a, a a ah ah hello and welcome to cross talk. we're all things considered. i'm peter level. the

western narrative. ukraine is winning and will win is crumbling. even the new york times it meets as much. the training military is collapsing, none the less, washington and its allies continue to pour in money and arms. it's crunch time for kids. ah . to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess, george samuel in budapest. he's a podcast or at the gaggle which can be found on youtube and locals, and here in moscow we have to meet with bob inch. he is a political analyst and editor and interest me internet media project. hi, johnny crossed up rules and effect. that means you can jump anytime you want, and i would appreciate i. let's start out with george and in budapest, i'm sure you came across the editorial piece and the new york times. and we've seen our cracks in this narrative. that is all pervasive as matter fact enforced by so social media that is much as they want to support the ukrainians. the facts on the

ground are working against them and policy has to adapt to it. and it's basically kind of a shot over the bow of the, by the administration. i am asking them, are you in touch with reality essentially, what did you take away from george? well, i think it's a clear indication of the divisions within the u. s. lead, i'm obviously the, some of the people in the pentagon and in the intelligence well, are giving realistic briefing. they say, look, this war is lost. there is no way you can win this war. of course, are we going opposition to all the people in the state department, all of the lincolns in another state, their reputation on this notion that ukraine can win this war. and this is also meeting with great possibility in the u. k. where our friends for secretary list

trust again came out with the article the other day saying we must win in ukraine unreservedly. you know, we was put in and put in your grade so that there was deep divisions. and even that editorial that you refer to either a response among readers, you know, we went told any of this. so i think there are deep divisions and it's not yet immediately clear how these divisions are going to play themselves out. well, the end of the divisions, even more glaring because we have had a few cycles, france, germany in italy openly saying negotiations and start there has to be a diplomatic solution, which of course is at odds with the anglo saxon. busy that is just really go, a little stress here was mentioned that i think i said before, george, you know,

every time she opens her mouth as positive for stupid because that's essentially what her editorials are. so, i mean, we keep hearing, you know, i didn't broad everyone's, you know, it's, the goal is obvious here, but the longer this goes on in the economic situation than europe now grows or grave. i'm talking about energy and now the entire issue of global boom security is on the agenda and they're very big way. so be doubling down, but who's doubling down and is this essentially an escalation of what they want? go ahead. well, natalie or the will agree what, what does it mean you will be in the matter tomorrow

we're going to use your mom. i want. ready to be that you were in the role these people i maybe you'd be maybe just so the or is not going where you whatever the right people. i mean, you know, i was all your, you know, just people who, why read there would be in your brain, you shop easy or you

go to the years with all the law in general, we all need to be made. so the way you want to go see things change or see in your re it's not only did one and the little, it's all gone. they are here and there is a great environment. they said, why aren't you,

we all ok, well if you're george, it's a sad to a demon. had to say here, let's say the truth, let's say the obvious here, it's a military dictatorship right now. so, you know, the mentor of, you know, we're supporting ukrainian democracy. well, political parties have been banned. there's only one television station. it reflects the, the government line here. and you have these lindsey graham types and lose trust type saying they're fighting for mom is either right actually defending a military dictatorship, but it does not allow descent and it's never filtered to western public because i truly believe that they were told the true condition they would say no, no, we didn't, we shouldn't sign up for something like this. go ahead. george is even worse than a military dictatorship because at least if it were a military dictatorship, it would have complete power over the country, and then it would make the difficult decisions that it needs to make. so

a reversal policy and just simply saying ok we've, we've tried to leave the war root, we fail, we're not going to assume peace. if you're a dictator, you can actually pull it off even though the public is sunday. i thought we were winning. now you tell us that we're losing, it's a little like him here. germany 980 could pull that off. but so essentially ukraine is a military dictatorship. that is not a monster of its own house. the saying ukraine is being wrong elsewhere, and it's the hours that i go governing your brain from elsewhere that are pushing it to continue this fine. they continue, you know, whether it's list raso, lloyd austin, and they say, well, we have to defeat russia, how much you want, what's, what's, what's, what do you want? 20000000. 3xb4xbcw. government trillion. what do you want? we're ready to give you anything you want congress happy to sign off on any amount

that you like. so of course your grade is just going to keep saying, yeah, give us more more. i mean, it's a huge money laundering operation. so they're all, they're doing very well, and the ukranian people are just suffering or zone. so it's, it's military dictatorship with none of the benefits that come with a military dictatorship. well, glad you brought a big money. because i mean, now we're just going to, you're buying scam on steroids. i mean, there's a lot of money for a lot of people here. and of course, the way the, the us government, the congress and the president taylor. this is basically no spring can do what you want with your i mean this is you really incredible. as you pointed out earlier, i mean there's every reason, but this will lead in their lives in the west to keep this going on as long as possible because you got a lot of money to spend it be all

