and is ha, some got, well, it's been a pleasure having you with us with this program here from moscow, one ot international a very busy day within covering day 2 of the annual general assembly at the you end in new york. it's about half past 2 in the afternoon that now it's still ongoing. we had a very tired joe biden ripping into his russian counterpart for a quote needless warren ukraine. the iranian president spent nearly half an hour bashing america. a correspondence are in new york details still to come. we hope you'll join us when we return. ah, a wrong when all proofs just don't hold me, you won't have to say proud. disdain becomes the advocate. an engagement equals the trail. when so many find themselves worlds apart,

we choose to look for common ground. ah, yes. now you need yes. if it's deploy bucket near to nancy in urban group comes in a book that probably the national shifty radiates. young showcase is under nathaniel. that sounds good. it's a, it's a boiler. weighs a w boy. ah, ah, what would be the name on that?

no, that would be what am in my chair, this is laura doesn't want that extra mom. but i know it's up under that y'all. with hello and welcome to cross thought were all things are considered i'm peter lavelle . does the european union have a death wish it would seem so rampant inflation growing energy insecurity, demanding unquestioning, solidarity regarding ukraine and punishing democratically elected governments are only some of the blocks maladies. to make things worse, there is a dangerous leadership deficit. ah,

cross talking the fate of the e. u. i'm joined by my guest, y'all. laughlin in budapest, he's a oversee lecture and in history and political philosophy in paris. we have rachel marston. she is a syndicated columnist and rti contributor and in london we cross demarco gassett. he is an international affairs commentator across elk grove. in fact, that means you can jump in any time you want. and i always appreciate, john, let me go to you 1st out of the corner of my on the plaza way. i can see you nodding your head after every single word. i said in my introduction, i'll let you take it from here. go right ahead. well, you say it's in your introduction that europe has death wish and you were implied that all these different policies are incomprehensible. you know, how could they possibly be wanting to commit suicide? well i, i certainly agree that europe is committing suicide, that the european leaders are, are killing of european culture, european economy and so on. but it's not me, it's not irrational. i mean,

i think it's irrational, but it's not, it's not by incompetence on the country. it is part of the program. the program, of course, is to create a political, united european lock will be at under american leadership. it is to create it even beyond that a new, the new man. you know, we had home a soviet to coast in the soviet period. now, it will be homo era pay us who is multinational, post historical post christian above all does not pollute who is, you know, kept strictly under control from the point of view of the climate in the song that is deposit. and if only when you see that, that project that you understand a lease various things that are going on, you know, it is worth having food rationing and fuel rationing to get a united luck against russia. because also on the line once one thing. and that is by the end of her mandate, or she may go in 3 years, or perhaps in 8 years,

she wants a fully fledged federal european state to emerge. and that goal explains, i think, everything. okay, well, let me go to rachel and parents. maybe i missed something over there at preceding years, but did anybody a vote on what john is claims that the european leadership wants because there seems to be such a glaring democracy deficit when it comes to their goals. i don't that i never see here are a goals, it's their goals. rachel, now, nobody voted for these bureaucrats, and they're the ones who are pushing this unelected policy down all of our throats . and all you need to know is what german 4 i minister and alina bearer, bach, said it added democracy, conference of all things in prague. just a couple of weeks ago when she was talking about ukraine. and she said, you know, regardless of what the german people think i am fully committed and i am going to,

yes, i'm going to continue support them. meanwhile, germans are worried about paying their energy bills each month and they're wondering how they're going to get through the winter with the energy crunch. and this is transpiring all across the block and you have, you know, certain countries kind of breaking off from it hungry. that's being punished for it . and poland is even saying, okay, yeah, we support ukraine, but there is an issue here. you know, they're coming up with some harebrained idea that germany and russia somehow in cahoots with each other against poland. so you're starting to see some fracturing happening already. so i mean, regardless of what, what the elite in the, you think it's a question of whether or not the people are going to follow. ultimately, if they're going to sleep, walk along, or if they're going at some, some point just rebel. yeah, i mean it's one of these strange thing that sleep walking with your eyes wide open . i'd really can't, you know, go square the circle. i think john is right, this was intended demolition marco, let me go to you. i read. poland is already been mentioned here. i was in poland.

