ah ah ah ah hello and welcome across stock were all things considered, i'm putin labelle so much longer. can we take the u. s. and u. k. seriously. there war of words is dangerous and reckless. the rest of nato and even ukraine are much more restraint. if there's a comp number ukraine, it will be a conflict, washington in london, endlessly promoted. ah . to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess, george samuel leon budapest. he's a podcast or at the ga, ga which me bought

a new to ban locals. and we also have dmitri bob, she's a political analysts and editor interest me, internet media project. i generally cross our closet effect. that means you can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciated or i, let's start out with georgia in budapest. well georgia, the last 2 days have had this kind of like, i think, fake shuttle diplomacy. everybody wants to come to moscow and they come to moscow and say that there are, they are there while they're in moscow. and as they're leaving, they say war is eminent, invasion is imminent. ok. no evidences been presented here. i mean this is and is primarily coming from the u. s. and the u. k. i and in between helene um the center of all this, at least the western narrative is ukraine. and again, presidents zalinski has come out and asked even his western backers for evidence of their claim, some an imminent invasion. i mean, this is beyond bizarre, it's kafka ask, what is the state of play george? go ahead this question. imagine what it is that the americans and the british in

particular are asserting. they are claiming that russia will attack without any kind of publications without issuing a list of demands without an ultimatum, without a list of grievances. just simply attack out of the blue eye. and you know, which country in the recent past has done just that. of course, not to germany with barbarossa, we just when i'm president, and in that he was preceded by no demands, no, all the major a list of grievances or something. russia just going to do this. i will go into launch this on the back end. and j, some of them pointed out it's going to be quite a savage attack is going to be preceded by aerial attack by missiles, then they're going to march on to it. and then,

so that's the assertion. and now let's think about also about who is really behind is who's the leading this propaganda campaign y k. so now jake saw them was an absolutely key figure in roster gate, which is also very interesting because this meet with, you know, we've added found out more information about the russian gate folks and about how the clinton campaign and that is j. so it basically funding the spying on, not only the trunk campaign, but the trump president that actually got into the trump so. so this is a person the some of them who is a master of manufacturing process is creating an absolute he presents no evidence where any of these claims will they keep telling ross is building up his forces building up. it wasn't on the number. they said it's still 100000 and i think so it,

but it's building up. it's all the same number i think was 2 months ago. so, you know, these are basically in the business of generating hysterical and do russian global propaganda campaign. gotta have very dangerous consequences. you know, begin demon is working because i'm sure you know the, the, the parable, you know, the boy that called, well, i mean, how much longer can you pay in the us saying invasion as emanated before? people don't stop taking them seriously, as i pointed out in money and production. go ahead. oh, i think that basically what we see is that the connection of all propaganda, please use the same time. for example, there is a steak and you know, when the real agenda is released by the really just the process security concern and they don't, they don't buy big. i don't replace it with the faith a john the own in a rush that,

that there is also the stakeholder bandwagon. like why wouldn't you all go by because everyone is needed. you know, once you've joined the bandwagon, you know the suite and eating those for leaving and no one tries to otherwise, why daddy's and what happened is that any evidence, basically not a single russian to see show made a revenue noises. you know, along the way, you great never know ordering. there are no signs or the so called aggression. well russia from, from, from, from the you bring in the, what is the boss one on there was 7 years about the impression that you get from the west. the breast is now that you be also, there is another propaganda which is fake alternative, good, great joints,

nato or your brain is firmly in the raw sphere of influence. isn't there something in between? you know, it looks like a boy for dr. alone. guy with why this was the way, basically car sherry was that actually be and known you to country with relations with russia. good relations for the you and i was going on is it is basically absurd. was the opinions down and says, we don't see the russian car just on saturday. president asked, he said, if the west has any intelligence show in that that, that is possible. let them share it with us and they didn't share. but the next day, the same it is, asians, whoa, george, the mom makes of such an important point here. i mean, when i find bewildering and very frustrating is that you have been wallace and list

