an interrogation gone wild, meaning torture, cruel in human and degrading t treatment. the use of extreme isolation was one of a range of techniques that were employed by officials interrogators and so forth. literally starting all the way back in 2002 for many, many days. and that is just unbelievably destructive. i was the 1st to really learn to go down there in the commission process in a 4 to 6 month period. you see a market deterioration in many respects with if you're a year or 2 solitary confinement, you're going to ask the defendant for the 1st time in 2 years to to, to interact with other human beings. beyond his lawyer and his jailers. it's going

to be the jury that's going to decide his life. he's going to be put on the stand. and that's where he's going to speak for the 1st time to the world for 2 years. if to be shut off from the world, it's impossible. mm. cash it's been 9 years in active duty and then i'm still in the reserves in 2011. the department of defense assigned me to assist on the team representing acknowledging mohammad, the, the lead defendant in iowa. case. what i can say is that the u. s. government has acknowledged that for the periods between 20032006, mister mohammed was held at,

has certain undisclosed foreign locations, black size, otherwise known as black. since it was what a boarded over $183.00 times. that's correct. i can say that right. there is a memos between the department of justice. i various organs of the u. s. government to include the department of defense, the central intelligence agency, as to what types of enhanced interrogation techniques would be authorized for certain types of detainees. with when they began confining pantano, they moved to having psychologists do interviews with patients, discover individual flaws, individual sources of trauma in security. and then they, they also discovered because they were many with arabs and muslims. a muslim

males are uniquely upset by nudity and also by female fiscal contact. and then share of dogs. race has always played a role in american tortures. the american torture techniques are part of old military punishments, punishments that were used on slaves and, and in you might find that strange, but there was one area where slaves were never whipped, but you use clean techniques on them. they didn't leave marks. and that was, if you're going to sell a slave, because a slave that had wit marks, means that they were not going to obey. and so a clean slave was so got a higher price. a cotton industry in the southern delta states of the united states depended

completely on torture. over the course of 4 decades human beings by using their bodies as a technological form. as a technological machine were able to multiply by 8 times the amount of cotton, an individual person could pick in a single day. so the use of torture is absolutely hide at the root from the very beginning. ah . in these kinds of cases, many people in the system for the people who are imposing these conditions, believe that ordinary punishment is too good for these people. and

a lot of it is about the other dis of them religiously, ethnically, nationally. culturally, it's easier than it would be to someone from your own community to do that. so in guantanamo being. secretary defense rumsfeld appointed a commander jeffrey miller, whose job was to extract information. and jeffrey miller made up a cd or staff did and are in florida rack and are under the oh, with the permission of the commander their general sanchez. e then can training sessions for the interrogators and the stafford upgrade person, or he transmitted the guantanamo techniques to the abil gradstaff.

basically, the restraints were removed and they were told to get results. the thing that became so clear is that what united states was doing was not a secret. it was hidden in plain sight. it wasn't really until the photographs from abu ghraib were released, which were just, you know, the tip of the iceberg of what was actually happening. that people in this country began actually talking about it what we didn't know was exactly the way to do. and if i had to recommend all over, yeah, i would recommend exactly the right. same course of actions that we did exactly right.

ferris in the mall. not all of them i can differently whether one is 1600 of them. we've only seen up in about 20 maybe 30 is 1600 and they, they are the worst ones are. are the ones we haven't seen? ah, who

so and yes they were violating. i know it's our regulations and what they were doing, but they were operating within a system in which they were condition they were structured in order to violate those loss when you arrived at the wave where you aware of what had happened there. oh, almost immediately after we arrived i will drive, we were briefed that there was misconduct, but we weren't given details. and the interrogators that i knew who had been there during that time didn't. they didn't talk about it. so we, we didn't know, i learned everything through the news. we understood the geneva conventions to mean that absolutely. you know, you, you, you couldn't, you couldn't harm anybody in your care that your primary responsibility was their

well being rather than putting them in distress. but then we were confused, and then of course we got these memos from the justice department and from the pentagon, authorizing the use of much more harsh techniques. we started adopting those techniques when i was station and mosul. among them were stress, possession, sleep, deprivation of inducing hypothermia just a any, any way we can put them in distress using dogs. this is, this is a slope. so called slippery slope so that they take the gloves off policy allowed american interrogators from going from a certain list of techniques that were let's say aloud and even those were already torture to doing extreme things, rape and sodomy in, you know,

that the most extreme forms of physical and psychological brutality trained machine has begun to crack. the reality of the battlefield is at odds with the tightly guarded messaging bed western public's view. courageous voices may be obvious. the rain should negotiate. now, while it still has something to negotiate with ah mm

mm mm ah ah .

