hear the sound of speech in the night. first. thank horses, not zebra. it's the doctors at the state department. but for the most exotic, hi, pompous is early on, and people keep attacking me and they say, you don't know what you're talking about. concussion like symptoms, white matter track changes. hearing loss, brain damage, that's not bad psychogenic illness. but that's just not true. if you look at the 2018 journal, the american medical association study, even before that study was published, information was being linked to the press that many of the victims had these mysterious white matter track changes in their brains. about a year later, when the study finally came out, they found only 3 patients with white matter track changes. and if you go on the streets of moscow today, and you randomly pick 21 people, you'll have

a similar breakdown because white matter track changes are common and everything from depression to migraine headaches, to normal aging professor. so let me, i think it's easy to understand the relatively easy to understand how something like this could have happened in the late 17th century. in rural must choose this, but in the 21st century in havana, as well as frankly all over the place. because american diplomats in russia, china, india, austria trolley at the united kingdom and a host of other countries, have several 100 similar complaints. what would possibly explain both a global scale of the problem? and it's very peculiar where so look 50 if distinct bias for the americans. sure. what are we to believe that the russians have some kind of secret

microwave or sonic device and are going down to columbia and targeting a home of one of the diplomats to make their family members sick? i mean, it's really absurd when you think about this. and what's happened here is people are getting confused because you've got 2 different phenomenon going on. you've got the initial case of what happened in cuba, which is a classic textbook case of mass psychogenic illness. and then you've got what's going on around the world which is slightly different. what is mass psychogenic illness? and the other is more mass suggestion, because what happened is after the initial report of what happened in cuba, the state department issued an alert to its diplomats and intelligence officers around the world to be on the lookout for anomalous health incidents. and then the department of defense recently contacted all of its $2900000.00 service

personnel in contractors to also be on the alert for anomalous health incidence. and those incidents of havana syndrome, as you mentioned before, things like difficulty concentrating, insomnia memory problems. they're so big as to be experienced by just about everyone who has ever lived in any given week. right. and so now people all over the world who are military personnel or intelligence officers or gentler match, working for the american government, are now on the lookout for these anomalous health incidents. and literally people are getting up in the morning and sneezing and attributing it to a van a syndrome because it's so bag. now, even if it's, even if it's the case of mass hysteria, i think it definitely is there to be dealt with. and people may need profession how,

but i would guess that it's an efficiency would depend on what you stipulate or hypothesize to be the main cause and how close it is to reality. you have worked on this case for quite some time on i confident then that american officials at this point can afford to pursue science with an open mind and the best interests of the victims at har. absolutely not, because what you've got here is a case of science mixing with politics. let me give you an example. recently senator mark or rubio came out and said anybody who advocates the mass psychogenic illness, explanation it's quackery. and what's really disingenuous, they're in really upsetting for someone like myself who has advocated that is there are 2 sick work reports, classified reports that came out. one was in 2018,

the secret jason group, which is a group of a lead us scientists who looked at microwave radiation. and the most likely explanation in that report was only released recently under the freedom of information act. and they concluded that mass psychogenic illness played a major role, and it was virtually impossible to the microwaves. the other classified report was that done by the f b i. it's never been released, but it was recently leaked, and their conclusion was, it wasn't microwaves. it was mast psychogenic illness, and people like marco rubio would have known full well that these 2 classified reports were there. they would have been familiar with the contents. and at the same time that they knew those reports were there. many officials in the u. s. government have been peddling the microwave free effect claim and that it's not

mass psychogenic illness, which is just very disingenuous on their part. now, while the psychic janica origin hypothesis is being discouraged, as you say, the media is right for speculation that it was indeed an act of aggression by the russians. so i saw that the washington post reported recently that they had of the cia william burns. mentioned that this issue raised this issue during the talks with his russian colleagues here in moscow and reported me even threatened some state to state action. the americans, for one reason or another conclude that it was indeed the work of the russians. she's even more frightening than the, than any, as i could, jenny, going my massey syria hypothesis given the latoria potential on both sides. absolutely. and it's very, very concerning. i mean, if you look at the national academy of sciences report,

which came out and december of 2020, you would expect that to be a dispassionate scientific analysis. if you look at the people on that panel, they had no experts on mass that could genic illness and they had no experts on pulse microwave radiation, which were the 2 main explanations that they were looking at. a friend of mine, simon wesley akins college, london was initially on that panel. he is a world authority, a mass like genic illness. he gave an interview and what you stated that he thought it was possible that mass cycle genic illness could explain what was going on based on what he had seen. after that, they kicked him off the panel. so what you're seeing here is a mixture of science and politics. the other thing that's interesting is pamela spry, one, the former ambassador to a couple of different countries was name by joe biden. as the head of the panel investigating a van, a center on the u. s. government. and recently she was on