right. and the for the you know, the same for us who, you know, the day we're going to be and we're in the same you know, it's not all the boys will want to on grade are everywhere you can do. so he did when he was he was the derivative

government. i showed you, you're a, a, a, a, a, this is all part of the rules based order. ok, that's one of the, you know, the one of the amendments do it here. george, it brings up a fascinating point, is that not only is ukraine being used as a cultural against russia, but the us and britain are using ukraine is a culture against the rest of europe. ok, little little, luckily ukraine is, you know, calling the shots and telling me you have to do this and you have the cop up for us

here. i mean, it's really quite an amazing show and that's exactly what it is. it's a propaganda show. go ahead. it's probably going to show when it's all about reorganizing the europe. so he breaks it, britain, withdraw from the u. the u back been managed to get rid of britain because now britain gets to organize the, you know, in accordance with american wishes. so it gets rid of any kind of a, whatever want to go to the european dimension. so really all i show is somebody is the sort of the best in the nation crash, whether it's in london or in washington, they just don't think that he's fully on board with, with the sanctions regime and, and everything else with arms delivers everything else with nature so i want to get rid of him, and i want to get rid of anyone at all in europe that we have a country voice. it's really all about the consolidation. if you are the us nato

umbrella, with britain, a loyal lieutenant george e. thank you, craning officials like that would be speaking the germans without the blessing of washington. no, i really don't. i don't believe that ukraine would dare talk like that. about germany. i mean, the leading power in europe to talk with such open contempt for germany's leaders and the, germany's leaders meekly. exactly. so i think clearly, you know, they'd be, they'd be encouraged from elsewhere. yes. so they, the mentor, keep the russians out, the germans down the americans in works in 2022, doesn't i gotta jump in here. we're going to go to which our break really say, ah, ah, ah,

ah, who is the aggressor today? i'm authorizing the additional strong sanctions today. russia is the country with the most sanctions imposed against it. a number that's constantly growing. i figure which of list, of course, if you click on the new scene in which the mind the we're, we're banding all imports of russian oil and gas,

new g. i a suffering of high a with joe by imposing the sanctions on russia has destroyed the american economy. so there's your boomerang. ah, ah, welcome back to cross top where all things are considered. i'm getting a little bell. this is the home addition to remind you. we're discussing some real news with let's go back to d. m a. here in moscow. we had a really big media story over the last week and it was the mary opal finally fell. the still works finally fell. but can you explain to us how western media and the

ukranian government described on that event? i'm not going to put words into your mouth, but you know, it was called evacuation thoughts to make sure you will get all the more and all of those that are out of the surrender. right. so no question about and then i won't be there. somehow you know, they will be they are in the

right people in the day and so what will be my monitor and the region to me on the be 3 the people who are resisting. so there you go, you know, the legal and they,

the year was full of you know, then you know, will be a l i. e. so i go in, they are rains a, where need all these q i you know, ok, well george, so a was described in they said evacuation, but nobody is allowed to use the word surrender because i would work against the narrative because ukraine is winning. ok. and also upcoming work crimes trials, which is something that i think will a shock the, the, the propaganda narrative of the west because there are soldiers involved. but

they're also a neo nazi elements in the russian side. for months when i understand these people will be a charge for crimes against humanity, war crimes, and it's very well documented. they've been watching these people since 2014. exactly. when demon was talking about george. yes, no question. incidentally. 2 the west, the media versus the new york time still hasn't been accepted, that mario as well. and so they write that according to the russian government, marianna is now under, has been completely fried grove, ukrainian, ukraine government has not confirmed and the times is not able to the russian whenever the ukraine says anything that's always accepted. but when russia has to be independently confirm, i mean, i think that will be what struck i doubt very much those of the western media are going to give much coverage. much like the haven't given much coverage to the lot

of fascinating information. the russians are providing about these bio labs in the ukraine and it's a lot of very detailed information that they have on comment documents and everything. it's getting no, no traction in the west. the media, what's, what is playing in west the media and again, and complete the distortion. and i think this is, this will play of a very big role as, as the economic crisis unfold this summer is here, this summer. russia is to blame for the food shortages, the energy shortages suppresses the in the, the western media or russia is blockading ukraine sports. now to blockade a pole that is a serious walker. if russia were really doing blockading is really important. we would be really hearing about it that would be a 30 big deal would be hearing at the united nations everyday,

