leon union and paving the way for the single currency the your own as that he has on it's deemed in economic supervisor while arguably dividing many on its future existence. in recent days though, there have been fresh disputes, a v post for exit, northern ireland protocol with the u, calling for suspension. meanwhile, standing firm on its position of a rush intentions with non e u. member ukraine. well, joining me now from chevy chase in maryland is professor charles help jan senior fellow and director of european studies at the council of foreign relations. thank you so much. also coming back on 30 years, of course, people may remember your boss, president obama, when you a national security council, european affairs direct era trying to get britain to remain in the european union. what do you think that he is a success? you know, if we had had this conversation 5 years ago and i would, i would have said, europe looks pretty shaky and match because you know, breaks it was on the horizon in france,

you had been national rally and germany, the alternatives for, for germany. and then you have the pandemic and one could have said, whoa, the populists are gonna are going to prevail. yes, breaks it has happened. it's been pretty ugly. but the e. u, i think his is in remarkably good shape. i'm pretty beat about development on the continent in part because the center, his hell, we just had a normal election in germany, italy, it wasn't pretty, but martha rella, the president drug, the, the prime minister have agreed to stay put. i think it's probably likely that micron is going to be re elected. so the center is holding. you've had a mutual ization of death that nobody expected to try to get your economies back up on their feet. immigration is under control again, not pretty bribing era to want to keep syrians in turkey,

bribing libyans to keep africans in libya, but you know, it's for now working. so and then the final thing is, is the relationship with the united states is back in pretty good shape. europeans are happy that biden is in office. i think everybody is asking for how long is he going to lose? the house in november is a republican, maybe even trump going to be reelected, but at least for now we're seeing a level of us european solidarity. that's pretty impressive. okay, well i, i should just say that obviously the german government certainly schultz is free just as a medical denies. he bribed any one and cause you k prime minister course johnson completely rejects that record. has been ever, i think, any kind of a mess. but i mean, i suppose, i should say that the off to used phrase that the you prevented a war. and that's not true. yugoslavia of course, was

a war when the european union was around. well, i think you have to give your a pretty high marks for preserving peace in large swats of europe. and the border between france and germany wide open the border between germany and poland open. it's worked, integration has largely achieved its objectives. has europe emerged as a geopolitical heavyweight. now, is mccrory trying to address that issue? yes. is he going to succeed? probably not any time soon. but the bottom line here is that you have in europe an integrated market. pretty strong political unity, it is one of the most successful political revolutions, if you will, of the 20th century. and of course, there are these tensions now, as regards the know the non protocol, what do you think the view is in the biden administration, joe biden?

as we sometimes mentioned on this program, there were room is that the ira a rebel song to song is house in new jersey. in the old days, you think he's going to definitely take the you side over the unilateral decision, apparently in the last few days by the british government to break the northern and protocol. well, you know, having worked in the white house during the obama era, it was, it was pretty clear that obama biden and others were, were not very keen on braxton. and you'll remember that president obama or the u. k . and, and tried to say, hey, don't do this, this is not a good idea. i'm not sure whether that helped or hurt, but the body, this is really, you know, was bricks. if that's what you're saying there. now i'm not going to own that one, but we can take that discussion offline the, you know, i think that that things are trending in a reasonably good direction on the, on the northern iowa. you, you know, we saw

a cabinet reshuffle not that long ago, which i think was in part about johnson's desire to find some way forward on, on northern ireland biden wants that to happen. he does not want to see some kind of a bus stop that it affects the relationship between the republic and northern ireland . so stay tuned. we're not across the finish line yet, but i have a sense that the british government wants to put this behind it and that some kind of compromise deal with is forthcoming. well, of course, for us, johnson is in battle because of a police investigation, but any fears you might have had about britain looking to the far east, perhaps that lead to china. ukraine seems to show that the nato alliance. certainly the alliance between the meeting and members, britain in the united states, never been stronger over ukraine. well, you know, it's,

i worried in the aftermath of brackets it, that britain would turn in were, in part because i think breaks it was the result of a somewhat isolationist turn within the british electorate. but that has not happened. in fact, in some ways, johnson has attempted to compensate for britain's departure from you by trying to punch above its weight elsewhere. all the focus deal the submarine, deal with australia, britain flexing its muscles in ukraine, sending a warship to the black sea, now standing shoulder to shoulder in trying to push back against putin's threats to ukraine. so i would say that right now, the u. s. u k. relationship despite the differences over breakfast it is, is in pretty good shape and that london is turning out to be the partner that

