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tv   Cross Talk  RT  September 16, 2022 7:30pm-8:01pm EDT

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i look forward to talking to you. oh, that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, accept where such orders at conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we should be very careful about artificial intelligence. and the point obviously is to great trust rather than fear. so we'd like to take on various jobs with artificial intelligence, real summoning with a robot must protect its own existence with ah
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ah hello and welcome to cross stock were all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle, official. kevin, it's immediate trolls have made much of the recent counter offensive. however, there gleeful backing of ukraine has demonstrated beyond a doubt. this is a nato war on russia. the stakes could not be higher. one side will lose and badly . ah, cross sucking nato's war on russia. i'm joined by my guest garland nixon in washington. he's a political analyst in tampa. we have larry johnson. he is managing partner for burg associates and a former c. i. a analyst and u. s. department of state counterterrorism official. and here in moscow we have maxine to chop. he is the director of the institute of international studies at moscow state sued of international relations. i, gentleman, cossack,
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rules and effect. that means you can jump any time you want, and i always appreciate that's going to larry 1st in tampa. much has been made about this counter offensive or on conical of not much was gain not much was lost at the end of the day, but it's good media fodder, good for the propaganda narrative. what is not mentioned in the narrative is that during the summer, the ukrainian army was destroyed. now we have a nato army with ukrainian foot soldiers and mercenaries. but this is nato's war against russia. agree or disagree with that? go ahead, larry. well it's, it's certainly moving in that direction that there were still ukrainians leading vote, leading the fight on this. but when you look at the quality of the troops, they were untrained, they had little experience, and they did not know how to properly use the weapons of. it was shocking an article in the washington post. earlier this week, with the look, interviewed individuals in the hospital,
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euchre wounded on craning and soldiers. and when they go through that, these guys are saying, look, we're, we're getting out gun. we're being the, we're losing 5 of us every one russian, that of the stein or one ukrainian from the don bass. and we don't, we send out 5 shells and we're getting hit with 100. so that is enabled by the nato. nato was making that happen and i think it, it is, it's becoming a very dangerous situation because i, i think i just saw a comment or a message from russia to, to natal. that, you know, if you put in long range what weapons you have crossed to red line, and the, the russians don't make idle threats. maxime in this basically the same to you because a, the way it's frame, this is russia and ukraine, but them, it seems, i mean, in zalinski said already in the last few days unseen. and that the, without american support, he can continue his effort here. and then you have western media sources gleefully
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saying, yeah, well, the americans and nato, they were all behind the great offensive konica. i mean, this is, it's not internationalized, it's nato eyes, and it's putting russia against nato. and in the, in the conflict like this, there's no win win as they like to say that one's going to lose here. this is what i agree with larry, this is getting very scary. go ahead, maxime. or the thing here is that is not just demands kind of a certain reconfiguration of military apperson, the russian side, which i think will happen. and in the short term, it also means if need to is going always force and weight behind ukraine. and it's clearly the potentials of nato and russia are as symmetric. and, you know, in this kind of conventional warfare rush is likely lose, which is not accepted by moscow that demands really
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reconfiguring the approach to the warfare and trying to advance to other domains. including non military domains, but seen russia have use these tools as well. but it also demands on the part of russia to more pain on nato countries, including their, you know, public works for, you know, support for a crane and also their economy standing in the military standing. so it indeed gets us in a more dangerous spite of confrontation, where we're not climbing the escalation for jumping, the escalation letter. and there are still some of the lethal of military tools that russia has. it says disposal, which it hasn't you so far. so there's still a lot of potential for the escalation, but it only will were some things for everyone. well, i got to let me get to you and watch it in here. we did immediately after that,
