ah, ah ah hello and welcome to cross stock, were all things considered on peter lavelle, russia special military operation and ukraine continues. this is widely agreed upon . beyond that media reporting on this conflict could not be more polarized and politicized. in the west, this conflict is black and white. good versus evil. no context is provided, which of course is done on purpose. ah,

to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess, george samuel in budapest. he's a podcast or at the goggle, which can be found on youtube and locals. and here in moscow, we have to meet with bob and she is a political analyst and editor. it interests me, internet media project, or i generally crossed up rules in effect. that means you can jump in any time you want, and i always appreciate it. i. let's start with george. george. obviously all of us are watching events unfold in ukraine very carefully. i'm watching western media, i'm looking at russian media, and i couldn't, you couldn't get to did a more different stories that are being reported, particularly in western media. there is no context where this conflict came from. oh wow. the way this conflict is being played out and how could possibly end because western media asthma turned it into an emotional event. not an analytical event. go ahead george. yes, that's right. there is no context and we get nothing. it's all

about the events that has preceded this russian special operation. so, you know, the media wasted 5 or 6 years out. this phony baloney, trump, russia so missed the big story, which was the biden. ukraine is going to action because i haven't really played a very important role in everything that has happened here. because it was the whole bama by the ministration, but engineer the qu, in february 2014 and many of the people who are involved in that, including of course victoria knew linda. we have her telephone though, you know? yes is out. yes. sorry. yes. is the guy click, she's out, and all these people are back in the meantime. you know, vitamin have been very much involved with the both my don government and the moment

the by the ministration came in. they me, they began pushing for ukraine membership engine, nato, and it has become very, very intense. around about the last october when defense secretary lloyd austin, went to ukraine, went to georgia and declared that the wrote to nato membership is open open. this was so strong that even the media picks up on this and it was the media now pretending. oh no, no, no, no, no, there be no plans at all. no plans at all book bringing in the ukraine into made so they lie about that just like they, they all know there were no promises made to go back jobs. no, no, no, that was your grade wasn't going to be broken tonight, but he's clear that's worth such plans. and that by rushing the through and no one was going to resist,

the russians were getting extremely concerned. and i think that explains why their tone changed in response was in november the buddhist started talking about red lines. and then a december, when russia presented these 2 very harsh documents to nato and the united states to know why these brought in. and they said, we just hear about this horrible, big, ugly bear, and this plucky little country trying to resist aggression. you know, gimme george, george, is that a wonderful job of introducing this topic here? because if you watch western media that cable, particularly russia did, suddenly out of the blue for no particular reason, invaded ukraine, that, that is the story line that you get. i mean, this is really appalling. and what it does is that actually the legs away from the most powerless in western society, they are the ones that are going to be punishment. the higher price is higher energy, right. and it's all because the unprofessional aggression daemon. well,

1st, if you worry about the general nature of this, you know, when, on the 3rd day or the day, one of the reason i felt very bad, i was really 7. no one in russia is rejoicing about what's going on. there is no g spirit in here right now. everyone is very serious concern. some people are going to need my listen, you know, we get sunday school lessons from the west like war is not the math. yes. hi, science war is not. it's a method on the 19th century. but while you are pleased with the 17th century miss with 17th century war becomes unfortunately with all know that. so just if you fax, the recent fax you know, would show who were needed and level the brain. yeah. get

a gauge of these negotiations, 1018. if you want the 1st and they did 2 days ago by the ukrainians, you read? presumably because they suspected him or what kinds of negotiations. when a member of the delegation get killed, you know, you go security service, government, get him you. when he was in power. in both sanctions or the hermitage museum, we think it is on the multiple state university. and he's like nice west someone culture. so i'm quite opposite to him. i mean it's very easy to appeal to people's emotions. yes, more is more than that. it's very easy to do. one tosh. you show that if you're geez, you show the show space and, and the go to all these math is to blame for everything. just so easy. you know,

