processor done us from the ukraine over the us, the war dr. song, obviously is the resources put into this a cost increase on russia as well. then the stakes will increase as also by russia, recognizing this for territory. special guns donors goes on and are a part of russia. it is huge implications for one. russia will have to devote a lot more troops to defend its own soil. again, i know many people will say critical, especially the worst was not really russia, as you can well, if ross has recognized as russia from the russian legal standpoint, is russia. and so you will devote more troops to defend its territory. there was a course of partial mobilization and also it will defend this territories at all costs. that is, this is considered to be an intrinsic part of the russian federation. and also in

the world, the russian, a nuclear doctrine allows for the use of nuclear weapons. in 2 instances, one is attacked by nuclear weapons, but also if the existence of the state is threatened, no one can argue that the 6th existence, ross, or threatened by merely having nato in ukraine, but obviously from having from putting its own territory on to life. this increases the likelihood on or d, m, the reasoning for using nuclear weapons, food will be used. now, don't get me wrong. i don't think russia would want to go in this direction, but it's obviously, it's obviously a huge well, this is part of escalation. it's, it's now racing the bar, and us as to just point out that the interesting part is how will the west react? because we have to keep in mind after this offensive wish was well,

about, obviously a great success. there's a climate territory for training. so in the west, we kind of the champagne bottles are almost a clear mix during the war and, and some live to go for this, for territory is becoming part of russia and russia. and they're also raising the bar. it makes the question of how will the rest respond the dilemma on how they respond militarily. ok, so let me, let me go to the me here. now, i'm basically the same question. you mean, because it's when they talk about a negotiated and the conflict when once these referendums are completed. and i think it's fair to say that they, they will pass. they will make a request to the russian federation to join russia. we're going assume that's going to happen. so there's a different if there is going to be a negotiated end,

it's going to be a different ukraine that will be negotiating. well, i think there are 2 points of view positions from which you can view this, which one is most important for me and that is a purely human you like people leaving these therapist? these are 8000000 people. what do they feel? what relief, you know, i have to stress that relatives and their old saying same thing. we don't want to move out if russia for sure that we're secure. let us be bothered, russia just don't go away. you know, don't let the groups come back. if you know all the stuff that you are to blame south and then you should have started because you made an offer, you know, even do it to them or don't start the same story wasn't changed. i don't you seem

to remember that that was exactly the issue that during the 2nd, you know, when the song was for finally. so basically the western business very politicized. actually, i think i can sum up with this little won't be senior great. they want to defeat or rush, you know, well how the way the media come out they so you're creating a fence. if you are so many square wild russian territory, i've been regain. they don't speak of all thousands of green and sometimes russian, so they don't talk about their suffering on the population you, which was on the control that russians came in. then you can use came back and started arresting culture and people who collaborated with us. so what it is very politicized. they don't feel for the people. and from this point of view,

i think everything on the side of the west is very basically asking the question is in boston, but he said i should use all the means necessary. i like the positional or the day and that's for 5. you mean basically sad. this is responsible, irresponsible, to check. if someone is blocking the situation. the stakes are too high. you want to try to gain like you try to try. you try that. if you want to try these, maybe not try, so not only your for the whole you make it so that the position of the west, which is like in, i'm sorry, you know, i did it again. you know, a, this is the 1st time just since 19th century,

when all european brass united in covering all the media except a few independent was, is on the on site. and that way ration was going to in soccer ball. we going to suggest something more. and this is a very dangerous situation, because indeed, the situation on the girl don't go to school either. he was blan, i'm sure that, out you with the rush was you should be ready to a lot more resources or an in rush it to look at the actual garage and done it while we were invited by the q 1000. that when they had right seen in russian i'm, it wasn't quite and we didn't go in there even though the why? because we talked a lot about the rental gains,