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the so called counter offensive we, we saw that them the electricity grade and much of ukraine went down. that was no accident, obviously here. and it's a reminder to everyone kind of an echo at what maxime said, is that there's a rush. the russia has a lot of tools and it's toolbox still can. it has a weapon, systems that it has not used with. there's no been those strategic bombing. there's been no major attack on command control centers that's still all out there and it's all very possible. and i, i expected garland is in there's a hand the russian doesn't even have to play in that. you know, general winters about the come riding in on his a snowy white steed into, into europe. i think, you know, there's a lot of talk about, shall rus russell escalate. i think there is a certain level of desperation on, within nato and within the countries because they know within the next couple months, this thing's gonna fall apart for them. i don't think personally russia has to. i would add soldiers simply because some of the areas they lost simply would get was
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because they didn't have enough personnel on the ground to hold those places and they had to retreat. and of course, on the other side, argued that it was, you know, some kind of a massive defeat. but in reality, if they kind of hold tight and make a few minor adjustments within the next um few months, um, you know, the, the, the, the e u countries are going to be in deep and serious trouble. so i don't think russia has to make it big of a moves as a lot of people i think they've got, you know, a lot of things on their times on their side of the role he's done with it. ok, well i'm going to use another phrase here. we go back to larry, here we heard of a lot in afghanistan. you've got the clock, so we've got to time. so in this case, who's got the clocks and who's got the time larry of russia has both. so the, actually i asked god reader the same exact question on this program, and he gave me the same exact answer, getting this guy, right. so we, we have and coordinate, we didn't coordinate on that, but,
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but natal does not have the troops to put in to, let's to say that they wanted to back up the ukranian army and flow and they don't have it. what we've seen in this latest offensive by the u ukrainians is that they don't have the ability to carry out that attack in depth. what that means is they're not only hitting the troops that are in front of them, but they wouldn't be attacking russian airfields russian artillery and placements. they would be disrupting supply centers in the rear, and they would carry that out with fixed wing aircraft rotary wing aircraft missiles. they don't have that. and. and so they're, they're really fighting with, with not enough weaponry, not enough armament. and they told us that have the capacity to provide that at the same time, europe is literally is into an economic tell spent the germany in particular. and so the economic elements of this is garland,
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correctly noted. general winter is coming and so this is going to further limit what the west can do. and yet they're becoming more desperate. this, that the euphoria over this in consequential retaking of car cough because it was a tactical withdrawal by the russians. they were not being chased down the street with a bunch of angry ukrainian soldiers. they withdrew ukrainians. come in, they're out in the open. it's much easier to kill. thanks maxime. it is the going back to who's got the time and who's got the clock's here. i mean it, at some point i would imagine to me, you know, i, it because of the, it's, so propagandized the narrative. let's, let's kind of unpack it here. i mean, nato countries are supplying arms to kill russians. okay. so why is russia still exporting energy to europe? well, i guess this is the question that
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a lot of people you're in russia asking in the sense, you know, it should be understood in the west, which perhaps it is in some circles, but it isn't. and others, there is a lot of pressure on who to take more draconian measures because you have this image of being the worst guy on the planet. but if you, if you, if you look at it from, from the perspective inside russia, he's been relatively mild and his actions and a lot of people and a lot of surface are putting pressure on the president. and the more decisive way. and you know, you know, you asked about the energy supplies in the summer colon for a deliberate destruction of richardson. wines of supply of way to nature weaponry to ukraine. which is, you know, happened just occasionally, but probably not enough or for, you know, because these are members are involving and enabling bringing offensive and social cultural offences. so i think the,
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the warnings and this is usually the kind of the protocol for the russian diplomacy . there's tons of warning coming of problems, and if they're not listen to then, you know, certain actions follow the same here. i believe that the russian warnings were not taken seriously november and december last year, right in january to last year. and then we ended up with the type of mass we're dealing with the day. and again, we see some publications and mainstream us near this. it will russia is blocking. they're not going to do anything. and in some circles, separate more pressure on western capitals, including on the button and ministration to supply more lethal weapons tend to be, you know, more open about there's, you know, support for ukraine that would have consequences. as you accurately noted, theater in your introductory remarks, this is the slide that no party can can afford to lose. and we know when, when, and, you know, if, if are we are to talk to the end game here,
