well, as the political leaders, you are responsible continued to walk free in washington, rachel blevins, r c. thanks very much for joining us here. not st. national. that was a round up of the latest news we had to can join us back in half an hour and a half more. ah ah ah ah ah

hello and welcome to cross thought were all things are considered. i am peter lavelle because of the conflict and ukraine. europe and russia are going there different ways and like a divorce. separation is full of anguish and finger pointing. the biggest loser of all in this, of course, is europe. washington couldn't be more pleased. it's a gemini, is being sealed, ah, cross sucking russia in europe. i'm joined by my guess. i'd real concentra in london. he is founder of a k consulting and a foreign affairs analyst in brussels. we have lucre bay, he's an independent journalist, and in mirror cash we crossed to martin j. he's an award winning journalist and commentator, or a gentleman cross hoc rolls in effect. that means it can jump any in time. any time you want all right ariel let me go to you 1st in london. ah, there is the conflict continues to dragon in europe at the behest of the u. k. i have to say and washington, and what is the end game here? what?

what does europe get out of all of this? because all i see is a lot of downside and subservience to washington. and to some degree, london london bay. they left the european union, but now they're back through the back door of nato. it's amazing. a drill in london . i think that no one is pretty much sure what is the end game? i mean, the game, i mean most people familiar with the case from 2014 until now. i think the end game might be in the worst case scenario, a nuclear war. but people in the west not very much keen to pay attention to what the moscow is saying. they are not very much king to pay attention more. the independent journalists and analysts are saying, i my so most of the conduct the interview process, jeffrey sachs,

who were warned at the united nations the father escalation of the company might lead to the potential nuclear exchange between the western russia. but people don't, don't get it. i think that because of the fact that the west hadn't seen war for many years, people somehow don't get it. they seen it on the screen. they associate war with something that is played on the play station or x box. but really and truly my generation don't know what the world war and the consequences a war off. that's why they are ridiculous position of russian fight. and that's why they are really getting these competency on the title. mr. leave. because this compet could have been prevented very easily in february if the western side would have provided guarantee security guarantee russia. but

apparently a russia is not in the position to have the same security rights of other countries in the west. and we have found that out, martin, let me go to you and mirror cash. basically the same question because what is europe getting out of this conflict? as is been just pointed out, could have been easily avoided. okay, going back to the december 17th, the 2 notes, one to the european, one to that nato, and went to the united states here. very clear with the russians wanted and they didn't take it seriously. so are the europeans, serious now in what is their goal in pursuing this conflict and backing zalinski and back in ukraine, that is losing very badly on the battlefield. go headlong. yeah, i think it's pretty obvious for me, it's quite simple. i mean, i was in brussels for 11 years. i understand the psyche official sort of thing. i think they won't chaos. i think they want a justification, a reason to boost themselves. geopolitically and militarily. and it's been on the

calls for very, very long time. use the word seriously, i'll be taking a russian seriously than we haven't been taking russian seriously for a very, very long time. we look at the timeline, we go back to not only forward agreement, strong enough between the you and russia, there was a lot of good with a lot of positive thinking. as from yet, cindy really wants to be part of the story. and he leaves at the time, but you know, we lost, i think a lot of credibility was last that 3 is the latest assign it because of chechnya and that was the 1st red flag. i think the 2nd flag came about a decade later with a number of frontline neighboring countries. russia off with some sort of association agreement with the net with neighborhood including you credit that was another slap in the face. and so the new, the nominee just continued to rush of humiliation. and then finally in 2014, you know, to offer ukraine a special association agreement which is just one step away from an exception. i