it's about the, the will of the people on the ground. let me switch back to back here. and so this is what, what is in play here. it's already been said on a set himself. this is not a bluff. ok. do you think the west takes that seriously? because i mean, you can be more emphatic than saying it right out loud. glenn. well, i think the very important question because this is a so called the question whether or not to this is a nuclear bluff on behalf of russia. i think the reason behind the questioning is because the west and russia, from my perspective, appeared to escalate differently. if you see the way the west escalates, it tends to embrace the sim salami tactics. it takes those thin slices gradually, and this is how it's escalated. well, russia tends to take this in a hold on and take this big leaks if you will, for if you want to take it from 2014 after the west,

or an coupling coverage president, a coach in kid. and then we saw in russia took a big step, it took back to korea and also supported don't boss. but then, and we saw nato play this incremental, a gradual escalation in which they refused to implement means that they didn't say we then it said openly just that they've been pushing, keep to do anything. and also they kind of in the language that played it down like it is the spirit of it. and, and at the same time, they were pumping in gradually more and more weapons and says, slowly, according shutting down the obsession media shutting down the position political parties arresting that opposition later, gradually suppressing russian language and culture. you know, we're building up troops in boss, you know, there was a very gradual escalation and then suddenly, with the rush, i get

a warning. don't do this, otherwise we will escalate. but is there a smallest collision done? you know, you know, russia recognizing on bus and then invading and who say there was, this was doing the same thing gradually. so slowly more and more heavier and heavier weapons at the beginning. remember that if you want to send fighter plates now everything is on the table. so it is gradual a escalation. and then of course, we would take it for granted them, but they've been, you know, they were, the americans took credit for helping sink the most go and worship they don't killing russian military leaders offensive american so just as well so was directed by them. and the british, so now you gradually up to this, nate, the russian war, and again, is russia type escalate? this will graduate with his huge escalation where the now partially mobilizes. 300000 troops has referendum in this 4 regions and set this nuclear threat though. so i think part of the reason why we don't take the bluff chrislynn with an

embosser statement in the west there. so i would think it might be a love is because it seems like we're a big step. we've come for expecting the slow incremental escalation, but i think if some extent were escalating somewhat, somewhat different certainly. and let me go to the break here. been this is all part of the process and it goes back to them both in the early part of the conflict where they were seemingly, there was some kind of deal there and it was the west, it rejected. this is what we were told here. ok. and so, you know, it would be then that gives a reason to continue the escalation. because if, if one side is offered a negotiated, then it's not interested in, you have to ask like you have no other choice beam a 32nd. but oh yes, that's what i need to say. well, basically receive the cranial sites who are compromised based on meeting.

and there is a fact, you know, the radio science store sheet. and now this is an ascii saying, we're not interested in further negotiation until we're when we're on a hold that thought we're going to go to a quick break. and after that break, we'll continue our discussion on ukraine staying with ah

what is lucy? blair chicken hooks to elizabeth i had stepped to chimney, which had me to place the middle of which had been you must you to have to walk up while the will thoroughly disappeared. we bought digital dish out of dollars in little jazz. you'll additionally, why not glad you're not sure they will say is because they with molest sale. so when you look grandma misquote, just because a quite a closure applies the finishes, you should just have to walk all the way up. but if you believe

a feature to one that could off now to music, what you will get, it will show this. chelsea lock who model bucklin yet we face to go on with naturally, scott, a little polkas off at a slow motion on the sheet on the direction you to show them so by the mere lucy to let you put be log on the sheet. it is leak. when what you know slip of the month about on with the michael when you realize it. look at what all this is just look like. must paulina mean? you came in the bathroom when the she doesn't but i wish la rychlik r angela wish you moment permission. as i put almost a w. sold out on the other one. when you mores with them, they will close up with mr. on the what was in a, with

a conflict on the bush with you bye with welcome back to cross back. were all things are considered i well this is the home addition to remind you were discussing some real news. the news let's go back to moscow, right? before we went to the break, you're trying to finish point, go right ahead, my friend. well, basically this is the problem. who wants to rush? it was, this is suffering, you know, we don't want us to die until recently when they were made