you can just torture somebody on a whim without knowing how to do it. and the reality of course, is that torture like any physical skill right? requires training, requires practice. it requires an institutional setting, a built environment, really, you need to have this institutionalized bass, physical space in which you can perform torture. we want, you know, we, we want to be successful. i was against the war, i'm a liberal, i didn't vote for george bush. but i wanted to do my job well, you know, i felt like, you know, if i can be successful and get intelligence from these people,

then we could and the or quickly, and i would be better for, for iraq, better for, for us my, the people who are for the reason days has been a focus, a few who have betrayed our values in solving the reputation of our country and with 6 or 7 investigations underway and a military justice system that has values. we know that those in law whoever they are will be brought to justice in. i was angry at our leadership because i knew that they were prosecuting interrogators and guards and leadership wasn't being held accountable. i i, i was disappointed in myself and our behavior were there was terrible.

so i was, i was, i was very angry when they have a great trial happened. i i, i got a call from the lawyer for chip frederick, and he asked me to act as part of the defense team. i said, well, the person that you should really talk to is, is, embargo. he ran this experiment in the 19 seventies and the situations of abu ghraib, as far as i can tell, are those conditions that are also reproduced in them. barto experiments, chip, frederick, he's the man here. oh, he was the one who had the idea of putting electrodes on the hood. his lawyer said, the problem now is the military want to use him in a show trial in baghdad. in abu ghraib, not only not a single senior office that went to trial. not a single seni office. they got

a recall letter of reprimand. in fact, in some cases they even got promoted the, the offices. so it's, it's the people at the top always take care of the people at the top. mm. for those individuals who were directed by the us government to, to engage in any technique that i believe would price level torture are cruel and human or degrading treatment. i think they lose a little bit of themselves every time they have to come in and human act. and i power is out to them as well, frankly in i don't think i noticed that until i got back. and then, you know, i tremendous guilt and i think a lot of us develop signs that were later diagnosed as p p. s. d,

but i don't know. i think that they have another name for now, and i think it was, it's called like moral moral failure. so to assistance is feeling that people come back with after being in war if they feel like they, they've, they've done things better outside of their moral compass. ah, we're still evaluating how we're gonna approach the whole issue of interrogations, detentions, and so forth. and i don't believe that anybody has above along. on the other hand, i also have a belief that we need to look forward as lowe's, as possible looking backwards. ah,

will look forward backward. well, forward is going to be like backward. if you don't do something about what happened in the past, nobody has been held accountable for the torture that happened in the past. and for this, among other people, i fault. president obama, essentially he gave everybody, dick cheney donald rumsfeld. he gave them all a free pass george w bush. they're all going to be rehabilitated. they're all going to be treated as great statesman. one day. i mean, they gave president obama a nobel prize for not being george w bush. the question, of course, the world that dancing around with or avoiding as does it work as torture work doesn't work. people that have information that are part of an underground apparatus, a terrorist organization, revolutionary organization, accomplished organization, whatever organized form of collective alan chip,

i, b, they won't break now. and the people that you pick up that are innocence. yes. you tell them to pieces, you'll destroy them, you'll ruin them. i think that a few of the people that passed passed through my hands as an interrogator did have intelligence. but mo, the vast majority of the people that i dealt with work just being picked up because they were males of military age and they were just get swept up and, and his res, i don't think torture is always being used as a method to gain information or, or confessions, it's often just been used are out of it out of anger and fear ah

right after september 11th attack, september 11th, 2001. a very well known hover law professor islander schwartz came up with the ticking bomb theory. and he said, so what happens, for example, if a tourist, as a ticking time bomb a small nuclear bomb in time square and the bombs ticking. and we only have so much time, we must torture. and then, you know, the show 24 of course started every segment with that giant clock ticking away. and it kind of gave visual reality visual imprint that resonated with this discussion of ticking time bomb in addition to the way that it framed our reception of torture. on a popular level,