the day they joined the european union and everybody said the same thing. we're going to be rich. we're going to be rich, and i said, no, you're joining a block and you will eventually be confined to your little space in a straight jacket. and i ended up being perfectly correct here. okay. and also, but the polls a rebelling against brussels is suing the germans for reparations. lots of fun going on in europe, go ahead, marco india and the pollutants said will be free, free yoga, all apparently pretty over, even implicit her. and here they are now in a very explicit to tyranny where the b u super state is being formed around the way the rules are being decided without their agreements. they are effect on how we are putting a bit of a german room, open prison as it were increasingly as things develop. so certainly, i think the polls have big regrets and also culturally they have far more in common with their neighbors in eastern europe and south to south than to do with the white

house. john, describe the grand european home a european project. that's something that's been dreamed up at night. no vision dreamed up in western capital where the lease on the technocrats had nothing better to do. i don't, fortunately, it's aimed at the old re person. your person prefers the slumber and he's helped in many ways by the media which is slumbering willfully on the watch. so this will carry it on. but i would add that there is also a bit of a time limit for you to achieve all the you master to achieve the aims. and that is because of course, they're running out over them over can capacity. they want to have guys running out of the results and they need to fuel the entire continent. and it's a question, what happens 1st, do they run out of the euro become a bankrupt current? so you'd be constantly ease to by increasing expensive gas or delay managed to do think russia in some way in the interim. that's why i think that the,

you and the germans are a bit of a hurry. yeah. john, it's one of those interesting things, you know, when you have adversaries, it's often said, you know, trying to pick who's had, who has the time, and who has the clocks and russia has both. okay. and the as nicer. and that's and that's self inflicted, that was intentional. okay. this was a self inflicted wounds that they are going through. go ahead. john in budapest, mark has said about poland is very important. there has been now for many years. i would say a polish problem in the european union. it sometimes said that the polls hate russia more than they love them. and see that the emergence of potent, or rather i should say, the domination of poland by poland of european union. and its foreign policy is one of the most remarkable developments of previous years. because previously it was, it was germany that dominated, and that's all that france. now, poland has emerged. helen thinks of itself, the americans think of poland now as their best ally,

their strongest ally and the poles. similarly, to take this very much to heart and have become completely crazed, i would say with a sense of their own importance. and it is that which explains this mad idea to demand reparation of germany. you know, you think it was enough to fight a war on, on one front with russia, but no, they've decided to open up a 2nd front with germany. and that's absolutely crazy. so the fact is that yes, there is a polish problem and the plan which i described may of course not go to plan. they can be spokes in the wheel. and the polish behavior is certainly one of them as far as inflation is concerned. and the, the, the, the bankrupting of the currency. i'm afraid, i think that is deliberate. the, just as it is in the united states of america for the reasonable reason that these countries, european union, the americans and others, british have accumulated such colossal amounts of debt. that the only way they can get out, my inflating accounts that way. so all this stuff about not being able to control

inflation, i'm afraid that's actually the plan is to have inflation inaudible that, that will ease over time, ruining, of course, the economy and the process, but at least getting rid of that. it rachel, the cov, it was a preamble for what we're seeing right now. and we have all of these are like the height of the elite class in brussels. basically saying i basically preaching central planning. i mean, the actually literally talking about it right now, does it have central planning or they're thinking of they're going to need coercion at some point. okay. and i, that's why i mentioned covert because how to lock downs work. do people obey what to what kind of stresses they have because it's gonna be a hard winner for you folks and, and i'm, i'm really afraid that they're going to have to resort to forced to make people obey your thoughts. rachel? well, speaking of central planning, just look at what's happening to the energy companies as they're facing this crisis . you have frances electricity, def, haas,