think that blew a fuse. they went over alliance. they were never serious. you will never actually have a serious about taking russia in as a real part as real plow because they wanted to impose the had gemini on russia from the very beginning, russia kick back on that bright from the early days. i think this is now the accumulation of the situation we have now when we talk about and n k is i think the you, itself is capitalizing on this conflict to give itself a boost and to justify a new ami, to scrap the voting rules so that the type system that works on the shortest time you talked about london and doris johnson, i think that was very much a play for distraction for him to actually shift the media camera away from so a lot of domestic policies which are saying and to some extent so, sensing about items we binds history and in ukraine goes back to before to son, 14. and you know, there's a, there's a certain bad taste in the mouth or of his chip from school lunches. so when the

end game really is to push russia further away, i believe. ok, well, i mean that's about martin. that's going to happen. look, that's good. that's going to happen. i mean i, whatever the outcome on the battlefield is the sanctions will not come down. ok, the sanctions will probably stay in effect forever. so it's a divorce. that's what i'm calling this program. bitter divorce. so when there is a divorce, luke, each side get some assets. what's the asset that you know the europe gets? there's a get the house. there's a keep the dog, i mean what, what does it get from all of this? have i say, is misery, luke? go ahead. i wonder indeed, but there is in this for europe, strictly, nothing in my brain. certainly nothing. for america is clear in all day of the bridge, it says doctrine was that russia had to be isolated. and the worst that could happen for the americans was that germany and russia would work together. that was to be avoided at all costs while they're succeeded. they come to sell their

liquefied gas, rust seeds in the future, and they're very high price in great profits. so for americans, everything's fine, they will sell their wages well. but for, you know, nothing. i mean, we lose the source of our energy and we don't sell anything anymore to russia. so it's awful. the situation, the only thing we gain is that is a country which is through the ukraine with 40000000 poor people to join euro. that's wonderful. thank you. ok, well i, i drill, i mean it again the political leader gary are gaining capital all out of all of this here. but i mean, when you, when france, they're giving out food vouchers, you know, we, we could see as a rationing of energy during the winter. i mean, i mean, did anybody think i had, because i can tell you the russians have been thinking about this in 2014, after the illegal overthrow of the legal government in, in ukraine. so they've thought this all out here,

is anybody thinking it out in europe? hello, unfortunately not in my opinion. i mean, not. i agree with chuckle edition, very famous of a closed school and i miss the recently said, the only statesman and in europe is a fine. mr. album who is standing for is not it. he's country is national interest and he's the most vocal edition in europe currently. also, he's wanting to go on to russia, what, who is calling out loud calling him at calling the bus. and he's, i'm having a serious mental problems, but i'm not going to follow that. what i'm trying to say is that i will disagree with the previous commentators that europe is getting nothing. what we are getting his poverty. what we're getting is a great reset us. the people i say that we will have nothing and we

will be happy. this is what we are saying. we have a skyrocketing inflation in united states. we have skyrocketing inflation here in this country in the united kingdom, but everyone is using you create as a substitute, but i will, but this is, this is just a transition. they keep it. it's a, it's a tough transition, but you know, it's a transaction, but it's a transition for home. they keep the power, they keep their riches and everybody else gets poor. that's what this great reset is all about. martin jump in before we go to the break. yeah, and how long can it last, you know, we keep talking about this so called war of attrition. you know, but it's really a, it's tom game, isn't it? you know, and i think the big question now is, how much stamina does european union a new countries have versus what rushes got in stock? i think we massively miscalculated this. i'm, we're heading towards a brick wall. well, yeah, i'm let me, let me stay here before we go to the break. i mean, as we speak right now,

there are divisions in europe. the, the older europe and new europe there be, you know, as rumsfeld said, but i mean, how can, what's going to be after the conflict the mean? is there still going to be internal contradictions in the european? i mean, how do they move forward here? when they're not even unified, now go ahead, keep going. exactly. i think division, division and more bricks it's, you know, i see there's a, there's a streets that there's really a line right on the middle of the, you countries 0 on the right. you got a number eastern european countries to a much more crow atlanta to assist a more pragmatic above their role and, and a very wary about getting brussels more power, more federalist superpower. and so i think um, i think we can seek to mission more chaos. and how does that translate? that translates of the polls in 2024 to far more far right. m p 's getting seats, which in many ways you know, any you, a mandarin will tell you, is the beginning of the end for the european union. so i see on the doom and gloom

