256 in 2008. now at least only speak about the price hikes and falls. bring 420. i mean it's, it's an amazing well activity and we will see what, what would be the ultimate outcome. but right now it's definitely a lot about politics. the ukraine conflict is widely seen in the west of black and white good versus evil. but as cross talk discusses next to me hearing one size view rarely leads to the lasting solution. ah. with, with industry.

on this talk and just look up some of natalie muscle around noon. she doesn't believe in the green shield on at night to me as priscilla. mamma cook as gosh, 6 great assembly. tim cut the rope to his ashley. uh, this is one of the with wonder pieces, but of course position did, admitted you but not, but the key for the ching, of brian's in metal for phones or something like that. and then we got that void, there was any residential, eval gray leak. i have them ah, ah ah ah,

ah hello and welcome to crossed out. were all things we considered on peter labelle. russia's special military operation and ukraine continues. this is widely agreed upon. beyond that media reporting on this conflict could not be more polarized and politicized. in the west, this conflict is black and white. good versus evil. no context is provided, which of course is done on purpose. ah, the to discuss these issues and more i'm joined by my guess, george. i mean, well he, in budapest, he's a podcast or at the goggle, which can be found on youtube and locals. and here in moscow, we have to meet with bob and she's a political analyst and editor it in us me internet media project or a gentleman, cross talk rules and effect. that means you can jump in anytime you want. and i

always appreciate it. let's start out with george. george. obviously all of us are watching events unfold in ukraine very carefully. i'm watching western media and looking at russian media. and i couldn't, you couldn't get to do more different stories that are being reported, particularly in western media. and there is no context where this conflict came from or was the way this conflict was being played out and how could possibly end. because western media is turned it into an emotional event, not an analytical event. go ahead george. yes, that's right. there is no context and we get nothing. it's all about the events that has preceded this. russian special operation. so, you know, the media wasted 5 or 6 years out. this phony baloney, trump, russia, so, but missed the big story, which was the biden,

ukraine's going to action because i think that has really played a very important role in everything that has happened here. because it was the whole bama by the ministration that engineer the qu in february 2014 and many of the people who are involved in that, including of course, victoria newland. and we have our telephone. so you know? yes, he's out. yes. sorry. yes. is the guy click, she's out and all these people are back in the meantime. you know, vitamin have been very much both with the, both my don government and the moment the by the ministration came in. they mean, they began pushing for ukraine's membership engine, nato. and it has become very, very intense. around about the last october when defense secretary lloyd austin,

went ukraine. he went to georgia and declared that the wrote to nato membership is open open. this was so strong that even the media picks up homeless and it was the media now pretending all, oh no, no, no, no, there be no plans at all. no plans at all book bringing in the ukrainians and they so they lie about that just like they, they all know there were no promises made to go back job so now no, no, no that was your grade wasn't going to be broken tonight, but he's clear that there was such plans and that by, you know, rushing this through and no one was going to resist. the russians were getting extremely concerned. and i think that explains why their tone changed in response was in november we just started talking about red lines. and then a december, when russia presented these 2 very harsh documents to me. so and the united states, still not a lot of these brought in and they said we just hear about this horrible,

big, ugly bear. and this plucky little country trying to resist the aggression. you know, give me a ga, ga that a wonderful job of introducing this topic here. because if you watch western media that cable, particularly russia can suddenly out of the blue for no particular reason, invaded ukraine, that, that is the story line that you get. i mean, this is really appalling. and what it does is that actually the, what's away from the most powerless in western society, they are the ones that are going to be punishment. the higher price is higher energy. and it's all because of an provoke digression demon. well, 1st, if you worry about the general nature of this, you know, when, on the 1st day or the day, one of the reason i felt very bad, i was really sad them. no one in russia is rejoicing about what's going on. there is no gene, greece, spirit, and you're right now everyone is very serious,

very concerned. some people are going to need my listen. you know, we get sunday school lessons from the west like war is not the math. yes. you but i sense war is not. it's a method on the 19th century. but when you are pleased with the 17th century miss with 17th century war becomes unfortunate with all know that. so just if you fact just recent fact, you know, would show who, when did with, and level the brain, you get a gauge of these negotiations. one was the 1st to need if you want the 1st and they did 2 days ago by the grand jury, presumably because they suspected him a crate or what kinds of negotiations. when a member of the delegation get healed, you know, you go security as soon as possible,