trust. and you know, of course jobs and all traveling around. but they don't want to negotiate. they just want to grandstand ok. i mean, and list, trust me as being a, you know, foreign secretary, she, she showed a lot of ignorance of history and geography in me. maybe would be good for someone like that to listen once in a while. if you learn something because she didn't come with the negotiation agenda, she came with a hectoring agenda. george. yeah, excellent point. and it was very interesting that during jake sullivan's press ok last friday and he was off this very question. well, why should we believe your intelligence? and you know, we had a bad experiences with intelligence such as they run up to the iraq war. and it was very different because before iraq that we were presenting intelligence,

the saw the walls we are trying to do with preventive, we try to stop a war. so imagine that with such cells, lose good people. we're trying to stop a war. well, how are you stopping a war by was this hysterical denunciations, likening, obviously, for contemporary russia to hitler's germany. how are you stopping a war by pouring in military hardware into ukraine? how are you stopping a war by encouraging ukrainian or your a c, a sleep number bed to make any concessions at all. so you're, you're essentially in gendering a wall and then you're trying to boston, this phony analysis. you're trying to store a list trust in the rest of the escalate. that's. that's the only way we could have peace in the world today is

a profit deescalate. but bradley is fine for the british, and the americans to send forces into the neighborhood, or at least find to send military hom where you know, by the millions of dollars in into ukraine. that's fine, that's not escalation, but russian conducting exercises with its own country. that's escalation, mean you're the ukranian sitting, you take cause to me, you have your western back or sending hundreds of millions of dollars of sophisticated military hardware. well, the same time they're sending the western. busy embassy, letting their dependence so, i mean, isn't that crazy? western back is actually putting a big target overview crane. i mean, you know, there is all the stuff you need to buy were what will be up behind the line. here we watch it from a very safe distance. maybe on zoom here. i mean, it sounds very dangerous perilous message to their friends and ukraine. or you're

exactly right. you know, i think the best we've had so far this crisis was from the leader in the nation where he basically wrote this present in the west of some kind of a super human more. so let me quote possible and he was the one imogen nation. all the wes, it's name is pronounced by the. ready us media s, it has the audio, the bad, the also the super intended extraterrestrial. and the, basically it, jim and i are very much why do you want additional jose before the old? what to actually if we just replace them by the jews, you will get down the circuits because we're going to present the at the same time . s some someone said someone writing a reference,

someone all the human the same time. he's always you bit human. that is just what he's playing, something back. you know, i've secret died here in these expressions. what is strategy? what is why? what can we expect from this is, do you mean i station these do my additional leader is know that the nation please . jo, george, i mean they brings up a very good point here. i mean, they, it's never, it's never explicitly said on the western side, what the russians should exactly do other than just surrender. is that what they want? i mean, i, again, this, this, the space shuttle diplomacy, it's for me, it's just putting on a show that you know, where we're giving them an off ramp. but the point is, is that it's about nato expansion in a whole of these visits. all of these letters are never address security concerns.

obviously. that's intentional. george. yes, it is indeed a complete faith. so the constantly wanting to come to moscow constantly. oh, i need to put in a phone call. busy and so my chrome during this week, i mean he visited moscow on monday that i think on tuesday, he had a phone conversation with dan yesterday and, and in our phone conversation. so again, you have this constant conversation, and all you're doing is just repeating the same points. you're not, you know, russia, i mean, guess there's obviously those 2 important documents that russia presented to the well, on december the 17th. but there's other issues that russia is raised, which is, for instance, ukraine is going through the motions is refusing to negotiate. well, you know, it has, it's supposed to negotiate, implementing the minutes to court over and over again. the russian

insist that you know, it is in black and white. this is what you need to do in order to fill in bins because and then it's up to france and germany, to lean on ukraine to stop negotiating says they don't do it. and so just right, and this is something you can say, you know what, what is the point of these discussions? if you don't do the minimum, ok, george, i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to a short break. and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on some real and stay with our team. ah ah ah

ah one that makes no sense. you know, born is another case. and you perish as a marriage we don't have with charity. we don't believe maxine the whole world leads to take action and be ready. people are judgment, common crisis with we can do better, we should be better. every one is contributing each in their own way. but we also know that this crisis will not go on forever. the challenge is great. the response

has been massive. so many good people are helping us. it makes us feel very proud that we are in it together. join me every thursday on the alex simon shows, i'll be speaking to guess when the world of politics spoke. business i'm show business. i'll see you then ah welcome back to process. were all things are considered? i feel about this is the home addition to remind you. we're discussing some real news. ah. okay, let's go back to george in budapest. don't you remember?