just among the civilians in guantanamo itself, they were getting pressure from the department of defense and they have these meetings. and in the meetings they screened the 2nd season of $24.00 and use that as a jumping off place to decide what tortures what methods they were going to propose to donald rumsfeld that they would use against the people they were holding in. guantanamo, i think, was very influential on the people that i worked with. i. i know that some of the techniques that people wanted to use they had, should they had seen on television programs. for instance, i mentioned to you our leaders wanted us to mock and mock executions and also using electricity. and these were things that they had seen on television. no, no one trained us on that. that wasn't, that was simply from colored here in the united states. we have this picture of

torture as something that is done by the lonely person, the lonely sure of the man who does it more in sorrow than in anger because he is absolutely forced to because so many lives depend on it. is willing to take the moral stain and the moral pain on him. and in order to save all these people, there was always this anxiety in american politics. which is that democracy kinds of makes, makes us weaker and less capable of taking the real things that real men should be able to do. there's a very gendered masculine as sort of notion behind this real men, torture and and democracy makes a sissy's blue in the middle east. we have people shopping the heads off christians. we have things that we have never seen before. i would bring

back water boarding and i'd bring back a hell of a lot worse than water boarding here and your terrors would be a free trial detention fcc 10 south for 2 years. they're going anywhere. would you say that the manhattan m. c. c is, while he done in plain sight, a black sight, an american song? yes, i would say it's a black saying that the sense of the black sites that people are be taken out and tortured, but they're being tortured in the way that their daily lives are being managed or not managed. they're not living in a day or a life. they are a, a neglected product in a warehouse where there's no maintenance, you know, i mean, even as like the most,

the most sol negating place i've ever bid. one of the things that we need to consider now and has become a quite an issue, is how many of these soldiers who use to participate in these kinds of american techniques are now policeman and immigration officers who managed mexicans and hispanics and other sorts of things in integrations, today, there's already beginning to be evidence that these old techniques, including freezing rooms, sleep deprivation, all these things are now being used on, on, on immigrants and children. so this is one of the terrible things about techniques is that they circulate between war and home and whatever you do and war comes home ah. ready ah. ready

different t torture clean. ready then we can feel that the thing that's being done to protect us isn't really so bad. we have become used to the idea that it is a legitimate moral stance that we do anything we need to in order to feel safe to feel secure. i mean a bizarre way, it's as if the government is trying to make a deal with us. you let us do whatever we want over here on the dark side. and in return i promise you will never die. it's like this fake promise of immortality. but of course, what time on the history of the american empire, a certain 50 years from now, historians might have to say, as french historians have said about french algeria, that something was lost in the russian brace of torture. the moral authority that made america world leader sacrificed for this the shamira of effective interrogation. and

ah, [000:00:00;00] ah, ah, who is the aggressor to day? i am authorizing the additional strong sanctions today. russia is the country with the most sanctions imposed against it. a number that's constantly growing up in your fisher list of course. sure. as you speak on the bill in your senior, mostly mine or wish you were banding all imports of russian oil and gas news.

i know they plenty of those with info. let me know we're gonna go with joe biden imposing these sanctions on russia. he'll has destroyed the american economy. you. so there's your boomerang. ah, a doubles are going to put well. talking with the bus. why is it middle pulled up? but he did a gift with

god because i love and we are with a issue. somebody over there also with a lot of video we look, are you up boiled up? i guess we'll look, it is a, is there a way i don't mind ah, need to come to the russian state patrol never. i've stayed as i phone and the most lansky in the div us. mm hm. the american culture,

also a group in the city of babel been okay. so mine is too bad, must be the one on the policy. but with we will van in the european union, the kremlin media machine. the state aren't russia today, and school ortiz spoke mckibbin, our video agency roughly all branded on you too. mm hm. so we put on the question, did you think it would cost with oh, when i was showing wrong, when i'll prove, just don't hold. i mean, you world is yet to say,

proud disdain becomes the advocate and engagement equals betrayal. when so many find themselves worlds apart, we choose to look for common ground. the sanctions package bombs, russian flags vessels from entering you port belgium, gary sweeney, romania stuner. now that there would be close to russian ships here for with this talk of rerouting oil and gas export to asia as myself. but i, with the additional booth on the eastern part of the northern sea route, has never been

a deal with food or she's done it. but of course, there are also, ah many 3 people have been killed in the shelling of residential areas, including several schools in the city of dawn. yes. that's according to local officials who accused the ukrainian military. i'll deliberately targeting civilians with weapons supplied by the way explosion left to aid workers injured in the ukrainian city of military current under russian control was an act of terrorism. say the local administration off the corresponding witness. the incident i am now at the my local hotel in the center of the city where an explosion took