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there's obviously there's no, there is some incentives for to be able to find some political settlements. but the way the west is approaching this conflict is that they can win this war of attrition with maxine, i mean, but you know, i'm sorry and i'm agreeing with you here. but, you know, we had the entire min one in 2 and we had the same interlocutors, they did nothing, then they were not good faith actors. what, why should russia interact with them on, on a political level now? well, obviously i don't disagree with you on this one is, was perhaps a way to suggest that the, the policy makers in washington should look into the approach where they can believe that by over financing occurring over military supplying ukraine, they can get an upper hand here and, you know, not charge any thinking in terms of a political settlement. scary. now talking about the red lines,
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demands and things like this. there's absolutely, in my view, no appetite or political sacrament. here i, on that point, there's no appetite for political settlement. gentlemen, we're going to go to a short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on nato's war on russia state with our ah, ah ah
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a move to go on classic and what is the best timing on july the identified them? this is a little bit of a vehicle because the lady knew who didn't really know what i to school car report backwards but some same yeah. i standing in my scheme. importantly. it cut all the stuff isn't off. don't love it. we live on your snow cranky part of it, which it it said to jeff. i mean, i mean, you're the one that even duncan b comma lucinda and the cobbler. somebody and the community that the coma a left really not is all right. suppose you decide are you still affected door bully out of them. so i did need it with us. that's a disclaimer. but how much the buddhist spoken to me regular beverly from william to 4th is looking at them during the summer because i see not
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exactly the reason why we should capital much pretty them we cannot create world was it was the case was a and then you build us to look for you, go that they sure i see that i think it's north chicago that we're still 80 past. after little things don't, i'm proud those. and when are you know, but it will be love enough to get an appointment with welcome back to cross stock. we're all things considered. i'm purely belcher manager. we're discussing nato's war on russia. ah, yes. collected ireland in dc. i want to continue the discussion. i was having with
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our maxine caroline to meet me i it was already mentioned here in december, the russians sent out 2 notes, all ultimatums, whatever you want to call them, to nato, into the united states. they were turned down. they were not taken seriously about the prospects of a, a military technical reaction to, for russia to ensure its security that was ignored. then we had february 24th. then we had the stem bull process were lindsley zelinski regime appeared to be on the brink of making some kind of compromise to wind the war down. we know now that boris johnson and others blew it off, said no, we're going to, we won't. if you make a piece, we're not going to be backing it. you don't have, we won't have your back. ok. i mean, and we go all, you know, back 8 years if you want all the way from the qu. so i don't see any kind of settlement here. there's, you know, just a barrel, which is a buffoon, the chief diplomat for dip for europe. he said that it will be settled on the
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battlefield. well, that's one thing i agree with him on. go ahead girl. i don't necessarily agree with him when that and, and as far as any type of diplomatic settlement, as we say here in, in the black community in america. there's a say in the goes like this which i'm but somebody shows you who they are believe. so the reality is, they've got to understand that the actual clean for the u. s. empire is not to get any kind of a settlement. it's to destroy russia, to tear russia to pieces and to steal the resources you cannot bargain with someone who plans does what a. she can't bargain with a wolf, they plan to swallow you whole. so, but the issue i think is not the battlefield right now. the weakness of nato, the weakness of each is political and economic. so if russia's right now, their strength is to say, well, you've got people in the streets everywhere, they're not happy you've, you just had a, an economic turn turn of events in italy. i mean, political in sweden,
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so realistically the, the, the right now, one of the things that i think that's happening with the u. s. is in pars coalition . you notice i don't say nato, because nato is nothing but an umbrella organization for the u. s. to, to, to control europe's foreign policy. but right now their concern is that things are falling apart and they're colo coalition is going to fall apart with the anger of the citizen. so i, you know, a lot of people think the battlefield. i don't think that's where this things decided. i think when the people of europe start tearing europe, literally a brick by brick to pieces on either, there will be new leadership in europe, or there won't be much of your left cold, hungry, angry people are not rational and they can be very violent. well, larry, i tend to agree with garland, but the americans will turn to the europeans and say, well, you have to suffer. ok. i mean, you know that that's one of the great mysteries for me. you know, we were out,
