i know that for you, the conflict in ukraine is not just about ukraine or it's territory. you wrote recently that it's a battlefield where the west, russia and other big players are fighting over diversions of and you world order. i wonder if this transition to a new world order is inevitable, or do you think it can actually be averted if one of the sides specifically the west, prevails in my, you being, you know, ah, the transition to would you polarity is inevitable. and the event will defeat russia would only slow down the line off the western dominion over war. the reasons are several of them have to do with the west, not only speaking about to the loss. so they show credibility, the loss of economic interests over dork. i'm or eyes of china,

for instance. i'm speaking about the west. and if you go to the concert, talk and speaking about the demographic crisis, the birth of the economy, crisis within the west. for the more and more level to increase the level of 4 of the call is age children's fragmentation western side. so there is an example reason and all these reasons have to do with the west, which in my opinion, and not only in my opinion, but also the opinion of several political scientists, will inevitably lead to the decline of west or medium over to ward. i think some of the west, especially in the liberal camp, they're also hoping for addition to your brand new will that it is sort of

a transition back to the future. for example, francis will be, i'm a prominent american political scientist who was a frequent guess and, you know, very influential figure in here over the last couple of years, he wrote recently that a russian defeat will make possible a new birth of freedom and that it will allow to renew this period of 1989. putting aside her ability. why do you think that period of 1989, the falling berlin wall, the collapsing soviet union? this emerging american unit to larry? why do you think it was so shortly? the spirit of 89 was so short believe because as you said, it was led by the collapse of the soviet union. so it wasn't truly generally. it was a dollar drive and let's say, so i'm not saying that it was the money factor because it wasn't

ok. but it was a man led by the rise of the polar moment. and as soon as the war experience it on fairness, i'm the baby daddy, this of the unit for a moment in particular to whatever the bomb being a grant do ward started turning the little overnight. so it wasn't about russia because russia at that time was a week, was a plenty of time, no problem. it wasn't about china, which was focused on our internal growth. it was for other reasons. so i can't, i can't agree with the spirit of 89 because i fully as

a said that the spirit was mainly alert, drive them on the very short regardless of the outcome of this battle for a new world, the united states will remain a very influential country, whatever they do, they will still be, and major players supreme. claire, why do you think they are going to such great lengths and frankly, such risks. now, in openly confronting russia, when they, you know, to get something that they already have an abandoned, why, what it, what is it exactly the day after? the thing is, the european and american joe politics has a lot to do with russia. so they read the states, it's already the 1st measure power of the war. but in order to keep it being a global empire, the u. s. is a, let's say,

like works there, some kind of divide and rule over asia because as of cl, florida mccain, there's said, and you know, mac and there is the funding father of your politics. rules are rules over door. so for the us is not in there of mentally confronting russia. is matter of keeps being the measure power over asia, because the medium over erasure gives the united states the lead over. do you also mentioned in the one of your recent articles that by an administration in the, in this, in their policy, via crane and their sounds on the ukrainian conflict is trying to kill 2 birds with one stone undermine russia, as you said. but also we can, the berlin paris acts is that is to reduce the influence of those political forces

in europe, who are in favor of europe's larger autonomy, strategic autonomy from the united states. how advanced is washington at this point in accomplishing these 2 goals? i think the by them, administration, achieve the goal because the, the european power steel, strategical, donnie as has been put to sleep. nobody is talking about the distinction the damp with the rush. they are only speaking about this is for the best and the end of the coupling, which was very, very important. i was on the economy, the link between the european market and russian market has been gone for the

energy, the coupling. it will be a matter of months of years. but it will take place. and as you know, the stream too, is that, and then we have not to which some years ago was the fine the brain that by mach wrong, but now is more alive than ever before. and it seems like it is even going to be a large with the entry of sweden and finland. so from my point of view by them administration has already achieved the goal. it's sure that americans are moving very fast in, in terms of that strategic objectives that i think it's only starting to join on the european how much they will have to pay for that in, you know, literal terms. you know, every single european citizen and you know, ad supermarket or at a gas station, but also in strategic and tactical terms. as the cost of these policies

become more clear to the european people. do you think, you know, those results the americans have achieved for now? do you think they could be sustain? let's start from these. nothing left forever. so when a speaker about the by the administration and shipping the goal and speaking about the short or the best of the mean that, that and for the show or to meet them, there can be no peace, no growth between noon on. and the rush is more than a bulk of the cost of the long term sustainability. and this is very interesting. actually, the mighty states hoped for, for lead bounce, big 3 and the red cent the financial actions because of mach wrong, is a seen as an obstacle between the american agenda for europe and the european

agenda for europe. because mac wrong is the mastermind of this for digital tongue. micron is the one ones right now, the only one for francis and all of them is the only one wants a dialogue with russia. so you know, micron will be the measure obstacle in the years to come, even because micron closely tied to germany. and also germany are in the shoals and the angle america, they hoped for a micron selection. because micro selection will give life to the but he's battling axes and from the bet, but it's better the max is the bands, the future, fewer and of course, the future of europe, russia relations. can i ask a specifically about the economic sanctions?

