[000:00:00;00] a, [000:00:00;00] a webpage, wells fargo, jokingly dismissed or shameful is the price point. and then the last, a very complex and a very complex phenomenon revealing something hidden, both about its consumers and societies at large. like any collective preoccupation, it gratified and punishes and it's old and exhaust,

exposes and misrepresent. with points i still joined the chunk of internet traffic . what makes point such a symbol of the guys discussed that i'm now doing by georgia tech article clinical psychologist from house with an overall law, got a kaleidoscope on orange. georgia is a great to talk to you. thank you very much for your time and congratulations on this amazing book. thank you very much. thank you. now, as i said, you are joining us for a ban like that here in russia. it is a subject of many lurid and politically incorrect jokes about the hot finish, ma'am. coupled with the data you're citing, your book that 9 out of 10 finish man up consumers of 4. and i wondering if there's something in the helsinki area that not only spark your interest, but also gave you the, the scientific courage to explore is subject like no,

i don't think you'd speak with him and i am from you. i moved here to be 13 years ago actually interesting such as don't be any writing something started long ago. and they started reading books about format that they could find. and then i came to the conclusion that at least in the field, there was nothing written about it. and the general in the psychoanalytic environment is always addressed for logical sides. and i thought it was missing, kind of the exploration of the old form itself. and one of our current site, guys, like you said, so this started long for my company to see him. and by the way, yes, the book, i mention this data about schumer's a very interesting research because it was

a very long research you started 1970 and there were wiring many dimensions of trying to be up to the present time. i know that other researches in different countries in the west, they said basically this one results. so it's not only a foster, but actually everywhere in western countries, there is this kind of resolve like 9 man on 10 and maybe nowadays 767, we went over 10 years ago on consumer. so i started off by disrespected, of many jokes about the temperament of the spanish people here in russia. you show very elegantly how boring went from an obscure home with a fascination to amass. phenomenal in i think i found was 50 years for a starting read day, legalize ation in denmark and them in the united states in the 1970s. and i was

surprised to learn that the collapse of the soviet union be in the country where i was born and also a major contribution to the industry in what way. well, developed for many, let's say for a 100 years, probably in a very nice style for just the accessible by few people in the taking the western countries. like you mentioned that by the end of the sixties and the beginning of the seventy's born or production and distribution were always allowed just by law. in some countries starting denmark in the us know, brian's e to the and many other countries. so my book is about mass form, so it's mostly to the period of the last few years and especially dedicated to 24 men, the sexual men. this is important to say the phenomenon to say why nowadays?

so i tried to focus on what is still the mainstream for an hour and during the seventy's and the former was a kind of side, the industry to industry. and actually there were unions in many countries and actors, movies they were trying to structure to their work as any other work. but when, so if you didn't call out, there was a massive amounts of women most yours and women. basically we need to do anything in order to to earn some money which of course into the. ready western world, so to say, and these change completely the landscape for an industry because it went towards a more can anybody with a camera could feel my new something and the and then the internet would be 90. so

basically these 2 factors together created a new landscape where all the unions and also the of the previous to see were swept away. but you know, so yes, the coming from, especially you praying that rose on the russia axis. so to say change the landscape, correct. me if i'm wrong, but from what i heard you say in other engineers, it's not just about the the nature of oregon, how actress is paid and how they're protected. but also about the style should have been the aim of the product itself because i heard you say before the back and the use of the eighty's. it was much more about the neutral pleasure, but damage shifted to far more violent and dominating kind of genre g. you attribute that to a cultural influx of women from before somebody union or is it just the nature of time itself, or the nature of male sexuality?

that has changed the word farm. this is a very interesting question. i would say that the the availability of women willing to do anything went well together with the, with the increasing they're going to want the extreme mothers was already present in the seventy's and made his body was more regulated, especially in the seventy's since the previous decade. the 60 in the west would be changes, so from changes there was semi, he's the movements and movements. so in that moment the fact that was representing female sexuality as a joy for and disconnected from procreation. as a pleasure for women, it was a new thing,

adamant in that moment. so it was already extreme doing the seventy's name is i mean we can find the extreme back to them to. but that fear was much different from the current form, which has been much about using a woman for me at pleasure. i wouldn't dare to say that there was a cultural contribution from the side of the women. i think patriot was already there. and the idea that actually we could exploit all these, we're going to do anything just was market advantage. so now one of the essential ideas in your book is that technological inventions, in your demonstrate how important is a logical invention. i'm not national tools, they don't just satisfy me when they form and shave them from times with pretty malicious,

insidious motives. i wonder how do you yourself try to maintain it's not an autonomy you've done some degree of dependency on on those technological forms and anything out there. why is interest in question? in a way human beings have always be technology goes from the very 1st time when somebody created the container to bring the water from the river to the cavern, which already baffled at technology convention, something out of the nature. but definitely the last 100 years saw a dramatic change in our landscape to the point that technology according to the goods and us that they bought a lot in the book became the subject of history and actually premium we as human beings are on the co, historical to technology, so definitely will even if acknowledged a word that is just one of the many optic technology,