for the european union. let me, let me jump in here. let me get in the loop before we go to the break, reflect on what we just heard from martin. go ahead look the oh, i think we'll see a lot of finger pointing between the leaders in europe. let's say this went to probably one things get really worse. now, the cost of the, the leisure of actual and the say she used to role in more than 2 euro. but when it reaches 3 euro, there will be a lot of questioning from the citizens getting really poor by the day, with inflation on my cost of energy going, getting higher and cost of food as well. so this is a disaster with where they, who are they going to blame their leaders? are they going to blue blame, potent they kind of tried to blame it, but i think the people will well not follow this. we will realize in the end, coming back and we put ourselves, we got our stamps. all right,

that's what i wanted to hear. we're going to go to a quick break. and after back break, we'll continue our discussion on russia in europe. same with ah, ah, well, don't my demo alex, she's going to be on the left in columbia. nobody but i just part of the language italian. real name is logical, who's a large group of college cool with which it is public, your fear to be a number sigma feel fair play make he's got like to put him is year from bush and below that season. now she did the with

the, you know, if you did with that, i don't, i don't buy a deal. this wouldn't have happened there from dado, as vida didn't push this agenda. this war was that because i'm here this week, boston on that. i need to what about a, a good be a little bit with with mm i look forward to talking to you all that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings accept. we're such orders that conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we should be very careful about artificial intelligence at that point, obviously is to great trust,

rather than fear. so we'd like to take on various charlene with artificial intelligence, real summoning with a robot must protect its own existence with with welcome back. across stock were all things are considered on peter labelle to remind you we're discussing russia in europe with okay, let's go back to london and rail if you, if you look at the biden administration's foreign policy,

it's an unmitigated disaster just about everywhere you look. however, one are in and it's kind of a, a back handed success, i would say is that they have unified europe behind the united states. now i posit, oh, in watching this conflict is that sure america has a sealed, it's a gemini over europe. okay. but it's kind of a pirate victory, isn't it? i mean, a, that part of the content is just going to get poor more isolated, less probate productivity and misery. i mean, what kind of prize is that? it's like 13 place pink ribbon. go ahead in london. i think the, you know, by the administration not united states by the administration. sure is so in the food. because if we look at the polls, whatever pulls, whether this is provided by n, b, c, or harvard university. by, by them has the lowest possible appreciation from,

from the citizens of, among the presidents who are really the country. so he's not very popular, but what he's doing is, i mean, he's, he's capable to do this because he's an old man. i mean, he will not be prosecuted for what he's doing. so whatever he's doing, he's doing this in mind that he will not get any consequences for what he's doing and he knows what he's doing. so i would not say that the bible ministration is mad . no, there you know, the playing according to the plan. i mean, the impoverishment of the american citizens or 1st of all now they will be back to. busy guns because they will be the militarize. so the average citizens will not have the same access to the guns. i used to apparently, and also because of the fact that they are because of the inflation and gas prices . they will not be able to live to the american standard as they used to

a. 2 2 festival at present binder and his ministration is acting against his own people and also against the people around the world. and at the same time he's blaming the put in and obviously yeah, they hated credit. i mean, if we continue with your line of argument, i mean this means that they just know better than everyone else. ok. by your electric car. ok. i read that. yeah, that's right. that's what i'm getting. yeah, that's what i'm getting at. exactly. i mean, this is the rule by the experts so that they, they routing by the measures. they see digits and they don't see human beings behind this digits. they, you know, they are the sacrifice of the emotions, human emotions open a new, they know what they know, what's best for us. remember that the dub dub, those ghouls, they know which mentioned, you know, martin,