because you wrote the reason that these economic sanctions, against most are both unprecedented and planned in advance. but i'm seeing more and more western analysts suggesting that the scale of the sections and specifically the effect on 3rd countries, how painful it is to the rest of the world. and maybe the biggest achilles heel. and that it may actually come back to her in the united states. do you think that there are indeed so well plan, do you think the united states are calculated accurately the rest of the world's ability and willingness to carry the burden of the american decision? i did right, that they were very long, black and unprecedented. but i also did something they were mainly they were acted against the or be a union. and only the 2nd level they were and they are aimed

at weakening rush. why? because the united states is a well aware of one fact, no one can expel russia from the global markets. you simply can't, because russia is not the north korea, russia, russia is the major, do, sir, and explore that of energy goes all over door. and secondly, as i said, the, the main goal, the main thought of that was to, we can do european union. why? because they work, union for the united states is a yes, a military ally, but the is also an economic rival. so the sink show regime was a long planned and carefully studied to weaken the european union. and indeed, the 1st target of the sanctions regime as you know, was the norm to stream to so by then the, the war to bomb up with them. now,

for many years, american political scientists criticized russia for using crude power and extolled the american ability to exercise self or smart power. and when other players back to americans will not because they are forced to but because they genuinely one till finally special for themselves. getting these images that are of fun of the global common good as an author or an advocate of universal. busy rules and values, it will change as a result of this whole ukrainian affair. in my opinion, doesn't matter. we do crane war because they show a crisis of the united states and not to be sold. i mean, not now, not in the years to come because they might the states administration on may the

too many mistakes in the recent years. the 1st for firstly am i make sure that the water, you know, the world are an incredible impact not only in the rest of the world, but also on the west. for instance, i can't really in but on the pinion was very huge. there was a growth, an incredible growth of american. he's in the wake of the water because of the death of us that i'm saying because of the death of more, my gosh, which was one of the very best allies you know, and he was wildly killed. ok, so i think the image of the many states is undermined. they and their mind themselves was undermined by themselves.

and the outcome of this war, of the peace of the 3rd world warring pieces will not impact significantly on the image of the united states. on the contrary, if we look forward to all our eyes, the war in blocks. ok, well mr. pierre born, we have to take a very short break right now, but we will be back in just a few moments taken. mm. mm hm. lou needs to come to the russian state will never. i've stayed on the north side scheme

with within the 55 with speedy when else with we will ban in the europe when you, when you the kremlin. yup. machine estate on russia for date and c r t spoke neck. even our video agency, roughly all bands on youtube and pinterest, and with the only one main thing is important for naziism, internationally speaking to that is that nations that's allowed to do anything,

all the mazda races, the reason us had germany is so dangerous. is it the law, the sovereignty of all the country wars business and business is good, and that is the reality of what we're facing, which is fashion. mm hm . mm hm. back and forth with emanuel pierre, born and italian author and political consulting, mr. pupil and before the break we talked about this transition to you and your world order and rushes gibbons. this with the current system of american dominance are well known. i think that almost analogical in nature, but you suggested that much of the global sounds also has a stake in this transition,

whatever the potential benefits in just throwing out washington for the rest of the globe, excluding ration made benefits. let's only think about working a many of washington. so most trusted allies, historical ice like india. so your area and brazil and brazil is that it will light. it's the show because it didn't america just as they have the side to side with russia. they knew towns who are to buy those call to arms against russia. why did so? because the warranty is also elite for them for they have a global aspiration. so they are citing with russia because we are here before the west against the rest and the west.

although all this time, since the end of the cold war ignored the interest of the rest of the ward. this is why by them was surprised by their refusal, the refusal of their refusals coming from countries like saudi arabia and brazil. but many political analysts like me when and surprise the rest of the war is the watch in these war. and these are citing with russia because the event while defeat the western not on military terms, but on diplomatic terms. and also on economic terms. because if you, if you, if you don't join the sanctions regime against russia, you are citing with russia implicitly. so the rest of the war deciding with russia hopefully to capitalize them when people are,

can see you also suggested that your brain is both a battlefield and negotiating table for the already ongoing 3rd world war in peace is that's a very interesting phrase. what exactly do you mean, and how's it different from the previous world wars when they speak about the war, the war in these, i'm using the concept which was popularized by of frances in the wake of the war. and it is what political scientist used to call great power competition, wanted to press or name the cold war 2. and it is different now compared to the previous war war, because it is a formal, the great powers are at war. but this war is called. and they

are fighting across the globe by means. sometimes the color shows us even wars. the reason the result of 30 is mom and the new kind of weapons like cyber attacks and the cognitive wars. so it's much more different than in the past. i think you also mentioned that there is a, in one of the articles that there is a shift towards the periphery. is that the meaning of the hostility is started to paraphrase. and that got me and thinking about tolkien books in which protagonists 1st fight for their own land. and then they come together to fly for the so called middle earth. and to some extent ukraine has a son of gannon cherokee, syria. they're all sort of middle lands, they are positioned arrive between, you know, other big players and potentially they have a lot to gain, but also