government get him when he was in power in both sanctions or the hermitage museum in saint petersburg on the multiple state university. and he's like nice west someone culture. so i'm quite the opposite. do gotten, i mean it's very easy to appeal to people's emotions. yes, more is more than that. it's very easy to do. one tosh. you show that if you're geez, you show the show put in space and, and the go to the snap is to blame for everything. just so easy. you know, it's just such an easy or difficult. but if you look what happened for 8 years, russia has been in the west. don't expand nato, this is dangerous. don't support these review when you grant what they're doing, you know, they are all their own people. they're essentially members,

they all know thanks. hermitage from the west, you know that her democratic elections, you know, they, they change or shank off was human and i'm just going to call progressive joiner. try and we encourage the radiance to play hardball with russians. we told you bring us a line that they could become a part of the west. and we told ukrainian that showed that kind of resist fujen on every, every week. the result is that russia place with its existence because you know, when i was in your brain, this is an essential threat for our share. would you just thought cool, preventive, you know, nice thinking people in the west all these left mean and need to find out the route . so russia ran was that post war. then most people,

probably the best people on the back would be deter america from the boy weapons. and he said, you know, who did your americans from doing that? only the russian army. unfortunately, this was the last residence and u. s. george washington post remarkably published, declassified or documents about massive. i mean, truly massive arm shipments ukraine at the end of last year. and we do, and i spoke before this got the attention of the russians, i immediately and we and then we get these very high, intense negotiations which the west showed nothing per other the russians hard work . and then we have, we get to where we are now. i mean there is, it is a sense of causality. here you'd be a, you're a very hostile neighbor,

attaining vast. i mean, hundreds of millions of dollars of hardware, military hardware. and that's just for peaceful purposes. go ahead george time. so in effect, ukraine was becoming a de facto member of bass or. and if i told him kind of admitted that in his press conference the other day, i mean when he was boasting about, well, you know, how much weaponry we have provided and all the training would be doing. and this has been going on since 2014. so no one has told them both think, but this is how you know, the people are going to praise. they do all this, but it's only confirm what russia has been saying, which is you are turning this country into essentially an aircraft carrier directed against us. and quickly, i mean, what if your grain were rushed through into actually do you are a membership of nate. so then russia really will have very little options. well,

you know, what, what are they going to do now? because now, you know they, they would, if they try to go in and disarm and not to buy your grain, they would be up against nato, and they really wouldn't be risky. well, what window was becoming very, very narrow. the judges you make it was a defensive alliance. oh, it's just oh the, you know, everything it does is just holding onto what is up. so an export massive amounts of arms, the countries that are not in the alliance, that is the bed. that's right, and, and indeed oldenburg said that, well, you know, we are now very actively involved with the georgia and the some reason both the, the governor, again, these are not members of nato. why, you know, actively involved with them. and again, you know, we are a defensive alliance. how are you defensive? so, the problem is that for russia, this was a, be really getting very,

very dire situation. and i think that's why, you know, they have to move quickly before the by the ministration would have pushed through major membership. because who would have resisted? i mean, back in 2008, michael resisted the grammar. but even though it was still put in, in that book or declaration, who's going to resist now, or actually you get a complete 0. you know, wrong will says one thing, one day when we go the next thing on the 3rd day. so i mean the americans wouldn't succeed in, had they pushed for and i'm sure that they were getting ready to before that was unfinished business for the biking people. daemon, i just want for the record, can you explain to our audience is read under martial law because some media outlets are making that claim. what is the i live here you live here? how would you describe the situation at least here in moscow?

