ah, with walking towards the part, an old russian saint has said that once you have a reason finding a pretext, it is only a matter of time, including finding a pretext for a war. the animosity between russia and the united states has been building for a number of years. in fact, one could argue that it never really disappeared, just diminished with the end of the cold war. how far can the current conflict over ukraine take it, and what does it mean for the rest of the world? to discuss it, i'm now joined by what is id, professor of political communications at the university of tech, ron professor. his id is great to talk to you. thank you very much for your time.

thank you for having me. now, in one of your recent articles, you suggested that they said you political rivalry over your grant that the all and now i'm serving in some i even participating in just like the problem of iran. suppose that malicious nuclear intention is essentially an artificial problem if it was deliberately created by the americans to justify our intentional jewel political you cannot make, has suicide towards those countries. does washington even need a pretext to do what it is that is mind them doing? you know, when it comes to russia, i think they do because it's not that easy to question russia when it comes to you know, they can always threatened to take you on the case to. ready un security council with russia having a veto power in the security cancer. that's not going to work out that you'd be accused of trying to make an easier ball with russia. russia has

a lot of nuclear bombs already, so that, that is not going to work with russia is so if you like, the states wants to fight russia and they do want to do that. they just said they need to find that a skews. and i think that is why they don't want the ukraine to finish, because if there is a settlement, then you're going to be able to use ukraine to put pressure on russia. and that is why if you go back a few years ago, the united states did not want the misc agreement to go through because that's what, that's all on the problems. and then ukraine would not have been able to be used as a stage to attack russia. it will cost difficult. but the problem with that rationale

is that the war in the crate is putting pressure not only on russia, but pretty much the rest of the world. because we see that in the form of skyrocketing within the field prices in many, many countries that have nothing to do with russia or ukraine are filling the pinch . now you've been pretty open about your use that you believe that these conflicting your credit is changing their current world order and that is pushing it towards a more multi polar arrangement with different powers are going to compete with each other. do you think that new arrangements, whatever is going to be if you think it's going to be more or less violent than what we have at the moment? you know we are going to transition. we had the bipolar world or this is 2nd world war. you have united states and the soviet union, then after the end of soviet union,

americans thought they're going to have a uni polar role with united, the 6 leaving that being that when this was about people like francis fukuyama talk to but in the history do the debate among the scholars, there's what americans wanted to do was actually achieve. there are some people who believe that americans never could establish really pull out all the people who believed they did it for maybe 15 or 18 years from the fall of the soviet union. and 2007 or 2008. and so there's a debate on that. but what you know now is that the world is moving towards the most high polar system. and during this transition, you're going to see more difficulties. so you'd like to see countries trying to find ways of. busy improving the chances of actually being

a greater power when the new world order is that should be settled down now. but as i, as, as we move away from this western centers system or as the system continues to disintegrate, do you think they will ever be a moment when countries like, let's say iran, russia been his elder and other nations that have, have had the experience of being sanctioned for a prolonged period of time, do you think they they will come to a point of appreciating that experience because it made them more self sufficient? could it saves them some pain as the transition period continued because it's got this transition. i think over the green is going to be painful for many members of the international system. you know, has been on the sanctions since 979 since the lucian is so used

to sanctions. and that experience of being on the sanctions and also continue to live and continue to prosper and has done a lot in terms of building things that you need because of sanctions. a lot of especially high tech devices are not able to be sent to you. don, so scientists in manufacturers manage to build a lot of things internally instead of relying on outside sources. it's going to be more difficult to do that. but once you do that, then you're going to be self sufficient. that is why, for example, the military does not depend on the 10th from outside. they make all the things that they want internally. and that is going to be important,

as you said, using this transition time. sanction the other 2 in us 5 policy to cause difficulties for countries that are not following us dictates. and the more self sufficient you are, the less those factions are going to help you. and the more cooperation you are seeing among sanctioned countries. so for example, we had the huge rush and dedication in just a few days ago. russia relations are going to be much more now, since the common problems are common enemies. and i think the same thing is going to be true with other countries that the us feels they need to pressure pressure. now, you mentioned before that they, if we accept that the direct confrontation between russia and the west or russian, the united states was intentional, was just a matter of finding the right pretext. de think all those ripple a fact that the global economy is witnessing or,