every international or possible. so the very fact that it's kind of flipped into news stories, not they know that this is untrue, but you still get the propaganda out. the reason your brain is having problems getting. 1 stuff out through the black season that they mind, they have the black sea and when you mind the blacks, they know insurance companies are not going to handle any shifts because it's just too dangerous so they can't get anything out. so what is happening now is that the europeans, european union is going to lose ukraine. they're just going to get everything out of ukraine. all our agricultural produce, anything that up, you know, we're going to use that to pay for all the arm that we're giving you. so you will have lots of om but almost certainly no food within a few months, you know, the e was just going to lose everything. well, it's one of the, another curiosity, at least, as far as i'm concerned, i'm going back to your original comment is that the you is basically agreeing to pay the salaries of civil servants and government officials in ukraine.

again, no reason to really want this thing to come to an end because those same officials not always paid on time or not. but now that it's going to be guaranteed by the european union as we see. increasing energy prices, empty shells, supply chain, all of this going on, but the ukraine will be all right here. i mean, i can see and we have, we have, we can get the millions of migrants that have left. greg got into europe here. i mean, beginning europe, europe in leadership is really a bit off more that they can probably true because it's only going to get worse when you're preparing for when you do it now as we speak right now. well, when you prepare for the next winter, they're not doing that right now. go ahead and

do it again. now when they will be again tomorrow. well, radiant will and then you re quiet the me. oh, you know, the reason why they got the key factor. we switched on by whoa whoa whoa whoa, by the way. so

you? yes. store. you bottle the real all the way and the way things are getting wrong was basically the idea be be back. everyone knows all the way you might be and then all. well, this is part of the, you know, rules based order. ok,

that's the way where we're actually running out of georgia. i'm curious, how can you come to my mind, the green new dealers? i mean this is really a boom for them. ok. everybody gets cold and everybody's, this is part of the industrialization here. i mean, they love ukraine for this because that's a good reason to cut off all this energy here. and of course, you know, when all that energy speaking turned off for some reason, there's going to be a lot more sunshine for solar. there's going to be a whole lot more when you know, i don't know where, why they think this, but i think they do go hit george a like you're right. it's actually very funny in that he shows up really fast. you miss all the green. you deal, basically there is no alternative to fossil fuels. so once you basically cut yourself in fossil fuel, there's not, there's no way there's no energy. i mean, it's basically when you, german industrialism will come to our show, say we got nothing 0, you know, you've got us all from, you know, russian,

oil and gas. we're going to be back to where we were in 1940. 1 so all the dog, you know, when a sunshine, when i was, it's nothing 0. i mean there was only reliance on fossil fuels. so a lot of that, i think a big market with 44 who would have thought in 2022. the germans were implemented on there. and so, i mean, it was a yes, really very well be happy, you know, great the nationalization, but now this is supposed to be the economic powerhouse of europe. so as you are doing well and you know you've been speaking of the green party here, i mean, this is one of the most twisted of narratives i've ever seen from the president. i

mean, there were the greens in germany. what are some of the most pro nato atlanta says the ball, but they're also new dealers. so, i mean, this is really, really twisted because for them to be pro nato, they have to have a lot of energy to fuel their tanks and all these other things. i mean, it's really wasted. it's almost, it's a brand last 3. yeah. all right, well they, we have a, i, a, i, and all the time we have here when i think, my guess in budapest and here in mouse, going to think our viewers were watching a c, a r d c. next time, remember ah ah,

ah, i think it is very difficult for us to understand that the conflicts generation also comes back on the generator. some of them in, if you unleash some kind of project into a country of interventionists as it negatively had this, this can me effect the security of that country. mm hm. only one main thing is important for knox ism, internationally speaking to that is that nation's allowed to do anything. all the mazda races, the reason us, hey jim, it is so dangerous, is the law, the sovereignty of the country, or is business and business is good and that is the reality of what we're facing,

which is fashion a russian state. oh, never this one ending no santini destination. i'm not getting calls, i'll send them up for a week within 55 when. okay, so mine is 2000 speedy when else with will ban in the european union. the kremlin. ca, yep. machine. the state on russia for date and split our t spoke neck. even our video agency, roughly all band to on youtube with requests with

told me is the aggressor tune chose is war today. i'm authorized with additional strong sanctions, but they go to chose latino in the scholarship as we speak on the louisiana. mostly mind the branding all in ports of russian oil and gas turbine and imposing these sanctions. i brush you as destroyed the american. in fact, mister barish boomerang, i way of suffering the i t interest really hitting people in the pocketbook, boise, i was only there. i see you using a router visitor unless you this is gonna impose severe cost on the russian economy of immediately and over.