wondering right now what, what kind of other sanctions could possibly be imposed on the channel when it no longer broadcasts in the u. k, or europe? what do you think about that yet? well that's, that's, it is now i'm not sure where they can go from that. i think there's any further assumptions that they have to impose. but, you know, again, you know, just to reiterate the use of sanctions to control the median. i would say is, you know, an absolute clump down on press freedom and we've seen this time and time again from the government which insisted it, you know, that it stands up for the truth. but they, they're, you know, they're censuring the truth. and i think that the steps are very, very worrying precedent, and especially because, you know, the situation is, is, is very difficult. and i think people are now starting to see through the narrative that is being put forward by the western western press. because there are some jernace in social media is hoping to come through and all of that, but this is, this is i said, this is state censorship. nothing more,

nothing. that's hard. steve sweeney international editor of the morning. star newspaper, thanks a lot for joining us on the program. well, that's the news for this. our stay tuned for more and just about 30 minutes. a with hello and welcome to cross top where all things are considered on peter level.

washington's unipolar moment, ended years ago, unfortunately, and dangerously. the foreign policy, bob has refused to come to grips with this new reality. this explains the increase tensions in europe, middle east, and asia, and the biggest loser is the west. ah . to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess glen dees in oslo. he's a professor at the university of southeastern norway as well as author of the book . we supposed be a propaganda in international politics. and in america we crossed martin j. he's an award winning journalist and commentator. gentleman crossed out girls and the fact that means you can jump any time you want and i would appreciate it. let's start. i was going in our slow, i'm you and i were in contact before we started this recording and you decide on the topic on the unit polar moment. well, how much to my surprise?

well, tony blair, the former british prime minister, gave a big speech about dominance of the west is coming to an end. so what a interesting collision of perfect storms here. first of all, for our audience, what he, what is meant by the unit polar moment, unilateral? what does that mean? well i get to this, i think is major story of our time because when the soviet union collapsed, the world became unipolar. this means that there was only one central power in the world because during the cold war you heard it was bipolar 2 centers. now under the unit polar order, you only have one center which is united states, which organizes the west, the collective hedge money. so, and so this really immersed in 30 years ago as to so we didn't collapse and they get preserving the unit color, distribution of power became the foundation for your security strategy. for idea was that as long as the u. s. maintained its global hedge money, then there would be no rivalries between the great powers. and this was ever

referred, rasa unit polar peace or hedge money if you will. so the problem was, what many academics point out which was the uniform moment was unavoidably be temporary because 1st of all, it would exhaust use resources to dominate the world. but 2nd of all, because maintaining youth dominance would depend on preventing the rights of other centers of power. one would expect the country's says different, thus russia, china, india, brazil, and others with increasingly corporate, with each other to both soft united states because they see the united states trying to keep about, well, as we see now, 30 years later, this predictions coming to fruition that is the use of exhausting many of its resources under major powers are ready to create alternative security and economic infrastructure which is independent of the united states. and the question has always been, how would the us respond? even brzezinski, remember who was could not be more of a phobic yet he also recognized there was a dilemma. the u. s. can either facilitate or support

a transition to multiple or order when the youth has a privileged position. or alternatively, you can fight all his rivals in a ground stand off to regain his former dominant position. now i think that because the west has linked the survival of liberalism and our values to hedge money. no negotiations or what we now see is that your assistant resume confrontation with many, emily rush in europe, china, and asia and iran in the middle east or so this is what we're seeing that is use will fight to restore is global hedge money even though this does not seem very likely at all. well, you bring up a really good point learn. i mean, one of the things that you know, in glenn gives a perfect explanation there. but is this an ideological thing? is it based on security? is it based on g o politics? because if it's ideological, then the west cannot lose, will that is, everything goes against everything in history. empires rise and fall centers of

power move around. i mean, that is the nature of geo politics to all of time. and so the where seems because of its ideology that it is the end of history is fukuyama said, go ahead, mark. i think come tony blair, having a wine about some western power way. miss gretchen isn't. it must be done over $2000000.00. cor, go own, but once you question about ideology, i don't know that's the right word. it's an ideology, is it philosophy? it's the only model that the west heart so long was that the huge powers of a lease which controlled our politicians, you know, had a very singular view of the world, which the politicians followed. you know, they look to poor countries and they said, are you pull him backward? i do have a huge democratic deficit. you know, are you in debt? and do you need american aid? and when you fall on the ground,