a difference. it cleans, i think, what was better sincere, what was the same people. it was the bringing side that still it was the west, the banish brush, all international institutes from international dial. barely managed for me just down there, united nations get or so. so russia, credit choice wouldn't kind of choice to make rules based order in general, you know, international, all security on the people, a 1000000 people leaving and because we're pretty good. so is almost always the internet is not for us. it's for someone else. and we can insure security. there is a very important fact that is why people are in fact i mean

that police report strongly. great, please. when you walk with the shops where assessment on the damage is controlled by iraq since february 20 for the site does not woman. maybe it was all just cleaning no problems. no it was. these were assassination teams by you and people died. a tax. people are sure, you know, the prosecutor general region or the actual commission now will you be inside delivery targeting that go to where people go to that they switch around. so when you have the, if the state that it can will maintain it is claim of legitimacy there's, it's killing its own citizens. ok, this is what i mean. i can't think of another reason to vote to leave. exactly,

i mean, this is awful. i mean, it was the same story as with best latino, until these school children were taken by people who claim to be are going to support it. you can talk about it, but they can you give such a huge crime that a door a session or at least for more or less more people at home when children, but they can, they're supposed to just in the same way. now if you don't like the ser for adults, or if you can see why i own been, you know, people go with why i want you. hi mark. precisely. you know that places where people walk where people go or where local administration or, you know, in house, on timers, you start shift their administration personal. precisely

a. so, i mean, was this kind of a, did you, how can we talk about international law? what kind of rules is this? well, the would be based on. so basically when you get a nasty show, when the west sounds, all right, she's needing. yes. because you way the legal framework. an empty shout. yeah. in a claim, you know, i've, i've kind of had a c change over the last few weeks and thinking about the timing or the duration of this conflict. because i think everyone on the russian side, at least, wanted to see this wrapped up as soon as possible. saving lives, obviously, but i'm considering russia is facing the entire industrialized wes, them, i call it nato worlds. ok, so this is the russia is at war with nato in ukraine. i'm. but in the,

the question of timing is really important because the longer the conflict goes on, the suffering of course continues. but the unraveling of the so called unity and solidarity of, of the west is becoming more and more apparent because it's time passes. the real pain, not the sanctions against russia, but the sanction ers are the ones that are feeling the pain as it gets cooler and cooler with every passing day here. thoughts one? well, this is sir, all this how, why we have this escalations to begin with because we are in a position now almost. no, no, not total about the exhausting completely. the other side and the, and the, and the especially claiming full mixture. that's why there's also no room for a diplomacy. that's why this comes like this so frightening now. well, you know, one could say that no one can ever see how this is escalated over this over the past 6 months, because when the war began, keep in mind that russia interest on after q and the capital and with

a lot of pressure on, on. so landscape to accept or what they couldn't get before the 24th of february, which was a settlement of final settlement on this, on this conflict. and, and as the democratic the point out this year, a lot of reports from both ukraine and america, that the, this is when boys johnson came to cave and said, listen, don't, don't make any deals with the russians. we can instead exhaust them. we can believe in, di, effectively with less, less of deal with them. and this is also something that post office said later on like it. and we, we should avoid any bad piece with russia. we should take a piece, which means we have to defeat the russians, which is all the americans to some extent said that they have to be defeated on, on the battlefield. and, and this is the problem. now you enter more on the exhausting the opponent and this is why are they? this is why it also implies a lot of escalation. because before that, keep in mind,

rush had avoided a lot of civilian infrastructure. it didn't even that tackle of the barracks where it knew that to create a soldier's work. it's main message was, you know, not in conflict with you in conflict with government so. so gradually this continuous increase made a question more and more weapons, russia escalades on this side, and you have this mutual escalation going on. and because if the goal is to exhaust the enemy and there's no austin, i mean there's no diplomacy anymore on the table. then if it's all the full victory, or if this is when this is when you have this mutual escalation. so i think about the timing that this is probably something that the kremlin is that is calculating because if you look at the weapon store, just across nato, i mean, they say that across eastern europe there. so he's working on the germans. say we have anything that they were on her, of course in america, not only that, a lot of the storage work stores have been to play them, but they're taking weapons out of active service to ship to ukraine. and i haven't