that has just been nationalized. you have germany's juniper, which in this state is considering taking much more of a stake in. so you see essentially a fusion of these big multinational energy providers and the state, and whereas before, it was much less. so increasingly, so, and in terms of controlling the population, i mean, we're looking at people already spilling into the streets to protest energy bills that they can't pay. and i can't emphasize this enough. it's one thing for ursula vander, line, european commission, president, to say, everybody's on board with ukraine. we're all united, and we all agree on everything. and we're going to do this and that to help people, but not give concrete details. and in the meantime, while everybody's waiting to find out exactly how they're going to get energy bill relief, the bills are piling up and people don't know what to do other than to spill into

the streets and it's september. it's not even cold out yet. so i don't know how they're going to handle this, other than with some kind of populations. tight control the, the likes of which we saw during covent, which ultimately was way that stop people from intermingling from making the situation worse. how i would like to know how the, you plans on preventing this situation from getting worse if things get pretty bad in terms of the heating situation as we had for into winter. yeah. well, you know, me go to marco, rachel, they, they don't, they're not very good. they have goals, but they're not very good at planning the same thing about energy prices in the u. k. i mean, you know, having these energy caps here that's just postponing that just postponing reality here. i list trust. good to a good luck. i mean the inheriting this, this is going to be very, very difficult for the okay. go ahead, marco, before we go to the break. yeah, i mean, if she follows the german example,

the german defense minister announced a couple of weeks ago that the army would be on the streets of germany from october 1st to patrol to stop riots. so the biggest country in europe is now preparing to batten down the hatches and in full so it's a fear on the, on the population. so things aren't looking too good. and as john said, this may be part of the plan, but it costs a great deal and risks a great deal of those who initiate the plan. because rachel says it's up to the population as to how much they can really tolerate without getting up and standing up all those rights which are now. so actually threatened by the elite mas. okay, mark, i guess i have to jump in here. we're going to go to a short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on the fate of the e. stay with

ah, look forward to talking to you all. that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given it by human beings, except with such orders that conflict with the 1st law, your identification, we should be very careful about artificial intelligence. at that point, obviously is to place trust rather than a with artificial intelligence. we'll somebody with a robot protective own existence with oh,

nice russian state so never be as tight as on the north landscape diva. mm hm. then i can also send, send it within the $50000.00. okay. so mine is 2000 speaking with little fan in the european union. the kremlin, yup, machine. the state aunt, rush up to date and split our t sputnik. even our video agency, roughly all band on youtube and pinterest and with ah, welcome back to cross square. all things are considered. i'm peter le belcher manager

. we're discussing the fate of the e. you. ah okay, let's go back to john in budapest, them in your 1st answer. i agree with you completely. i mean, this is that washington's behest, but please explain to me, what is the prize if you have a economic blocked once was prosperous, is now their productivity goes down. poverty goes up. i what kind of price is that? is it, or is it just say, a battering ram against russia? i mean, but, and we conform. oh, and by the way, that is the having europe in lockstep with washington is a good way for them to get rid of sergeant schultz. as i refer to him in germany because they definitely want to see him go no matter what he says, nobody what gives them they want him gone. go ahead john. i mean, you know, you could ask, go, what did the bolshevik same to achieve in 1917,

did they end to achieve a bankruptcy superpower? that was presumably not in the list of things to do and, but of course, that's what they did. the same question applies to the european union. now, i want to make myself very clear when the gas problem with gas started, which of course, the european union is responsible for by closing down the street to the european commission and all the european leaders said, well, that's great because we wanted to reduce fossil fuels anyway, it was a part of the green deal. they've been trying to do this for years now. they're doing it by force, as you said in your earlier question, why are they doing this? why are they doing it? because they want to have fewer people. i am sorry to sound like a crazy conspiracy theorist, but the french national assembly right now is you think they'd have better things to do is voting along on euthanasia because they want to be able to bump, hold people off in their own people's homes. if they don't die of cold 1st, these people are convinced that the priority is the climate. and if that means