it's just such an easy or difficult. but if you look what happens for 8 years, russia has been in the west. don't expand nato, this is dangerous. don't support these review when you grant what they're doing, you know, they are all their own people. they're essentially agent members. they own hermitage from the west. you know, they heard democratic connections, you know, they, they change or shank off was such an human and i'm just going to call professor joiner. we encourage the radiance to play hardball with russians. we told you bring us a line that they could become a part of the west, and we told your green you, that they showed that kind of resist fujen on every, every week. the result is that russia place with its existence because

you know, western in your brain, this isn't essential, threat for russia. would you just thought who prevented you know, nice thinking people in the west all these left mean and need to find the creasing the route. so russia ran, was that post war, then most people probably the best people on the but would be deter america from the boy weapons. and he said, you know, who did your americans from doing that? all the of the russian army. unfortunately, this was the last resume, and you said george washington post remarkably published, declassified or documents about massive. i mean, truly massive arm shipments ukraine at the end of last year. and we didn't do. and i spoke before this got the attention of the russians. i immediately and we,

and then we get these very high, intense negotiations which the west showed nothing for other the russians hard work . and then we have, we get to where we are now. i mean there is, it is a sense of causality. here. you'd be a, you're a very hostile neighbor, attaining vast. i mean, hundreds of millions of dollars of hardware, military hardware. and that's just for peaceful purposes. go ahead, charge that, that time. so in effect, ukraine was becoming a de facto member of base or, and if i told him kind of admitted that in this press conference the other day, i mean when he was boasting about, well, you know, how much weaponry we have provided and all the training would be in doing and this has been going on since 2014. so no one has told them both thing, but this is how you know, the people are going to praise. they do all this,

but it's only confirm what russia has been saying, which is you are turning this country into essentially an aircraft carrier directed against and quickly. i mean, what if your grain were rushed through into actually do you are a membership of nate? so then russia, when it will have very little options, well, you know, what, what are they going to do now? because now, you know, they, they would, if they try to go in and disarm and not to buy your grain, they would be up against nato. and then they really wouldn't be risky. well, what window was becoming very, very narrow. the judge it may kill was the defense of alliance. oh, it's just oh that you know, everything it does is just holding onto what he's got. so an export massive amounts of arms, the countries that are not in the alliance that is defensive. that's. that's right

. and, and he did. oldenburg said that, well, you know, we are now very actively involved with the georgia and the some reason both the it has the governor. again, these are not members of nato. why, you know, actively involved with them. and again, you know, we are a defensive alliance. how are you defensive? so the problem is that for russia, this was a be, was really getting very, very dire situation. and i think that's why, you know, they have to move quickly before the, by the ministration would have pushed through major membership. because who would have resisted? i mean, back in 2008, michael resisted the grammar, but even though it was still put in, in that book or as declaration who's going to resist now, or actually a complete 0, you know, wrong was, there's one thing one day when we go the next thing on the 3rd day. so i mean the

americans wouldn't need it, had they pushed for and i'm sure that they were getting ready to before that was unfinished business for the biking people. demon i just want for the record, can you explain to our audience? is russia under martial law? because some media outlets are making the claim. what is the i live here? you live here? how would you describe the situation at least here in moscow? go ahead. well, there are no limitations on public life. i mean basically the last around all there and i could be reading it right now. so basically it's amazing how the media duration and the, and the queen size. it was kind of interesting even happen all over the western world, but maybe that's just the coincidence. ok, maybe maybe i believe in but in general, people are concerned and you see people listening to you all the time. you see them

take in their mobile phones or you know, for us, it's a graduate because believe me, there are millions of people who built you great. these people even rush. i woke up that it would be just, these are the same apartment buildings that you find in moscow that you'll find the stole that you find, you know, she be yours. it was fun, country and very, you know, you know, very from a genus because all the people the same education, they all watch the same that it isn't. so there are still lots of things connecting us. jump in here gentlemen. we have to go to a short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on some real new stay with our tea. ah. when i would show the wrong one all 3. i just don't the room yet to figure out the thing because the attitude and engagement equal betrayal.