boots uncle sam. and if countries around the world said yes to those 5 than they were welcomed and there was a huge body slam, you know, your, our kind of guy are kind of dictator or kind of leader. this is how americans thought in the west followed with this doctrine. but i think a lot of it was about, you know, what we got now is we saw loses. this is the problem. we're losing our power and we don't really know how to deal with it. just as just as a british empire, imploded in the 2nd world war, the americans to really know how to deal with this new scenario that china, iran, russia, india, these companies already forming, they're really getting their act together and creating a real opposition to america. so you know, how do we cope with in the longer term it's going to be casualties. can be low chest, something winding. but some, i don't think most of it is genuine. i think a little bit is just just the west. don't really coping. ready well, with this new world order, it's interesting that what martin just said there and glen, because if we frame it in ideological terms, well,

a lot of what the western liberalism and that's going to spread means today. well, 1st of all, very daily into most of the world, this woke isn't stuff and all about me, most of the world scott's that it is being just ridiculous. i mean, are you build a coherent, prosperous society based on these ideas that the west is very forcefully exports right now. and i, as a result of what we've seen the global south, not condemning russia or it's military operation. ukraine. i think you can draw 2 conclusions. one, they don't take the west very seriously any more. and number 2 and very importantly, they're not a rate of it any more thoughts? no, i agree, no other way. and another thing i think when the rest keeps talking about, this is an attack on the rules based order. this becomes a role. this becomes a way of expressing, again, ideology as power. so they're saying, you know,

we without western hedge money, you can't have the survival of example, liberalism, but i think it, the rest of the world is the, they're being critical because they see this is mainly as the power line behind. because when the west, a soviet union began to pursue this hedge, a monic liberal order, what it was to find us was giving essentially the rest is going to give itself an exemption from international law. so keep in mind when it, when the rest brings up this principles of great principles, democracy, human rights is not used to limit the they're the power of the state, rather, it enables it. so for example, if promote this concert goes sovereign in a court in which it was referred to democracy. human rights, the rest can interfere in domestic affairs. we can po documents by calling them credit, delusions for calling a human a terry interventions, even severing territories of other countries. so there is this sense that

liberalism has been so intertwined with the hedge among the concept that again, when we do speak about the west leadership, we see it as the guarantee for liberal values of the rest of the world. increasingly see liberalism as simply being a logical, talking point to justify money. so again, when can take both sides of the argument and it is quite interesting that these discussions aren't really being held in the west at the moment where the power of the west federal disappearing thus at the same time the world is increasingly rejecting this liberal ideology which will justify the badge money. what mean martin or will under the current administration to bite ministrations about democracy versus a ta chrissy or a real throwback to the bass demising. it went really no. um, no perspective on the realities on the ground around the world. but then you know,

joe biden, he, if we, if he takes on board is democracy versus a tar chrissy. he fist bump the, are the crown prince of suffolk rafia. i mean, what is there were other make of this year? i mean, you were, where's the human rights? where is the democracy? where's the rules based order? i mean, it just, it is absurd in the whole world. sees this. ok. a glen glen talks from the point you said that these, these, these incredibly seismic issues, these qualities that we cling onto our gun since the 1st part of the last 7 years are really just talking points. that's absolutely correct. use that phrase they are . and the whole world is realized, it's not before, perhaps, if you go back and say only 15 or 20 years, you know, when the west meant huge decisions, it could, it could bank on a fair amount of his ex colonies in the global south and to support of un to support is on those days gone. you know now the west, the so called worse. what is the west west is the you 2726 countries. and america

