to start teaming up with his he's, he was coming up with i'm says audio is if i'm dish publish it, but you put them should i did this with the 1st one? i'm going to give you my daughters in with soon learn how to proceed to with ah, ah hello and welcome to cross top. were all things considered? i'm peter lavelle. the group of 7 has vowed not to lead putin when his war against

ukraine actually announced new restrictive measures. but what about the officially enforced narrative claiming ukraine is winning? the wes attempt to weaken russia have failed. in fact, the west is weakening itself with raw, sucking the situation in ukraine. i'm joined by my guest, george samuel in budapest. he's a podcast or at the goggle which can be found on youtube and locals in munich. we have bra, ralph niemeyer. he is a leader of a german resistance movement and in st. petersburg across to gilbert doctorow. he is an independent political analyst and author of memoirs of an ex pat manager in moscow during the 1990s. i gently cross talk roles. in fact, that means you can jump any time you want, and i always appreciate george. let me go to you 1st. here are the g 7 is up to it . it's act again. here is if anybody really cares what the g 7 says, nora, but nonetheless, they have vowed bit pulled in will not win his against the grain. what,

what does that mean? what are they going to do about it? okay. other than inflict more misery on their own consumers and voters. go ahead, george. well, that's exactly right. that's all they have disposable which is do they can misery on the ukrainian and of course on their own was and when victor or by the other day, that's an oily blog, completely cutting off from oily boards from russia will be like releasing a nuclear bomb on the hon, give them it or will speaking not just to get there is, but for many europeans, this is an absolutely nonsensical idea of cutting yourself from energy import because it is simply the destruction of your own economists. and it's quite clear that there is no ready means at the european disposal to replace

russian oil, replace russian gas. so all of it is just simply call the e u horse. look on the line was supposed to be the chief executive of the human. she's the president of the european emission. she has no important mechanism. she got pools european to do one thing or another. she can talk along them out. but ultimately you're gonna have to decide, are they going to stop? are they going to freeze? i was just going to bring their economists the whole or are they just going to live their lives and then are going to follow the big we're still on the line and the european emission and that's totally ukrainians. well, no one really cares very much about that. i mean, they just didn't count for the as part of the us, the nato agenda. well, i'm glad you brought that up. gilbert. i mean, all of the russia now is the most sanction country ever. okay. how does that help ukrainians at all? go ahead and st. petersburg, it doesn't. anyway, it's

a curious thing that western analysts have spoken above the their, their appreciation of russia's military effort until now. they say that is proven, rushes weakens. that's quite extraordinary because the rule of the russian effort has captured a territory about the size of the united kingdom since the start of the, of the special military operation. it's also bears mention that russia is certainly the only country on earth with the perhaps exception of china, which is able to withstand the sanctions from hill with united states and its allies that would have delivered, less often overlooked a. so russia is proving itself to be strong in remarkable waste and in ways that no one in europe could equal. and that very fact as to the hostility, the envy of european countries and their leaders with respect to russia. so it's

been paradoxical. the russia strength sheets to these are these vicious information war efforts by europeans, amber united states to compensate for their real loss of ground in the competition of russian. ralph, let me go to you in munich, m a. i don't, many of us would have expected the germans would play a much more prominent role instead of just being subservient to washington. because germany is, has the most to lose and is losing the most. i would say, i mean, i've never seen a political class of a major country willing to turn off the switches for of their entire economy. because somebody with no with will no real power in brussels, told them to, oh, by the way, you know, i never thought i would have seen a german chancellor who i referred to with sergeant schultz on this program. being openly insulted by the president in the united states and get away with it. i mean, what kind of leadership is germany have what kind of leadership is europe have go

ahead ralph. yeah, you just said right. we are obviously not our own man. and mr. charles is not his own man. when being on the international stage, he obviously took orders from washington and it became quite visible a couple of days ago. and he gave a speech addressing us germans in english. so we wonder whether he lost his vocabulary book for us or but i use rather reporting back to washington because that's the truth. we are not submarines since the 990 is when we thought that we were suffering after the 2nd world war. and after the berlin wall had come down, that we would have our own stay to the nation, would be sovereign and we would get the peace tree to you eventually. but all of the nations that we harmed during the 2nd world war. and you now see that actually