been able to see him in his report to verify but, but, but undoubtedly there with something exhausted and also european economies. i mean, things are going great in europe now. it's difficult to keep the homes industries, cons, obviously survive a lot of the energy intensive industries counselor. so and then again, dennis ross exhausting us. and then of course we are trying to explore the russians through by a johnson. so just to we have to believe the rush was dry slowly. this is also something rand corporation, by the way, as under catered for many years, that even the excess excited, the escalating the conflict in the bus. they had a long record of this in 2019. this could helped to get russian more involved in the region, believe more russians in terms of blog and research. and this is a way of destroying russia, so we are to some extent in it all in an existential conflict. i mean, that's the word exist. so yes, so, so this is a crazy escalation on both sides and no diplomacy. and this is why it's very

frightening. situation i went demon went to go back to the referendums. i think it's very important to point out to our viewers that this will have a demonstration effect. we have 4 regions that are voting on leaving ukraine and obviously joining russia. and then we have the military campaign, we can add like odessa, coff eventually. because once this process of leaving ukraine joining russia will set is a precedent for other regions of ukraine and b. obviously, ultimately, the most important that the russians are there to protect the people that they recognize as being part of the country. what kind of demonstration effect will it have? well, let me 1st explain something brought us your brain was more proceed until proposal . and when you bring one of these regions credit,

basically a harp is not what you don't have a pencil. they all was voted for the pro ration candidate. they voted for which my against to the phone with that for each or that the more that was against their will was for russian s b c. so basically since for 1000, what can these people had no choice. they would not elect people into government. they were doing that and the last one green, which was the last piece is this idea. you know, lead out russia. it reminds me over that german and french strategy during the 1st one which was invented, then you know, that the germans wanted to bleed out the franchise. the result was that they

bled out themselves to each other. and 1st of all, what became the tragedy that we know? so in the same way, i mean, this is the last. now there was a smoke on the west give, you know, okey in syria. there were a few children pena, something by the star. so, no more they and, you know, making it a huge program, you know, basically inviting fighters from the artist game unit. and then it became a huge you will continue to reason in the same way. if russia said it's way prevalent election in 2014, maybe in the beginning of 15, misty on a course, you will get the letter or a legal needs and everything will be fine. but the one that they wanted to change it in the same way. now, i mean,

i love watching the government division, d i a z y, there it is under pressure would. it doesn't matter for them. you know that people are dying that ukraine is suffering. what, what matters is that the question and what is it? they are right on their side, it is under pressure not only from the anti or do you, but also from the nations. how can you to be an instructional authoritarian that there are people, you know, who put the president on a depression. there is a, a story system we have why i can explain to you because rush is not being authoritarian states since 1987 a we have to end on this point here. fascinating discussion. i think,

i guess in our slow and in mosque, i want to thank you for watching those here are the see you next? i'm remember across a ah ah ah

i'm willing to do it. you know cranium, t coyer shooting idea. she ship a dr. lean ship board of control, you put you on board. so you should shield video to g at the mobile door by like you system really being able to know did not sing the anthem, missy leon. yeah, well, we can do a stems out arkell room dish, but i live a crazy day to where you store lot of the my subway, but just dory. yes or no. i live here the least get us but we ship them. so just take a look. you know what of them, i need a transcript for that for a one. they each double that or quick with global i'm saying

years about how she took on my job is to pull out the enough room for you real quick. if you take a picture of, i'll go double play, you have to go so good. i'm up with our at least 15 people are killed, inconvenient having children in a school shooting in central russia at least 24. others are wounded. we hear from a pupil evacuated from the building, with the liberal for it, the way students were killed. it was very scary. there were blasts on the 3rd floor, on the 2nd floor, everywhere. rushing a release of the disturbing video of the suspect. he shot himself dated the scene waving a p certain.