last week we had a net price mark spokesperson over at the state department, tom talking about the that there is somehow some intelligence that the russians are working on a false flag video with, you know, actors and fake blood and all of this type of thing here. but isn't that possibly a form of projection? because what i worry about is a provocation and a provocation dealing with what the real problem is, is the entry ukraine conflict with kid and the a dumbass known as collectively the don bass. that's what i worry about with all of this military hardware being poured into ukraine. well, that's what it's for is to attack the don bass, obviously not to attack russia and every one knows that. and then you have some kind of provocation. and you get the video and then the,

the games begin. ok. and they will point to figure the rushes, the aggressor when in fact it is something that is being played out in an intra ukraine. complex thoughts. i think that's a very good point because so we know from the o s. c, observers that there has been an increase, a substantial increase in sci fi violations on the line of our com side of this heavy weaponry is being called in to ukraine. plus with holy historical rhetoric, supposedly encouraging the ukrainians, though it might well lead to some people within the security intelligence are within your brain in collusion with us and you can just services to stage some. 1 incident because they know that any kind of military offensive by kid against the dumbass. good. well, trigger

a russian intervention. and it's clear from everything that we hear from london and washington. and this is what basically they would love to see because they weren't well, they want to see russia isolated, they want to see russia push out of europe altogether. they want nato to be strengthened once again, the british and the americans are in the forefront, the leading, the west against russia. they want whole economy trading, contacted in europe and russia to come to an end, a strain to so they want to see this conflict. they don't care about ukraine, the cause of the future. great. they want to see the sampling. i think that's why it is a dangerous situation. and the ruffles themselves said several times, do you know something we don't, you know, it is something being planned that we don't know about. so, so i think that, that, you know, you know, concerns of a demon let. let's go back to august 2008,

and you had been a very georgian president, soccer feelie. he gets a little bit of a nod in the judge from the u. s. in his adventure in trying to reoccupied self assess here. well, the bush administration got cold feet of the georgian forces were obliterated and self is that he is gone forever from you credit from georgia. now bring it up to speed to the present. it seems to me, considering all of the rhetoric, because we didn't have that with george. we didn't have this media frenzy with in 2008. remember, was the eve of the olympic games. but now we've had money since the end of october, high intensity propaganda comm claiming imminent invasion. i don't know anything that is imminent for months on em, but anyway, but this time, you know, they nudged the ukrainian to say, try it again. we have to remember the care forces we're,

we're completely utterly defeated when they try to take control of the dumbass. now this may be the 2nd attempt, the difference between georgia, 2008 and ukraine in 20. 22 is that nato will give them the green light to continue, even though they will not send their own forces their own. they will not put any kind of flesh in the game. they want the ukrainians to do it. what your thoughts are exactly right. now, my scenario is a 1008. let me remind you in spring 2008, need to at summit in bucharest, reassurance that your brain and daughter will at some point in the future going. they ask the person that we know now, right? decision and don't day when no one cares are really nice. read it as basically the green light to take out the see here and later on our am,

let me explain you why he didn't expect russia because you don't remember that russia? no, it didn't interest focus since 1990 since the times of the soviet union around for middle school in january like in iraq. it was not there. so i really misread may to misread russia. russia want, but he did not eat it and the tragedy. and when the friendly don't remember how she was the big you know, he kept saying the roster groups are on the route believe. see, the problem is that these people in the west, the may still need it or they try their main concern is to make it. there you go. you know, there is a process, the 78,