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we have solidarity westerns off a different the americans, they'll give a hoot what happens to the here a, b, and it all okay. even less so about the ukrainians. larry right now, know what they're almost being treated as if they're some human for the human toll, the spin experienced both by the ukrainians and by the russians along the border with ukraine is, is horrific. but the garland had it right with respect to that when people were cold and hungry, all the other politics disappear. and there is such an enormous disconnect right now between the political leadership in europe and in the united states. and between the people that the average citizen, for example, in germany, they're talking about 3 and 10 businesses of already closed that people are getting hit with utility bills that are 56, sometimes 10 times what they were paying long family businesses that endured world
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war 2 if you can imagine that, like a bakery or being forced to sell, and what is the leadership in germany talking about? or we need to set up a fun to promote more green energy. i mean, good god, this is madness. well, but that's no and they are and sorry i was going to add on top of that is that, you know, now there's talk about giving food stamps to america, into american military personnel because of inflation. and in the same new cycle that neck i've lost track, i don't know anybody can tell me how many tranches of military aid has been sent to ukraine this year. i've lost count of lost count the number and the, the, the dollar price number here. i mean it's, it's amazing it, but i'm agreeing with larry because this is an elite agenda here. maxime, you know, we're talking about the minutia now. but, you know, your, your geo political thinker, there is no way back. i mean, february 24th is
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a line in the sand. um, because as i said, like with mince $1.00 and $2.00, which is so obscure to western audiences, you know, this is not the 7th or 8th month of this conflict. this is the 8th year of this conflict. people don't understand that in the west year. but, you know, russia is making a complete re orientation elsewhere. because why would russia under any circumstances right now, deal with any of these western leaders. they're obviously off their rocker. go ahead, what i have to say, and i think everyone understands that there is just not just one battle going on, but a few battle some few levels at the same time. you know, ukraine is a theater for really new world making, meaning, making processes globally. obviously, and, you know, one way in the european politicians seem to deal with it is not to seek solutions for the crisis. and, you know, some kind of deal with russia so to say, but the channel, the anger of their people. but that my colleague spoke about to russia, right?
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the common were sula, lately that you can send your, you know, bills to moscow, shows you that there are no solutions for the problems that people haven't named, that they want to channel their anger towards rush. that's wanting. secondly, they can, like i said, they believe that they buy a lot more financial aid and military hardware to ukraine is a solution, not the solution. and they are new to the conference that i think there's also where is it likely to fail? secondly, i think old was when and washington and brussels and other capitals and was realized that there was a really big, a global struggle for the opinions and the hearts and minds of the global south. and the fact that, you know, countries that are not in the west lea, a decisive role and how, you know, these come to play out in the welfare of russia. and the west is also telling that
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there is the era of $9900.00. the kind of the human polar moment is gone and the multiple world is, is in the major. and finally, have to say there is, as flicks are in between the interest of the united states in europe is the united states has been a lot more pragmatic than the european and exported russian gas in or, and dealing with the crisis of oil and exploring other material and resources from russia and trying to hedge their own risks here and then emerge as a, quote unquote mediator into conflict when everyone else's finds themselves in terrible shape. that i think is also spotted in moscow. ah, it, well it's, it's, it's really interesting carland because the way i look at this here in the big picture of it all the, the entire e u project and this ridiculous offensive organization, nato, it's all on the line right now because everybody's all in on this here,