and canada and what is to west? what can it do now in with his huge subject, it's very much on his own. and it has to keep on banging the strum and going on about the liberal values. but the truth is, we don't even believe in the liberal values ourselves anymore. you know, democracy, free speech, human rights, just look at what we're doing to and people look at the junior sand case. you know, look at the number of journalists are being arrested in europe for reporting on the war and ukraine. but role to that, the january 6 rioters. yeah. yeah. so you know that this, this edge that we had is gone. you know, we're looking at a new recent new world order and china and russia are actually beginning to make it very, to the whole world. there is an alternative out, you know, and i think the longer we go on though with these ideas, the more that the west is exposed to being more corrupt than it ever was in a corruption is now really a huge factor. now when we look at ukraine, when we look at china, i mean,

how can you mentioned china without bi and family relations with deals are going on there? how can you talk about ukraine without looking at what biden's family are doing? a new credit is disgusting and the only way that we read about these articles read about this graph is from foreign journalists from the other side of this new world order from the china, from russia, from turkey, from wherever you know, we don't, our journal is just you know, forgotten how to do their job. and so we are shipping up to something completely new. we don't really know what it's going to look like. but we are living a new reality that you know, america and its allies in europe are no longer a dominant force anymore. they're gonna have to take a back seat to a new economy, a new sort of rules. and we're not behaving really very well about it with our attitude towards china, which shocks me actually that the so much religion see the so much i'm just meeting and talk is a war. how do you go to war with one of your greatest training? honest, it doesn't make any sense. me, glen martin with great pointer and it goes back to my original question here,

is that this is just ideologically driven, it's. it's not rationally, but it's not, it's not ok. this is not assessing your assets and your strength in your ability to get what you want to me if they've made these roasted glasses is itself limiting and it's actually so humiliating. go ahead. 30 seconds. are we going to break? i am good example. this is exactly the chinese because our hours with china could easily be resolved on this coast back to the one china policy like china has been very open if you will not intervene in taiwan unless you have steps over the line recognizes independence or want us to use been good, gradually abandoning the one china policy, which sparks tiny since ranch. and based on this, we're now making china enemy because is predictably responding to a publication as we had already expected. so it is no different than nato expansion

propagation. and then you can reaction, gentlemen, we're going to go to what your break and after that your break, we'll continue, our discussion will stay ah, ah ah ah ah with

ah welcome back to cross stuck were all things are considered on people? well, this is the home addition to remind you were discussing some real news. ah, let's go back and learn then in miracle. one of the interesting things about this unipolar moment coming to an end, it has come to an end. and well, one of the big differences in looking at european politics and the crisis in ukraine is that it seems to me that that germany has finally completely abandon us

politics of billy brant. mama, the korean government in germany no longer. i think it was a really broad talk about 2 different legs. one be able to stand on, on what are they in the west, but be able at the same time to reach out to the east. it seems like those days are over, and that is one of the accomplishments of washington in london. i mean, to finally break the relationship a potent wanted since he came to power of having a good, vibrant relationship with germany. that seems to have come to an end, and i would say as a result, it is isolated europe because there's not a major power in europe now that wants to reach out and out some kind of de tant, we haven't used that word in a long time. with russia, go ahead, mark. no, i think we're a long way from it. it's are unfortunately because when you get into the heads of some of these western elise who still believe they can play the war of attrition with russia, you see that they're not. they're not interested in any long term. friendship.

ready or, or deal with russia, you know, we liked russia during johnson's period because it was poor and backward and nothing seemed to work. and they needed the help of them and america at certain point, it was a little tiny window where yeltsin seem to be our guy, you know, soon as prudent came in. so the build economy, something going on like russian rush is a problem versus the threat rushes, creating all these problems for us, you know, and what comes from that. what i noticed as a journalist is this package fear mongering, which is delivered through the media. you know, we go this fear mongering, go now sir. memory is nothing new in the west. we've been doing it. you know, you can go back to the days when russell was young. man and nixon went to russia. the soviet union that to and came by with the so called deal rum sold and cheney, we're looking at him say, now we've got these new russian submarines which are non acoustic, that hundreds of them just, you know, parked off the coast of america. and we couldn't, they couldn't get a, get it into their heads. that because we couldn't detect the us and russian