go ahead. well, there are no limitations on public life. i mean basically the last and it's all there and they could be reading it right now. so basically it's amazing how the media ration and the, and all the points. it was kind of interesting even happened all over the western world, but maybe that's just the coincidence. ok, maybe maybe i believe in but in general, people are concerned. i mean, you see people listening to you all the time. you see them taking their mobile phones or you know, for us, it's a graduate because i believe there are millions of people who built ukraine. these people even rush. ok that, that'd be just these are the same apartment buildings that you find in moscow that you'll find in stole that you find, you know,

she be yours. it was fun. country and very, you know, you know, it's very from a janice because all the people kind of the same education, they all watch the same. so there are still lots of things connected us. they might have just been here gentlemen. we have to go to a short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on some real new stay with our team. ah ah. when i was shot the wrong one, all room. just don't any room to fill out the thing because the attitude and engagement equals the trail. when so many find themselves, well, the part we choose to look for common ground. ah

welcome to cross stock, were all things are considered. i and peter labelle, this is the home edition remind you were discussing some real news. ah, i'll go back to dina. d. made if you could just very shortly will describe how russians perceive ukraine and ukrainians go ahead. well, or until recently or didn't was basically the same all the people and it was very also just basically when you make a difference in the russian empire,

ukrainian or russian russians are all gold rush in the soviet union. the different narrow the were more because. ready there was a general education and people basically watched the same re channel and it isn't bob, what has been happening in the last 80 years man by russians. the reason why there are you a protest now then in 2014, when and basically my don't have them are with 40 policemen killed and the army is the more they don't claim you went to russia. there were some products in russia at the time, and they were more numerous. why? because people at the time had not yet seen the cruelty or the, you know, i mean dos. now we have 8 years. he's not from a gun that we have several 1000000 refugees. from your brain,

you're just don't see them in the streets because they're the same as up. you could see from the visible, you know, they, they have a different eastern, isn't it? very interesting that russia is deemed the aggressor but a 1000000 to a 1000004 people moved from the john bass to, to rush. i don't think that's ever happening to georgia. they change gears a little bit here. what happened to western values? what happened to freedom of speech? i mean, if you, if you question the mentor, that the state department and, and they have described for the intel intelligence community, you're a traitor. how do we get here? i know that started under trump, but this is bleeding into just everything. now. you drink vodka, you're an agent of who would have thought go ahead. yeah. i mean, in some ways, i think the, the arbitrary government measures during the co theory of the past 2 years kind of

paved the way for this. but versus the act would have been on the day can against russian media just like that. no legislation boss, just simply, you know, a government decrease. russians are getting the property seat, right. you don't have to like russian 1000000000 as the things. but what, what, how does this about, what does they done? did they, they get you declare one day. this person is part of booting in a circle. what does that mean? i mean, even if true, what does he done? why and why does he get his property taken away? and this is just going across the boat. everybody is clapping and then there is this extraordinary facility on an individual level to ward russians. and are you going to get a russian not being served in the in restaurants? russian stores are attacks. you remember the time when after 911, all these solemn politicians games?

i know there's just nothing to do with most lives. this is just the terrorist we wasn't given to lama. where are these voices today in the west? what is there? any politician who say, we don't want to take this album, individual russians, this is, you know, this is a regime oh, why and happy they're going along with this. i mean this, you know, we have valerie get to give you, you know, he gets fired from his position of the very distinguished musician because, you know, he, you know, he didn't condemn the government. well, i mean, if he had done that, wouldn't put his life in jeopardy of role if you, what you say is true and then is this monster wouldn't actually, you know, in some ways to get life in jeopardy, but now he's gone. so this is completely arbitrary and really, governments are just engaging in the worst lowest the demo. or if i see

on shoring russians or hey, you know, the west lady hates us and this is a long, sunny hatred. you know, it was supposed that it was all about communism, but it is something much deeper going on here. i d. mckinney, i suppose it's politically incorrect to say russian lives matter to well, you're right and the russian brought us to even more money. correct right now, because it's just amazing. it reminds me that early years of bolshevism, how everyone in the same one. yeah, get our hands on their property once they get their dealers. well, i remember i read george kennedy memoir. you know, the famous cameron walked in moscow during the time of the war. and afterwards he saw how communist introduced the reforms in europe. and he wrote that

when it is confiscated, the lamb from the land was these by the some some b, r, e in the farm. especially what bus can you belong to the boss, but you in taken the lead to the country for many years. so okay, they can, they are more just they can take the videos on whether it is you know, by the way, some of these variable western sanction in friedman and ivan, this stupid thing you would expect from the nice people are very welcome. they actually are some of the western government who are married and russian and these 11 years later, the west continued. you can check the news for that one. but what happens