and the american economies also with this thing, do you think that was sort of factor then? because the americans are now facing unprecedented inflation, which is adding to already preexisting social pensions and all of that will be crucial mid term elections. the bite in the ministrations approval ratings are among the lowest things in history. so do you think all of that was also, you know, part of the plan? you know, you may have heard that you need it i for the home and they have called the u. s. government mafia regime. and been you study how the us government works. you. busy realize that people on the interest, the us citizens interest are defective in europe. interest. other people's interest is not really the 1st by the 1st priority for american politicians is to get to the elected. and they get elected by raising millions of dollars and

oil companies. big manufactures others industries that benefit from was quite happy. you look at what they are doing in the u. s. a stock market in the last 3 months. and so that is going to be a priority, whether american people, the suffered or not, is going to be concerned what's going to be the 2nd test consent of people like president biden and other people who are in the white house. and that is why causing the kind of situation and then they realize that not only people in the united states, but people in asia, in africa and other places are going to suffer. but american could care less about the suffering of the people. what they care about that make an official is

basically benefiting the smallest the other gene that they're running and washing. but the purpose is that let me challenge you on this one because we both come from countries with a fairly large reserve war of resilience. you know, we've been exposed to hardship before, but the american population by and large, i used to living pretty comfortable lives. and i have a lot of friends in the united states who are, who have been used to conference and who bought into all this ideological rhetoric about freedoms and how the american government or the american society american way of life is exceptional. but now when they have to pay what they have to pay the gas time, i think they have reception changing very rapidly. and you can easily see that across the pool, that the sort of the social attitudes in the united states are changing. maybe not dramatically. yeah, but a lot of people i actually questioning whether what they've been told by their

stories is, is indeed supported by the reality. do you think it's still business as usual in the united states this time around? or do you think perhaps they may have been change in the collective, not in the literature, but in the way the collective decide to proceed. what leadership is doing. you know, that's a risk that us government took. they wanted to do this very much. if you look at apple ram report and the think back in the united states, they published a report in 2019 years ago talking about this is the title of that report . they say, well, they're reaching and unbalanced in russia. so especially democrats in the united states after 2016 election, the early wanted to cause serious harm russia as a country russians as, as a nation. and that's was a very important go. and the american officials,

you know, they rely on the propaganda machine. that the corporate media in the united states provide so and then by shutting down independent outlets that are not controlled by the media. us media like r t send sitting content that is not in line. that is a foreign policy both. and then i'm sure you and your family prior to that a few years prior to that, because yes, the writer network was also essentially ostracized them taking off international airways because it was broadcasting something that wasn't in line with the american mainstream. but i tell you, it took a couple of years for the u. s. good to go to that process. and they get to russia

and outlets in a few days, but they get to couple of years. it took them just a few days to, to attack the rush and media. so going back to your question, do this list that the american officials took that they taught that maybe the corporate media in the united states would justify all the harm. that's going to be faced by the american people and to be honest with you, i don't know when there's this level of propaganda is going to actually work or not . you have a segment of the american population. that is, yeah, i think what the biden administration is doing is powerful to the united states as a country. and there's a segment that is basically following the propaganda affected them. i guess we will have to wait and see, but for the time being let's take

a very short break. we will be back in just a few moments stating ah, ah, during the 2nd world war in nazi occupied, poland valinda was a farming region. today is part of ukraine between 19431945 members of the ukrainian insurgent army led by step on bendara. nasa could thousands of poles in virginia in a diabolical ethnic cleansing process. the mergers were particularly horrific and brutal villages were burned and property looted. valinda masika is without doubt one of the bloodiest episodes in polish ukrainian history. while ukrainian politicians still reluctant to talk about these events, how to modern day ukraine and poland view. this tragedy of the past,