submarines newsome reins. that doesn't mean that they're not there. in reality, they didn't exist. they weren't there with vinny, it is always great inflation. yeah. the cleaner the power of nightmares, the power of that fear mongering, huge about didn't stop the next administration for the ministration somewhat correctly from wrong investing in today's and billions of dollars in more military industrial compet kit to try and detect the so called non acoustic russian mac submarines which didn't exist the same things going on today. we've got more fear mongering over china. i know where it's heading. it's heading towards more military spending. that's the number one thing and it's, we've seen it in ukraine and i'm beginning to wonder, you know, as a skeptical journalist that's covered graft for the best part over 30 years. i'm beginning to wonder whether big international matthew sto, corruption is taking over here are these leads to we elected as so called democratic leaders of our values of our beliefs in this, in this neoliberalism,

are they actually pocketing huge amounts of money from these obstacles? we don't know where these arms go. we don't know even we don't even see the receipts from lockheed martin and rape him. you know, we don't even know they get delivered. you know, if you're as old as i am, you can probably remember reagan coming to power on the arms, the arm scandal with the conscious. you know, reagan use the fog of war to cover up all this secrecy. to create secrecy over basically selling arms, iranians, which is a legal taking $30000000.00 off iran and taking $18000000.00 of that and giving it to the contras to focus on an interest in the regular oil course. legal legal. he got off the hook, he was never known for that because he used the fog of war to actually move dirty money around people in the worst of very, very naive. they don't understand it in money. the people that did take the hall for it were pardoned of yes, i am the president of the an are a the and so we go to quite good job right now. also. i mean, we,

i hate in both the tony blair's name again, sorry, but i mean, to talk about the, you know, the, the, the dominance of the west coming to an end. i mean, he, he was part of the, the tipping point. he was very much with agreeing to the illegal war in iraq to the point isn't why i'm going to go to the point about ukraine and the point above iraq and the point about afghanistan is dirty money. you don't keep money is all about these games. how do you move money around? how do you store dirty money? how do you save that money and you cream dirty? my of huge arms contracts. a son said pretty much the same thing about afghanistan . he said, the point of us get gunston was not to finish a war winter war. it was create the sort of black zone where you could keep a little dirty money and keep everybody in check. you know, i was afghanistan, 2000 something. i, british soldiers and one of the biggest frustrations they had was i was show me the head come video of while they were fighting taliban once on field. other people

were collecting a heroine, morphine on the other side and packing it away in it. and you know, so there was a lot of corruption there and i think when i see a new train, i was dirty money. i see dirty money in china now, who's getting this money? who's actually profiteering? go back to room. nobody rolling around contract 1st. we still don't know today how those american arms companies got paid the $30000000.00. how they get paid. well, i think they will end up calling it the hunter by model glen. you're going back to the big picture of the end of the unit polar moment. i mean, are we in that vicinity strap right now? i mean, because, because i think we're all in agreement it's, it's a combination of ideological possession and greed. okay. i mean, again, the snow was a rift, i mean, it wasn't when it was the keep it going though, the whole thing is the keep it going. it looks like that's something they may try in ukraine. i don't think they're going to be nearly as successful. that's why i

think the pumping so much money in their big hub, it now all you care. okay. and they'll be no accounting for it later. just like in afghanistan. so. so glen, i mean, are we in that trap right now with the westbound enough to, to maintain its ideological predominance because it's messianic b or turn to pours because everything's well loss of face. they've created a situation where either you, when completely or you lose completely but world history is everything's in the middle. it doesn't usually get the extremes, go ahead one. no, i agree, but it also depends how one would define the objectives. i mean, if you look at ukraine and russia, they were actually moving towards a little diplomacy. we're moving forward towards disagreements as we know in march . and again, what's not the student is that the ukrainians walked away from it because the united states and the u. k. person to do so, arguing that you know, you can,

we will give you all the work and of course there's no, no one of the things today that you can come to see about still the strategies as much weapons but what their weapons need for what they call the fee process, it's simply to continue, it is going and they get it from the us congress and all and the media. you comparing this idea over and over again. this is an opportunity as well, to bleed ross to try and 2nd nomic and military power. so i think this idea of dragging out to the war is, is part of the part of the goal. and it's also good for our minds to building because what the state of the key military power is, a lot of influence comes from having this enduring complex. i mean, the amount of been trying to get the economic and political it was over the years for years. only now with this war i'm going is our europe bending over