what's really interesting about this conflict is i've, someone pointed out in media is that, you know, most war presidents get a bump in the polls, but there's no bomb for biden. but the reason is very clear why that isn't the case because it's an elite war. this is not a popular war. this is an elite driven war. martin. yeah. which she can win. and you know, i think that the, the previous comment of some buying being oh, which my little chuckle is quite run of them. i don't think he's really planning to even stick around to, to receive the long term opprobrium from press or from others who are holding to account for screwing up the economy. and i think ruin relations with european you make quite a big deal piece of this relationship between the you and biden, and i have to take you to task one is, i don't agree with you. i don't agree that there is this great friendship is great . i'm sure i think that go i my home. no, i'm not saying it's friendship, not at all. okay. i think it's, it's cold. calculated geo politics. keep going,

you know, say it's forced to germany. it's america basically leaning on the europeans. they've always done that. you know, ever since i arrived in brussels in 1995, i was was shocked. how would the main international institutions and brussels morris for the americans on practically everything? it's embarrassing. i mean, it's really shameful. and i think it's part of the identity of the e u, which is losing its role as, as he is losing the popularity balls with the fiasco coded. and the, all these things accumulated together now to cushing, you to actually have his own policies, its own independent on me, you know, so it doesn't take the orders of washington. so i think there's a contradiction going on there, but it's never going to end. well, i mean, if that division carries on and that, you know, your pin union gets what it wants, which is more power federally speaking, then that's bad news to everybody. and i think there's no, there's no test cases. there's no, there's no experience, no track record is on experimental and you know, when you start making these huge for raisins,

international channel politics with surprise, arms to a regime like ukraine. you know, you wonder where that's going to and i, i can't, can't i see a rosy picture for anybody? i think we're pushing washer into the arms china, into india. i see a new bricks is already then. this is a success story that i think is going to get more successful along with this will consume. yeah, luca, it's, it seems to me the, this whole effort to isolate russia, isolate russia, but it's not isolated at all. and the more the europeans do this, the more they isolate themselves. i mean, it's so counterproductive for them. luke, in brussels, react, well, if you look at the say, 84 percent of the world population doesn't follow the west, doesn't follow your kind of america. so this is the isolation, it's on our side, we are oscillating ourselves. we are, we are making sure that europe will not be leading the world in the future for sure

. for sure. you know, america, michael, think they will go china there of course. but you know, it's, it's really going to the pits. and at the same time, the frenzy of support for ukraine is fading out slowly. here for a time, you don't believe that when, when the school, i don't know based on what on the creation of experts on tv, but this is fading out and when winter comes and the difficulty is linked to the energy issue, then the questions will come up and are the euro crafts and european commission brussels that he's trying to suppress the rule of unanimity in the european accounts. it shows how, how terrified they are of disagreement. well, they're, they're, they're terrified of democracy in general. ok. they really are. ok, i mean, what was it during breaks ago? we've had too many referenda that's you know, that that's anti democratic it's,

it's the, at the essence, it is ok. and it will let me go back, you in london. and now i understand that the polls have initiated a st 7th round of sanctions against russia. well, drill. why does interest russia sanction europe once, and just turn off the energy, go ahead. it could have russia, but russia doesn't have to sanction those people. i mean, they are coming to and so russia is just doing its own policy and rightly so is concentrating on people take away from the west. i mean, it's very rational and i agree with this. i mean, silvio berlusconi just recently an article, a. busy another saying that west is isolating it. so from the rest of the world that is sending, it's all in gas to india is sending it an oil. and going to china. i mean, who would like to, i mean, they will accommodate, i mean, russia,

our people don't understand it. i mean, in the long run, euro will be home and future generations will remember what the euro across the us because it will have a long lasting impact on this continent. we will be irrelevant in the geopolitical role in international affairs. we just, i like to coin it between russia and china. we will be a junior partner, not even a servant of the united states, which is a mom, a let me go to europe is going to be a junior partner that has to pay of steeply for energy. and if you're going to have your own army, you have to buy american made. ok. i mean, every step of the way, martin, you said in the beginning, the program, the europeans didn't take russia seriously. do you think they take russia seriously now that i, i think i have to, you know, they, they realizing that rushes go