you know, or the big games in trying to identify though there are nice, you know, pretty soon better focus is the problem is and if only want to just so nice they're all invited. can you know, they said we will withdraw our instructors instruct the saline and you just like them to go there were, you know, when they will probably be just the whole way. and the problem is that the media not remember the bank. so lambert's, i mean, i remember that was an 8 if it was yesterday there wanted to meet the credit by the me, you know, a european investigate in august 2008 and the commission committee that it was georgia. you know, it was but i remember how sad the night before

they do it by the way. she, she said don't, don't stop the war. really is our jewelry at the moment was body to body. look what happened to him by during the bottom night. sorry. it was all in bond, please. you know, it was a nominal, but that's why to the immediate it basically if i don't get the problem, what the doctor will find russians. georgia will be ill disposed to want to say yes, you know, i said, yes, it's a small nation. all don't get it. they were not prepared to face the russian army in the same weight. ah, yes, a 1014, and in 2015 when they try to attack that small area, you know, the percent of the ukrainian therapy they were deterred by the local militia. by

now, the situation is very different because you bring an army group, they want all those weapons. so now it may be a real threat, and that's why russia are needed there. it was there. if you turn, you brilliance. prepare, go past well. now prepare for the russian on b. c. george. i mean, you know, i look at the, you know, these fantasy plans that they have here. and i'm glad to, we have talked about august 2008 with how to set here. but when the 1st missile fires, the 1st bullet goes. busy into the air then the fog of war comes into play here. and we, the, the, the ukrainian military is acquitted, so very, very badly on, since the legal, coo, the overthrow of the democratically elected government in february 2014. the best of plans never work out. ok. and daemon has a very good point that these are the, the training military men under the command of zelinski may want to get the don

bass back, but they don't want to go to war with russia. i think the sullivans and the and the blinking and the bit of the victoria new ones. they haven't thought this out. they never have thought about. go ahead church. no, i didn't get sorted out of it, but from their perspective of what would work very nicely for the west would be this russian invasion. russia will be seen to be this monster in the eyes of the world with the finally that we have the evidence that they, they, this is true, which is, you know, it is hitler, russia is nazi germany. and that was, you know, what the, well, the terrible things are. there are options within 24, these looney military scenarios. i just got to march on to kear. they're going to see if i can hear in reality,

all that is likely to happen. they do, the worst comes to the worst, is that the russians will step in and secure the dumbass. because then that the consequence would be that eventually, you know, the dumbass will be re incorporated with russia. ukraine would lose this territory, just a big loss of ukraine, but the nato phone book and some of them. okay, that's great. great, george. you're absolutely right. and this is the twisted logic because a dumbass is already lost. if you don't want to implement them in school course, but it's already lost so well they're in a sense, ukraine is losing really nothing against membership. and it's a way for them to say, well, we tried, but the russians took it away from us. i mean, it's a really maniacal plan, but it might work. it might well because i think there are clearly people with in the ukraine. intelligence and security are very happy with this. ok,

we lose the buck we gain entry into the nato club. so now there'll be no argument against letting in ukraine because it is the victim of aggression. i mean, it needs our protection. so then those and the conflict on the ukranian church, it will have been resolved on exception. and you and i talked about this on the goggle crime me is the, is the why and the point. and i think that and that's why the orient you probably curses those days back, worry that she didn't get the prize because the price wasn't the down. the price was grimy, i may miss me, miss, and that's my whole point. my question going to be the miscalculate all the time and, and they always blame others for their great ideas to go go nowhere. go awry. i gentlemen, that's all the time we're all going to keep a very close eye on the story here. i want to thank my guest in budapest and here

in math. i want to thank you for watching us here to see you next time. remember, oh, for ah ah, bring you the very latest every out the day. this is no fun. everyone here with a democratic republic of congo is among the richest

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breaking news with our live on at the international, but the top cotton sports rules that a russian figure skating star camila valley ever can carry on competing at the winter olympics. and beijing that is despite and testing oh dear pro bond substance in december. ah, of the claims of an invasion of ukraine by the middle of the week. the u. s. is by tracking a little bit not making any definite prediction. now saying instead to the invasion could be any data canada police clear a key border crossing with us, the truckers protesting vaccine mandates but peaceful rallies in the capital continue and support the so called freedom con boy now entering it so weak we spoke .