when too many find themselves well, the part we choose to look for common ground. i was on with this with you. i am with

from beach still these are efficient, but i to in the board with a welcome to crossed out. were all things considered? i and peter labelle, this is the home edition to remind you were discussing some real news.

ah, i'll go back to dina. if you could just very shortly, will describe how russians perceive ukraine and ukrainian go ahead. well, i'm g o recently are in was in the same all the people and it was very basic union bank the rationing by green. yes. are russians? russians all gold rush in the soviet union. the difference narrow you are more because. ready you know, there was a general education and people basically watched the same re channel and it isn't bob, what has been happening in the last 80 years for my man by russians.

the reason why there are you a protest now then in 2014, when basically my dad had them with 40 policemen killed and the army is more on boston crane. you went to russia. there were some products in russia at the time, and they were more numerous. why? because people at the time had not yet seen the cruelty or the, you know, i mean, don't us. now we have 8 years, you know, from a gun that we have several 1000000 refugees from your brain. you're just don't see them in the streets because they're the same as you can see something visible. you know, they have a distinct east and isn't a very interesting that russia is deemed the aggressor but a 1000000 to a 1000004 people moved from the john bass to, to rush. i don't think that's ever happening to georgia. change gears

a little bit here. what happened to western values? what happened to freedom of speech? i mean, if you, if you question the mentor, that, that the state department and, and they have described for the intel intelligence community, you're a traitor, how do we get here? i know that started under trump, but this is bleeding into just everything. now, you drink vodka, you're an agent of who would have thought go ahead. yeah, i mean in some ways, i think the, the arbitrary government measures during the cobit theory of the past 2 years kind of paved the way for this. but versus the acts that have been undertaken against russian media. they just like that, no legislation boss just simply, you know, a government decrease. russians are getting the property seat. right. you don't have to like russian 1000000000 as the thing. but what the hell does this about? what does they done? did they use you declare one day?

oh, this person is part of boot in, in a circle. what does that mean? i mean, even if true, what does he does? why and why does he get his property taken away? and this is just going across the boat. everybody is clapping and then there is this extraordinary village on an individual level toward russians. and are you going to get a russian not being served in the in restaurants? russian stores are attacks. you remember the time when after 911, all these solemn politicians game and i know this is nothing to do with muslims, this is just, these are the terrorists. we want to give vent to islamic phobia. where are these voices today in the way, who you know, when you know what is there any politicians who say we don't want to take this out on the individual russians? this is the general james. why and happy they're going along with this. i mean this, you know, we have valerie get idea of, you know, he gets fired from his position. very distinguish musician

because, you know, he, you know, he didn't condemn the government. well, i mean, if we have done that, wouldn't put his life in jeopardy of role if you, what you say is true and that is this monster wouldn't actually, you know, in some ways to get life in jeopardy, but no, he's gone. so this is completely arbitrary and really, governments are just engaging in the worst lowest the demo. or if i think i assuring russians of, hey, you know, the west lady hates us and this is a long standing hatred. you know, it was supposedly, was all about communism. it is something much deeper going on here. the, my, the mckinney, i suppose it's politically incorrect to say russian lives matter to well,

you're right. and the russian brought us to even more money. correct right now, because it's just amazing. it reminds me that early years of bolshevism, everyone in the same $150.00. yeah. get our hands on their property. let's once they get their dealers. well i remember i read george kennedy memoir. you know, the famous cameron walked in moscow during the time of the war. and afterwards he saw how the communist introduced the reforms in europe. and he rode that while it is confiscated, the lamp from the land was these by the some some the reason that the farmer spect what. but can you belong to the boss? but you take a nice the leaves all the coffee for many years. so ok, they can take