making people poorer with less energy and therefore less c o 2 soviet, that's the plan. well, you know, rachel, i me. what if we can stick with with energy? i mean, i agree with you. this is just, this is in that in that not just an ideology, it's a fanatic of fanatical religion. it's a green new deal thing. um and you know, and then and there, there are websites going all across europe. how to get firewood. that's really amazing. it's got pre industrial. ok. let's do it in, in a course of a few years. i'm but the, those, the leads there is still going to be flying around in their private aeroplanes. i mean, i, at what point do people to say enough of you people, i cannot see how the political stability can be maintain when you have the leads. have the temperature up high, and then you have no traffic lights in your streets. rachel? yeah, all i know is that people here, at least in france, haven't reached that point and they are far too comfortable. i'm not sure if they will reach that point. there's a few people spilling into the streets right now. it's not that much,

especially considering previous protests like the elevator protest. so it's hard to say where people's tolerance level lies. but tom, in terms of, you know, where this is all going. if john mentioned the, the green dreams of the you and that touches on the point that this whole thing is just so ideological. and it's really hard to under state how ideologically bubbled they are in brussels and how everything is all about, you know, whatever we believe. and in terms of a construct, we can just execute and their 1st rude awakening was when they realized when the initial in um, in the initial aftermath of the onset of the korean conflict, they were like, okay, well, no big deal we can do without russian gas such as makes us shift sooner than planned to are green economy and then the, you know, they start pulling on the leavers for that plan and nothing worked. and i was kind

of the 1st shock. so i think reality is slowly starting to set in. but it's kind of a you know, the big question mark here is whether or not they are absolutely beholden at all cost to the ideological reality, or if pragmatism is going to give way at some point. well, that is a really good point, marco, my feeling is with these leads, they can never admit they are wrong. okay. and that's what i really terrified because they will double down triple down until they get what they want. because public opinion is not important. we've already heard the german foreign minister. i don't care what my voters have to say. we're going to support ukraine. i mean, you're in the u. k. i mean, how much is it? do people believe that we have to suffer in sacrifice for ukraine? do people really buy into that? well, it's constantly repeating, a very simplistic kind of been tra, boris, put it very well before he left his post that it was, he said that they would,

how did he put it? they would, they would have that they were bleeding in ukraine and april for us to simply be paying more in, in europe and britain. that was a minor cost compared to sacrifice will be great. but the sacrifice will be a great one. he forced upon them when he leans of stop the rather promising piece discussions at the beginning of april this year. so it's an unnecessary problem and it's a false dichotomy. we could have a piece and, and, and stability as well. so it is, but people tend to have a very low analysis threshold and they tend to believe what they told me, i think as a racial suggested once the, the difficulty of paying the bills that each for each kind of problem appears on these shows. it will be an entirely different attitude, but if people are still intimidated into coming out with these positions. and as john said, there is the agenda which is wider and the european elite masters off. mr

says are not actually in any thinking in the wrong in any way. they think they're doing quite well. they haven't let a good crisis go to waste their law and they've used it to put their own agenda forward. zip. so in force our compliance to come up with a series of laws at a time of food shortage, restricting the production meet and, and restricting the availability of grain and fertilizer which would make the grain greater in quantity. so the thing is happening on many levels and if we look for a kind of normal 20th century, kind of logic to this, there is none. but if we look at the kind of technocratic dream, we'll all nightmare that is being the fruit. some people thinking that so cool, great reset seems to be on calls and consistent with what decisions are shopping taken right now in john, this is the we have the perfect environment to create

a total authoritarian state. and in an authoritarian state, that is virtuous. you know, and, and woke and, and, and, you know, democratic in a very narrow sense because of, if you disagree there, you know, your voice that your voice simply doesn't matter. hungry hungry is a very good example of that here. but this is a windfall for, for the, for authoritarian sale. this is our momento guess. we can, we can shut anything down their throat here. we learned that we learned what to do and not what to do with cove. and we know exactly what to do in this situation. go ahead, john. i totally agree with that. not only is that all for a terry and isn't you asked in an earlier question detail whether they were prepared to use falsely deletes. of course, they're prepared to use force. how many people do you think they blinded at during the la vests movement in from that he of 40 people were blinded by the police. so they used force then, and of course they use force during cove it professor neal ferguson, the famous modular,