washington had hoped for. is that going to continue? we'll have to see, but so far so good. i mean, watching the progress of the, by the ministrations a raising of the issue of ukraine. what have you, what have you made of it? obviously, the by to ministration came to russian invasion was imminent, then dropped the word imminent aud pieces of intelligence. actually some of it repeated from, from britain, the british intelligence, claiming that a person actually banned from russia was being prepared to take power in give very odd bits of intelligence being reported by all the newspapers. how do you think about demonstrations handling all of us? i think the bible folks have broadly gotten it right now. nobody knows. probably including proven himself whether rush has been in vain ukraine, but they've got enough force on the border, including ships in the black sea that one has to take very seriously the prospect

of a huge russian invasion that would perhaps include besieging p s sacking the government and install it out of that, and i any intention of doing that? well, what would be the point? well, you know, this is, this is where i have a hard time figuring out exactly what, what the point is in the sense that, you know, a potent is a trouble maker. brewton has invaded or tried to interfere in most of his, his neighboring countries from georgia. to ukraine, nego or no car bach, moldova, he went in to syria, but these actions have generally been low cost, low risk, a low cost, low risk operation in ukraine doesn't really get him much. ok, so let's say he wants to annex done boss, or he wants to connect don boss to crimea. he still loses the rest of ukraine. so if his goal here is to try to pull the country back into rushes, fear influence,

he really does have to invade the country. that's a huge toward be near. i'm not sure he's got the stomach for that so that he'd be nearer weston nato nations. i mean, i have to say on, on those different things, syria, i'm sure the russian government would immediately say that there was british, in american backing for the rebels on the ground to going to carry back fusion, intervene to solve a, as a by john and armenia and as, as regards don, bess and elegans can so, and you know, that even western powers of ad through accept the un security council resolution on the minsk agreements, 2202. they've accepted it to them. it's agreement is fine for russia, which isn't even mentioned in the agreement that you don't see that. and you're talking about isolation earlier. and i suppose the trump element here, and certainly your cable channels, like fox news,

saying this is about biden's presidency in taxes, worried about mid terms. and it goes, boris johnson here, being investigated by the police. well, you know, in terms of, of what rush has been up to in its neighborhood. i think the facts speak for themselves and russians ought to look in the mirror and ask themselves, why is it that everyone who lives near us wants to join nato? and i think it's for 2 reasons. russia keeps interfering sending troops and it's neighbors, and they want some protection number to everything else being equal. i think people want to live in a democracy, not in a repressive autocracy. they don't want to worry that if they he got, they're going to get poisoned or thrown in jail. that's why i think so many countries have been interested in joining nato. where is, is biting right now? i think he is engaging in dog diplomacy with the europeans. i mean, almost every day somebody is flying to either kiev or moscow. the channels of

communication are open. there is a real serious effort to get diplomacy to avoid a war, including by looking at the minsk agreements that you just mention. but there's also a realistic assessment that the diplomacy might fail. and that's why by now is taking 2 additional steps. one is putting more troops in eastern europe to tell the russians, hey, you don't like native. well, it's going to get worse. you're going to have a lot more capability on the eastern flank than you did before. and number 2, putting up in the window very significant sanctions, including against the inner circle, which should get him to ask, is it really worth it? do i really want to suffer the economic punishment that will come with an invasion of ukraine professor comes on? i will stop you there. more from the form, a special assistant of u. s. president barack obama. up to this break plus did. then princess elizabeth

know about the mama. rebellion with 90000 may have been killed, maimed or tortured by british imperialist. as she was told 70 years ago, that she was to become queen dollars more coming up and bought 2 of going underground. ah, but a t h . a world, a judgment, common crisis with we can do better, we should be doing better. every one is contributing each in their own way,

but we also know that this crisis will not go on forever. the challenge is great to response has been massive. so many good people are helping us. it makes us feel very proud that we are in it together. oh, seemed wrong when i was just a to see how this thing becomes the advocate and engagement equals the trail. when so many find themselves world support, we choose to look for common ground. ah, welcome back. i'm still here with professor charles, gulped john senior fellow and director of european studies at the council of

foreign relations inform, a special assistant to you as president barack obama vladimir putin was elected democratically. and of course yes, you know, the russians are very quick to talk about human rights and about guantanamo bay, still being opened. you mentioned sanctions. do you believe this sort of economic warfare is good travel bands as it freezes? at mastercard, visa blacklist that, i think that was around your time. it was around 500 entities between 200-2021. the us treasury says 933 percent increase would impact us sanctions have on russia. well, you know, biden has, has explicitly stated that no us combat troops are going to ukraine, that the united states and they know partners are not going to go to war with russia over ukraine. so the question then is, what should be the response? if russia goes and invades it's neighbor, and the main response is sanctions,