germany is doing exactly what washington wants them to do. first, they said we are not going to send any arms into conflict which is against our law and against the people. it's not actually it's against international law to do that . but suddenly we do it a week later, and there must have been some instructions from washington and they received them and around stain at the base. here in germany from all american wars are still being acute in route wealth. leave the behavior of the german government and other governments in the european union make them co belligerence and this conflict. i think that, you know, that should be take, be noted, particularly the because of the regime type in care by the germans of all people should be very aware of that. and then there, it's completely whitewash. we'll talk about white washing a little bit later. george, i want to go back to you again, the g 7, you know, who must not win, but i thought ukraine was winning. how do you explain this to me?

maybe i missed something. go ahead. well, i say the boy that i. 2 the g 7 and the western powers can't really make up their mind. i is russia just this hopeless, mediocre militarily incompetent, demoralized chaotic state that is being absolutely trounced and hammer by the plucky ukrainians. oh, does ukraine need oh, when friends, desperately and you know, we need to send everything that we've got in order to ensure a potent doesn't prevail. they can't really get the narrative. right? and so they go for one to another just in order to persuade the public that somehow by sending in lots and lots of arms into ukraine, they are not actually endangering ok the safety of europeans and american, but charge for judgment because they got charged meant for 8 years,

nato has been training the ukranian army for 8 years. arms have been pouring into, you grain, i mean so more training, more arms. let me throw that to gilbert here. i mean that there's that we've been doing the western powers have been doing this for 8 years, and this is the result they're getting. so why would you say pouring bad money in after reporting? good money after bad money. go ahead in st. petersburg. a effectiveness doesn't exist in vocabulary of the european leaders. they are posture is all postural d, v weapons. richard been sent to him until recently have been, oh, they haven't been effective and they have been delivering the way where they are destroyed on arrival. that does not bother us luster, the, the western presidents and prime ministers,

a very concerned with their relationship with united states, not really with their relationship with ukraine. and they want a demonstration of bid one another. well, i mean about ralph, i mean, what, what does ukraine mean to the german people? i mean, if you could speak for your entire people or just yourself here, but i mean, why is germany willing to sacrifice so much for a country that has no strategic value? whatsoever to germany or the west? well i, as i said before, i believe that this is a do orders of someone else. germany is particularly not interested in ukraine. the hardly know much about it. i mean our culture is so different. you think that polish people are closer to vest ukrainians, but even there is a lot of differences. but here in germany, people are saying, okay, people are suffering. let's take them on the refugees. we want to help. we want to

look good with that and all that. yes. but on the other hand, we don't understand as a german people who ukrainians are and what they are. and not many of us even recall the recent history from a 100 years ago or from 77 years ago. mean last night we had the ambassador of ukraine on the german tv show, again that he's, mr. malik is quite extra tenant in this sense that he's accusing paper. busy and he said to openly the germans, we would owe them for 10000000 soldiers who lost their lives in freeing us from novices. he's turning it completely around. i mean, stefan dera, the outer and nationalists, leader of, of ukraine at that time was a strong ally of mr. hitler. so who fought the guns to here and who freed us?

i mean, i wish that there would be clarity, at least in germany on that matter. because we wanted to be freed from fascism. but mr. state certainly did not. they did the opposite. yeah, george, i mean we were, you and i have talked about at the, at the, the gaggle or podcast, how the narratives have been flipped. ok, where the good guys are, the good guys are now the bad guys. bad guys are now the good guys. go ahead. 15 seconds before we go to the break. and if you listen, do sergeant shows the speech on v e day. he kind of pretty much suggested that somehow germany was one of the good guys in the world war 2 and the russians. well, the bad guys and somehow you know, the price. oh that thought, hold that, that we have to go to hard break them out about hard break, will continue our discussion on the situation and you can say with ah,

a wrong i just don't know. i mean, you have to see how this thing becomes the advocate and engagement. it was the trail when so many find themselves, well, the part we choose to look for common ground ah, with

ah, ah, with welcome back to cross like where all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle. true mind you were discussing the situation in ukraine. ah.