and why does the memory of aline, us to divide people ah ah ah, what come back to worlds and forthwith thought is id, professor of political communications at the university of tac from professor before the break. we were talking about the, the risk that the at the biden administration took and trying to over expand and unbalanced russia. and i think it was a saw been an ancient greek story teller who warned about dean castle for what wishes for last it come true. i think it could be argued that the biden

administration did that more to itself than to rush over to funding and, and balancing. but anyway, do you think they may initiate more geopolitical flareups a while in office, for example, in with china over tie one or do you think they've got enough on that place for the time being? you know, americans are capable of doing all of the things that you mention. and i actually was quite surprised and i listened to 20 blinking speech about china just a few days ago. and there were people in the united states that are doing that. and china could play a role by helping russia and fight admission that's coming from the united states. and there were some people who are arguing that good policy, a good policy is actually causing difficulties between russia and china. and when i listen to lincoln, i realize that they are actually making

a decision of putting pressure on china at the same time, i think russia, which is, i don't think it's my decision, but american officials are also not making my decisions in the past. and the result is that i think the chinese yellow american succeed in this campaign against russia. china is going to be next. and that's very important. now, on the other hand, there was the situation with russia. we're creating more amplitude images. there seems to be for the resumption of the iranian nuclear talk. they're in motion again and while i understand what's in it with the americans, doctoral iran is a large oil producer. and we already mentioned b, you know, the discontent, american voters, when they come to the gas station. what i cannot understand is what it is for iran

. why would your country need another agreement with americans that could be easily revoked by the previous administration by this, by this next administration? rather, that is why you have a need as really kosh about it. the man said, is this america saying that you fool me once? shame on you. for me twice, shame, shame on me. so they don't, i don't want to be sort of see the same problem again. like the american b rains are actually starting the years folklore and relying on some of the american fork wisdom. and you know, if you have some of those same, i don't know, my knowledge of russian is not that great. so i don't know if it is something similar to russian, but a, i expect, you know, this is, this is a very large something to do. and, you know,

given that fact is iranian leaders realize that competing with russia in the oil market is not going to be a good policy. i think the majority of it, i think that having some sort of cooperation with russia because this is what the americans do. they want to push on to position that the russian government is not going to police. so they sabotaged united russia relations. but i think in your life, the fact that competing with russia and energy market is not going to be something good because no matter what americans tell you the gender, the don't do what they say and they do other things. and this is the experience we have had with the united states in the last 4 years. the rain, they talked surrounding the rainy nuclear problem problem has been going on for so

long and various iteration that it's hard to understand what the center on for the time being other still about your suppose it intention to have a military application of your nuclear technology or are they essentially about the mon, the pain that then the west can legitimately subject iran to what, what is it the center of those? so, you know, one call them major problem that we have is that based on the 2015 agreement, g, u, a the united states and other members of the 5 plus one that they do not. 3 in tissue, national cannot make relations, and that was that's what, that's what the loan was supposed to get done, would get severe limitations and peaceful nuclear program. and other side would stop sabotage and economy intentionally would accept. and in reality,

what happened was that they, they never really followed that article of the agreement and then top left. so let me just clarify for our audience the agreement was signed, but be in practical terms. many of the international bank still refused to do business with iranian enterprises, so you never quite read the rewards that were promised they were on paper, but they never came to be materialized. that is rachael. and now what they want to do, what happened during the tough administration was that they put part of military under sanctions, the big, the called the military, it terrace organization, which has never been done before. and then they put that part of us military under sanctions. and the aim was to sabotage whatever the next

administration in the united states decided to do. this is what people like robert mary was needing. the american team was saying at that time that the, the top administration is doing things to make the j. c p a very difficult now. 1 that these people are in power. it seems they want to continue the sanctions that some created this addiction to sanctions that you see people in the white house have and they want to continue with that addiction. they want a chief that's sanctions, military and the problem that is that this gives them a tool to basically sanction anybody in iraq as the english because they can just say that this person is linked to the military. and then that's, that's how the sanction that person. so by keeping you necessarily under sanction, they want to actually have