but all of this objects that surround us. and that is not only a tool in our hands and depends on how we use bad. this is, are kind of a nice position to anders t. e claims that actually we should be worried about how technology use us, which is the reverse perspective, where knology actually can change deeply our, even our emotions. and the way we are in the work. it's just a little that technology is the current word, so i don't think that we can, we can imagine a word without it. it's a very, very difficult processed and balance our relationship with technology. within that there knology for work. i think that the starting point is to question seriously our technology, the landscape. and i, i mean, i try to do is even just looking for the topic is much wider than or your mentor

under the german industrial for lots of our who in many ways was ahead of his time for telling the dangers of being inflamed by technology. so i saw that his 2nd book of essays was titled the app. ma'am, i know that you don't like judging or moralizing in any way, but do you think by and large, 40 years after the publication of this book we have come to just don't be in for kind of being proven that people are not all of them, but by and large losing touch not only with the free period in them or but also the bodies. because when you look at both these fear this disinvited in the same time as a change union of offices without union. yes, yes. you're right. yeah, i personally,

i think the word, the side by now present i really wonder how he would consider the current needs and then towards, for example there on because many sections were based on radio and g is greater mazing, he was foreseeing that are really much more talking about the current, although he died i think he, agents so before the ancient. yeah, i do believe that she is the word is, is present in this moment. i know that there are many other seems, there's much more positive about ecology and they believe there is just let's say the normal development or human consciousness are going to or that i am closer to

this worries. so to say and the responsibility to discuss. i am worried that the more well interestingly that despite human beings so much ahead of his time, he is not widely published in english. you know that, that is, you know, we usually think of the western world as the, and the driver of both the 3rd and the 4th industrial revolution. and yet, they are very few translations of his work that mostly on an amateur in nature. i wonder if that is just an unfortunate happenstance to you, or if you think that are a form of deliver it will actually ostracizing. yeah, well, as an analyst it's hard enough to think of that. there's a mean this regression on this work issue to this or a finally published in english. i found out this year there is

a big work. i think it's published in america about around this war works. in general. it's some 500 pages book. so they have now finally translated to something and spoken to him. it's interesting because his 1st born was published, the end of the 2nd world war 48. i think the 2nd one, the eighty's or 1988. and i could find a translation, and it was already existing since the sixty's, but in the true word. so to say it's funny, last year maybe august, so i see it as a little bit of a regression because it was a very critical voice. especially for him and he was also contemporary of young and i think union ideas are also seeing a bit of a revival. so maybe it's a synchronistic went in a way that we're coming back to prominence anyway. do we have to take a very short break? right now, we'll be back in just

a few moments they can a ah ah welcome back to will support a clinical psychologist from finland and also law got assist a kaleidoscope on foreign georgia before the briefly touched upon this very central

idea in your book as well as in the work of good there on, there's that now logical inventions are not natural tools. they not only satisfy our needs but also shape and foster them. and sometimes they even create our needs . and you provide a very interesting example of coca cola, something that for many people essentially managed to hijack that basic need for 30 stand by claiming to satisfy they'd actually increase it. and i think that's a very sort of common thing within the big industry as well. as within the big pharma industry because they're very, a lot of very obnoxious images there. if you look at the most prevalent disease is metabolic diseases, right now be diabetes, dementia, a, b, c. many of them would be trace to people being hooked on certain foods or on

certain habits. and i think one is you have to read recreating the same dynamic and certain populations that could be very helpful to some of very imaginative to some. but in many people it also creates a dixon and i understand it's a very complex question i have is them you don't like passing judgments, but where do you think we should start in terms of both assigning responsibility? because you know how budgets are something that we are all concerned about. it is a public good and also helping people develop a helpful and sort of mutually respectful relationship with technology and the dimensions. and the industry that produced down. yes. yeah. your questions are always very interesting for be they would require a lot of time to reflect on the questions. well, i would say that taking the example corner and the name of my book was

to show different sides of it, which is something that i didn't find many books. i called the book a kaleidoscope for dia, that every chapter should have been a color and all the colors together. they were for me to come to school so that the reader concern the book. so do say and see maybe some configurations or others from these in order to, by the question mean when a phenomenon is a complex form, is having the possibility to see many colors and, and embrace this complexity is the 1st step we have to do before doing what you are asking, the same about technology technology is a very complex topic. why is a lot of reflections? and so to say deepening here many asked before we,

we can decide something about what can we do in order not to be just addicted. so i thought it was me too many books or was this complexity there were only focusing on some aspect, for example, addiction or a logical version. but form is, is a very complex object. that actually is just a good seymour, many other phenomena of our work. so what you asked requires 1st of all to know much better, so much a deeper level a and then we can try to understand what can we do about it. well, we can invite out here to get your book and reflect on it, but i can tell you from a personal perspective that one of the very simple but for some reason, very insightful ideas. for me. it was that, that, that me not just leave it in our bodies,