okay, go back to gilbert in st. petersburg. and the 1st part of the program we were talking about who's giving orders to whom here you have a dissenting opinion. go right ahead. i cannot say definitely who is getting directions to mister shows, but i would like to do is a very important situation that in the greece is in government and he was dependent on agreement. so the range because of our agreements, are not just any agreements were bounded by ruby to read and they had a program which included our foreign policy positions were always very anti rushing the last 20 years. and the german dreams have been the most

bull in attacking russia in trying to sanction russia. therefore, it should come as no surprise that when it rains the game, full members coalition and at the last elections or they have come in with a strongly russian position. they needed not states. the question is, who are stronger than the government? i think we are sending it officials very we personality and it is is colleagues in the cabinet from the green, ignorant experience and long story themselves to be suited turner. yep. and they are totally well i actually ralph, i, i, i very much agree with gilbert, the position of the green party. however, i would add another layer to that is that washington is never like social democrats

. okay at all. okay. they've always been very suspicious. they're getting it, they're going to make a deal with, you know, it goes all back. they keep the russians out, the germans bad and the american then, and the social democrats always challenge it one way or another. go ahead, ralph. yeah, actually i do agree with both of you. i mean, the green party that i knew was pedro car. and cathy, 40 years ago, i interviewed her as a young journalists and she was demonstrating and ramstein as well as it moved against the deployment of pershing. yep. rockets and so on and cruise missiles and so on. so that is a long way. the greens have come when the 999 because of what war broke out and the 1st german military direct military participation after 945. this was done by florida and fish fish or the green

foreign minister at that time. who make that shift and who actually he vowed that he would never have out with happened again saying there were concentration camps run by subs in the territory of the. busy federal republic of yugoslavia and kosovo, and which was not true. it's a bit like the situation we have now. we start where they say the war crimes committed. well, the well route you're going exactly way want to go. i want to talk about the information where let me go to george here. that's one thing that we keep hearing charge over the russians have lost the information war. well, i mean, if you're in the west, it's all dissent any, any contrary in view of the situation that's an ukraine is shut down. i mean, then what's the point of having an information more of one side can speak, and that's essentially what is happened. go ahead, george. it's worse than that. it's not just that they closed down t and,

and when the band, any access to russia, media in the western governments are also engaged in using the vast smearing operations. there are any number of organizations and things thanks from the by western governments and the e u who so the purpose is to go on writing reports about who to box on the net or currently this information agent or the russian tools of this information. that's what they do. they live actually funded by the european government, the government, and they probably report completely worthless, but they serve to great this the atmosphere that is the soonest, the russian boss all over the place, putting out all kinds of this information, trying to all the western. so yeah, i mean,

then that is what happens then. people don't want to listen to that and they just exclusively to the absolute nonsense goal by western governance of case in point. yes. so they, they speak on may the 9 delivered by british defense minister ben wallace, in which he not only with like russia to not be germany. he actually went to the mean and disparage the performance of the red army. and we'll go to, but him, you know, the soviet performance, the pretty much melissa, read the truck back and then styling spending millions of people to perish before the german times. the way the russians like that. they just sent millions of people because they didn't care about, you know, they just, it's just a matter of humanity. that's what you get. effect winning information war. okay. it

just, it use yeah, big light, but it, it shows their weakness. that's why they, they believe in censorship because they don't want to counter argument, you know, gilbert, one of the things that very frustrating for me as our on december 17th, when the, the russian center ultimatums. because that's what they were one to the on nato and went to the united states. now, you know, you can go, at least you could go to the, the kremlin website, you could go to task dot com, and you would get all of these documents. i had guessed after guess before 2 of february 24th. but you are not messaging. we don't know what that what's in boot didn't head on. why did you just go and read to press come brings. why don't you read the press release? it was all out that was all out there on display. george and i have talked about this countless number of times. you're surprised they did. they telegraphed. they were going to do from the very beginning. nobody listened in with this information warren and shut down a for of dissenting views. we said it's only going to get worse. go ahead gilbert.