is, in this way, the west consolidates russian because everyone, you know, 300 dual in depth and it makes them, it makes the debit just rush because no rush of that one percent. sure. i'll put them in for us. they know if there is what they did on the gated, i mean george. so if confiscation is the name of the game right now. so western assets in russia, it's fair game, right? i mean, that's rental property. yeah, i think, and i think there's increasing talk about that that russia should retaliate or be they've lost a lot of money, a lot, a lot of property should retaliation by nationalizing all west and assets in russia . and that of course, means they take all the intellectual property, and that means that they can now manufacture all these goods and just sell them

around the world. and now on the western companies will then try to sue you stolen our intellectual problem. but good luck with that. i mean, people have been trying to do that against china of the year without any grades. but i mean, it is indeed a fair game. after all, you know, russia has lost an enormous amount that raises other issues to these companies who will now lose their assets, will go to their respective governments of a way. going to help us out. i mean, we're, we're in a lot of trouble. we've lost a lot of money. 1 you know, we can't stay in business and then you really have to bail them out. i mean, they got them into this trouble. you'll be up to them to get them out. so saying, i mean, where is the money going to come from? staying with all the refugees. oh, come on. how well you know where you know, who are welcoming, how many of you, who's going to pay for all of this? i mean, i mean, we don't many millions of refugees from your grace who even knows who the hell

these people are. and i do germany is going to have to pay for all of this. so i know that united states is quite happy creating a problem for other countries, but a lot of people are going to be a heavy price in the west. well, in georgia, i can tell you that the ukrainians and russians are crossing the southern border as we speak. okay, they've got, they got the word, the ball on the borders open d ma, again, kind of give us a notion of how russians feel about this. the because in i started in my introduction, is that there is this reporting on this conflict without context. ukraine is complete context for russian. so being the inter marrying people, i have a member of my team grossbach team. she has family in mary ocho, which is under siege by the ukranian army. i mean, it's very, very personal,

and that is something western media never explains ukraine in the, in the conscience of russians is a domestic issue. it's not a horn issue. go ahead. the ma, right, but just to protect us from a lesions mario was taken by, i had a referendum on federal. why did the green in spring of our goal for staying in the people's republic? you know, the part of the region, the brilliant groups roll into the park there and, and the rest of people are in the and now the russian army people are trying to push the ukrainian troops and the sole reports of the views. but they all get the population to me by many years. but you know, you asked me to call you about it. it seems to me the west is underestimate. i mean,

they hear that you get a date for property and they want to get upstairs and get out. this is on the list . you may think people, you know, very dear, that you can feed rations more. so what i believe is a wall and i want to go and this is also underestimate, they do, that is man, she didn't think about the consequences before starting. there is also stupid course. it was part of that there will be a backlash in the west, of course, which in you will, that support is a rush into what are going to be unfortunate that had to be good. but that was all. the upside is huge. country, you know, 40000000 people hostile to russia with huge data where you can high tables, edible weapons, defacto member only though,

because they're all radius crane and most people based on the western power. so would you name the cold us on these more? let me jump in here, jim and george last 30 seconds to you. the liberal west is supporting some of the most vicious, neo nazi battalions and ukraine never reported. go ahead. no, never recorded. and of course, this double piece with the liberal west supporting neo nazis in croatia in the 1990 s. he was one of his law, make terrorists and check border. and indeed, the finance and transport the jihad and into balls the again, in just in the 990. this is a long standing tradition. and all of this is not recall just instead we get the sanitized picture of gloria you rowing. the media, i mean,

are all the time we have a little one. think my get some good, a person here in moscow and thank our viewers for watching us here. are you see you next time? remember the ah ah ah ah mm. with

her headline story. the 3rd round of peace talks between russia and ukraine and with both sides come missing. to reopen, humanitarian corridor is a question open of life po cache, where they go to do they go west, east, north ansel. however, many people remain tramped and their cities claims the ukrainian army are continuing to shell areas where civilians reside with when they did but is discovered in a mass grave. outside the guns were read, berry and i say budget because few have been identified so far on covering the grim

the secrets of the past. the mass graves containing the victims of 8 years.