said in an interview in december 2021. when the 1st lockdown started in china. he's referring of course to march 2020. but in 22. when he looked back on it and he said we didn't, we could do this kind of stuff in europe. but then we saw china and then actually do it and we realized we could write. so that fleet. so the authoritarianism and the victorian state car is, has been used and they are psychologically prepared to use including for energy shortages in switzerland for example. you are already being invited to denounce your neighbors in terms of the heating. but the real danger, i would say, i mean that is already a very major danger. but the real danger is also the horizontal aspects of term tele terrance. which unfortunately are running already at full speed. by that i mean the tendency of citizens on the horizontal level to go along with the mass psychosis with what mateus does metals, the mass psychosis, to denounce each other as they did during co bit. if your friend had a barbecue or whatever. the media of course, are, are great at this. i, myself,

am constantly attack now in the dutch media because i work with political party for being, you know, having connections to russia and so, and all the state will. you mentioned that to us in your question. he did, they think they are being buttress, but that's how to tell it to her. it dictatorships all started. did you think we had a wash of ics thought of themselves as mass murderers? no, they were fighting rection. they were fighting for progress. they thought of themselves in the i found out of history and it's exactly the same mentality. it rachel, it living in paris, i. or how do we a, on a, on, on your micro level and the, an everyday life for me is the risk of phobia gone up and all the love of ukraine ah, ah, increased. i mean, how do they look at this? i mean, marco's absolute right? the, i mean, we're spoon fed, you know, on a daily basis, the same message over and over again. but is ukraine love of ukraine and hatred of russia is i can get of the citizens through the winter now. and it's really

interesting that question you bring up because very few people ask it, actually he, we're being told what to thank on french tedi and the plurality of information has decreased ever since they shut in out. i split nick r t it's, it's very difficult. li, accessible from here in europe. but yeah, i mean, i notice and talking to people that the thinking is changing. now that they realize the average person realizes there's an actual personal price to pay. it's gone from yes, we should support ukraine. yes, of course. you know, russian bother them and we should do what we can to help them in our freedom, democracy, blah, blah, blah, because that's what we were told. now the thinking is more well, you know, there is a lot of corruption there. it's not really our problem. it's, we're going to really suffer for this. um, you know, what point is this and how, what's the exit ramp for this? and as we know, there is no exit ramp being presented anywhere. so yeah,

people is starting to shift their mindset and i'm noticing that especially in the last month or so. oh, marco, let you finish off the program here. oh, basically the same question. i mean, uh, the u. k is notoriously anti russian. russo phobia is basically was born there. um, so is it, it's worth about being cold on this winter because it will make you feel good. wearing your sweater that your spot is spiting. vladimir putin is at work. i will, the side subtraction. and so far as the temperature declines, us, so will the belief in the proposition decline as well. but i from the point of view of those, well, a luncheon is processed late that i tried to comically defeat russia at the beginning of this crisis that filed a they know they come to that salary to feed rush about that i think the hope people now is using all that and numerous p r companies to push the proposition of russia military setbacks in such a way to remove competence in russia,

in russia's domestic population, in their own leda. and if they could manage to do that, install their implying copy too. well, they've been trying that isolation, they've been trying that since they both should be grad revolution and they've never succeeded and all the time we have here many thanks, i guess in london, paris. and in budapest, and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at r t c. and next time, remember, cross knuckles ah ah ah

ah sure, pretty mom to protect our homeland sovereignty territorial integrity and to insure the security of our people. i consider it necessary to support the proposal of the ministry of defense to conduct partial mobilization in russia. the russian president announces a true build up caving. it is necessary to ensure the defense of the nation. seeking the blinking. then i'll vote in favor of it. all these events have shown that we have one path, the sooner the better. without russia we have no future locals in the dawn bass say they are ready to make their voices.