well, i think we have to put the information more information or substitutes for a real or it is a virtual world. and that is the ball in which was most of the united states exists. united states for last 30 years is capable of real ground war. and so this is taking place. i wouldn't get too excited. but russia, ruling information were considering where we had been since much against the notion that russia would be given a fair hearing of any con, is excluded. however, in the real world, what will count at the end of the day on the ground, and what russia does not do to achieve its objectives, which one might say, are pretty clear. it is to take and keep control and to do crane and to

keep the frame from the black sea and to limit the grid that it is not a good read to russia at any time in the future. so in that real world, so what's on the ground? we'll see how it works and they're being given every chance to succeed because we are just 6 or western supplies to ukraine. alright. anyway, very effective. finally, you know, ralph of the western media coverage of this is just simply appalling and it's obviously intentional. my position is always been, it's rushes time table and russia will determine the outcome when it's ready when it wants to do that. but, you know, one of the things that is never really talked about is that, why did we get into this situation, the 1st place, because of insecurity in europe, that the, the very poor security infrastructure that allowed to happen,

and russia will, will make, will not offer negotiations, it will say these are our conditions and these are well will be met. it will be another ultimatum. and i think europe is not prepared or even willing to think about that. go ahead, ralph. yeah, you're absolutely right here as well. now, what i have to note is that there's a rewriting of history at the moment. i mean, we see, and all our papers here in germany, especially those who are close to the green party, like tuts, the target side to they, they kind of scripting what mrs. bareback is saying and even what mr. charles is going to say putting in this context, read it. they started and had already planned to begin the war valid before hitler rose to power. you know, this was yesterday on the headline. so they're having put in idle with started.

busy with hitler, sometimes they're not care about of mr. phones likes to lincoln to hitler and george, you and i, we've cross this bridge before. okay. i mean, i remember the new york review, but it was like and what was it like 19919293. something like that. ok. you know, the new revisionists, the, this is happening again except for what the differences and some of those were crazy academics. now politicians are in, in, in, on it to go ahead george. it is no question of that. and that within the next 1020 years, the willfully a historical anti historical germans will convince themselves that they were actually victims. i've been well to that. they were actually the victims of aggression by silent when jackson you went on the german t, v. i'm pretty much told them that this is what the soviet committed these terrible atrocities against you. when they invaded berlin,

he knew his audience, and i again yesterday a may, the 9th ben wallace and his speech. he started talking about the whole rig arrays and mothers that were committed by the red army when he was liberating europe from fascism. so that this and now you know, we would look back on local to who were the good guys with a bad guy. and yeah, george, what do you bet? a batch a couple of beers on this one before it's all said and done. it was the, the russians that trick the japanese into attacking pearl harbor, bad stuff, history. you know, it sounds comical right now, but we're, we're going down that path that we're a very, a historical one when you're, when you're a historical, you're looking for catastrophe. gentlemen. that's all the time we have many thanks to my guess in budapest, moon munich, and st. petersburg, and thanks to our viewers for watching us here, are you see you next time?

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you today i'm authorized and additional strong sanction foreign companies, quitting russia. a licensed atm card, so blanton bangs disconnected from the international payment system, functional, happy jermel, donna and euro exchange rates follow up on a couple more stuff. so i would know what the committee met, the bulk of the bill from that is the current. can you say i don't know? sure. c, m a j a. suppose you russian business overcome this song. so you know, i bought enough to huddle. she is tremendously just me don't impress voice bullshit . nash a productive not to steal a miracle. what i see that when you come, when you with the players, what, what do you got on your move in your mind? a key to cost to get the group when you, when you're speaking with dr. numbness listening,

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