a role of not doing what they're supposed to do under the agreement. busy and that's what you'd be, there's a very cautious if you'd like to what's going on. now speaking about their reading liter, if you already mentioned the speech that i told him he gave a couple of weeks ago in which he talked about the need for the muslim world, and specifically iran not to be sidelined as the world moves or tries to take a new shape and not sideline does many muslim countries were after the 2nd world war when the current system was, was forming. how do you think the muslim world or the my, which lets me, there's also divided that crowds national terry and political lines. how do you think it could bring its weight to bear on international politics? i think what you have decided and you're hoping that other muslim countries do the

same is to actually have alliances and networks with countries that listing us him and. and here's my question and china and so the cultures are different. religions of different cultural backgrounds are different. but this is common threat to humanity in washing and us policies are causing lots of difficulties for ordinary people are on the wall. so this is the hope that we have that country that realize that countries that have the option of not full following us. you know that there's some continued under us pressure. we have in this part of the world. we have countries that have us bases inside, inside the country. it's difficult for them to make independent 5 policy decisions

. but for countries that are relatively less dependent on the united states, the hope is that having network and the coalition of countries that are going to resist that pressure that's coming from the united states and developing discussion of resistance. that's why a lot of people admire what the russia is doing now, because russia and neither ship finally decided to say no to this aggressive policy that was coming from from the best that needs to be have that needs to be that needs to continue. and then our job in, in countries outside the area is actually to join forces to make sure that us him when he is going to. and so let me have a professor. is that correct me? if i'm wrong, i don't think any country can afford to take such a rebel is stands for cultural or your political reasons. but what i'm also seeing

over the last couple of months is that many of the old rival resource, if you said being rephrase that many historical grievances between countries, let's say india and china or russia and turkey, iran and some of the goals phase. but i think these rapid changes in the international system that they've been discussing the program today. of course, in many of the countries to sort of think outside the box. do you think that can also happen closer to your home? do you think that could be any recreational between the sunni and the sheer world to that would be great. that's towards making the muslim world and it's waived on. busy international politics south, you know, you don't have been trying to do that since then 1979. stomach revolution. you don't have been supporting palestinian that you know, and suddenly muslims, and you don't actually think a lot of the high price of supporting purchasing is especially with military

technology. so they can defend themselves against theirs. radio call. it's been awaiting international politics. it's a, it's a very painful issue, but that influence is not that big. if we take, let's say the golf monarch is like the saudi arabia or the, i'm, or it's been very interesting to watch that the supple changes in the politics of late, how they relate to china, how they relate to the united states. do you think there's any interest in that in tech rama? do you think around? can take it a bit further? i think, you know, i have been so even before the current situation, i've been trying to improve relations with countries like saudi lee because he does not consider them to be enemies. you don't have enemies, enemies, the united states and countries back as if. so, improving traditions with the saudis and you're going to be important. and also as you know, in our neighborhood, you have to have extra relations with you. but as i mean, it was in,

it's just a few days ago you reservations with countries like mod. excellent. you don't have good relations with countries, but rock in august and i understand other neighbors that you don't have. and you guys, relations with this country is, depends on how much the well to follow us, lee, my father. and you have been historically clients of the united states. and as you said, as they realize that the us is climbing power, hopefully they develop more independent 5 policy. and if that happens, the united relation is going to is significant. well, let's keep our fingers, i trust with that as well as with the rest of the world professor, it's been a great pleasure talking to you. thank you very much for this opportunity. thank you. thank you for watching hope you're here again. well. busy the part ah

with mm ah ah, ah, what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy even foundation, let it be an arms race is often very dramatic and development only personally and

getting to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very critical time time to sit down and talk ah, with shemika. that's all with no lou, but he spoke to study of olivia. you've used to be your mom of.