that's how you create a disincentive. both deter, to try to get them to set, to decide not to go in and to put pressure on russia. if it does go in these are, these are major sanctions, you know, after the 2014 events, the annexation of crimea interference and don bos sanctions were imposed, but they really didn't go deep into the russian. i mean, i know you dropped. i mean, i don't know actions are, would be like that, but they are much more far reaching and 2014 people can watch our joint. bolton trumps the national security adviser about sanctions and cuba let alone all the other countries. i don't know how many countries the u. s. know, sanctions in the relevance here, of course is to this foreign affairs magazine piece. you wrote that one us priority was to help manage china's rise of the global stage. the usa should formulate a strategy to peel russia away from china. as we know that the sanctions this

economic growth has just strengthen the relationship green most quinn beijing as well. yes, it has. and in some ways, one negative knock on effect of sanctions is pushing russia closer to china. that happened after 2014, where we saw russia compensate for its economic isolation by trading war with russia, with china moving closer to china. if russia invades ukraine, than i assuming that the sanctions will push china and russia closer, closer together, that is something that seems to me to be unavoidable, and in my mind, does not outweigh the importance of reacting with a serious set of sanctions against a negative. what's the point, what does it, what did they do with the point to the sanction they, they would create number one,

a deterrent putin has to ask, are russians are going to be better off if we occupy ukraine and they'll be body bags coming home. you can be sure of that, and if major russian banks and companies are cut off from the west, we hear that there will be a ban on certain kinds of technologies that will make it very hard for russians to buy cell phones and other other basic electronic items, so the idea here is to create disincentives for ukraine to, to suffer a rush. where is it, where is the, where is this or sleep if, where is this your guys use force against it? where is this? why is it worked in iran, in venezuela or in syria? where is this sanction policy ever ever worked? it, it's worked in in iran. right? i mean, we, that we got it, we got an agreement. it looks like we may get a re start of the j c p o way. why is iran going to the negotiating table

in part because they want to get out from under sanctions. okay. well, i mean, a lot of people in iran, arguably a saying why, why bother given of course, the reneging of the un security council resolution that by the trump or administration in any case, i do think her do think that her if, if russia is definitely not going to invade ukraine, the sanctions are going to be in place that russia and china and the global south, because we've seen chinese massive investment all across the global south means that the european union, an u. s. power is basically on the decline now. well, you know, i think that if we do get a d escalation, if we do avoid a major war and this would probably be the biggest war in europe since 1945,

it's conceivable that you could see russia's relationship with the, with the united states, move in a better direction, maybe we can get the main sk agreement implemented. maybe the dispute over ukraine can turn into a broader discussion that would include conventional arms control that would include nuclear arms control. so it's right now that doesn't seem to me very likely, but it's, it's conceivable. i also think, as i wrote in the piece that you mentioned that russia is over the longer term uncomfortable in the relationship with china because it is the junior partner. and over time, i think russia will be looking for a western auction because chinese power is going to make the russians uncomfortable . yes, you're right to say that china is a rising power. it will soon have the world's largest economy. but it's important

to keep in mind, but if you add up the collective weight of the united states and it's democratic partners in dramatically outweighs china or a combination of russia and china, it's important to keep that in mind. and that's one of the reasons that biden has been working so hard to promote solidarity, not just with europeans, but also with south korea, japan, taiwan, australia, and democracies in east asia. professor charles. gotcha. and i get my put, ah, in recent days the u. k. monarch, queen elizabeth the 2nd celebrated had platinum jubilee mocking 70 years or the british throne. when she found out her father george the 6th had died. the queen was on a 4 day trip to kenya, the east african nation was declared an independent state in 90. 63 after the spark of the mo, mo uprising. joining me now from the capital of canyon, i will be a senior lecturer from day star university, a member of gender africa, dr. wendy and joy. thank you so much, wendy. ever coming back on?

yeah, britain. oh, big celebrations for the platinum jubilee. she was told she was queen at treetops. i understand that her shut down hotel now a surprise no big mention that what perhaps a 160000 were being held in u. k. concentration camps at the same time. yeah, yeah, during their mom, mom i insurrection against their colonial government. it's kind of ironic or that it would elect breeding, actually mentioning at the circumstances in which she became queen. and in fact, the president's office always also celebrating that event. so it's kind of ironical . although of course, as we noted that the people that took over a drama kenyata or his son of course is now president distance himself big time from ma ma just remind is because i mean what 90000 may have been killed, maimed or, or tortured. yeah. yeah. i'm not sure about the numbers met was

a huge number of millions in and sensation and so far about tie it was about 8 years. so it was nice to have pretty period at the end was great, brutal. and as the canyon human rights commission of the fact, you don't know what symptomatic of the education that's happened since post independence in your country. read writing a lot about what you call a colonial education in kenya. regardless of how we're educated here in britain about colonial and imperialist atrocities. yeah, we got, i didn't education system. that's more about telling us the benefits of colonialism . and very little about the resistance of many, many candidates against colonialism right from the 1895. when they set foot t and b, say that that can, you would be long period british battery company. so there have been rebellions