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that's why i said in my introduction, one side will lose and badly. and that's the stakes that we see right now. the entire e u project. that thing is, it's a and the and nato is at stake here. and the russians though, it go ahead, garland. yeah, because what we're seeing is a contradiction and obvious contradiction between the us empire and the concept of democracy. and so now we're seeing that the people in europe are figuring out that they don't have democracy. they don't have independence, they don't have sovereignty, they don't have a leadership that is looking out for their constituency, and they're not going to be happy about that. i think you also have to look at this through the context worldwide in the u. s. is trying to up the, the heat on taiwan also. so to some extent, i think we have 3 super powers. i believe we have a fairly responsible government in china, fairly responsible government in russia and a bunch of med dogs in washington. and that, unfortunately, for russia in china, it is kind of incumbent upon their leaders to luxury in
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a new world order without um, provoking or get without getting these med dogs to a point that they push a nuclear button. i believe it can be done. and i believe that's why rush in china, so it's showing so much constraint. i think they understand that and i think they will, they will be able to do that. ok, larry, take take a swing at that. that's really interesting. what garland just said there is, are there reason well enough people in washington to, to get that because we're in that the cities trap. okay. and we see it left right and centre. are they going to right to make the right make the right decision? evidence would say they won't go ahead. larry. washington is infested with corrupt, little pushes right out all these tiny, tiny people with tiny, tiny brains running around. what has had, what has happened is and gone. correctly noted it, the when history looks back at this period, this will be the formation of a new world order in terms of the multi polarity. the end of the united states had
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gemini in the world, the end of the united states, as the holder of the reserve currency. and the united states did it to itself. russia did not look for this contract. they didn't try to provoke this. russia kept looking and thinking, i think i'm naive, lee, that there was going to be some adult in washington d. c. they would step opposite that. ok, look, let's put all this other nonsense aside. let's talk. and they didn't do that. they said, yeah, we can, we can defeat russia. let's impose sanctions and not a single soul in the intelligence communities is the best i can determine, sat down and said, hey, what do we do about the fact that russia is self sufficient economically, and controls a whole range of commodities and minerals and rare earth minerals that we need in the west to survive with larry the set them on. the interesting thing is,
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is it meant russia only makes up 3 percent of g d global g d p. well, who would have thought that 3 percent was really important? nobody, nobody sat down the powder of the cost. i mean that's was so truly shocking about this. and now there is literally the economics toonami that's headed our way. it's going to affect the mobile depression. if anybody thinks that the collapse of the economy in germany, it will just be an isolated event that you know that there's no basis to have a discussion with somebody that's stupid. yeah, well, i don't. that's why you know, i don't watch cable tv outside of tucker carlson or a gentleman. fascinating discussion. i want to thank my guests in washington, tampa, and in moscow, i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at ortiz. see you next time. remember crosstalk rules ah,
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ah, ah, the question that india us very often is whose rules are, is the global order playing by. and the a c o becomes an option and a forum for a different set of countries of the would just say that this is a non western grouping. they're all very strong political leaders in their own right in these countries. and they are energy po, houses, economic bo houses, they have large populations, you know, and they're saying that is a different part of the world that seeing a look at a different grouping with
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ah, mobile, is this the best of both? no issue. my, for the mobile, when you visit annual g d. p per capita is about $4000.00 euros. how long does that? we've got drugs on a mobile, a wants to sleep up on a planet coffee seal fukway pursuant. you put them in your printers where you find them all belong to come out to la louis, thought they would have thought of unemployment is off the charts, moldova territorial integrity and sovereignty. we respect a country which enjoys financial support from the u. s. and the you is constantly
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roth, by political and corruption scandals. oh, but all that didn't stop mo, google obtaining a new candidate status in 2022. ah ah, a myself or the only other really weird young for the young woman was in a network that i was getting myself was sort of in that. but as i went to one of the identified them, this is a little believe it was of it. when i know you've been a little below, vanessa is an oakwood village, so glad aisha african look at the idea if i don't live here or saw it, what mean they start.

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