a zone call with several a van, a syndrome patients. and one of them asked her, they said, oh, what about the f b i report which was leaked and they said it was mass hysteria. you don't believe that, do you? and she said, well, i'm holding open the possibility of mass psychogenic illness. right. after that, there was an outcry in she was forced to step down and people were saying things like, we're not crazy. you know, we're not mentally ill, but that's not what mass psycho genic illnesses, math, psycho genic, illness doesn't mean that you're crazy. it is a collective stress response based on a belief. and everyone has beliefs and everyone is potentially susceptible. but especially for so me that's what your book is. so how to because you mentioned several in fact several doesn't example. so there is psychogenic illnesses and some of them rise sporadically. but in most cases there are some

preceding conditions that will benefit justin. hi, he's and band based case is usually used by a certain political motivations. if that's indeed the case with has an ascension that is being handled both scientifically and administratively with a certain political agenda in mind. my question is, what would possibly be gained from handling it this way? because i think we don't see having biden administration could benefit from, you know, hundreds if not thousands of that diplomatic personnel coming out with some strange symptoms. asking for compensations, let alone raising tensions with another nuclear power. you mentioned important work, their compensation because lawyers have now become involved and you're going to see tens of thousands of cases all over the world. now an american service personnel

wanting to be potentially compensated. you know, that's very important aspect to a van, a syndrome now, because the symptoms are so vague and they are found all over the place. you know, there's an interesting case that happened in 1950 or in the united states in the pacific northwest. where the u. s. was doing testing of the atomic bomb in the pacific ocean. and a rumor started that fallout was coming down on the pacific northwest, particularly in the region of seattle, washington. and people started to see these pit marks on there when strange. and it became so concerning that the governor of washington state owned president eisen power and ask for assistance and an investigation was conducted. and the researchers concluded that people started looking

at their wind screens instead of through their wind screens as they normally do. and there's a similar parallel here with her van syndrome because people have anomalous health issues all the time. but now, any time a diplomat or an american service personnel has some type of help incident, it's automatically looked at in a new frame. that this may be a syndrome and you know, the other reason why i think this is so much a political issue is the word and the word here is embarrassment. thing that the u . s. government, under trunk, and now buying have miss identified the meeting calls of crickets and cicadas, because that's what actually happened when they looked at the recordings that

people were. that's another huge potential cost your impact. let's take a very short break right now, but we will begin right on that. after short breaks, they tune the me i champs all down through here, all this little area over here. so you're camps are always a little nicer than this is evidence of absolute poverty, destroyer. people in our city and other cities, all across america are living like this. where at the original eden village that opened up in 2018 right now, there's 31 homes on the property. it's

a little over 4 acres with 31 homes and a community center. unfortunately, a lot of people don't make it out of edition more homeless. so my, i'm really happy for you with me in ah, the challenge nutrition, chinese issue agenda my hash ah, i look forward to recruiting she'd been kelly victoria quote and i knew massage tissue tangent of london to learn that research.

she gave to the family, you know, if you me here mom, look for that i think ah

ah ah welcome back to well, the 1st very 1st home you all have on a syndrome math psychogenic, illness and the real story behind the mystery and hysteria. professor sell me, you mentioned b a that potential hypothesis i think was initially suggested by the, by the cubans. and while it sounds possible, and it's funny i, you know, the, the issue i have with it is that if you go back to those initial cases, the whole case, i originated the low level of the i officials and have on them. but they were supposedly affected, not at the embassy compound, but brother,

2 large hotels. and i think i residential building or something where people of other nationalities are also present. if that was the evil doing of cekada or the natural behavior when they're foreigners be affected as well. you know, in cases of vast psychogenic illness, it's important to understand the historical. busy context in november of 2016, the c i, a officer is walking near their homes and dana in hearing the strange sounds. they weren't sure what to make of them. and they said that it was almost like a beam of sound being pointed at their homes. and in late december of 20161 of them had your pain and headache and he went to the embassy clinic, which is very common symptoms. and afterwards he made it unusual comment. he said, you know, it's almost like someone is pointing

a beam of found my home at night and they didn't think too much of that. but then a couple of other officers mentioned the same thing. and then this theory developed that the russians, or maybe the chinese were pointing some new acoustical device at the americans as a form of harassment. and what's really interesting here is when more recently you've had claims of microwave radiation and the fray effect, it's not the fray effect. we know that now, because in 2018, a top secret classified report of a lead scientist called the jason group, looked at the possibility of the fray effect. and these scientists eliminated the fray effect because what, what happened was of the 1st 21 victims,