there have been armed struggles, the one that catches the imagination, of course, is them out loud because of the extent. but they're, all these rebellions are hardly talked about in the curriculum. and it's really strange that even at this level, at the present, you have to go over what colonialism is with my students. because they don't know, they don't know, many of the major feedback it don't even know why it was here in the 1st place. and that's a combination of the education system that we have for what wise though, should say one of the princess elizabeth for them. princess elizabeth porters, sean marie, he was interviewed he, he joined a rebellion after being the porter for the green tree jobs. why? why is the educational system like that? because it was set up to prep the colonial admin. so in fact, one of the ways in which the british government, one of the tactics and mt

a rebellion, was to, to increase the number of schools, especially in central province where the larger mo, mo, was based. so the point was to get people who it would not be loyal to, would not give their loyalty to them. and that would support the british government . so that legacy has continued because now the people who got education while those who are not active and then when it came in and you get that the next generation to think more in terms of maintaining the colonial system that had been left behind. and then as having a different education system that was inclusive and reflected our study, but as regards imperialism and it's a connection to racism. you've actually talked about class here. and even where the

queen was staying, the princess or queen was sitting, working class whites. bowers of course, church was concentration camps in south africa against the white boys. there was a class system around the new key area which, you know, in the western imagination is karen dickson is white, mischief, happy valley. those are the, those are the stories of kenya, safaris. yeah. what the fact can, you know, was cast to be colonized by the elite of the british colonials. it so other people who went to the brand of africa, why he's not there is people or just civil servants who are working on behalf of the state. but the people who came to kenya and settled in, i knew, yeah, well that's, you know, you and all those. so they came with that all day. then you know, the values of that he stopped resting. that's what they brought here. yeah. the problem for can,

can you had highest number of it on high school bureaucrats? so it was not just a was also that you show them many of it alone. your office has had been to the public schools and to breach. so this is deborah johnson went to that school. i'm sure he'd say that. yeah, good, good back. ok. i mean, i should ask, i mean, barbados obviously is left to commonwealth. i don't know what your views about. can you leaving the commonwealth? would it be possible for princess elizabeth, on the 5th of february $9052.00 not to know about the mass extermination of canyon's going on at the time she was staying there, even if she knew it was inconvenient for her to know, and that's another legacy we have in it we have remained from britain, which is out of the special and secrecy and spin that what is more important is

that you have the system in fact, and any stories that they inconvenient you just keep them under the rad, or you don't to mention them i thought so, you know, and if she knew it was inconvenient for empire, so it was, it was easy and they found not to know and that's, that's, i guess, the week we have remain even in kenya. right now. a lot of the problems that we have are swept under the rug and we talk on elephant in the room, but we never mentioned the elephant. what is that? the commonwealth imperialism of the i, m f. all, all of them, all of them. you know, for example, in education i education system was, are we got a new system from the class and from i m f and world bank. all those kinds of fellows, but we can't talk about it even if it's named documents. so when you hear civil servants, they, they behave like lord promo who, who wrote their handbook for civil service. they just pretended it didn't happen.

they just keep away the documents and dust, you know, brand in the system as inefficient as efficient. and that's a british spin for you, this is a pretty good that it's well because in government and i, and refute all the allegations, of course we invite the investors to london only surely i'm after a few things don't want to enjoy a thank you. thank you very massive for the show will be back on wednesday. 17 years to the day. the un mobilized the kyoto protocol, the international treaty, which extended the you and framework. conventional climate change until then keep in touch by social media and let us know whether you think kenya is free from british imperialist. ah, ah, the democratic republic of congo is among the richest countries in the world and

natural resources, but he cannot mclee it. still one of the poorest cobalt is an essential material in manufacturing batteries for modern devices like electric cars, mobile phones and computers. 60 percent of the world's cobalt reserves are in congo . 20 percent of it comes from small scale mines. unicef figures confirm that in 2017. more than $40000.00 children, worked in cobalt mining in the republic to earn a living and pay for schooling. next time you use a fancy gadget like a smartphone camera or laptop, and just remember that there's a chance it works thanks to a child hard labor children like john michelle henry at o countless others like them. ah, a

ah, the headline stories today, the international olympic committee rules there won't be any awards ceremony for russian figure skating star camila oliva. despite the 15 year old being cleared to further compete at the beijing games by sports top court. old armed pensioner is western media. it, let's go all i tell him a photo of an elderly woman being trained to fight in ukraine, but ignores it's the extremist ays of militia group which appears to be doing the training ah barricades in brazil to the heart of europe. rules. oh it's, it's the fences of freedom convoy protesters from across the youth descend on this city, preparing to vent their anger at coven restrictions. these are life pictures showing us what.