a lot more staying power. and also more importantly, i think the point was made earlier. you know that some media is starting to lose his interest in the ukraine will quite quickly. i was in london last week and i had a cheeky lunch time drink with a and a sort of a national newspaper, a continuity which one. but he told me that i lost 2 or 3 weeks, the interest of reduce the ukraine's plummeted dramatically. and i think that's also going to have a barrier on, on public perception, on how res receive use it is, is, is the you taking russia seriously? it will have to a certain point when people around the world who don't really want to get involved in this conflict, the global south african nations, for example, who miss recently recently met butin, you know, those, those partners who may be forced to choose between them a ross will say, no, we're not gonna play that game. you know, we, we don't have the same problem with, with russia and russia and sons of some colony and some former colonies in africa.

puget proved to be very resourceful for countries like monte, we've helped them with internal security, for example. so i think come, there's going to be a little division, it's only gonna home the european union, but it starts to look like somebody of a junior plan, maybe even a long class. i think the 1st casualty, in this conflict will be the use own diplomatic international department. i think we're going to see the end of this joke is fast of ease. so good foreign policy, i think as can be the 1st victim, you know, and russia always was more comfortable anyway, talking to a member states individually. yeah. a multi lushly and i think that's just kind of in hans. let's just going to increase to the point where no one is talking to the, this ciocca in brussels usa burrell, you know, the man so incredibly boring that when he was parliament president, that actually video footage, people nodding off in class on one of our ne, apparently he's a poly gods, but i,

i hear you can speak jibberish and 7 language. it's really quite amazing. look at we have one minute laugh. finish off the program for us. okay. well, i guess it was said earlier that the situation for europe geopolitical situation is for us any, i mean mr. michael says that we should humiliate russia a profile position of every on in turkey with helping out in this conflict. why your doesn't do anything except close doors. i think it's technical. what we're doing to ourselves here in europe and people own start to realize in the coming months. because now it's still can that copy paste from what you're saying, but it is changing slowly and i hope it does. yeah, well i, we, i like game of thrones and one of the great means of game of thrones is winter is coming gentlemen. it will be fun. yeah, i'm, i'm sure it's sergeant schultz will be cheering on, you know, the, the, that the,

you, i'm, it's a prevails with russia. that's all the time we have. i want to take my guess in london, brussels and america. what i think our viewers for watching us here are to see you next time. remember, cross talk with ah, today i'm authorized to additional strong sanction. foreign companies, quitting russia. numbers on a license atm console, blantan banks disconnected from the international payment system, dysfunctional hoppey journal. donna euro, the exchange rates follow up when i check up on a couple more stuff. so i would know what the committee met, the vulcan's, the billing address. that is the current. can you see it? but i don't see a material with zoom in russian business overcome this song. see me. i bought

enough to huddle. she instrument. she tells me don't press voice bullshit. national productive. not to steal a miracle. what i see. and so when you call when you with any of your mind or just feed them out, but i, she sco price a cost difficult when you, when you, when we talk new person who is a school. so a delusion, look a little too much with a wrong one. i just don't know. i mean, you well, yes to shape out. this thing becomes the advocate and engagement. it was the trail. when so many find themselves worlds apart, we choose to look for common ground.

ah, the average gas price in the us reaches an all time record of more than $5.00 per gallon with the cost at its highest in california. we don't want to go too far, like we don't want to use the car to might says it's pointless to guys right now. the lot of buying i can do because i think we're good been with us media bloss washington dumping billions of dollars worth of weapons into the black hole of the ukrainian military. that's the key. i have no cheese is the liberty stalling on delivery. i protest break out in the pakistani capital after an indian ruling party spoke.