8 of them reported their attack. now, if it's microwaves, you can't record the microwaves because they're not a sound the microwaves. bombard your head and stimulate a nerve in your ear or brain. there's a debate as to which one it is. and you get the perception of a barely discernable clicking sound. but the for the that's right. and when they looked at the recordings of those 8 recordings, they concluded that they were the maiden calls of these short tail cricket. and some other recordings that were done turned out to appear to be assessed as cicadas . so it's just not possible. i mentioned the sailor which tries before. many historians noticed that salem village was known for its world fractious population. there were many arguments over property and raising, right,

as well as over value. it was a highly pure isn't and then we are righteous society. it's not given the level of political polarization in the united states, especially following the election of donald trump. when some of those 1st reports of the have on a junk occurred. do you think it may have been a factor in the emergence of bass here? well, this is a case of a bad journalism, bad government and bad science up there really should be an investigation of the journal of the american medical association and how they ever published. the 2 studies they did. my 1st career was as a journalist, about 40 years ago in the united states. and one journalist look into stories like this. you can't be an expert on everything, acoustical weapons, or microwaves or all this other stuff. so you have to rely on experts. but in this

case, the experts at the journal of the american medical association have really let us down. i don't know how those studies were ever published in the 1st books. well, you would be blame on one journal, but you know, as a, as a journalist who has been covering american politics over the last 5 years. and, you know, look at the case of the whole russian gate and the narrative that it was essentially the crime. linda has installed donald trump in the white house and you know, whatever was the level of russian interference in the american elections, it definitely wouldn't have raised to the level of, you know, electing a president for a country of more than 300000000 in the us. pretty much every american major, mainstream american outlet run with this story saw. and by the way, it was also a big democrat. the democrats were made the conscious decision to portray trauma as

a russian agent. they knew it wasn't the case. we know that from the weaklings, but they made a conscious public relations decision as a way of, you know, destroying his image. i monday, the biden administration is dealing with essentially, it's saw, it's on and it's a fairly light case at this point. a big issue that's going on right down, it's very frustrating to me as so many news organizations. and so many leaks of officials and in american government keep pushing this idea that the diplomats in cuba had brain damage. if you can show me that they had brain damage, i'll resign my position in the department of psychological benson often. university . it is absolutely unequivocally not the case. what happened was in 2019, the journal of the american medical association published the study, which looked at this small court of patients in cuba. and they found

brain anomalies, brain of animal. these are not the same as brain damage. it's very common in small groups. when you look at brain scans to find minor anomalies, and these anomalies were very minor and they have conflated anomalies with brain damage. it is not been found whatsoever that there was brain damage in the diplomats in cuba, but it keeps getting reported over and over again. you so i did the medical handler that my direct question about the manipulation all of the narrative. and that's your right. but, and what do you think can refrain my question a little bit? because i think the level of psychological, our nation in the united states is very fine. this, this is what allows for such psychogenic and factions to originate and spread

that very rapidly would you foresee and not the case is like that check curve. for example, if you're a non conspiracy, the thing is it stand by the similar psychic energy. do you think they may be on a case is when people will be easily led to believe that somebody is out there trying to frame them or cause them damage yet? look, it's very concerning what's going on with the american government in with the american media and how they have handled this case. and the situation is right for an incubation of further cases like this. you know, at some point you have to listen to science and the scientists, and that's not the case here. the national academy of sciences, the senate foreign relations committee, they interviewed, mostly bland,

says den interview, many of the skeptics, the prominent skeptics who have been speaking on this case and the same with the senate foreign relations committee. and there's this, this understanding out here that mass cycle genic illness is somehow some kind of mental disorder or calling people crazy. it is absolutely not the case on people. i would assume i need somehow dealing with that because after all are being posted somewhere, overseas is indeed a stressful job. and maybe if people are so susceptible to those theories, maybe they need help. now i have time for just one question and i want to ask you about the media because i know that before your single out the media as a, as a main driver and amplifier of the psychogenic illnesses. and it's very interesting that the point of view made that people are now wanting in line that now using social media and media to relieve that psychic stress the way they used to go,

for example, to the church, but instead of being discharged, the stress is being collectively accumulated, it's sort of, you know, continues that it's infectious power. can you talk more about that? what could possibly be done to prevent this isolated case of psychogenic illness from spreading all around the globe among let's say one countries, diplomatic personnel or even bigger groups. yeah, well, there's a danger here for the future and we have to get our house in order in the united states. i'm a u. s. citizen, i'm a new zealand citizen and it's really embarrassing to me when you have such partisanship out there. and now on both sides coming together on this, and they have not looked at the science and they haven't listened to the mainstream scientists. i'm not a rogue scientist on a straight down the line,

mainstream scientists. and those studies in the journal, the american medical association, any neurologist or medical doctor worth their salt, who takes the time to examine those studies. those studies are very flawed, and we need to listen to mainstream science. but unfortunately, the waters have been muddy bipartisan politics and it's destroying the united states of america. we've saw the last few years, and it's very concerning. it's very alarming. and it's, it's disturbing. well, let's hope that somebody will take a lesson or 2 from the very interesting and yes, funny. although, as we discussed before, it would be pretty dangerous given that this issue is now being discussed within the military intelligences of rush in the united states. with all the nuclear capabilities that they have. anyway, professor told me we have to live in there. thank you very much for being with us.

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