but we are the bodies and the desiring bodies and, and your book demonstrates it in a, in a very interesting way. and there is, i think, a huge difference in perceiving yourself. i'm living in the body and actually imagining yourself that same body. i can you, can you speak about that a little bit? yes, this is, this is an important for me because for example, and experience technology. so i'll get to a screen basically where speaking nowadays or videos or pictures. just how it knology invites kind of splits with the bobby b. because we look at some checks and sex performance. and the only senses that we are using in that moment are basically sides and hearing because there is but actually sex as

a real experience as an important experience. so it would be much more involving those like a smell in box. most of all, very interesting how, like you said before that they're trying to munition of opposite. it's like why is this sexual thing? but actually it doesn't have anything to do with the sexual, embody experience because we're just sitting in front of the screen. there's nothing a physical, there are some people, there are some things, i mean my only physical people, not just watch they, i think use the imagination. and sometimes that happens to all of that. i mean, there is not the an embodied experience with the people are shouts, but it's not the same thing as a real sexual kid can actually ask you about them. because i think this is a fascinating question and sexuality is one of the sort of 5 basic things that's calling and identified. and i think more than others,

it requires the presence of the other, you know. yeah. and you unions like to talk about the the benefits of living at imagination. but i was perhaps a downside to that. as a clinical psychologist. what are some of the dangers of living out too much of your sexuality in this imaginary reality? yes. oh yeah. this is also very important topic to i believe that the unions, but all of the cycle and i need to work. let's say it's very much leaning on the variables side and we can to not to get too much attention to the body. but there are movements so to say in the 2nd world are trying to include the body level much more. and there are very interesting crossovers between, for example, you theory and authentic move manager or dance therapy and other teams that more

than body. so yeah, me, there is always to disconnect from the girl and body experience. there is the need to pull out of it together like the imagination, but also the, the body lever. so important just technology object, the vice discrete from the body experience in a way. and this is one example. i mean this is happening a lot with g best we can disconnect from the body. we can disconnect from the emotions. we can disconnect even from ethics because we just watch a video with our responsibility, what's going on and maybe some violence video or something that we wouldn't, we would never do reality. still, we are enjoying something which is violent. so there's a lot of questions that are poor by these things,

and definitely try to reconnect body and mind much more also in the union. the theory put out the wrong because if we look at the data, despite these very wide availability of the people around the developed world, having less tax their having, it's later in life. it's also less creative, not only because of their birth control, but also because of the precipitously balling pro comes in many of the man, if you step outside the corn for a while. what do you think is happening with human sexuality in general? within the larger view of technology and the 4th industrial revolution that we're about to enter. yeah, well, on one hand, there are many signs of crisis like you were mentioning. only other i'm reading so many interesting books that are address and sexuality in new ways and very interesting ways. i her mind

a speech the authors fema authors. but i am reading a lot of books about sexuality and couple relationship and already ann marie and menu. let's say development, so really in sex. so like you said in the beginning there was some opposite phenomena happening at the same time. there is a crisis of the previous way, maybe sexuality, the patriot prizes investment, also the way it has always be tended. and hopefully, you know you elements and circulate, you will change the landscape in the future. so i hope that we will have all better sex and better relationship. i'm yeah, well and has a better relationship with reality, which i think is the goal of any psychological school, but especially in psychology,

seen as one of the allowed reality to really real gone like magic to mere mortals. since you have the goddesses in the title, what do they have to do with base activity asked for? and yeah, i know we have a very short time left to so i just try to make a huge about maybe, maybe the listen. i will be curious to see in the, in the more extensive way. and i had the idea that say, the hypothesis that a factor of fascination for form should be found also outside the usual logical explanations is definitely fascinating for the majority of men and women around the world. could be one of the genders. and i believe that reducing everything to the g is beats to narrowing. so my hypothesis is that

actually porno, poor. it's possible to find some sheens to walking on the ear as was connected to the sake of a big topic or you know, the year of the say there was a place in a place beyond the bad a place or place of the got the place of the human beings, so in a very strange way, or somehow something has to do with the under certain shade. and i explain it in the book, but it's really along their topic now. and so the reason i sense that the form that there is some hint to the secret that that actually is fascinating because believe that the soccer eyes were a statement that is dead. and we can say that the secret has

disappeared as a, you know, any union of what they have replied to you. that what can a, whether he's called the not the, the guys are still present it. it's a matter of seeing and perceiving them and having a relationship with them today. i have to leave it there. i wish i could have more time to discuss fascinating book, and i invite our readers to to get it that you have an advantage over russians. i think it's still available around the world on amazon, so to take a chance on that. thank you very much with this possibility to talk think and thank you. what you hope to hear again next week. all the fire ah with

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a ah ah, russia confirms a missile strike on military targets in the 4th of odessa. it follows a barrage of accusations by the west. ukraine not moscow's already breached the new grade export field. the site itself admitting wheat stores were not. it also ahead . all countries of africa have sovereignty, are free to choose their own policies, including foreign policies in the interest of their own people. the words of egypt, foreign minister following talks with his russian counterpart in cairo who is on a tour about for 10 months to the dismay of washington,