a remote they can they be a los or whether it is you know, summer by the way some of the, the variable west. sanction in friedman. ivan, this stupid thing you would expect from the nice people are very welcome. they actually are some of the west them who are mary and the russian and the way to read continue. you can check the news for that one. but what happens is, in this way the wes consolidate russian because everyone, you know, 300 dual in depth. and it makes them, it makes the rush because no rush of that 100 percent. sure. i'll put him in for us. they have no idea if there is what they did on the good. i mean,

george. so if confiscation is the name of the game right now. so western assets in russia, it's fair game, right? i mean, that's reciprocity. yeah, i think so, and i think there's increasing talk about that. russia should retaliate or be they've lost a lot of money. lost a lot of property should retire early a by national, i think all with them assets in russia. and that of course means they, they call the intellectual property, and that means that they can now manufacture all these goods and just sell them around the world. and now on the western companies will then try to sue you stolen our intellectual problem. but good luck with that. i mean, people have been trying to do that against china of the year without any grades, but it is indeed a fair game. after all, you know, russia has lost an enormous amount and that raises other issues to these companies

who now lose their assets, will go to their respective governments as a way, going to help us out. i mean we're, we're in a lot of trouble with lots of money. 1 you know, we can't stay in business and then the government will presumably have to bail them out. i mean they, they got them into this trouble be up to them to get them out. so saying, i mean, where is the money going to come from? saying with all the refugees, oh, come on. oh well, you know, we were welcoming, how many of you, who's going to pay for all of this? i mean, you know, i mean, we don't many millions of refugees from your grace who even knows who the hell these people are. and i do germany is going to have to pay for all of this. so i know that, you know, i'd say just quite happy with creating a problem for other countries, but a lot of people are going to be a heavy price in the west. well, in georgia, i can tell you that the ukrainians and russians are crossing the eric and southern

border as we speak. okay. they got, they got the word, the ball on the borders opened. d ma, again, kind of give us a notion of how russians feel about the see. because in the i started in my introduction is that there is this reporting on this conflict is without context. ukraine is complete context for russian. so being the inter marrying people have, i have a member of my team prospect team. she has family in mary ocho, which is under siege by the ukranian army. i mean, it's very, very personal, and that is something western media never explains ukraine in the, in the conscience of russians is a domestic issue. it's not a horn issue. go ahead. i'm sorry, you're right, but just to protect us from a relations mario bo was taken by. i had a referendum on federal way to degree in spring. it all of that for, you know,

staying in the people's republic. you know, the part of the brilliant groups roll into the part of them and the rest of the people are in the and now the russian army people are trying to push the ukrainian troops and the sole person on the battalion reports of the views. but they are holding the population to need my money. but you know, you asked me to call you about it. it seems to me the west is underestimate. i mean, they hear that you get a date for property costs and they won't get upset and out. this is on the list. you may think people, you know, they dia, that you can feed rations more. so what i believe is a war and i want to going. ready into this is also underestimate, they use a man,

she didn't think about the consequences before starting there is also stupid, you know, or was, it was part of that there will be a backlash in the west and of course in you will, that support is rushing the what are going to be unfortunate that had to be good? what was all the upside is huge. currently, you know, 40000000 people hostile to russia with huge data where you can high table, edible weapons, defacto member only though because they're already crane and most likely, even based on the west and both that. so would you name the cultural us on these more? let me jump in here, jim and george last 30 seconds to you. the liberal west is supporting some of the most vicious, neo nazi battalions and ukraine never reported. go ahead. no, never bought it. and of course,

this double piece with the liberal west supporting neo nazis in croatia in the 1990 s. he was gonna be lama terrorists and check border. and indeed, the finance and transport the jihad into balls the, again, in, in the $990.00 is. this is a long standing tradition. and all of this is not recall just is that we get this the sanitized picture of this glorious, heroic you, the media. i mean, are all the time we have a little one thing, my guess i'm going to pass on here in moscow and then think our viewers are watching us here. are you see you next time? remember the ah ah,

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