a lot to lose. i think the case of again is done is it's a very good one. it's a very rich country in terms of mineral resources, it's allocated geographically in a very advantageous position, but for decades it's been ravaged by conflict. what do you think is this my strategy in this day and age for such middle earth powers? how should they get, conduct that policy to maximize the benefit and minimize the chances for conflict? well, the best strategy could be the following dialogue with everyone alignment with no one. but we are in the mid bill of the 3rd, the war war in peace. so no, great, we're not, the russia will accept from the as far worse,

a full non alignment. if i were to keep a, we're a because that's them. i would suggest a you want the missing my counseling. okay, you are welcome. you want to use that money to put it. you're going to ask me, your money is not welcome, but it will be very, are on the do train war as being the work or should moment of our era. for it, we'd war some the position or follow golf just surgically position and countries like us. you said because i found tour down some but to not only them and it would be very hard, much hard. they're done today to be non aligned to be no trouble. now we mentioned a frances a couple of times and he's an interesting figure he's been involved in the ukrainian conflict diplomatically since it's very beginning of the site. some of

that involvement was quite controversial. for example, a couple weeks ago he post with the ad nationalist, ukrainian nationalist. so i would have been saying, you know, not a banner, but a few days ago he made some very bold. and i would say politically incorrect statements about this war. saying that it was caused by, quote, need to barking at rushes door, which he said to cause the kremlin to quote, react badly and unleash the conflict. but what's the significance of this statement like this coming from one of the worlds and one of the west, most prominent spiritual leaders, i cannot think about any other leader of the so called western world to say something along those lines. well, i wasn't surprised at all when they read the book statements because the book now let's say it would be fun for both francis

just like his predecessor, he's a fan of the multiple transition and they gave it to way for a normalization or the holy see russia relations, why need so? because they are no lead to the fact that the west cannot be re christianized again. the west is lost to the west and throughout the post christian era. and the holy sea is both a political and the spirit, while power. i think it is the only be really spiritual power of the war. and so the vatican thinks about politics, economics, but also about spirituality and francis, just like his predecessor. so in russia, the so called to cut to come

a gas. the civilizational decline in favor of studies asian. ready traditions, this is why the holy scene has tried in the recent years to approach to russia and the has the spouse itself from the west. for instance, the holy c back the russia operation in syria. the only c tried to normalize relations with the policy and the play, the role doing the obama era, the signing of the nuclear deal. and this is why the holy see right now is trying to escalate the cry between the west and the russia. and by means of those are very strong declaration because they are very strong or francis center site, you know, to go to europe,

the united states and russia, the holy see wants peace. and i would like to be part of the peace agreement. and you said that you weren't so surprised by po francis statement, but as i was reading american accounts of it and then houses of it, i think there was a lot of this, me, a lot of anger, some questioning of the pope's cognitive ability. and he's with them. do you think washington will now introduce sanctions against the whole the see because clearly what the pope is saying goes very vividly against what the biden administration and the rest of the west is trying to push as the as the truth. well, sanctions are the best, the tool of the mighty states foreign policy. so they could try to sanction the book. i think the united states some are magically

will for their why the distance with a policy that will not do it openly, but they will the, with, for the pro, this protestant is ation agenda in the rest of the war. because against the background of the war, warning he's against the background of the west, russia confrontation of the seen american confrontation. there is another war taking place across the globe. and the is a the war inside the christianity. there is capitalism against the broadcast on sharks. the growth, the global growth of the sun sharks is mainly driven by the united states. so the united states might well or apply to the pulps a strong position if they were in russia by for their funding.

accelerating sometimes a shop several countries. when mister pitt, they're gone, this is a very interesting conversation. unfortunately, we are out of time. but the only thing i would say is that regardless of which confessional christian confessions they belong to, or even which religion would belong to. because many abrahamic religions have a very similar themes, as the bible says lasted the peacemakers, because they will be called children of god. let's hold both francis or whoever wants to make a contribution to resolving this conflict will succeed. but the time being thank you very much. for sharing your thoughts with fully agree with you and thank you very much again for the invitation and thank you for watching hope to see you again on world apart a a

a . so what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy, even from taishan, let it be in arms. race is on often very dramatic development. only personally and getting to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very critical time time to sit down and talk

with her. so says it will be for basic military on the border with finland if the country becomes a member of nato that start to hell. thank you. now as a formal decision to join the alliance with me. and i'll see you corresponded reports exclusively from the territory of the besieged as off stalls. steel plants buy battles between russian and dumb bus. the joint forces local international battalion, the still raging of the 10 are killed in a racially motivated shooting. in buffalo, social media uses points out the shooter war, the same at neo nazi symbol used by the ukraine as of the callian. although with few links.