern africa, slogs global panic prompting country to shut down and travel with the region. the variant is already spreading globally with the u. k. the latest nation to confirm cases, frauds postponed by the 3 vaccination for its caribbean territories, off the respite and fall, and on rest over the order with whole just corner 11 pm here, mostly watching on international with me. daniel, who can swerve you all this evening. welcome to the program. now the u. k u s and.