and doing what the americans want to do. and i think you can also see the same possibly in asia, military conflict begins to intensify or escalate some pressure rooms with china. maybe it can mobilize some of the neighbors of china with united states. and obviously, the reason i'm saying it's because the sing the song as well. there's a grievance now which been made in, in israel, and then going to saudi arabia. this is to build up the rhetoric against iran. now, why would united states do this? well, obviously this can open up for this really a tax on your own. however, it would also be simpler to short use. leadership includes in the release for having this conflict there, the have to look to our students for leadership. that's the source of influence in the region. so again, i am not sure what else to explanation for because pursuing a conflict with us, russia in europe and asia, and iran now in the middle, is

a major war there. if you can't possibly fight on 3 front, so i think this having this slow burning conflict is, might be a strategic objective, you know, a martin, it exactly in the, the 3 regions. and i mentioned in my, my introduction. i mean if you have count that you have risk. busy of crisis, inflation is itself the justification to do to be involved in, in these, in these areas here. because i have always said like in the middle east, b, u. s. in the west got out of the middle east, they would make their peace. it might be very turbulent and might be very violent, but they would come to terms ok, the same thing in asia. but when you have the western powers, primarily the united states, that is it, it creates a, a slippery slope not to make hard decisions. okay. and on top of it, i mean,

you know, we glenn was saying here, i mean, the european, the west has dominance in europe, but it's a pretty hollow prize, isn't it? i mean, it, germans are not going to be freezing in the winter. what kind of price is that? i will say that we need a marshall plan, the americans to fly in d. c, threes, and drop food over us citizen europe. you know, that's where we're heading. i mean, the germans now have to russian the hot water that it can not you have to boss week or something, one of the richest countries in the world for the 1st time. and that is true, right? you know, so this is worrying and when you can see the german news, what the european units world power is. you know, i think when we look at the west in general, and we talk about middle eastern biden in saudi arabia the last couple of days. and the 1st punch is punch. what have you call it? um, there's a lot of smoke and mirrors. the love be yourself there, frankly. and this idea that america is going to stand by israel and we're going to defeat iran. i mean, for god's sake, what planet are you on, man,

who is going to take on iran in their right mind? and when it is really, germans push spider each. each is shrunken seat and he just kept saying, while you're as a loft or maybe would probably what you're gonna nonsense. absolute nonsense. and the interesting thing is, is that we, in the west of kept this, this, this, this, this, this fear mongering going in the middle is for a long time now because it's great business for us is great business for arms countries. um, companies, you know, and, and, but the, it's frank, it's completely taken. you only have to look very closely at the relationship between saudi arabian around how it's becoming slightly cooler. and, you know, these 2 neighbors are actually starting to open up by chance towards each other. you know, they're both lining up to join bricks. how can they be enemies? they're both gonna be in a new train, or i was saying here, it's one big rift here. okay, all right, gentlemen, we've run out of pamela and i think my guests are slow and america,

and i think our viewers are watching us here. are the see you next time? remember? ah, i during the 2nd world war in nancy. ok. my poland, virginia was a farming region. today is monday of ukraine. between 943 and 945 members of the ukrainian insurgent army led by step on bandera. thousands of poles in virginia, in a diabolical ethnic cleansing emerges were particularly horrific, and brutal villages were burned and property. looted the bellini. a massacre is without doubt, one of the bloodiest episodes in polish ukrainian history. my al ukrainian politicians, still reluctant to talk about these events, how to modern day ukraine and poland view this tragedy of the past. and why does the memory of belinda still divide people

ah, with russia says its forces have killed hundreds of foreign mercenaries and destroyed multiple ukrainian military assets inside the done yet the people's republic with a decisive battle for control of the area in full swing. fall in the neighboring lugens, the people's republic, our corresponded, joins a russian combat, control that mopping up hostile resistance from ukrainian troops, dressed as civilians and the recently recaptured city of lisa talked with control that we were with the now cooling for back up those hoshal potential haul stop in the park with building and he.